OT: WAG FAILING NHS AND PATIENTS IN WALES

NHS Wales: A&E and ambulance performance worst ever - again
By Owain Clarke


The performance of A&E departments and the ambulance service are the worst on record, while waiting lists have never been longer

The worst ever performance figures have once again been recorded by hospital emergency departments and the ambulance service in Wales.

Figures for October show fewer than 65% of patients spent less than four hours in departments like A&E.

The ambulance service responded to just half of immediately life-threatening calls within eight minutes.

The director of the Welsh NHS confederation said the service is facing "unsustainable pressures".

The statistics also show another growth in waiting lists, with 668,801 people waiting for planned treatment in September - equivalent to 21% of the Welsh population.

NHS in Wales facing its most challenging period
Waiting times records broken again in Wales
Welsh ambulance service asking for military help
Dr Suresh Pillai, vice president of the Royal College of Emergency Medicine Wales, said the figures "once again show a worrying further deterioration in performance".

It comes as the NHS Confederation in Wales - the body that represents health boards - warns shortages in the care sector are proving to be a "massive challenge" and increasing pressure on A&E departments and the ambulance service.

According to it's director Darren Hughes, as many as 15% of acute hospital beds are filled with people who are medically fit to leave hospital but are stuck waiting for care to be arranged elsewhere.

Almost 9,500 people had to wait more than 12 hours in urgent care departments in October

Just 64.9% of patients spent less than four hours in emergency departments at Welsh hospitals before being admitted, transferred or discharged in October.

This was down from 66.8% in September - which was a record - and far below the target of 95%.

The figures also show 9,484 people had to wait more than 12 hours in urgent care departments in October - the highest number recorded and up from 8,485 the month before.

The target is that nobody should be waiting that long.


Ambulance Service Response times

During October, the ambulance service responded to 50% of "red calls" - where a life is at immediate risk - within eight minutes, down from 52.3% in September.

These are the worst monthly response times since new targets were introduced in Wales in 2015.

The target of 65% has not been met for 15 consecutive months.

Last month's HIW report found ambulance crews had to wait more than an hour to transfer patients on no fewer than 32,699 occasions.


Waiting times for planned treatments and Patients waiting to start treatment

The figures also show there were 668,801 on NHS waiting lists in Wales in September - again, the highest number ever.

This equates to more than 21% of Wales' population.

It has also been revealed that 240,306 people had been waiting more than 36 weeks for treatment.

This is down slightly from the previous month's figure of 243,674, but is more than nine times higher than at the start of the pandemic - with 25,534 waiting more than nine months in February 2020.


'Understand and act'

"The urgent and emergency care system in Wales is facing a crisis and we are only just entering winter. Patient safety is at risk," added Dr Suresh Pillai.

"The government, boards and NHS leaders must understand and act now to ensure that the current crisis does not deepen and lead to more avoidable excess deaths."

Darren Hughes, director of the Welsh NHS Confederation, said: "The NHS in Wales is currently facing unsustainable pressures, from all angles.

"These statistics show the unrelenting high levels of demand the ambulance service and emergency departments are facing, with October seeing the highest number of immediately life-threatening calls made to the ambulance service since records began.

"We need to be honest with the public that winter is going to be extremely difficult. The whole system is working together to find solutions to solve the problems... but the pressure on the system is higher than at any other point during the pandemic."

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This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

Chris a lot is to do with the quality of AMs and fact labour are obsessed with sucking upto popular causes like the environment lobby just to gain the popularity vote? Shows how stupid their AMs are they give go ahead for 80m bypass that's not really needed yet suspend a bypass that is needed because rd will be washed away in time with no alternative route unless you call a 4mile long 12ft wide rd suitable? And if you look there are many cases of stupidity by various depts..... can throw billions into nhs but that wont solve problems that have been caused by
the cutting of expenditure to NHS over long period of time, nhs need something it hasnt got and thats staff.....another problem is labour been in power far to long they think they can do what they like and will still be voted in by the working classes in wales....but they're saying with more devolved powers they need more AMs at cost of 28m pa extra

