We want Sam Hammam walking round the pitch

My opinion....

I don’t.

My opinion.

Be carefull what you wish for barclay 1

well some of us had wished for an owner to come along and believe in our club for decades mate... and it took someone from Lebanon to be that person. the youngsters have no idea how bad it was pre Sam ...and the older ones that should remember do not because they were at home with a liverpool top on watching world of sport ....am i grateful to Tan ? yes i am... but would VT have even heard of Cardiff City before SH came along ? no he wouldnt have...

No i was there in the bad days.
Sam hammam constantly bullshitted , lied and fleeced us through different avenues and still threatened to take the club under.
Thank god everyone that mattered saw through the rodent and got rid of him.
We have never been close to going into admin since he left.
Few hypocrites that have moaned about every owner but said nothing when sam was doing the same..
Im that we have moved on Sam will never come back and if he still wants to fleece a club that much piss off down west i'm sure the owners will sell to Langston

well maybe ...if everyone that mattered..had payed what he was owed none of that would have happened...
at the moment we owe a fortune to our owner or a company owned by our owner and the same people that slaughter Sam fully accept VT doing much the same ...or will VT become a rodent/liar/etc if he actually wants his money back ?
and yes i remember some rip offs... pay as you win renegaded on ..huge ticket hikes of more than 100% for cup games { or was that rick } .. and the golden ticket { was that sam ? or the riddler } try the words fair,. honest, even...and if you were a regular through those dark days you have a very poor memory...

Be carefull what you wish for barclay 1

well some of us had wished for an owner to come along and believe in our club for decades mate... and it took someone from Lebanon to be that person. the youngsters have no idea how bad it was pre Sam ...and the older ones that should remember do not because they were at home with a liverpool top on watching world of sport ....am i grateful to Tan ? yes i am... but would VT have even heard of Cardiff City before SH came along ? no he wouldnt have...

No i was there in the bad days.
Sam hammam constantly bullshitted , lied and fleeced us through different avenues and still threatened to take the club under.
Thank god everyone that mattered saw through the rodent and got rid of him.
We have never been close to going into admin since he left.
Few hypocrites that have moaned about every owner but said nothing when sam was doing the same..
Im that we have moved on Sam will never come back and if he still wants to fleece a club that much piss off down west i'm sure the owners will sell to Langston

well maybe ...if everyone that mattered..had payed what he was owed none of that would have happened...
at the moment we owe a fortune to our owner or a company owned by our owner and the same people that slaughter Sam fully accept VT doing much the same ...or will VT become a rodent/liar/etc if he actually wants his money back ?
and yes i remember some rip offs... pay as you win renegaded on ..huge ticket hikes of more than 100% for cup games { or was that rick } .. and the golden ticket { was that sam ? or the riddler } try the words fair,. honest, even...and if you were a regular through those dark days you have a very poor memory...

I liked Sam a lot and am very grateful for what he did.

However he took out loans for what he spent and took a significant wage from the club which be used to pay those loans off. He must have had the collateral to get those loans which is more than Kumar, Cadwell or any of our other owners did.

As the poster said had it all worked out we could have got somewhere special but it didn’t.

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

I havnt read the whole thread so apologies but just clicked on page two and saw this.

I wouldn't be surprised if Dalman and Choo are on £600,000 a year to be honest

In 2017, Ivan Gazidis at Arsenal was on £2.6 million a year ,chief exec.

Daniel Levy at Spurs £7 million
Woodward at Nan Utd £3.1 million

So for a championship equivalent to be be earning the figures quoted ie half a million a year wouldnt surprise me.

You can get almost £300,000 a year to be chief exec at a local NHS Board do I reckon these figures are probably if anything less than we think

Be carefull what you wish for barclay 1

well some of us had wished for an owner to come along and believe in our club for decades mate... and it took someone from Lebanon to be that person. the youngsters have no idea how bad it was pre Sam ...and the older ones that should remember do not because they were at home with a liverpool top on watching world of sport ....am i grateful to Tan ? yes i am... but would VT have even heard of Cardiff City before SH came along ? no he wouldnt have...

