' The biggest back tracker ever '

Boris Johnson that’s him.

Plus fucked up the virus from day one , slow on everything and backtracked

And now


Boris Johnson four days ago: “Let's be in no doubt about it, the exam results that we've got today are robust, they're good, they're dependable for employers.” Not a single claim in that sentence was true, was it Prime Minister?



The Govt’s 2020 coronavirus crisis results so far:

PPE - shambles.
Care homes - shambles.
Late lockdown - shambles.
Testing - shambles.
Face masks - shambles.
Quarantine - shambles.
Schools - shambles.



Apparently, Spaffer Johnson hates this photo...so whatever you do don't share it.

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They are a complete and utter shambles!!

They are a complete and utter shambles!!

and whatever method you use there will be a big chunk of students unhappy.. do you have the keep all happy answer ?

100% right.

Don't know why he made those comments last week, there was always a high possibility of a u-turn.

He has failed on many fronts. I think a lot of people have realised that other than dealing with Brexit, he is incapable of being Prime Minister.

They are a complete and utter shambles!!

and whatever method you use there will be a big chunk of students unhappy.. do you have the keep all happy answer ?

Well firstly he's had since March/April to come with a workable/practical plan.

Secondly, once they had a system any well run organisation would have had a dummy run (based on info like either teacher assessments or mocks) to identify where there were inequalities in the system and then adapt it accordingly.

Thirdly, if you have a system, that you think is fair (which is what he and his team originally said) stand by it. They actually did that but because they didn't do the first two things they set themselves up to blindly defend the undefendable !!

It's pure incompetence of the highest order.

There was actually a kid who had been offered a place in Cambridge, but because the system adversely treated pupils from deprived area schools she actually received an "E" Anyone with the slightest knowledge of the Cambridge/Oxford entry system will know that they only make offers to those at the very top end of the academic scale, so the system has to be catastrophically flawed to get it that wrong (that's not the only similar example by the way).

As usual, whatever the Tories come up with it will s^%t on those at the more deprived end of society.

We all differ in our different political allegiances but defending this debacle is just not right.

Anyway, don't worry, they've got another chance to get things right now; Brexit negotiations will start in earnest at the end of September

Last edited by piledriver64 on Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Complete lame duck.

Country now entirely run by the teachers.

They are a complete and utter shambles!!

and whatever method you use there will be a big chunk of students unhappy.. do you have the keep all happy answer ?

Well firstly he's had since March/April to come with a workable/practical plan.

Secondly, once they had a system any well run organisation would have had a dummy run (based on info like either teacher assessments or mocks) to identify where there were inequalities in the system and then adapt it accordingly.

Thirdly, if you have a system, that you think is fair (which is what he and his team originally said) stand by it. They actually did that but because they didn't do the first two things they set themselves up to blindly defend the undefendable !!

It's pure incompetence of the highest order.

There was actually a kid who had been offered a place in Cambridge, but because the system adversely treated pupils from deprived area schools she actually received an "E" Anyone with the slightest knowledge of the Cambridge/Oxford entry system will know that they only make offers to those at the very top end of the academic scale, so the system has to be catastrophically flawed to get it that wrong (that's not the only similar example by the way).

As usual, whatever the Tories come up with it will s^%t on those at the more deprived end of society.

We all differ in our different political allegiances but defending this debacle is just not right.

Anyway, don't worry, they've got another chance to get things right now; Brexit negotiations will start in earnest at the end of September

its not political...its a problem where there is no one size fits all solution..
and yes like that E grade there are going to be anomalies no matter what method, which btw is obviously government backed but actually put together by educators, the exact same educators who would be advising Stamer/ Corbyn if labour were in power...
but eh oh keep knocking

Complete lame duck.

Country now entirely run by the teachers.

yes education is run by educators.

I have no political party allegiances, in my 30 years voting I have voted for the for Labour, libs,Tories and UKIP. As my situation and life experiences change so has my voting.

You can Blame Johnson, Williamson, Drakeford or Sturgeon if you want, but I doubt anyone of those can even spell algorithm, neither mind understand or god forbid write one. Under the direction setters (because that’s all they are) are armies of civil servants. The one in charge of England’s exam regulators earns more than £200K a year, plus Wales and Scotland each have one. How come no mentions them. A private company approached the English exam regulators offering their services to create the algorithm, but the civil servant knew best and have sown chaos.

Remember all the fuss about Cambridge analytica ? From big data they could predict how to influence your personal vote, that wasn’t the data but the algorithms they use to manipulate it. Here we have kids who have been tested since four, against a school that has years of achievement data and a teachers opinion that may be biased or not. This can’t be the biggest headache they have faced if it’s your job in the real (private) world.