This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

Chris a lot is to do with the quality of AMs and fact labour are obsessed with sucking upto popular causes like the environment lobby just to gain the popularity vote? Shows how stupid their AMs are they give go ahead for 80m bypass that's not really needed yet suspend a bypass that is needed because rd will be washed away in time with no alternative route unless you call a 4mile long 12ft wide rd suitable? And if you look there are many cases of stupidity by various depts..... can throw billions into nhs but that wont solve problems that have been caused by
the cutting of expenditure to NHS over long period of time, nhs need something it hasnt got and thats staff.....another problem is labour been in power far to long they think they can do what they like and will still be voted in by the working classes in wales....but they're saying with more devolved powers they need more AMs at cost of 28m pa extra

Allan, a lot of trurh in there!

I know your working background, so you stand well placed to appreciate the OP

I voted against WAG being created and I subsequently voted against it in the subsequent re-vote. They offer little to Wales as a whole but a lot to themselves

Some bloody good people amongst them but those at the top, as in most working environments, play the game and suck up to each other in the hope they may be given a 'leg up' the greasy pole

Who was it pre-election as First Minister who said "Vote for me, as I'll only do one term to settle things down and then I'm off..."

Another broken promise from the inept Mark Drakeford...

The price of lockdown. The NHS was struggling anyway, the lockdowns failed miserably in stopping the spread of the virus and have also condemned the NHS to a slow painful death buried under the backlog of issues that were not dealt with due to the lockdown.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

I'm sure a certain Mr Drakeford slashed the NHS budget as a Health Minister ( happy to be corrected) is there any point in moaning though Labour like the SNP are loved whatever they do or how poor they perform in education , health drugs , children in care , both Governments have overseen these areas under performing for decades, bugger all to do with Covid or Brexit.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

It used to be said that the NHS was only safe in Labour hands but after 20 years of Looney Left Welsh Labour Government this claim can no longer be made.

When Cameron, Osbourne and Clegg set off on their "Austerity" project Wales was the only UK Government NOT to commit to maintain NHS spending, in real terms, at pre 2010 levels. In fact in 2015 Wales became the only UK country where spending on the NHS fell below pre 2010 levels in real terms, and Mark Drakeford was Health Minister. Welsh Government NHS spending has never been a real priority for the Labour Party and despite the NHS being the biggest single budget expenditure each year the Looney Left Labour Party in Wales always seem to look to the NHS budget to save money.

In 2007 they even claimed it would save money to make prescriptions free in Wales and put more money into the NHS but they NEVER offered any evidence to support this nonsense.

None of this has stopped Welsh Labour pouring vast amounts of "Vanity Projects" the biggest probably being Cardiff Airport, purchased by the Looney Left for £52m in 2013 and supported since by huge chunks of tax payer money, earlier this year the WAG wrote off a £42m loan to Cardiff Airport and immediately gave a £42m grant. Well over £100m of taxpayer money has gone into that money pit which has been valued at just £15m. It simply beggars belief. There are countless other examples of wasting taxpayers money like the £113m on the enquiry into the M4 relief road but this happens when commercially illiterate politicians get their grubby fingers on vast sums of money it gets wasted on one vanity project after another.

Sadly the NHS in Wales is in crisis and it's brought about by decades of underfunding by the Looney Left Welsh Labour Governments and the only way out of this, in my opinion, is for the Westminster Parliament to recall the devolved powers for Public Health. Maybe add the devolved power for Education at the same time.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

Chris, please don't tell me the Roathmeister rides again!

We don't agree on everything mate, but at least we have a reasonable debate. I don't understand where these trolls find the time. I do sometimes wish I was ignorant, it would save me a hell of a lot of time from actually thinking!

There needs to be a mechanism for failing politicians to be sacked. Everything Drakeford and Labour touches is a disaster, but thats the price gog nationalists and the red sheep are willing to accomodate.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

So you debating me or just circling your troll hounds to go in for the kill. I didnt realise a simple response to a important topic warrants such a response. I guess you dont know when to stop.

