Come on then Fellow Bluebirds , ask yourself this ?

Who's the biggest villian ? Vincent Tan for rebranding or Sam Hammam for refusing to strike a deal over the Lanston notes. hence still leaving our club in Debt .. What do the inner circle think of this ??????

Who's the biggest villian ? Vincent Tan for rebranding or Sam Hammam for refusing to strike a deal over the Lanston notes. hence still leaving our club in Debt .. What do the inner circle think of this ??????

I wouldn't call either a villain, in one way or another we wouldn't be where we are now without either of them, Sam is going to get the best deal available that he can, that's how it works, VT is backing his vision with his money. Villains or saviours.

the reason i use the word villian Gwyn is not to show sides . i personally think the VT is an honourable man who really cares for our club

Sam agreed the deal and accepted Tans offer of £10 mill, but when it came down to it, there was NO £10 mill upfront.

How long has Sam been waiting for this money now? It's quite a while.
I'm surprised he won't take it being paid over a year if I'm honest.

annis do you think sam will come on board with vt

Common Annis if Hamman didn't borrow money from his own company we wouldn't be in this mess! He lied to us much more than Tan is at the moment! If Hamman came back to the club im sure ud see a lot more fans walking over that than the rebrand!

annis do you think sam will come on board with vt

Spoke to Sam today, NO chance of Sam running back to Tan after what happened, Tan will have to do what he originally agreed with no messing about this time.

I honestly dont understand why Tan does not just get rid of Sam once and for all in one go, especially as it means so much to our future.

Even Carl,Whitley or Gwyn can not understand this of Tan.

Common Annis if Hamman didn't borrow money from his own company we wouldn't be in this mess! He lied to us much more than Tan is at the moment! If Hamman came back to the club im sure ud see a lot more fans walking over that than the rebrand!

Where have I just said about Sam coming back etc ?

If that's true Annis im sure a deal is very close ? if i agreed to pay Sam money that i was reluctant to give him , then i would want to pay in installments too ..

How long has Sam been waiting for this money now? It's quite a while.
I'm surprised he won't take it being paid over a year if I'm honest.

5 years at least.
Luke, because then Tan, would say heres £2 mill and why does Tan just not pay him off, Sam has done his part reduced it from £24 mill to £10 mill, true or not, now Tans turn.

If that's true Annis im sure a deal is very close ? if i agreed to pay Sam money that i was reluctant to give him , then i would want to pay in installments too ..

Because then Tan, would say heres £2 mill and why does Tan just not pay him off, Sam has done his part reduced it from £24 mill to £10 mill, true or not, now Tans turn.

How long has Sam been waiting for this money now? It's quite a while.
I'm surprised he won't take it being paid over a year if I'm honest.

5 years at least.
Luke, because then Tan, would say heres £2 mill and why does Tan just not pay him off, Sam has done his part reduced it from £24 mill to £10 mill, true or not, now Tans turn.

That's what I'm saying, he has been waiting 5 years do another year wouldn't kill. Especially if it means he gets a new agreement in place. He'd be more successful in court if they broke a new agreement than he was last time surely.

How long has Sam been waiting for this money now? It's quite a while.
I'm surprised he won't take it being paid over a year if I'm honest.

5 years at least.
Luke, because then Tan, would say heres £2 mill and why does Tan just not pay him off, Sam has done his part reduced it from £24 mill to £10 mill, true or not, now Tans turn.

That's what I'm saying, he has been waiting 5 years do another year wouldn't kill. Especially if it means he gets a new agreement in place. He'd be more successful in court if they broke a new agreement than he was last time surely.

Sam would win this time in Court, as Malaysians agreed to this debt etc, but if he won, he would be suing for £38 mill and then the club would go under and Sam would get Zero as He has not got 1st charge over the club.
Tan would move the goal posts again to £2 mill.

If that's true Annis im sure a deal is very close ? if i agreed to pay Sam money that i was reluctant to give him , then i would want to pay in installments too ..

