So having read the Q&A

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

Did you miss the bit where they said they would look for additional investors or even some other party to bt the club?

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

Did you miss the bit where they said they would look for additional investors or even some other party to bt the club?

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

It's not quite the guaranteed admin/liquidation if they didn't have a blue shirt that a large proportion seem to be coming out with though.
They're seeking new investment at the moment anyway, so no real change there.
They could try and sell us, but nobody will buy it.

Personally I think if the rest of the board had made it known how big a decision re-branding a football club, and how so many would be against it, then they could have come to a better compromise and carried on as they were with the aim of getting a premiership club!

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

Spot on Owain and it's all ifs and buts and promises, but they have torn our club apart, fans are turning on their best friends, we are being dictated to and the heart of our club has been smashed. We are now £82 mill in debt and that £42 mill is now about £45 mill and rising, they have run our club now for 2 yrs and its now in a worse mess than ever.
Also only 3 wks ago Tg made a statement and has now totally gone back on their word. I really fear for us.

I asked for it to be put in stone and was told VT does not do that.

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

Some would call it a complete load of bollix, myself included

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

Honestly some of you are starting to sound desperate. Pick holes all you like no-one is listening anymore.

It seems that:

- We still owe VT £40m, and presumably this is rising if we're losing £1m a month.

- No deal with Langston has been done yet.

- VT will consider swapping his debt to equity if and when the Langston issue is sorted.

- VT was never going to pull out

- Looking at feasibility of stadium increase (which stadium was built to allow)

- Full steam ahead with training ground - although they haven't decided on a location, or whether to just stay at the vale.

- Malky has a transfer budget - (which is obviously the good news!)

- Bluebird on the badge was an afterthought, and it had to be explained to the Malaysians why we'd want to keep a bluebird on it!

Not quite the £100m 'investment' that has been so talked about.

Honestly some of you are starting to sound desperate. Pick holes all you like no-one is listening anymore.

Tony, u saddened me by your comments, Owain really does have. Point here.

Honestly some of you are starting to sound desperate. Pick holes all you like no-one is listening anymore.

It's a pretty big hole though...

I'm just amazed how many people are happy that this red shirt/new badge has now solved our debt problems, and we're now running a financially stable football club. Nothing has changed! (Obviously VT is still here, but I don't think they were ever going to pull out)

Honestly some of you are starting to sound desperate. Pick holes all you like no-one is listening anymore.

It's a pretty big hole though...

I'm just amazed how many people are happy that this red shirt/new badge has now solved our debt problems, and we're now running a financially stable football club. Nothing has changed! (Obviously VT is still here, but I don't think they were ever going to pull out)

Owain, they never were pulling out.

worth a read

Cardiff City's 'whimsical' rebrand gamble on red

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18338444

You don't need a big hole to sink a ship

You don't need a big hole to sink a ship

And when it sinks we loose over 20.000 souls

I think that some people including Annis are missing the sole point here, yes it's pretty obvious they were not pulling out as they have £40m invested, however they could have just sat back as a creditor and wait for us to go to the wall which lets face it wouldn't be long as we are losing over a million a month, they're debts are secured against the clubs assets so they would always get a large proportion of there money back even if they pulled out and left us to our devices, let's not forget they don't currently own any part of this club until they start converting debt to equity, until that point they are creditors to the club who charge 7% interest!
I will be more than happy when this langston issue is sorted and the debt gets converted to equity as we will then have a balance sheet that will provide other investors with a club possibly workin investing in cos at present anyone with a ffiniancial eye can see we are insolvent, so those that say we wouldn't get wound up or go into admin clearly have no idea as we don't have the cash flow to sustain more than 6 months spending without tans money, don't get me started on FairPlay rules either until people read those thoroughly u won't understand the need for revenue pushes ie the red rebrand

And the rebrand is not about shirt sales that will take years to get even revenue of 5-6 million per year it's about putting the club on the map for potential investors ( publicity has achieved this and businesses all over the world will be watching our progress over coming months) stadium namiing rights once Langston are sorted ad boards shirts sponsors its the whole revenue streams that can be provided and all games will be live in Malaysia what better way than for British businesses lookin to penetrate Malaysian markets than to then use city as their tool to advertise out there

And the rebrand is not about shirt sales that will take years to get even revenue of 5-6 million per year it's about putting the club on the map for potential investors ( publicity has achieved this and businesses all over the world will be watching our progress over coming months) stadium namiing rights once Langston are sorted ad boards shirts sponsors its the whole revenue streams that can be provided and all games will be live in Malaysia what better way than for British businesses lookin to penetrate Malaysian markets than to then use city as their tool to advertise out there

But they could have done that anyway, without needing to change our colour and badge!

What about all the publicity that the Carling Cup final would have given us? That surely is worth more than a story about some championship club that have changed their colours.

I think that some people including Annis are missing the sole point here, yes it's pretty obvious they were not pulling out as they have £40m invested, however they could have just sat back as a creditor and wait for us to go to the wall which lets face it wouldn't be long as we are losing over a million a month, they're debts are secured against the clubs assets so they would always get a large proportion of there money back even if they pulled out and left us to our devices, let's not forget they don't currently own any part of this club until they start converting debt to equity, until that point they are creditors to the club who charge 7% interest!
I will be more than happy when this langston issue is sorted and the debt gets converted to equity as we will then have a balance sheet that will provide other investors with a club possibly workin investing in cos at present anyone with a ffiniancial eye can see we are insolvent, so those that say we wouldn't get wound up or go into admin clearly have no idea as we don't have the cash flow to sustain more than 6 months spending without tans money, don't get me started on FairPlay rules either until people read those thoroughly u won't understand the need for revenue pushes ie the red rebrand

1) I thought there are many points of debate/argument , not just a "sole" one . What do you think is the only point?

2) Their debts are secured , but what is the realisable value of the assets secured against? The stadium cannot be sold , and player registrations would revert to the League in a liquidation so no realisable value there. So how would they get back a large proportion of their money?

3) They do own part of the club - they hold about 49% of the shares. Why do you claim they don`t?

GREAT!!! Get the additional investors in or sell the club to others who will re-instate the things we love.
As if there are only investors out there, who insist on red and a piece of shit as our crest...

Sorry I meant points not sole

They have invested a total of 40m approx and as far as I am aware none has been converted to equity, some other debts have been converted yes, my point being they at present have no real tie to the club other than the loans they have provided to the club

I was also led to believe that they have secured these loans against the stadium, if I am wrong I stand corrected

Sorry I meant points not sole

They have invested a total of 40m approx and as far as I am aware none has been converted to equity, some other debts have been converted yes, my point being they at present have no real tie to the club other than the loans they have provided to the club

I was also led to believe that they have secured these loans against the stadium, if I am wrong I stand corrected

I don`t have the exact figure in front of me , but over £6m of the investment is already in shares , giving them the 49% shareholding.

There may well be a charge against the stadium , but if it can`t be sold , that security has no value. The Council made sure that there are strong restrictions preventing a sale for at least 20 years. This was put in place at the early stages of the development to prevent the possibility of a repeat of what happened when Sam Hammam stitched up Merton Council over Wimbledon`s ground.

My first question to alan whiteley wouldve been... Alan.. why are you such a scaremongering lying prick?

My first question to alan whiteley wouldve been... Alan.. why are you such a scaremongering lying prick?

And he would probably reply 'who the **** are you?'