Perhaps you will get a warning.

This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

Chris a lot is to do with the quality of AMs and fact labour are obsessed with sucking upto popular causes like the environment lobby just to gain the popularity vote? Shows how stupid their AMs are they give go ahead for 80m bypass that's not really needed yet suspend a bypass that is needed because rd will be washed away in time with no alternative route unless you call a 4mile long 12ft wide rd suitable? And if you look there are many cases of stupidity by various depts..... can throw billions into nhs but that wont solve problems that have been caused by
the cutting of expenditure to NHS over long period of time, nhs need something it hasnt got and thats staff.....another problem is labour been in power far to long they think they can do what they like and will still be voted in by the working classes in wales....but they're saying with more devolved powers they need more AMs at cost of 28m pa extra

Allan, a lot of trurh in there!

I know your working background, so you stand well placed to appreciate the OP

I voted against WAG being created and I subsequently voted against it in the subsequent re-vote. They offer little to Wales as a whole but a lot to themselves

Some bloody good people amongst them but those at the top, as in most working environments, play the game and suck up to each other in the hope they may be given a 'leg up' the greasy pole

Who was it pre-election as First Minister who said "Vote for me, as I'll only do one term to settle things down and then I'm off..."

Another broken promise from the inept Mark Drakeford...

Chris
The power as gone to his and others heads do he wont ho until forced to go..... all logic as gone out window can see that with their transport plans and covid passes both defy logic in their implementation..... i will say waiting lists will take 10yrs or more to sort out as Eg I use to take 3 or more patients a day for appointments now its 1 a day generally.... where have all the patients gone past 18mnths? NHS does not have the staff or equipment to reduce waiting lists at any sort of rate to effect waiting times for many years... very few areas are not as badly effected in way orthopedic and other surgical procedures have been... deaths from waiting will be suppressed as it wont make nice reading once covid deaths subsides to a level not worth reporting daily.. WAG is not fit for purpose because all its done is move incompetent wannabe politicians from London to Wales and made them feel important running a country by wasting many millions of ££££££s on vanity or useless ideas

There needs to be a mechanism for failing politicians to be sacked. Everything Drakeford and Labour touches is a disaster, but thats the price gog nationalists and the red sheep are willing to accomodate.

There is a route via the ballot however we don't have the urge to take on Labour, oh unless it's a Brexit vote.

The NHS in Wales was on its kness well before Covid. After 18 years of labour control through devolved powers to our lunatic government. The people on the front line are outstanding but beyond that it's shocking.

If there is anything else to illustrate labour's failures and their deluded view its the creation of the Futures
Commission. Under the very heavy influence of Sophie Howe. She pretty much has a veto on any decision. Unelected. Earning £100,000 plus. Proud of her influence in the M4 relief road being shelved.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophie_Howe

It's as simple as to many people trying to access the system at once.
What's the answer build more hospitals.I would say we need three times the number of buildings and staff as we've already got.
Mind you finding the money and staff to provide a decent service is another matter.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

Chris, please don't tell me the Roathmeister rides again!

We don't agree on everything mate, but at least we have a reasonable debate. I don't understand where these trolls find the time. I do sometimes wish I was ignorant, it would save me a hell of a lot of time from actually thinking!

No, mate. Not Roathy. Just another 'nip in, nip out' merchant running for the hills whenever he gets found out

The NHS in Wales was on its kness well before Covid. After 18 years of labour control through devolved powers to our lunatic government. The people on the front line are outstanding but beyond that it's shocking.

If there is anything else to illustrate labour's failures and their deluded view its the creation of the Futures
Commission. Under the very heavy influence of Sophie Howe. She pretty much has a veto on any decision. Unelected. Earning £100,000 plus. Proud of her influence in the M4 relief road being shelved.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophie_Howe

A very good spot and you only need to look at the CV to realise this woman is typical of the unelected people who seem to run the Country these days.
If you have not heard of 'Common Purpose' the woman typifies the breed. The motto of this organisation (shadowy charity supported by Central Govt and with fingers in many many pies) is 'leading beyond authority.' It is entirely anti-democratic in ethos and intent.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

Chris, please don't tell me the Roathmeister rides again!