The big state is a scam, jobs for those from the right class. Great if you can ride the gravy train for all its worth, but it’s my money, no its not, it’s my daughters and granddaughters because they will be paying.

The EU first, then the Whitehall and the devolved administrations.

Johnson has one job Brexit, but he is sacrificial. Sunak may well be prime minister this time next year

Why is it ok to mark kids down by several levels so effecting them possibly for rest of their lives! but it's not ok to give kids higher Marks based on teacher evaluation? Using algorithms is throught with problems as it relies on someone coming up with a formular that's fair to all! But even before they started it was always going to be sided with better off areas and private schools as they have most higher grades per pupil so it proved..

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Agree there mate

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Nah,can't trust any algorithm that includes your postcode as part of it's solution.It's easy to critisise Boris because he makes it so.The mans a total feckup.He;s done his bit by hoodwinking the electorate but now the Tories ought to get someone in thats actually got a scooby.

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Nah,can't trust any algorithm that includes your postcode as part of it's solution.It's easy to critisise Boris because he makes it so.The mans a total feckup.He;s done his bit by hoodwinking the electorate but now the Tories ought to get someone in thats actually got a scooby.

its only easier if you dont give it a seconds thought.. most people do im afraid.. there is no simple obvious answer and its not political find it totally bizarre that people devoid of any actual complaints have to try to make it political... what next boris is at fault for the manchesters being knocked out of europe ?

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Nah,can't trust any algorithm that includes your postcode as part of it's solution.It's easy to critisise Boris because he makes it so.The mans a total feckup.He;s done his bit by hoodwinking the electorate but now the Tories ought to get someone in thats actually got a scooby.

its only easier if you dont give it a seconds thought.. most people do im afraid.. there is no simple obvious answer and its not political find it totally bizarre that people devoid of any actual complaints have to try to make it political... what next boris is at fault for the manchesters being knocked out of europe ?

It's when you promise the country your on top of things and you are so blatantly not.It's only just started.Lots of people who voted Tory at the last election will be on the dole this Christmas desperately trying to hang onto where they live and mark my words you know who we'll all blame because that's what we do.

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Agree this year results sadly will be devalued watch the record pass rates over this teacher will always mark up there pupils to make themselves look better ,there was never going to be easy way of doing this personally I would of not had summer holidays and put the kids back early and had them sitting there exams

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Nah,can't trust any algorithm that includes your postcode as part of it's solution.It's easy to critisise Boris because he makes it so.The mans a total feckup.He;s done his bit by hoodwinking the electorate but now the Tories ought to get someone in thats actually got a scooby.

its only easier if you dont give it a seconds thought.. most people do im afraid.. there is no simple obvious answer and its not political find it totally bizarre that people devoid of any actual complaints have to try to make it political... what next boris is at fault for the manchesters being knocked out of europe ?

It's when you promise the country your on top of things and you are so blatantly not.It's only just started.Lots of people who voted Tory at the last election will be on the dole this Christmas desperately trying to hang onto where they live and mark my words you know who we'll all blame because that's what we do.

unfortunately there will be many on the dole your correct.. but you cant have the penny and the bun.. the majority agreed with lockdown and it was as clear as day and said often enough the result would be unemployment.. as above, if you want to blame Boris go ahead, but i do not really think many will ..besides he has done ok.. and if you compare him to most of his foreign counterparts ok goes up a few levels...

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Agree with that. I've got no allegiance to any party, but other countries around the world had the same problems with lockdown, PPE etc, but Boris is an easy target, while Drakeford is wonderful????

With the exams situation you have to remember though - that Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales Education ministers for their respective assemblies and Govt - also made the same decision. So you need you to criticise them all - as they all made the same decision.

In Wales , Kirsty Williams (Lib Dem) made the same decision , The Scottiosh Nationalist Party made the same decision to.

However the WJEC (Welsh Joint Executive Committee) have stated they agreed with using the algorithm method.

Did you also know that in 2019 when they cross checked the teacher assessments compared to the actual grades awarded from the exam , the teacher assessments were only correct 16% of the time.

So I think it's not quite as simple as it seems. Without doing an exam and backing it up with actual coursework - then the results are just opinion based. In this case 57,000 teachers all giving their individual opinions on kids with hardly any cross referencing going on.

Add on top of this the example of a kid who was A* in his predicted result being given a B , as the school were only allowed so many A* to be awarded. The nonsense here is with OffQual , local education - not Govt ministers.

Kirsty Williams was only told there may be a problem with Welsh A level results last Friday - 3 working days before they were due to be released. That is nothing to do with Westminister and all to do with the WJEC / Welsh Assembly.

