‘ Interesting’

Hmmm?

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Surely it shows the way they record covid deaths is distorted

Surely it shows the way they record covid deaths is distorted

Yes it does.

Half a million ish a year. Hmmm

Surely it shows the way they record covid deaths is distorted

distorted in what way ?
the official figures have been available and put on here for months and months.....

Surely it shows the way they record covid deaths is distorted

Either that or we've all collectively forgotten the terrible lockdowns of '93 when we were battling to save ourselves from COVID12

Surely it shows the way they record covid deaths is distorted

Either that or we've all collectively forgotten the terrible lockdowns of '93 when we were battling to save ourselves from COVID12

i honestly think that a big percentage of people do not realise how many of us die each year .
and i have never, not once seen anything from our governments or on the media where covid deaths are actually put into context of normal deaths...

Confused. Only a few weeks ago there were figures on here quoting excess death figures at marginally more than the reported figures. Now the excess deaths appear to be loads less. I would question the reliability of those figures.

Confused. Only a few weeks ago there were figures on here quoting excess death figures at marginally more than the reported figures. Now the excess deaths appear to be loads less. I would question the reliability of those figures.

Not looked at this year but that's pretty much the death rates normally. So if there' 60 million or so in England and Wales and 550k or so die each year pretty consistently then why isn't the average life expectancy over 100 ?

These numbers are just completely wrong and you should look into such things before posting unchecked statistics.
Between the start of Jan and the end of October a total of 499k people died in England and Wales. That is data directly taken from the ONS spreadsheets. For November and December the official ONS statistics show ~100k - 110k deaths. (The margin of error comes from deaths being recorded weekly and some deaths being registered in week 1 of November despite dying in October or an estimate of deaths being registered week 1 of Jan despite dying in December) Again all this is data directly from the ONS website

These numbers are unquestionably wrong and is blatant misinformation. Be careful to make sure that just because someone’s put ONS graphics on it you still understand the information being presented and the validity of it.

Chris Whitty said on 5th January that "over time, people will say this level of risk is one society is willing to tolerate... at least 7k people die of flu every year and about 20k die of flu in a bad year"

He mentions in between about the vaccine being the thing that brings us to the point where we accept the death rate(suggesting COVID will never be erradicated?)...

From personal experience, I have heard an equal amount of people from many degrees of separation have died due to lockdown, [allegedly] falsely reported as COVID (such as car accident reported as COVID) and people who have [allegedly] died just of COVID [although I am skeptical as to whether this has been properly questioned by those who have passed on the info].

For years, there have been campaigns to raise awareness of mental health deaths, cancer deaths, obesity deaths etc. etc. but that's now not reported and we clearly have disproportionate media coverage of a single issue.

Do you draw the line there? Or do you look into coincidences surrounding where the world's wealth is coincidentally going and what these people hoarding this wealth are suggesting everyone else does... Who ironically seem to be the biggest "rule breakers" and hypocrits of the lot? Or do you trust the industries and people behind them. No ulterior motives, squeaky clean etc?

I bet the population of the UK was far less in 1990 so a higher percentage of people were dying back then.

These numbers are just completely wrong and you should look into such things before posting unchecked statistics.
Between the start of Jan and the end of October a total of 499k people died in England and Wales. That is data directly taken from the ONS spreadsheets. For November and December the official ONS statistics show ~100k - 110k deaths. (The margin of error comes from deaths being recorded weekly and some deaths being registered in week 1 of November despite dying in October or an estimate of deaths being registered week 1 of Jan despite dying in December) Again all this is data directly from the ONS website

These numbers are unquestionably wrong and is blatant misinformation. Be careful to make sure that just because someone’s put ONS graphics on it you still understand the information being presented and the validity of it.

either way the reaction is insane and will come at a huge price...both in terms of deaths , general health and our economy...

After a quick calculation of my own for ons deaths this year I got 572,705 with the last 2 weeks left off. Judging by the fact deaths have been in the 12k mark for 5 consecutive weeks before going just into 13k for week 51 I'd imagine there were another 25,000 deaths in those 2 weeks which would bring the years total to just shy of 600,000.

That would put it a good distance ahead of any other year on that list, a whopping 70,000 higher than last year and over a hundred thousand higher than the early 10s.