We don't agree on everything mate, but at least we have a reasonable debate. I don't understand where these trolls find the time. I do sometimes wish I was ignorant, it would save me a hell of a lot of time from actually thinking!

No, mate. Not Roathy. Just another 'nip in, nip out' merchant running for the hills whenever he gets found out

So you do not know when to stop then. You feel it's within your power to carry on the negative posts. I guess you won't get a warning though.

Also, found out? Whats there to find out about me. I couldn't give a .....

Just find it funny how you start to call in the pack for the hunt and seem to be enjoying the hits.

That's all ive done is posted a thread on nhs/covid. I thinks its you and the pack have been found out.

It's as simple as to many people trying to access the system at once.
What's the answer build more hospitals.I would say we need three times the number of buildings and staff as we've already got.
Mind you finding the money and staff to provide a decent service is another matter.

More to do with selfish idiots taking up the time of ambulance service and a&e by accessing them for petty things when can either go a&e by car or public transport or seek other advice without going there? but from experience visit to a&e are not nessasary .... money is there but the cuts in training over the years have meant massive shortages in frontline staff ..... now it will need more than money to put right the waiting lists.... the lack of organisational structure caused every nhs person to be diverted to covid care resulting in basically shut down of all but life saving services.......now there are covid non covid areas in hospitals but to late damage done....... can say same thing with Gp surgeries which is also contributing to excessive people going to hospital as they've almost closed down compared to pre covid days ..

It won’t change. We keep voting the same people. The same people allegedly pro nhs. But what they are really for is appropriating more power for themselves and discussing “wales relationship with the uk”. Some a pro Indy person in charge of it.

These aren’t our priorities. They should work with their remit and stop trying to force independence on us.

I facepalm when people criticise Johnson for his handling of the nhs in wales. He doesn’t control it!

We can’t even get the nhs app working here.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

Chris, please don't tell me the Roathmeister rides again!

We don't agree on everything mate, but at least we have a reasonable debate. I don't understand where these trolls find the time. I do sometimes wish I was ignorant, it would save me a hell of a lot of time from actually thinking!

No, mate. Not Roathy. Just another 'nip in, nip out' merchant running for the hills whenever he gets found out

So you do not know when to stop then. You feel it's within your power to carry on the negative posts. I guess you won't get a warning though.

Also, found out? Whats there to find out about me. I couldn't give a .....

Just find it funny how you start to call in the pack for the hunt and seem to be enjoying the hits.

That's all ive done is posted a thread on nhs/covid. I thinks its you and the pack have been found out.

I said your response would be pathetic; and so it proves

I haven't called anyone in, Mr Angry Armchair-Bear; your own post brought its own reactions without my interference

Try responding to a specific point/question that has been made to contradict your ramblings. If not by me, by someone else, like TheHangedMan

Did you not say you couldn't give a fu... before stating you would simply go create yet another name?

Be honest here, you aren't really cut out for a Forum where people have the right of response when they disagree, are you?

"Couldn't give a fu..!"?

I don't think even you believe that in reality...!

Can I suggest you go take one of your hats off and allow some of that steam to dissipate before you blow a fuse...

The thing I can't understand is the valleys is one of the most deprived areas in the UK ,yet they keep voting labour back in all the time , what have they done for you nothing,they are so quick to stand up and criticize other political parties for the same things that they have been failing at for years.

Im staggered by how hypocritical most people are on nhs. People clap on the doorsteps and yet you see trains full to the brim with people not wearing a mask. Even the city staduim at half time is the same. I don't know how good these masks are. Might it help though with nhs pressure? How gov say people can make their own judgement?? People are just ignorant and selfish pehaps?

"People are ignorant......." You state that after stating "I don't know how good these masks are.". The irony is just breathtaking.

I have no scientific evidence that I can point to to but I would hazard a guess that the masks used, and they way in which they are worn by most, are pretty much useless as a barrier to a virus that we will all probably get at some stage.

