New Zealand v Britain coronavirus

Hello all, I'm going to put the cat amongst the pigeons a bit here, apologies in advance for starting a thread so soon after joining but I didnt want to interfere with the top cat updates on the main coronavirus thread which imo are the best about including msm, I have been going on there to get my information instead of tv, radio etc for the past few months and have told everyone to do the same.

What the hell has this country been doing? New Zealand have just announced its Covid free, I admit it's a smaller country but why has their response been a million times better than ours? Why has the New Zealand prime minister been a million times better than ours?

New Zealand, less than 50 deaths, let that sink in. Less than 50 deaths where ours is around 50,000. Plus the massive extra strain our deaths and caring for people with the virus puts on our economy.


We are an island, so are New Zealand, why did we not close the borders and go full lockdown like the New Zealand prime minister did and insisted on doing? Why hasn't this country got a politician with the foresight and courage to do the right thing for the good of the people? When I watch the New Zealand prime minister speak (shes labour and very patriotic by the way) and the pride she takes in protecting her people. She puts our politicians of all parties to shame.

Surely when this is over and the full British death toll is in Boris Johnson and the whole of the British government should resign.

Undoubtedly NZ have done well and their leader is a good egg. But you can't really compare. NZ isn't a major international hub. I think its pretty much agreed the virus was in Europe well before the first reported cases. Studies now suggesting as early as October.

You said yourself the populations vary hugely, let alone the density, The ethnicity, The social norms, I could carry on...

Here's a good read by a German about his experiences in NZ and comparing to his native country.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politi ... rules/amp/

Sack the leaders of Germany, Spain, Italy, France, US, Brazil and number of other countries too? All because their response wasn't as clean NZ?

Why can't we celebrate the fact that one country is out of this mess without making it political?

Undoubtedly NZ have done well and their leader is a good egg. But you can't really compare. NZ isn't a major international hub. I think its pretty much agreed the virus was in Europe well before the first reported cases. Studies now suggesting as early as October.

You said yourself the populations vary hugely, let alone the density, The ethnicity, The social norms, I could carry on...

Here's a good read by a German about his experiences in NZ and comparing to his native country.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politi ... rules/amp/

Sack the leaders of Germany, Spain, Italy, France, US, Brazil and number of other countries too? All because their response wasn't as clean NZ?

Why can't we celebrate the fact that one country is out of this mess without making it political?

Yeah fair point there. It is hard to.compere. I do think European leaders should also consider their position. As we have the benefit of being an island I would have liked just one of our politicians to say this " if you come here and flout our regulations YOU WILL BE DEPORTED: which is what the new Zealand premier says in the below clip. Set your stall out from the start.



https://youtu.be/O-FnIW4T1PM

Undoubtedly NZ have done well and their leader is a good egg. But you can't really compare. NZ isn't a major international hub. I think its pretty much agreed the virus was in Europe well before the first reported cases. Studies now suggesting as early as October.

You said yourself the populations vary hugely, let alone the density, The ethnicity, The social norms, I could carry on...

Here's a good read by a German about his experiences in NZ and comparing to his native country.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politi ... rules/amp/

Sack the leaders of Germany, Spain, Italy, France, US, Brazil and number of other countries too? All because their response wasn't as clean NZ?

Why can't we celebrate the fact that one country is out of this mess without making it political?

Yeah fair point there. It is hard to.compere. I do think European leaders should also consider their position. As we have the benefit of being an island I would have liked just one of our politicians to say this " if you come here and flout our regulations YOU WILL BE DEPORTED: which is what the new Zealand premier says in the below clip. Set your stall out from the start.



https://youtu.be/O-FnIW4T1PM

I think the problem is we have a lot of dickheads who are our own.

Look at VE day street parties, the Beaches and parks and to top it off the latest protests.

These people have been here all along!

Undoubtedly NZ have done well and their leader is a good egg. But you can't really compare. NZ isn't a major international hub. I think its pretty much agreed the virus was in Europe well before the first reported cases. Studies now suggesting as early as October.

You said yourself the populations vary hugely, let alone the density, The ethnicity, The social norms, I could carry on...

Here's a good read by a German about his experiences in NZ and comparing to his native country.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politi ... rules/amp/

Sack the leaders of Germany, Spain, Italy, France, US, Brazil and number of other countries too? All because their response wasn't as clean NZ?

Why can't we celebrate the fact that one country is out of this mess without making it political?