After a quick calculation of my own for ons deaths this year I got 572,705 with the last 2 weeks left off. Judging by the fact deaths have been in the 12k mark for 5 consecutive weeks before going just into 13k for week 51 I'd imagine there were another 25,000 deaths in those 2 weeks which would bring the years total to just shy of 600,000.

That would put it a good distance ahead of any other year on that list, a whopping 70,000 higher than last year and over a hundred thousand higher than the early 10s.

whopping.... not anywhere near what anyone would predict it would take to close a country down..
watch some films, read some books... it doesnt get close to what people have ever envisaged ..or in fact just look at history... i lived through the hong kong flu .. i can remember events and even football results from that period yet dont remember the lockdowns or mask wearing or months off school...

This is classic misinformation that plays into the hands of covid deniers and conspiracy theorists. If you look on the ONS site there have been 604,029 deaths in England and Wales up to 25th December with another weeks worth to add to that. So add Scotland & NI figures to that there are well over 70,000 excess deaths in the UK this year, but bear in mind that was with lockdowns and the social distancing measures. If we hadn't gone through the hardships there could have been at least a quarter of a million excess deaths, maybe close to half a million We'll never know. The lockdowns and special measures have literally saved hundreds of thousands of lives so to suggest they were not worth it is completely absurd.

This is classic misinformation that plays into the hands of covid deniers and conspiracy theorists. If you look on the ONS site there have been 604,029 deaths in England and Wales up to 25th December with another weeks worth to add to that. So add Scotland & NI figures to that there are well over 70,000 excess deaths in the UK this year, but bear in mind that was with lockdowns and the social distancing measures. If we hadn't gone through the hardships there could have been at least a quarter of a million excess deaths, maybe close to half a million We'll never know. The lockdowns and special measures have literally saved hundreds of thousands of lives so to suggest they were not worth it is completely absurd.

half a million deaths that would put our deaths per million population as the worse in the world ....with not just more deaths per million than anywhere on the planet but more than the countries with the 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,and 6th amounts COMBINED.. now thats not very sensible now is it.. ,. its this sort of exaggerated scaremongering tripe that makes people terrified and unreasonable....and make no bones about this costs lives....
you have zero evidence the lockdowns and restrictions have worked....just your assumption they do... but there is tons of evidence of the harm they have done...

This is classic misinformation that plays into the hands of covid deniers and conspiracy theorists. If you look on the ONS site there have been 604,029 deaths in England and Wales up to 25th December with another weeks worth to add to that. So add Scotland & NI figures to that there are well over 70,000 excess deaths in the UK this year, but bear in mind that was with lockdowns and the social distancing measures. If we hadn't gone through the hardships there could have been at least a quarter of a million excess deaths, maybe close to half a million We'll never know. The lockdowns and special measures have literally saved hundreds of thousands of lives so to suggest they were not worth it is completely absurd.

half a million deaths that would put our deaths per million population as the worse in the world ....with not just more deaths per million than anywhere on the planet but more than the countries with the 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,and 6th amounts COMBINED..

Careful there Skid, that kind of fact-based logic sounds mighty like conspiracy talk

half a million deaths that would put our deaths per million population as the worse in the world ....with not just more deaths per million than anywhere on the planet but more than the countries with the 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,and 6th amounts COMBINED.. now thats not very sensible now is it.. ,. its this sort of exaggerated scaremongering tripe that makes people terrified and unreasonable...

All these countries had more stringent lockdowns than the UK, without them their death rates would have been far far higher. At the start of the pandemic SAGE assessed different strategies and concluded that if they did nothing and aimed for herd immunity it would lead to 510,000 deaths.

you have zero evidence the lockdowns and restrictions have worked....just your assumption they do... but there is tons of evidence of the harm they have done...

There is absolutely overwhelming evidence that they work. Just look at infection rate curves before and after lockdowns. Governments wouldn't impose them and destroy businesses and livelihoods if they didn't. There is no denying the harm lockdowns cause but saving lives has to be the priority.

Skidemin. If you’re going to go with such a bold statement of there being zero evidence that lock downs work why don’t you provide just some of the tons of evidence they don’t work. Of course I mean actual evidence and not just your assumption.

Skidemin. If you’re going to go with such a bold statement of there being zero evidence that lock downs work why don’t you provide just some of the tons of evidence they don’t work. Of course I mean actual evidence and not just your assumption.

try re reading what i posted..

half a million deaths that would put our deaths per million population as the worse in the world ....with not just more deaths per million than anywhere on the planet but more than the countries with the 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,and 6th amounts COMBINED.. now thats not very sensible now is it.. ,. its this sort of exaggerated scaremongering tripe that makes people terrified and unreasonable...