As someone said 2020 is a unique year with unique decisions being made. A student going to uni will soon get found out if they arent smart enough and have to switch courses.

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Agree with that. I've got no allegiance to any party, but other countries around the world had the same problems with lockdown, PPE etc, but Boris is an easy target, while Drakeford is wonderful????

You seem to forget this gov were warned in plenty of time but they chose to ignore the warnings and thats a fact.

Why is it ok to mark kids down by several levels so effecting them possibly for rest of their lives! but it's not ok to give kids higher Marks based on teacher evaluation? Using algorithms is throught with problems as it relies on someone coming up with a formular that's fair to all! But even before they started it was always going to be sided with better off areas and private schools as they have most higher grades per pupil so it proved..

Teachers are frequently wrong, particularly for black students getting only 30% of their predictions right, with just over half right for white students. Labour campaigned against teacher assessed grades last year, saying they discriminate on race and class grounds. Way too many kids go to university anyway.

What's happening in Wales ? Also Scotland while we're talking about it.
Didn't they use the same technique?
No one mentions them, but they had the same problems.
Anyone calling for Kirsty Williams to be sacked ?

Much easier to criticise Boris?

In fact the logarithm proved to be quite accurate as teachers had over estimated the results (so as not to upset the children).
The over estimates were about 40% and the actual figures now being talked about who had their grades increase, was about 40%
This is from the Welsh Assembly's own figures.

Agree with that. I've got no allegiance to any party, but other countries around the world had the same problems with lockdown, PPE etc, but Boris is an easy target, while Drakeford is wonderful????

You seem to forget this gov were warned in plenty of time but they chose to ignore the warnings and thats a fact.

So when were the Welsh Assembly (Labour) and Scottish lot (SNP) warned? Are you saying they were kept in the dark until the results came out?
Did you know that education has been devolved, and therefore the sole responsibility of the Labour party in Wales and the Labour and SNP in Scotland, for over 20 years?
How much preparation and warning do they need?

And yet the Tories will always get in im afraid. Brexit policy trumps everything else.

And yet the Tories will always get in im afraid. Brexit policy trumps everything else.

gave lots of thought to that...

Loves a U - Turn

Politicians make all the tough decisions, and then have to put a front on to hide or show what they believe their supporters want to see from them. But in regards to the “big” decisions, I’m not going to pretend there’s a perfect individual on this planet who knows exactly what the right decisions are at every given time.

Politics is an impossible conversation if we’re talking about opinions. I don’t really mind Boris, I get him and the Torries haven’t made what I believe to be the right choices or the ones that make the most sense to me, but you have to remember they have advisers and scientific experts giving out dozens of alternatives and claiming the decisions we eventually decide to do is the best option for x reason.

I’m cool with people hating on a politician or a party etc, hell I might even agree with you on some/most things. But don’t get too passionate about it, nobody wins when talking about politics really, especially a bunch of football fans who don’t know too much about the ins and outs of it.

The academic year of 2019/2020 should be scrapped and started again in September 2020 with exams taking place in May/June 2021. This solution would not be perfect but it is the nearest anyone will get to a level playing field. Of course the Government won't take this option because of the extra cost and the Universities moaning about losing a year's worth of new students.

As for Boris you could compare him to his hero Churchill. They both had one primary job to accomplish, Churchill to win the Second World War and Boris to complete BREXIT. As all round PM's both were f**king hopeless and Churchill was shown the door once the war was won and I suspect the same will happen to Boris once we are out of Europe.

They are a complete and utter shambles!!

and whatever method you use there will be a big chunk of students unhappy.. do you have the keep all happy answer ?

Poor little darlings, didn't you know they are all grade A students this year, and if it wasn't for the government they would all be in Oxford!

Boris Johnson that’s him.

Plus fucked up the virus from day one , slow on everything and backtracked

And now


Boris Johnson four days ago: “Let's be in no doubt about it, the exam results that we've got today are robust, they're good, they're dependable for employers.” Not a single claim in that sentence was true, was it Prime Minister?



The Govt’s 2020 coronavirus crisis results so far:

PPE - shambles.
Care homes - shambles.
Late lockdown - shambles.
Testing - shambles.
Face masks - shambles.
Quarantine - shambles.
Schools - shambles.



Apparently, Spaffer Johnson hates this photo...so whatever you do don't share it.

Annis you left out the way he dealt with his buddy taking car out to test his blurred vision Shambles

Friends daughter had a B last year in one subject but need an A. She decided to resit the year on one subject to get the A.

She had an A in her mocks and predicted an A*.... Algorithm gave her a C

She already had a B from last year

Fortunately now been sorted to an A*, not pleasant for her opening the C result though!