Yeah fair point there. It is hard to.compere. I do think European leaders should also consider their position. As we have the benefit of being an island I would have liked just one of our politicians to say this " if you come here and flout our regulations YOU WILL BE DEPORTED: which is what the new Zealand premier says in the below clip. Set your stall out from the start.



https://youtu.be/O-FnIW4T1PM

I think the problem is we have a lot of dickheads who are our own.

Look at VE day street parties, the Beaches and parks and to top it off the latest protests.

These people have been here all along!

Its looks like the VE day celebrations have passed through without effect as all the numbers have been falling through the period when they're likely to have shown. There must have been some degree of responsibility although no doubt some will have got out of hand and were irresponsible. Like the beaches, marches, street parties and raves we keep hearing about. Lets hope they pass through without burdening the NHS as well.

It's a silly comparison we no more sparsely populated areas suffer much less from this disease. The stats are everywhere and on your doorstep. New Zealand covers 50% more land area then the UK and has a population smaller than north London. Its links with the outside world a mere fraction of those of the UK. The entire country has less international air traffic than Luton airport. Nobody goes there by train and very few be sea.

Although we've observed the rules we're naturally uncompliant. I was reading a bit on the weekend about the Singapore and their people have finally started protesting - They're thinking about fitting the entire nation with electronic tags. In true Singaporian style the protest has to date been online. Never compare us with the nations who are adopting procedures we wouldn't except. I've heard a number of people critical of the general Gov performance to this crisis who go on to say, they have no intention of being part of the NHS test and trace app should that ever get off the ground. If that's your position then fair enough but you should lose all moral credibility if you then compare us with countries who have adopted such measures.

Fair enough to compare us with nations with a similar profile France, Spain, Italy Belgium, Germany, The Netherlands etc but the real analysis comes with comparing all of us with others. Clearly Germany has faired much better than the rest but it too has faired significantly worse than say Poland, Ukraine and Azerbaijan, to name 3 but I could have named 20, indeed every single former soviet block country. Why is that ? It cant be the health service and it cant be their Diagnostics. It suggests that poverty may not be the factor we think it is. Less natural integration possibly a factor. They are of course born compliant and maybe a little more scared than we are in the west. Maybe they're bodies are better at fighting sickness having not been filled with medicines from day one of the their life.

Undoubtedly NZ have done well and their leader is a good egg. But you can't really compare. NZ isn't a major international hub. I think its pretty much agreed the virus was in Europe well before the first reported cases. Studies now suggesting as early as October.

You said yourself the populations vary hugely, let alone the density, The ethnicity, The social norms, I could carry on...

Here's a good read by a German about his experiences in NZ and comparing to his native country.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politi ... rules/amp/

Sack the leaders of Germany, Spain, Italy, France, US, Brazil and number of other countries too? All because their response wasn't as clean NZ?

Why can't we celebrate the fact that one country is out of this mess without making it political?

Yeah fair point there. It is hard to.compere. I do think European leaders should also consider their position. As we have the benefit of being an island I would have liked just one of our politicians to say this " if you come here and flout our regulations YOU WILL BE DEPORTED: which is what the new Zealand premier says in the below clip. Set your stall out from the start.



https://youtu.be/O-FnIW4T1PM

I think the problem is we have a lot of dickheads who are our own.

Look at VE day street parties, the Beaches and parks and to top it off the latest protests.

These people have been here all along!

Its looks like the VE day celebrations have passed through without effect as all the numbers have been falling through the period when they're likely to have shown. There must have been some degree of responsibility although no doubt some will have got out of hand and were irresponsible. Like the beaches, marches, street parties and raves we keep hearing about. Lets hope they pass through without burdening the NHS as well.

It's a silly comparison we no more sparsely populated areas suffer much less from this disease. The stats are everywhere and on your doorstep. New Zealand covers 50% more land area then the UK and has a population smaller than north London. Its links with the outside world a mere fraction of those of the UK. The entire country has less international air traffic than Luton airport. Nobody goes there by train and very few be sea.

Although we've observed the rules we're naturally uncompliant. I was reading a bit on the weekend about the Singapore and their people have finally started protesting - They're thinking about fitting the entire nation with electronic tags. In true Singaporian style the protest has to date been online. Never compare us with the nations who are adopting procedures we wouldn't except. I've heard a number of people critical of the general Gov performance to this crisis who go on to say, they have no intention of being part of the NHS test and trace app should that ever get off the ground. If that's your position then fair enough but you should lose all moral credibility if you then compare us with countries who have adopted such measures.