No i was there in the bad days.
Sam hammam constantly bullshitted , lied and fleeced us through different avenues and still threatened to take the club under.
Thank god everyone that mattered saw through the rodent and got rid of him.
We have never been close to going into admin since he left.
Few hypocrites that have moaned about every owner but said nothing when sam was doing the same..
Im that we have moved on Sam will never come back and if he still wants to fleece a club that much piss off down west i'm sure the owners will sell to Langston

well maybe ...if everyone that mattered..had payed what he was owed none of that would have happened...
at the moment we owe a fortune to our owner or a company owned by our owner and the same people that slaughter Sam fully accept VT doing much the same ...or will VT become a rodent/liar/etc if he actually wants his money back ?
and yes i remember some rip offs... pay as you win renegaded on ..huge ticket hikes of more than 100% for cup games { or was that rick } .. and the golden ticket { was that sam ? or the riddler } try the words fair,. honest, even...and if you were a regular through those dark days you have a very poor memory...

I liked Sam a lot and am very grateful for what he did.

However he took out loans for what he spent and took a significant wage from the club which be used to pay those loans off. He must have had the collateral to get those loans which is more than Kumar, Cadwell or any of our other owners did.

As the poster said had it all worked out we could have got somewhere special but it didn’t.

most owners if not all lend their clubs money...and very often the loan is via another company owned by the same person,,, this gets mentioned all the time in the press .. i have no idea of Sams wealth or financial situ now, then or at any point but i do know things are not always what they seem... and he was obviously not in the wrong because payments have been made to him..
why it all went wrong....? Sam wrongly assumed crowds would be considerably bigger.. i assumed they would be too mate... i think many did .. it actually took an FA cup final and a new ground to be hitting 20k but lots of us thought we could achieve that once we were back in this division after two quick promotions and a chairman who was pushing the club... but its easier to blame someone else... like everything..
had he not pushed so hard.. and instead assumed we would get crowds 50% less than he imagined and run the club likewise .. this wouldnt be a topic and we would probably still be lower leagues waiting for someone to believe in us...

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

come on... and which clubs do not borrow money from companies owned by or partially owned by the owner of the club... ? i know Abramovich at one point was owed 1 billion by chelsea, not sure how that stands now ?
no he didnt want it public for whatever reason. its his business . i really dont get this rosmarie and thyme thing where people think ilangstone is some sort of who dun it.. yes he was langston but is it VT we owe money to now ? a VT owned company ? or has he sold some of the debt to a third party ? we do not really know until accounts come out. and then for 12 months do not really know whether it changes until the next accounts... and i dont understand ..and even if they were etc .. they are employees... they havent been open because we do not know how much they earn, they havent said... and their wages are not individually declared in club accounts .so therefore are they also hoodwinking us ?

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

come on... and which clubs do not borrow money from companies owned by or partially owned by the owner of the club... ? i know Abramovich at one point was owed 1 billion by chelsea, not sure how that stands now ?
no he didnt want it public for whatever reason. its his business . i really dont get this rosmarie and thyme thing where people think ilangstone is some sort of who dun it.. yes he was langston but is it VT we owe money to now ? a VT owned company ? or has he sold some of the debt to a third party ? we do not really know until accounts come out. and then for 12 months do not really know whether it changes until the next accounts... and i dont understand ..and even if they were etc .. they are employees... they havent been open because we do not know how much they earn, they havent said... and their wages are not individually declared in club accounts .so therefore are they also hoodwinking us ?

Wages are in the accounts, particularly over a certain level as far as I understand.

The problem with Sam was that he deceived he club and us by saying that Langston were backing him with money, yet they were actually him! In this day and age, and even back then possibly, we could have been in serious trouble with FFP as there is a definite limited amount that owners can invest annually against turnover.

I agree that we would never have progressed without Sam, but the OP was talking about having him back; have people forgotten about Black Friday, winding up orders, debts everywhere ?

Sorry, Sam had his day, did a fantastic PR job but I don't want him anywhere near our club again.

Be carefull what you wish for barclay 1

well some of us had wished for an owner to come along and believe in our club for decades mate... and it took someone from Lebanon to be that person. the youngsters have no idea how bad it was pre Sam ...and the older ones that should remember do not because they were at home with a liverpool top on watching world of sport ....am i grateful to Tan ? yes i am... but would VT have even heard of Cardiff City before SH came along ? no he wouldnt have...

No i was there in the bad days.
Sam hammam constantly bullshitted , lied and fleeced us through different avenues and still threatened to take the club under.
Thank god everyone that mattered saw through the rodent and got rid of him.
We have never been close to going into admin since he left.
Few hypocrites that have moaned about every owner but said nothing when sam was doing the same..
Im that we have moved on Sam will never come back and if he still wants to fleece a club that much piss off down west i'm sure the owners will sell to Langston

well maybe ...if everyone that mattered..had payed what he was owed none of that would have happened...
at the moment we owe a fortune to our owner or a company owned by our owner and the same people that slaughter Sam fully accept VT doing much the same ...or will VT become a rodent/liar/etc if he actually wants his money back ?
and yes i remember some rip offs... pay as you win renegaded on ..huge ticket hikes of more than 100% for cup games { or was that rick } .. and the golden ticket { was that sam ? or the riddler } try the words fair,. honest, even...and if you were a regular through those dark days you have a very poor memory...