All these countries had more stringent lockdowns than the UK, without them their death rates would have been far far higher. At the start of the pandemic SAGE assessed different strategies and concluded that if they did nothing and aimed for herd immunity it would lead to 510,000 deaths.

you have zero evidence the lockdowns and restrictions have worked....just your assumption they do... but there is tons of evidence of the harm they have done...

There is absolutely overwhelming evidence that they work. Just look at infection rate curves before and after lockdowns. Governments wouldn't impose them and destroy businesses and livelihoods if they didn't. There is no denying the harm lockdowns cause but saving lives has to be the priority.

so the evidence is more people getting infected and more people dying ? ....because what the graphs show is a sharp increase in both infections and deaths each time new restrictions are put in place... .. you can argue it might have been worse but the key word is might..you dont know that and there is no scientifically based report that says that either.... maybe they have no effect and maybe deaths and infections would be less..... i think the later but unlike you im not putting a wild figure on it.....as for your first remark about the countries with the highest rates also having the most stringent restrictions.........isnt that my point ?...it only differs in your assumption that the most stringent lockdowns saved the most lives....where as im looking at numbers that say them having the highest deaths and highest infections can not be a coincidence

This is classic misinformation that plays into the hands of covid deniers and conspiracy theorists. If you look on the ONS site there have been 604,029 deaths in England and Wales up to 25th December with another weeks worth to add to that. So add Scotland & NI figures to that there are well over 70,000 excess deaths in the UK this year, but bear in mind that was with lockdowns and the social distancing measures. If we hadn't gone through the hardships there could have been at least a quarter of a million excess deaths, maybe close to half a million We'll never know. The lockdowns and special measures have literally saved hundreds of thousands of lives so to suggest they were not worth it is completely absurd.

half a million deaths that would put our deaths per million population as the worse in the world ....with not just more deaths per million than anywhere on the planet but more than the countries with the 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,and 6th amounts COMBINED..

Careful there Skid, that kind of fact-based logic sounds mighty like conspiracy talk

well predicted.... yes it is fact based but that has not stopped people coming on and using phrases like overwhelming proof { without giving any } or asking me to defend things i have not said { while casting doubt by saying ...actual evidence...which is what i posted } anyway whats tomorrows lottery numbers ?

Skidemin. If you’re going to go with such a bold statement of there being zero evidence that lock downs work why don’t you provide just some of the tons of evidence they don’t work. Of course I mean actual evidence and not just your assumption.

try re reading what i posted..

Apologies, I did misread your post.
Despite that though, it stands to reason though if there is zero evidence for lockdowns working then there should be evidence to show they don’t. That’s the evidence I’m asking for.

Skidemin. If you’re going to go with such a bold statement of there being zero evidence that lock downs work why don’t you provide just some of the tons of evidence they don’t work. Of course I mean actual evidence and not just your assumption.

try re reading what i posted..

Apologies, I did misread your post.
Despite that though, it stands to reason though if there is zero evidence for lockdowns working then there should be evidence to show they don’t. That’s the evidence I’m asking for.

dont you think producing solid evidence for something that will do such massive harm lies with those that are imposing these restrictions... ? and there is none...its this zero sum game all the time with a lot of emotional blackmail thrown in... numbers rise ,oh they would have been higher... or , the people were infected prior to lockdown or restrictions even when the new higher under restrictions figures are months after the lockdown started ... and the minute they drop..lockdowns also worked ? its summer, figures drop oh the lockdown has worked...but....expect a 2nd wave in the winter... yep thats what happens with all respiratory illnesses...
anyway....do you not think everyone should be questioning things that do not sit right not just accepting...
up until last week i knew nobody who had died with covid on the DC... i do know quite a few who had lost elderly relatives..
none of those deaths were unexpected...and the fella i know who died last week had been taken into hospital very ill and was dying of terminal cancer ..and we are 9 months in... i have been to 4 funerals in that time and would defo have been to a few more bar for restrictions...not covid...
i havent a conspiracy theory... but i do understand people looking for alternative explanations and tbh do not understand people swallowing every single word out of the TV without some of it stopping them to think, thats not right surely... our government even managed to knock off over 5k deaths and there was hardly an eyebrow raised ... ?