This is the best pre season business we’ve done in years

Denham, McGuinness, Collins, Giles & Wintle

I like all these signings.
Lower wages than what will sold with Hoillett, Bennett, Bamba & Glatzel who didn’t offer enough for the wages they were on.

We’ve got younger players in the squad and I do hope they come through. Colwill looks like a giant. Play him for 30 champ games this season and we might have a top player on our hands.

Keys for us:

Tomlin staying fit
Moore staying in Wales
Promoting youth
Surviving the season

Very happy with MMs contribution this pre season tho. Shrewd (if uninspiring) business.

It is one of, if not the worst, by an absolute Country mile.

Employee of the club at all??

I just think we need a reset it’s unsustainable to have squad players on 20k a week and so on. This can be a good rebuild year. We know Tan isn’t going to put the money in, I’m not lacking ambition I’m just a realist.

I’m obviously not saying it’s as good as seasons we’ve spent money but the objective is different and as such I’m happy at least we’ve signed some decent players

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

I personally don’t think any of the youngsters we’ve seen towards the end of last season and this pre season are good enough for the first team. I’m not necessarily saying they never will be. I think a few could well make it, but nobody has shown they are capable. And I am glad a lot have had exposure to the first team so far this pre season. But if that’s the route we intend on going down we’re in serious trouble. I would love to be proved wrong, and as I’ve said on another thread I’ve never felt concerned about the squad going into the season until this year. I also am not confident in McCarthy as he keeps persevering with the same formation and hasn’t diverted from it once during pre season when we should be trialling different ideas.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

People moan because the youngsters are not being given a chance now before they have kicked a competitive ball you’ve decided they’re not good enough.

We can’t have it all ways

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

—-

I think wintle will be on a third of the wages of Ralls/Vaulks/Bacuna so he’s good business. As is McGuiness.

If we had a prime Whittingham in the centre of the park I’d fancy us this season.

It may be good business financially, but not from the competitive point of view. So I will half back you there.

These players are on a fraction of the wage for a reason. I'd play for free, and I'm 54, would it be good business for MM to give me a ring.

Being sarcastic of course

Sam Hammam would be furious with such pre season performances. Until he is back at the helm we will keep on going backwards.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

I personally don’t think any of the youngsters we’ve seen towards the end of last season and this pre season are good enough for the first team. I’m not necessarily saying they never will be. I think a few could well make it, but nobody has shown they are capable. And I am glad a lot have had exposure to the first team so far this pre season. But if that’s the route we intend on going down we’re in serious trouble. I would love to be proved wrong, and as I’ve said on another thread I’ve never felt concerned about the squad going into the season until this year. I also am not confident in McCarthy as he keeps persevering with the same formation and hasn’t diverted from it once during pre season when we should be trialling different ideas.

agree 100% with your first sentence and have been god smacked at some raving about them..
i do have my fingers crossed that there is more to come though....

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

I know you’re a serial pessimist but jeez, give McGuinness and Wintle some slack before slagging them off without even playing a single proper game.

McGuinness was in the Arsenal youth set up for 10 years and played for the U18 and U23 teams so clearly he’s got something going for him. Just because he was let go by one of the best teams in the country doesn’t mean he will be bad for us. For context Arsenal’s Centre Backs cost over 100 million, McGuinness not breaking into the Arsenal XI certainly doesn’t mean he’s a bad player.

As for Wintle, you’ve conveniently left out the fact that as well as previously working at KFC he’s also made nearly 200 professional appearances and been a first team player for several seasons now and is only 24.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

i know this ......they were younger line was spun on here a few times but its not strictly true....
besides if all these boys are actually good enough to play championship football they should have won their league by a record margin no matter how old they are....

I'm really hoping we have at least one more coming into midfield who is creative and is able to keep hold of the ball as it will be hard to tell just how good the individual players brought in are if we don't have someone capable of really creating chances.

While Lee Tomlin would be capable, will he be fit often enough, and it will be a lot of pressure for Rubin Colwill to cope with if he is the one put into that role and expected to be the main driver for the team in his first full season at this level.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

i know this ......they were younger line was spun on here a few times but its not strictly true....
besides if all these boys are actually good enough to play championship football they should have won their league by a record margin no matter how old they are....

I'm sceptical about the strength of this squad, especially the likes of Cowell who page was 'blown away' by ! We'll find out very quickly in the next month or so. The Championship is the 4th strongest league in Europe.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

Paul, does he actually 'hate' Tan; or is he (my personal opinion) playing to a certain element on here...?

I remember similar being said after Warnock took over mid season and moved us considerably up the table then next pre season signed.

NML on a free from league one.
Etheridge on a free from league one.
Loic Damour on a free from french 2nd division.

We still have a decent spine to our team. We have strengthened where we needed to strengthen albeit still short of a creative attacking midfielder.

Hopefully we will prove you all wrong.

What happened to the Robbie Brady link? I thought he was nailed on to sign for us?

Hasn't MM gone on record saying we are done for the summer?

I have to say this is one of the poorest transfer windows I csn remember, it's only going to take an injury to Morrison or Moore and we will be in a relegation dog fight. The midfield is no better than last season and our defence is certainly weaker and we have 2 recognised striker who plays regular 1st team football.