I liked Sam a lot and am very grateful for what he did.

However he took out loans for what he spent and took a significant wage from the club which be used to pay those loans off. He must have had the collateral to get those loans which is more than Kumar, Cadwell or any of our other owners did.

As the poster said had it all worked out we could have got somewhere special but it didn’t.

most owners if not all lend their clubs money...and very often the loan is via another company owned by the same person,,, this gets mentioned all the time in the press .. i have no idea of Sams wealth or financial situ now, then or at any point but i do know things are not always what they seem... and he was obviously not in the wrong because payments have been made to him..
why it all went wrong....? Sam wrongly assumed crowds would be considerably bigger.. i assumed they would be too mate... i think many did .. it actually took an FA cup final and a new ground to be hitting 20k but lots of us thought we could achieve that once we were back in this division after two quick promotions and a chairman who was pushing the club... but its easier to blame someone else... like everything..
had he not pushed so hard.. and instead assumed we would get crowds 50% less than he imagined and run the club likewise .. this wouldnt be a topic and we would probably still be lower leagues waiting for someone to believe in us...

The man took us to the brink of excistence he contantly lied about everything including his langston denial. Threatened to kill the club and lots more. For that i think he's a tw*t who is best far away from Cardiff.

Be carefull what you wish for barclay 1

well some of us had wished for an owner to come along and believe in our club for decades mate... and it took someone from Lebanon to be that person. the youngsters have no idea how bad it was pre Sam ...and the older ones that should remember do not because they were at home with a liverpool top on watching world of sport ....am i grateful to Tan ? yes i am... but would VT have even heard of Cardiff City before SH came along ? no he wouldnt have...

No i was there in the bad days.
Sam hammam constantly bullshitted , lied and fleeced us through different avenues and still threatened to take the club under.
Thank god everyone that mattered saw through the rodent and got rid of him.
We have never been close to going into admin since he left.
Few hypocrites that have moaned about every owner but said nothing when sam was doing the same..
Im that we have moved on Sam will never come back and if he still wants to fleece a club that much piss off down west i'm sure the owners will sell to Langston

well maybe ...if everyone that mattered..had payed what he was owed none of that would have happened...
at the moment we owe a fortune to our owner or a company owned by our owner and the same people that slaughter Sam fully accept VT doing much the same ...or will VT become a rodent/liar/etc if he actually wants his money back ?
and yes i remember some rip offs... pay as you win renegaded on ..huge ticket hikes of more than 100% for cup games { or was that rick } .. and the golden ticket { was that sam ? or the riddler } try the words fair,. honest, even...and if you were a regular through those dark days you have a very poor memory...

I liked Sam a lot and am very grateful for what he did.

However he took out loans for what he spent and took a significant wage from the club which be used to pay those loans off. He must have had the collateral to get those loans which is more than Kumar, Cadwell or any of our other owners did.

As the poster said had it all worked out we could have got somewhere special but it didn’t.

most owners if not all lend their clubs money...and very often the loan is via another company owned by the same person,,, this gets mentioned all the time in the press .. i have no idea of Sams wealth or financial situ now, then or at any point but i do know things are not always what they seem... and he was obviously not in the wrong because payments have been made to him..
why it all went wrong....? Sam wrongly assumed crowds would be considerably bigger.. i assumed they would be too mate... i think many did .. it actually took an FA cup final and a new ground to be hitting 20k but lots of us thought we could achieve that once we were back in this division after two quick promotions and a chairman who was pushing the club... but its easier to blame someone else... like everything..
had he not pushed so hard.. and instead assumed we would get crowds 50% less than he imagined and run the club likewise .. this wouldnt be a topic and we would probably still be lower leagues waiting for someone to believe in us...

The man took us to the brink of excistence he contantly lied about everything including his langston denial. Threatened to kill the club and lots more. For that i think he's a tw*t who is best far away from Cardiff.

But did he NO.

Jason, your obsession against Sam is unbelievable, but actually you know Nothing at all, other than media Gossip.

You spout so much shit about crook etc, the only two faced poster on here is you.
You joined a group of posters yrs ago and tried to finish this forum off, said you would never post on here, but your back daily spotting pure shit, why dont you stay on your own forum, oh i forgot it failed.