Because then Tan, would say heres £2 mill and why does Tan just not pay him off, Sam has done his part reduced it from £24 mill to £10 mill, true or not, now Tans turn.

im sure a deal is very close Annis .

annis do you think sam will come on board with vt

Spoke to Sam today, NO chance of Sam running back to Tan after what happened, Tan will have to do what he originally agreed with no messing about this time.

I honestly dont understand why Tan does not just get rid of Sam once and for all in one go, especially as it means so much to our future.

Even Carl,Whitley or Gwyn can not understand this of Tan.

Just a guess but if VT gave Sam £10m upfront now, it could prove difficult for us when trying to buy players during this transfer window. Any selling clubs might think 'Cardiff have loads of money' and stick an extra million or two on their valuations.

It might be of interest to see if VT changes his stance after 31 August??

Someone mentioned an offer of 10m over a year with the debt becoming secured if they failed to pay, did that ever get offered?

annis do you think sam will come on board with vt

Spoke to Sam today, NO chance of Sam running back to Tan after what happened, Tan will have to do what he originally agreed with no messing about this time.

I honestly dont understand why Tan does not just get rid of Sam once and for all in one go, especially as it means so much to our future.

Even Carl,Whitley or Gwyn can not understand this of Tan.

Just a guess but if VT gave Sam £10m upfront now, it could prove difficult for us when trying to buy players during this transfer window. Any selling clubs might think 'Cardiff have loads of money' and stick an extra million or two on their valuations.

It might be of interest to see if VT changes his stance after 31 August??

Tony, I honestly think Tan will go back to Sam on this one.

Sam would win this time in Court, as Malaysians agreed to this debt etc, but if he won, he would be suing for £38 mill and then the club would go under and Sam would get Zero as He has not got 1st charge over the club.
Tan would move the goal posts again to £2 mill.

Annis I agree with you Sam would win, but I'm not sure he would get the full £38m though. Probably a firgue of around £10m (or just above) is more realistic because he would be suing under the terms of the 2009 agreement.

If that is the case he should settle now for £10m now even if only £2m is paid up front, with rest (paid next May) is secured as a 1st Charge Mortgage

Sam would win this time in Court, as Malaysians agreed to this debt etc, but if he won, he would be suing for £38 mill and then the club would go under and Sam would get Zero as He has not got 1st charge over the club.
Tan would move the goal posts again to £2 mill.

Annis I agree with you Sam would win, but I'm not sure he would get the full £38m though. Probably a firgue of around £10m (or just above) is more realistic because he would be suing under the terms of the 2009 agreement.

If that is the case he should settle now for £10m now even if only £2m is paid up front, with rest (paid next May) is secured as a 1st Charge Mortgage

U might be right Tony, but Sam honestly believes Tan would still play games and so he is not prepared to take that chance and I have to agree with Sam on this one, just pay Sam up and let him go.

Sam would win this time in Court, as Malaysians agreed to this debt etc, but if he won, he would be suing for £38 mill and then the club would go under and Sam would get Zero as He has not got 1st charge over the club.
Tan would move the goal posts again to £2 mill.

Annis I agree with you Sam would win, but I'm not sure he would get the full £38m though. Probably a firgue of around £10m (or just above) is more realistic because he would be suing under the terms of the 2009 agreement.

If that is the case he should settle now for £10m now even if only £2m is paid up front, with rest (paid next May) is secured as a 1st Charge Mortgage

U might be right Tony, but Sam honestly believes Tan would still play games and so he is not prepared to take that chance and I have to agree with Sam on this one, just pay Sam up and let him go.

You have to say by paying Sam up now at a cut price fee is far better for the club

I really hope that Vt pays the full 10 million to Sam as soon as possible.

I also really hope that I never hear another word from Sam Hammam about Cardiff City again once he has been repaid.

Without Sam we would not be where we are today - and I mean that in both the positive and negative positions we find ourselves in.