As been mentioned, we ain’t getting money for players, so need to be shrewd, there is no god given right for someone to just keep pumping money into something whilst the economy is as it is, look at other clubs, I’m sure if you made millions you would not want to throw it all at a football club where players transfer and salary,s are not in proportion to the real world.
We need to be able to sustain or mount a squad that is capable of promotion or retaining our current league status until either Tan sells us or believes we can push onwards and sustain premier league status

We've needed to reset at the club. We need a season of consolidation and build on that.

Weve been over paying on wages for years.

Apparently we are just doing what we want to happen. A sustainable football club.

Of course that isn’t good enough for some.

As been mentioned, we ain’t getting money for players, so need to be shrewd, there is no god given right for someone to just keep pumping money into something whilst the economy is as it is, look at other clubs, I’m sure if you made millions you would not want to throw it all at a football club where players transfer and salary,s are not in proportion to the real world.
We need to be able to sustain or mount a squad that is capable of promotion or retaining our current league status until either Tan sells us or believes we can push onwards and sustain premier league status

I agree with everything you say. We do indeed need to be "shrewd" and therein lies the problem, possibly.

I'm not wholly convinced that MM has an eye for a good footballer, certainly not for one that can take our game to a higher level.

Given that our centre midfield is glaringly deficient of the skills required to dominate a game and has been for some time, surely a shrewder manager would have moved heaven and earth to address this issue.

It is not that I'm rubbishing some of the players he's brought in without first giving them a chance. It's more the positions he hasn't filled that concerns me.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

i know this ......they were younger line was spun on here a few times but its not strictly true....
besides if all these boys are actually good enough to play championship football they should have won their league by a record margin no matter how old they are....

I'm sceptical about the strength of this squad, especially the likes of Cowell who page was 'blown away' by ! We'll find out very quickly in the next month or so. The Championship is the 4th strongest league in Europe.

the squad was too thin last season and even thinner this....the one saving grace is that a lot of other clubs are in a similar position...

seems the budget isnt there so it is what it is... but best calling it our pre season is off the scale....

It’s all about opinions and each and everyone of us is entitled to one.

Looking at the majority of the other clubs there has been little movement of players since the window opened. Some clubs have spent big but that doesn’t guarantee success.

We’ve moved quickly IMO to bring a few in and I’m sure a few more will come. However to start slagging off players is a bit short sighted and unfair.

I still think we are a top 6 side and will finish in and around it. As long as the players give their all in matches I’ll be happy.

I really don’t understand supporters moaning about players because it gets us nowhere.

I for one am looking forward to the season starting and seeing where it leads us.

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

Paul, does he actually 'hate' Tan; or is he (my personal opinion) playing to a certain element on here...?

Chris, I do wonder myself??? Always throwing Sam's name into the mix too!

I respect your opinion, and am jealous of your enthusiasm.

People say McGuinness was Premier League. He was released by Arsenal having plied his trade at a mid table League one side. Wintle was a KFC worker up until a few years ago, and, from what I have seen is very much lower league.

Forget the kids, none of them are good enough. They are being pushed through because they are cheap not because of their quality.

Let's see shall we. The club know exactly what they have bought (or not as is the case) and they are trying to tell us we are ready to compete.

The club at the moment is a joke.

You are going the youngsters a disservice saying being pushed through? Or are you saying club is looking to get relegated by playing youngsters that in your opinion are sub standard and shouldn't be playing in championship just because they are cheap? From what we saw latter part of last season several of them looked as if can play at this level time will tell if they can...... but for you to right them off before season starts is premature and would say pessimistic but that goes without saying as far as your concerned....

Pessimistic yes, but Its an opinion borne out of experience, and what I have seen so far of their performance.

I have said in previous posts that Isaac Davies is the only youngster with potential and I stand by that.

None of our youngsters are good enough. They had a very poor year against their peers last year, so promoting them an masse to the first team squad sends out a perfectly clear Message to me.

Most of the u 23's were much younger than most teams they played also!! We get you hate tan, and we know you think sam would do better, but try showing a little support for our youngsters, instead of slagging them off, before a ball has been kicked of the new season.

Paul, does he actually 'hate' Tan; or is he (my personal opinion) playing to a certain element on here...?

Chris, I do wonder myself??? Always throwing Sam's name into the mix too!

Didnt we have an academy player go to euros called colwill obviously diesnt rate him? Hes More like playing to his ego wanting to be made out to be the forum pessimist or whatever? But to slag players off even before a competitive balls been kicked is pure daft but guess hes hoping they fail so can boost ego of told you so after 10 games but forgetting theres 40+ in a season .... reminds me of a previous poster of times gome by .

No ego here. And of course I want Cardiff to do well this season.

This board is about voicing opinions and how we feel about our club. You rather I lie?

I think the question is, is MM the manager to scour the lower leagues for emerging talent or seasoned pros who still have the desire to compete using a very small budget, is that why he was scouted ?, I can think of a few championship clubs in a worse position presently,
I would be fuming if I was a Swansea fan, the money they gave brought in to what they have spent over the years