Jason, you finally got me to bite with your constant slating of this forum, Sam etc etc, you need to get a life.

If you were there really during the old /bad days as you say, then you will honestly answer the following,



ANSWER THE FOLLOWING QUESTIONS HONESTLY?

What you do know is where were Cardiff City before the year 2000?

What were our crowds?
Where were we in the League?
What was Ninian Park like?
What was our assets?
Who was willing to buy us?

All I know is that when Sam Hammam was owner, I felt that he was a true Fan/supporter, getting out there and mixing with fans, taking to the pitch and basically doing all the things that a fellow CCFC supporter loved.

Remember me and my son Being at Chesterfield and Sam walking around in front of CCFC fans on pitch doing fist pumps, doing a jig, etc - they were fantastic times for us long suffering fans and surely that is what most fans want from there club - a family feeling.

Now I agree that financially, Tan has gone above and beyond and I am sorry for bringing this up yet again but after waiting so many years to get up to the promised land (first time), I and lots of others Felt totally alienated with the RED thing, It felt like I had no longer a CCFC identity. Then Tan said on record that "WE ARE NOT FANS/SUPPORTERS WE ARE CUSTOMERS". For me that felt like it was a slap in the face for all the years of support (even though I am fully aware of the financial situation of all clubs these days as CUSTOMERS stay away)

So, for me, From a feeling point of view, Yes, an owner who gets involved with the fans/supporters will always be trumps for me

(Eddie May was another example)

All I know is that when Sam Hammam was owner, I felt that he was a true Fan/supporter, getting out there and mixing with fans, taking to the pitch and basically doing all the things that a fellow CCFC supporter loved.

Remember me and my son Being at Chesterfield and Sam walking around in front of CCFC fans on pitch doing fist pumps, doing a jig, etc - they were fantastic times for us long suffering fans and surely that is what most fans want from there club - a family feeling.

Now I agree that financially, Tan has gone above and beyond and I am sorry for bringing this up yet again but after waiting so many years to get up to the promised land (first time), I and lots of others Felt totally alienated with the RED thing, It felt like I had no longer a CCFC identity. Then Tan said on record that "WE ARE NOT FANS/SUPPORTERS WE ARE CUSTOMERS". For me that felt like it was a slap in the face for all the years of support (even though I am fully aware of the financial situation of all clubs these days as CUSTOMERS stay away)

So, for me, From a feeling point of view, Yes, an owner who gets involved with the fans/supporters will always be trumps for me

(Eddie May was another example)

With you on that mate, there was a rapport with our club and an incredible atmosphere not seen for many a year or since, i for one cant have ago at a man who took us from the bottom and woke us up

Be carefull what you wish for barclay 1

well some of us had wished for an owner to come along and believe in our club for decades mate... and it took someone from Lebanon to be that person. the youngsters have no idea how bad it was pre Sam ...and the older ones that should remember do not because they were at home with a liverpool top on watching world of sport ....am i grateful to Tan ? yes i am... but would VT have even heard of Cardiff City before SH came along ? no he wouldnt have...

No i was there in the bad days.
Sam hammam constantly bullshitted , lied and fleeced us through different avenues and still threatened to take the club under.
Thank god everyone that mattered saw through the rodent and got rid of him.
We have never been close to going into admin since he left.
Few hypocrites that have moaned about every owner but said nothing when sam was doing the same..
Im that we have moved on Sam will never come back and if he still wants to fleece a club that much piss off down west i'm sure the owners will sell to Langston

well maybe ...if everyone that mattered..had payed what he was owed none of that would have happened...
at the moment we owe a fortune to our owner or a company owned by our owner and the same people that slaughter Sam fully accept VT doing much the same ...or will VT become a rodent/liar/etc if he actually wants his money back ?
and yes i remember some rip offs... pay as you win renegaded on ..huge ticket hikes of more than 100% for cup games { or was that rick } .. and the golden ticket { was that sam ? or the riddler } try the words fair,. honest, even...and if you were a regular through those dark days you have a very poor memory...

I liked Sam a lot and am very grateful for what he did.

However he took out loans for what he spent and took a significant wage from the club which be used to pay those loans off. He must have had the collateral to get those loans which is more than Kumar, Cadwell or any of our other owners did.