Jim, I'd like to agree with you; but I fear being accused of being a "troll", "bully" and allowing him to (quote) "live inside my head rent-free" by the now surely overly tired (it's well past hibernation time) Mr Angry Armchair-Bear, who dishes it out but detests having to take it back, so I won't...

Of course, I jest on the word 'fear' and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm no shrinking violet but the guy behind the (well hidden) mask is of little consequence and/or substance in this or any other of his past or present names

Indeed, when another Moderator (not me) admonished rather than threatened him recently, his simple retort was to resort to type and largely avoid the 'live' issue of that moment, i.e. his inability to know when to quit

His actual retort was (quote): "Ban me, if you like. I really don't give a fu..! If you do, I'll just create another name"

Evidence points to one or more new user names being created/used already and might explain his limited visits to the site under the Angry Bear name

No threat to 'ban' was made by anyone, so the reaction seemed pre-emptive; maybe from experience?

Not that he would (quote) "give a fu...!" (sound familiar?) anyway

You're not the only one to see straight through him and the reaction will be interesting/amusing...

Chris, please don't tell me the Roathmeister rides again!

We don't agree on everything mate, but at least we have a reasonable debate. I don't understand where these trolls find the time. I do sometimes wish I was ignorant, it would save me a hell of a lot of time from actually thinking!

No, mate. Not Roathy. Just another 'nip in, nip out' merchant running for the hills whenever he gets found out

So you do not know when to stop then. You feel it's within your power to carry on the negative posts. I guess you won't get a warning though.

Also, found out? Whats there to find out about me. I couldn't give a .....

Just find it funny how you start to call in the pack for the hunt and seem to be enjoying the hits.

That's all ive done is posted a thread on nhs/covid. I thinks its you and the pack have been found out.

I said your response would be pathetic; and so it proves

I haven't called anyone in, Mr Angry Armchair-Bear; your own post brought its own reactions without my interference

Try responding to a specific point/question that has been made to contradict your ramblings. If not by me, by someone else, like TheHangedMan

Did you not say you couldn't give a fu... before stating you would simply go create yet another name?

Be honest here, you aren't really cut out for a Forum where people have the right of response when they disagree, are you?

"Couldn't give a fu..!"?

I don't think even you believe that in reality...!

Can I suggest you go take one of your hats off and allow some of that steam to dissipate before you blow a fuse...

Im cool! Nice to see im still in there to be honest.

The thing I can't understand is the valleys is one of the most deprived areas in the UK ,yet they keep voting labour back in all the time , what have they done for you nothing,they are so quick to stand up and criticize other political parties for the same things that they have been failing at for years.

It's because they see the Tories as an English party and like Scotland they hate all things English, Labour and SNP know this and like the sheep we all love, they follow blindly, although they turned into raging right wingers for a brief moment in 2016

Shocking Stats

This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

Chris it really is serious. Having worked in the NHS and also when i retired, spent many long hours with family and friends admitted to hospital, I can say that, resources are not being used effectively.

That is from the top down. When there was a matron in charge of the hospital who used to oversee the way the wards were run, resources were used much better, now we have (senior clinical nurse managers) and i am afraid many of them are not up to the job.

Although NHS staff are doing the best that they can they have no control how wards are run, as i said at the begining, it starts at the top. And I am sorry to say that those at the top are not up to it.

It is not so much that the NHS is underfunded, as it is down to how those funds are utalised.
It is no good throwing money at the NHS if it is not used properly. In my experience, a lot of money going into the NHS is being wasted. There is a lot more that I can say, but not on a message board

This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

Chris it really is serious. Having worked in the NHS and also when i retired, spent many long hours with family and friends admitted to hospital, I can say that, resources are not being used effectively.

That is from the top down. When there was a matron in charge of the hospital who used to oversee the way the wards were run, resources were used much better, now we have (senior clinical nurse managers) and i am afraid many of them are not up to the job.