As the poster said had it all worked out we could have got somewhere special but it didn’t.

most owners if not all lend their clubs money...and very often the loan is via another company owned by the same person,,, this gets mentioned all the time in the press .. i have no idea of Sams wealth or financial situ now, then or at any point but i do know things are not always what they seem... and he was obviously not in the wrong because payments have been made to him..
why it all went wrong....? Sam wrongly assumed crowds would be considerably bigger.. i assumed they would be too mate... i think many did .. it actually took an FA cup final and a new ground to be hitting 20k but lots of us thought we could achieve that once we were back in this division after two quick promotions and a chairman who was pushing the club... but its easier to blame someone else... like everything..
had he not pushed so hard.. and instead assumed we would get crowds 50% less than he imagined and run the club likewise .. this wouldnt be a topic and we would probably still be lower leagues waiting for someone to believe in us...

The man took us to the brink of excistence he contantly lied about everything including his langston denial. Threatened to kill the club and lots more. For that i think he's a tw*t who is best far away from Cardiff.

try reading the board mate... this last few months we have had no ends of people moaning about refunds and this from fans who claim to be old school..life long fans..{ im not having a pop at them just trying to put it into perspective.}. yet you seriously expect a business man to just wave a huge amount of money he is owed and if he doesnt he is a tw*t ffs.. if you think in ten years time this club could be happily going about its business under a new owner while still owing VT millions which he has asked for numerous times.. but it never goes to court your dreaming..as for the Langston denial ..waw.. football club borrows off another company also owned by the clubs owner... id be shocked if any fan does not know this is very common practice.. do you even know if its directly VT we currently owe money too or if its some other VT company ? and if it is another does he then qualify as a rodent tw*t ?

Came in when the club was on it's knees.

It was still there when he left.

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

come on... and which clubs do not borrow money from companies owned by or partially owned by the owner of the club... ? i know Abramovich at one point was owed 1 billion by chelsea, not sure how that stands now ?
no he didnt want it public for whatever reason. its his business . i really dont get this rosmarie and thyme thing where people think ilangstone is some sort of who dun it.. yes he was langston but is it VT we owe money to now ? a VT owned company ? or has he sold some of the debt to a third party ? we do not really know until accounts come out. and then for 12 months do not really know whether it changes until the next accounts... and i dont understand ..and even if they were etc .. they are employees... they havent been open because we do not know how much they earn, they havent said... and their wages are not individually declared in club accounts .so therefore are they also hoodwinking us ?

Wages are in the accounts, particularly over a certain level as far as I understand.

The problem with Sam was that he deceived he club and us by saying that Langston were backing him with money, yet they were actually him! In this day and age, and even back then possibly, we could have been in serious trouble with FFP as there is a definite limited amount that owners can invest annually against turnover.

I agree that we would never have progressed without Sam, but the OP was talking about having him back; have people forgotten about Black Friday, winding up orders, debts everywhere ?

Sorry, Sam had his day, did a fantastic PR job but I don't want him anywhere near our club again.

not that we have any say in it but id love Sam back , not sure he has the money as investing in football clubs has moved on... but his failings in my eyes were to be too optimistic ..and had he not been and just run it as a business should be.. where then ? we fell short of averaging 8k that first promotion... business sense then isnt signing kav and thorne... but that is what he did.. and i wouldnt change it for the world, yes we had black Friday as so many others have...but by then at least the clubs profile was much higher we were a proper club again and back on the map and infact continued to move forward... its so easy to forget where we were and just how bad it was... and without Sam gambling i honestly do not think any of this new ground , top end championship.. 5 play offs, two promotions and 2 cup finals could ever have happened..
accounts...i think your wrong...wages are in the accounts but if individual wages were we would not only know how much they are on but would know what players are on too. where as most what you read are guesses... ive only ever known what 3 players have earned here 1 from years ago ,the other 2 quite recent and the wages quoted on messageboards have been way off on both..

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

come on... and which clubs do not borrow money from companies owned by or partially owned by the owner of the club... ? i know Abramovich at one point was owed 1 billion by chelsea, not sure how that stands now ?
no he didnt want it public for whatever reason. its his business . i really dont get this rosmarie and thyme thing where people think ilangstone is some sort of who dun it.. yes he was langston but is it VT we owe money to now ? a VT owned company ? or has he sold some of the debt to a third party ? we do not really know until accounts come out. and then for 12 months do not really know whether it changes until the next accounts... and i dont understand ..and even if they were etc .. they are employees... they havent been open because we do not know how much they earn, they havent said... and their wages are not individually declared in club accounts .so therefore are they also hoodwinking us ?

Wages are in the accounts, particularly over a certain level as far as I understand.

The problem with Sam was that he deceived he club and us by saying that Langston were backing him with money, yet they were actually him! In this day and age, and even back then possibly, we could have been in serious trouble with FFP as there is a definite limited amount that owners can invest annually against turnover.

I agree that we would never have progressed without Sam, but the OP was talking about having him back; have people forgotten about Black Friday, winding up orders, debts everywhere ?

Sorry, Sam had his day, did a fantastic PR job but I don't want him anywhere near our club again.

not that we have any say in it but id love Sam back , not sure he has the money as investing in football clubs has moved on... but his failings in my eyes were to be too optimistic ..and had he not been and just run it as a business should be.. where then ? we fell short of averaging 8k that first promotion... business sense then isnt signing kav and thorne... but that is what he did.. and i wouldnt change it for the world, yes we had black Friday as so many others have...but by then at least the clubs profile was much higher we were a proper club again and back on the map and infact continued to move forward... its so easy to forget where we were and just how bad it was... and without Sam gambling i honestly do not think any of this new ground , top end championship.. 5 play offs, two promotions and 2 cup finals could ever have happened..
accounts...i think your wrong...wages are in the accounts but if individual wages were we would not only know how much they are on but would know what players are on too. where as most what you read are guesses... ive only ever known what 3 players have earned here 1 from years ago ,the other 2 quite recent and the wages quoted on messageboards have been way off on both..

There is news on that, since Sam left Cardiff and was able to get on with concentrating on his own businesses, Sam is prob worth 6-10 times more than he was 10yrs ago.

Nearly 2yrs ago Sam nearly bought Cardiff back, bid was accepted until they found out it was Sam.

Also am American based company had a bid accepted but pulled out after their lawyers / accountants told them to.


We’ve been for for sake for a number of years that was originally why Dalman was brought in.

Sam states many times he wasn’t Langstone. That’s where I had trouble with it. I think he was treated badly by the egg men who made a lot of money out of his hard work.

Anyway to answer Annis’ questions.

Where were our crowds?

We had large crowds before Sam. Anytime there was a sniff of success the crowds went up massively. As they do at most clubs but more so at ours. Under Rick Wright the crowds blasted up home and away. However under Sam it was sustained. Although as we petered off and started struggling the crowds settled at about 12,000. I think that was the biggest disappointment for Sam as he was promised Barcelona size crowds.

Where were we in the league?

Bouncing between the bottom two leagues with little hope of advancing above that. Now people will say what about Swansea and other clubs that got up without massive investment. Well we weren’t doing that were we.

Ninian Park?

Was a shithole but it was our shithole. Although Sam sorting the Grange End was awesome for us. We needed a new stadium to progress. Thanks to Sam we got that although quite clearly he couldn’t deliver that himself.

My opinion....

We are in no financial position to add another 600k a year (or whatever it would be now) to our wage bill.

What do you think Dalman & Choo get

Plus all their living costs and both living in London, Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

Can you point that out in the accounts ?

wages in general are in the accounts and not what individuals earn...which you most likely know.. as you also know they are not doing yjeir jobs for nothing.

I don’t think for a minute they do the job for nothing. However are you claiming that Dalman and Choo both take a wage in excess of £600k a year like Hammam ?

Even if they were they certainly haven’t tried to hoodwink the club and fans like Hammam by borrowing from Langston, who were actually Sam himself !!

At least they’ve been open as are the accounts nowadays.

come on... and which clubs do not borrow money from companies owned by or partially owned by the owner of the club... ? i know Abramovich at one point was owed 1 billion by chelsea, not sure how that stands now ?
no he didnt want it public for whatever reason. its his business . i really dont get this rosmarie and thyme thing where people think ilangstone is some sort of who dun it.. yes he was langston but is it VT we owe money to now ? a VT owned company ? or has he sold some of the debt to a third party ? we do not really know until accounts come out. and then for 12 months do not really know whether it changes until the next accounts... and i dont understand ..and even if they were etc .. they are employees... they havent been open because we do not know how much they earn, they havent said... and their wages are not individually declared in club accounts .so therefore are they also hoodwinking us ?

Wages are in the accounts, particularly over a certain level as far as I understand.

The problem with Sam was that he deceived he club and us by saying that Langston were backing him with money, yet they were actually him! In this day and age, and even back then possibly, we could have been in serious trouble with FFP as there is a definite limited amount that owners can invest annually against turnover.

I agree that we would never have progressed without Sam, but the OP was talking about having him back; have people forgotten about Black Friday, winding up orders, debts everywhere ?