Although NHS staff are doing the best that they can they have no control how wards are run, as i said at the begining, it starts at the top. And I am sorry to say that those at the top are not up to it.

It is not so much that the NHS is underfunded, as it is down to how those funds are utalised.
It is no good throwing money at the NHS if it is not used properly. In my experience, a lot of money going into the NHS is being wasted. There is a lot more that I can say, but not on a message board

Roger money is wasted because nhs us a cash cow for certain companies who deal with nhs... things like furniture what cost you me £100 would cost nhs £200 all this started with thatchers free market in hospitals ..... management went from 15 to 45 overnight back when introduced at my hospital... the list is endless of waste in NHS but a lot is forced on hospitals by things introduced by varying political parties over the years..... hospitals even got a dept specifically for WG beaurocrocy...

This is all getting serious now and needs sorting!

This is not about the NHS staffs; anyone who has been treated by or worked alongside these dedicated people will know what a wonderful job they do, the commitment they put into it and the sacrifices they have to make often over family time and finances

We live in tough times but I've always maintained WAG is relatively inaffective and their inability to take crises such as this by the scruff of the neck shows exactly why they themselves are not fit for purpose

And they want more power through a devolved Government?

It could make one laugh; if only that wasn't so scary an idea...

Chris it really is serious. Having worked in the NHS and also when i retired, spent many long hours with family and friends admitted to hospital, I can say that, resources are not being used effectively.

That is from the top down. When there was a matron in charge of the hospital who used to oversee the way the wards were run, resources were used much better, now we have (senior clinical nurse managers) and i am afraid many of them are not up to the job.

Although NHS staff are doing the best that they can they have no control how wards are run, as i said at the begining, it starts at the top. And I am sorry to say that those at the top are not up to it.

It is not so much that the NHS is underfunded, as it is down to how those funds are utalised.
It is no good throwing money at the NHS if it is not used properly. In my experience, a lot of money going into the NHS is being wasted. There is a lot more that I can say, but not on a message board

Not in Wales but here in London I was discussing this just the other day with a nurse who was urging me to complain to senior management because my wife was waiting in triage to be induced for two days simply because of a shortage of beds/midwives on the labour ward. Our new little Bluebird end up arriving 16 days overdue and was perfectly healthy as was her mam, but every day past week 42 of pregnancy can cause potential issues so we were naturally concerned.

I said to the nurse that, I saw no point complaining to her or her colleagues at the time, I was firm in making sure that we wouldn't be leapfrogged by those who preferred to vent their frustration in the direction of the staff on the triage ward, but beyond that, it was neither appropriate nor productive to do so to the staff who were clearly doing everything in their power to make my wife comfortable and frankly didn't have a magic wand to wave and resolve the problem even if they could.

I did say I would send an email to the senior management after the important bit of having the baby was all sorted and we were home safe and sound because it was clear to me that the issue was poor capacity planning, lack of direct insight from those making the decisions in senior management which leads to poor foresight, and poor communications across the different wards.

My work is heavily focused on driving efficiency (largely in manufacturing but I work across many industries) and the one thing I could see from a mile away was that the issues were solely coming from poor management. For reference, this was in Queen Charlotte's in Hammersmith which is viewed as one of the best maternity hospitals in the region and the nurse I was speaking with told me that they face these issues day in day out. I'm sure it is as bad, if not worse in many other areas of the country, especially back home based on the figures in the OP.

So from my recent personal experience, I would absolutely agree with what you say 'Guv.

Throwing money at the problem won't make the inefficiencies go away. I don't have the direct experience many on here have with the health service (thanks to all those who do what you do for us). What I can see though is, however it is currently being run, clearly isn't working.

I suspect this has probably been the case for a long, long time and the last 18 months has just revealed how vulnerable the NHS has become and how detached those from making decisions are from those who see the impact of poor management on a day to day basis.

I'd also go as far as to say that this is an issue that seems largely systemic as it is pervasive across a sustained period of time, across different regions and both sides of the political divide always seem to be campaigning on fixing the NHS then continue to add to or ignore the problems for the entirety of their time in power.