Sorry, Sam had his day, did a fantastic PR job but I don't want him anywhere near our club again.

not that we have any say in it but id love Sam back , not sure he has the money as investing in football clubs has moved on... but his failings in my eyes were to be too optimistic ..and had he not been and just run it as a business should be.. where then ? we fell short of averaging 8k that first promotion... business sense then isnt signing kav and thorne... but that is what he did.. and i wouldnt change it for the world, yes we had black Friday as so many others have...but by then at least the clubs profile was much higher we were a proper club again and back on the map and infact continued to move forward... its so easy to forget where we were and just how bad it was... and without Sam gambling i honestly do not think any of this new ground , top end championship.. 5 play offs, two promotions and 2 cup finals could ever have happened..
accounts...i think your wrong...wages are in the accounts but if individual wages were we would not only know how much they are on but would know what players are on too. where as most what you read are guesses... ive only ever known what 3 players have earned here 1 from years ago ,the other 2 quite recent and the wages quoted on messageboards have been way off on both..

There is news on that, since Sam left Cardiff and was able to get on with concentrating on his own businesses, Sam is prob worth 6-10 times more than he was 10yrs ago.

Nearly 2yrs ago Sam nearly bought Cardiff back, bid was accepted until they found out it was Sam.

Also am American based company had a bid accepted but pulled out after their lawyers / accountants told them to.


We’ve been for for sake for a number of years that was originally why Dalman was brought in.

personally id love it... how divisive it would be is another matter...

Assets?

Didn’t have many. Earnie was knocking about in the youth but may never have got a go. Ramsey was obviously very young.
Arguably it was Sam’s push for youth and the buzz that got us him.

Who was willing to buy us?

No one.

Sam states many times he wasn’t Langstone. That’s where I had trouble with it. I think he was treated badly by the egg men who made a lot of money out of his hard work.

Anyway to answer Annis’ questions.

Where were our crowds?

We had large crowds before Sam. Anytime there was a sniff of success the crowds went up massively. As they do at most clubs but more so at ours. Under Rick Wright the crowds blasted up home and away. However under Sam it was sustained. Although as we petered off and started struggling the crowds settled at about 12,000. I think that was the biggest disappointment for Sam as he was promised Barcelona size crowds.

Where were we in the league?

Bouncing between the bottom two leagues with little hope of advancing above that. Now people will say what about Swansea and other clubs that got up without massive investment. Well we weren’t doing that were we.

Ninian Park?

Was a shithole but it was our shithole. Although Sam sorting the Grange End was awesome for us. We needed a new stadium
to progress. Thanks to Sam we got that although quite clearly he couldn’t deliver that himself.

Neil the questions were to loud mouth Jason.

We always got a large crowd for a one off game , but we could not get consistent large crowds a fact, I was there in the 90’s with 4 home crowds from 1,400-1,700 etc

But Sam woke up the sleeping giant and woke up South Wales and got the rest of the UK to notice us big time and yes behind the scenes it’s been a roller coaster ride, but our support is there and Sam was the only Chairman since Rick Wright to recognise we had it.

I still believe potentially we could average 40,000-50,000 if we stayed in the Premier for a number of years and made the Top 6

Assets?

Didn’t have many. Earnie was knocking about in the youth but may never have got a go. Ramsey was obviously very young.
Arguably it was Sam’s push for youth and the buzz that got us him.

Who was willing to buy us?

No one.

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

Came in when the club was on it's knees.

It was still there when he left.

David’s,

Two promotions / No relegations

Left Top of the Championship , 6pts clear.


Outline planning for a new stadium £80mill, 110 acres.

A squad of players left worth more than the debt.

Crowds tripled

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

In enjoyed reading your opinion.

A lot of truth about Sam and Tan

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

I will give positives for both as I do regularly.

But out of the two I trust Tan a lot more than I trust Sam. One of the reasons for that is that Tan won’t get carried away by becoming a fan as he is a business man first and foremost whereas I think Sam got carried away and spent more than he intended to. But Sam liked his status amongst our fans (who wouldn’t?). I think had we given Tan that affinity he may have fallen in love with us too as I think he has seemed close a few times. But the Red is always there so some will never give Tan the respect he deserves.

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

Sorry sam was only interested in himself and what he could get out off club.... call me a sceptic but to me he had one objective obtain the ground just like Wimbledon the parallels are very similar even the council knew this and wouldn't let him near the ground! Yes sam brought fans together ect but did that at Wimbledon and ask them their thoughts on sam now? Anyway hes gone and long may it remain so..

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

Sorry sam was only interested in himself and what he could get out off club.... call me a sceptic but to me he had one objective obtain the ground just like Wimbledon the parallels are very similar even the council knew this and wouldn't let him near the ground! Yes sam brought fans together ect but did that at Wimbledon and ask them their thoughts on sam now? Anyway hes gone and long may it remain so..

So easy to write what you’ve said about Sam, with no facts, nothing to even back it up in fact I can’t believe I am going to answer you for the 50th time.

First you only read the media who I know personally and will back who ever is the current owner and turn once they’ve left.
You actually don’t know any facts, just media and gossip.
But you do know the success Sam brought us from a club in debt going only one way down, before Sam cake and piss poor crowds.

Well your 1,000% wrong.

Sam handed over £3.5mill in the year 2000 for Cardiff City that was a club in total collapse /dire and only two yrs previously nearly went out of the League. I could on and on and on.

Ninian Park had a lease on the ground and not the longest, Sam got Cardiff City 110 acres of land and got outline planning permission and guess what today we own our own ground



As you Allan don’t actually know Sam, I can you tell now Sam absolutely was besotted by Cardiff, lived and dreamed us and to this day still talks about us every day.
I won’t go through everything I have written a 1,000 times .

Sam loved us beyond and still died and I can say through my honesty he would never ever put us under . Threats are totally different than actions.

Sam devoted nearly 7 yrs of his life to Cardiff City.

As I said you have NO idea what your talking about .

As to Tan, No love at all , it was pure business and I have personally chatted on my own to Tan for hours. Great business man and well done to him outside football.


Some straight questions to Allan,

What were we worth in the year 2000?

Why if we were a club that was there to make money out of, was there not buyers lining up?

What state were we in then?

And what was Ninian Parks condition then?

How are we today as a club in size than we were in 2000?


ALLAN I HOPE YOU ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS


Our team on the pitch was it worth anything?


As to Wimbledon who don’t interest me.

Sam was never relegated with them, 4th div to Prem with crowds of 4,000.
They could not sustain football without Sam.

I have spoken to many Wimbledon fans and it’s 50-50 as they were heartbroken when he left .
As to all the players during his time them, not one player I have met has ever downed Sam.

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

Sorry sam was only interested in himself and what he could get out off club.... call me a sceptic but to me he had one objective obtain the ground just like Wimbledon the parallels are very similar even the council knew this and wouldn't let him near the ground! Yes sam brought fans together ect but did that at Wimbledon and ask them their thoughts on sam now? Anyway hes gone and long may it remain so..

how about explaining what you see as this this ground conspiracy... and the similarity to Wimbledon..

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

Sorry sam was only interested in himself and what he could get out off club.... call me a sceptic but to me he had one objective obtain the ground just like Wimbledon the parallels are very similar even the council knew this and wouldn't let him near the ground! Yes sam brought fans together ect but did that at Wimbledon and ask them their thoughts on sam now? Anyway hes gone and long may it remain so..

how about explaining what you see as this this ground conspiracy... and the similarity to Wimbledon..

He sold Plough Lane for a lot of money and left Wimbledon homeless.

As the OP on this post, its been interesting to see opinions. Both Sam and Vincent Tan have their absolute merits.

Will be forever grateful to VT, saved the club, poured his own personal wealth into the club, but I don't believe he has an affinity to Football, or its supporters. For many millions there is an emotional attachment to a Town or City's football club. Apart from the red, this is the only area where VT has fallen short (Not failed). Tan deserves to get back as much of his investment as he can when he sells, and I believe he is a completly honourable man.

Sam for me, connects the club to the fans, shares the passion, is a football supporter and has an affinity to the club. When an owner gets excited about his club, it rubs off. Sam never had an opportunity to flex his muscles in the Premiership. Had he had such an opportunity, I personally think his speculate to accumulate approach would have been better suited and would have been really well supported by the City faithful.

Again, It's only my opinion. Tan will keep us safe, Hammam would push us on.

Sorry sam was only interested in himself and what he could get out off club.... call me a sceptic but to me he had one objective obtain the ground just like Wimbledon the parallels are very similar even the council knew this and wouldn't let him near the ground! Yes sam brought fans together ect but did that at Wimbledon and ask them their thoughts on sam now? Anyway hes gone and long may it remain so..

how about explaining what you see as this this ground conspiracy... and the similarity to Wimbledon..

He sold Plough Lane for a lot of money and left Wimbledon homeless.

Sam wanted a new stadium when he was with us. Where are the similarities between selling Plough Lane and planning on having CCS?