Fair enough to compare us with nations with a similar profile France, Spain, Italy Belgium, Germany, The Netherlands etc but the real analysis comes with comparing all of us with others. Clearly Germany has faired much better than the rest but it too has faired significantly worse than say Poland, Ukraine and Azerbaijan, to name 3 but I could have named 20, indeed every single former soviet block country. Why is that ? It cant be the health service and it cant be their Diagnostics. It suggests that poverty may not be the factor we think it is. Less natural integration possibly a factor. They are of course born compliant and maybe a little more scared than we are in the west. Maybe they're bodies are better at fighting sickness having not been filled with medicines from day one of the their life.

You make solid arguments but to fly and continue to fly people into this country from places we knew were coronavirus hot spots (China, New York, Italy) without so much as a temperature check was at best negligent and ar worst criminal. We had a massive advantage on other European countries in that we are an island. We did not use it.

It's about leadership, She had it we didnt



https://twitter.com/brexit_sham/status/ ... 60737?s=19

SCOTLAND population approx 5 mill , over 2,500 deaths

SCOTLAND population approx 5 mill , over 2,500 deaths

Your point is very valid The only defensive I can give Scotland is NZ has nearly three and a half times the area Making social distancing harder but I don’t think that really covers the vast difference in numbers thou

SCOTLAND population approx 5 mill , over 2,500 deaths

Your point is very valid The only defensive I can give Scotland is NZ has nearly three and a half times the area Making social distancing harder but I don’t think that really covers the vast difference in numbers thou

We could go on and on and prove Boris/Uk were late on everything and got it wrong, they should of listened more to other countries and would of saved more older peoples lives.

This is pointless comparison. Turkmenistan has roughly the same population as NZ and hasn’t had any reported deaths, what was NZ doing wrong.

The four most global cities are with different reports swapping Tokyo and Paris

1 New York
2 London
3 Tokyo
4 Paris

There’s a trend there. And with the UK and to a lesser extent France being relatively small countries with their capital as the hub of all things it was inevitable they were going to hardest hit. I wouldn’t mind betting a fair chunk of the globes flights are in-between these four cities as well as a highly efficient train service.

It was in Europe in Jan/Feb and exploded in March by then it was too late. Hindsight is wonderful

The yanks stopped Chinese flights very early, but let flight after flight from Europe enter. By the time everyone had realised this was the real deal it was too late.

I have no idea why everyone make this so political. Whatever MPS were elected labour, tories or nationalists the government is the institution in the shape of the dept of health and thus civil servants who somehow even though the top ones earn twice as much as MP's and have jobs for life are beyond any criticism. One thing I know is Matt Hancock or any of his predecessors never had to order hand gel, face masks or ventilators.

SCOTLAND population approx 5 mill , over 2,500 deaths

Your point is very valid The only defensive I can give Scotland is NZ has nearly three and a half times the area Making social distancing harder but I don’t think that really covers the vast difference in numbers thou

We could go on and on and prove Boris/Uk were late on everything and got it wrong, they should of listened more to other countries and would of saved more older peoples lives.

I'd sack Stugeun as well Annis. Useless.

It's not a true comparison, it's like comparing a pea with a mango.

As said very well below, we are an international hub and have people travelling in and out from all over the World and we have millions of people living here from all over the world especially Europe.

Added to that we are overpopulated and have too much movement in and out.

Then we were too slow to lockdown and stop large gatherings (with hindsight) and finally, the NHS/government allowed people out of the hospitals and into care homes and spread the virus.

New Zealand have done a brilliant job, but it's not fair to compare with the UK and the way it flew through the community undetected.

The UK government set up emergency stock of PPE in 2009.. Some how they forgot to include masks gowns and bodybags.
Greece went into lockdown 3 weeks before us 170 deaths.
Then we had a P. M who declared he would carry on shaking hands.
Our borders were open to anybody. Quaintine should have been introduced at the start not the end
My opinion the government took their eye off the ball because of Brexit

Perhaps we cannot compare ourselves with NZ but we are an island so we certainly shouldn’t have the highest number of deaths in Europe? Look at Germany in the centre of Europe but we have almost ten times the number of deaths!

The UK government set up emergency stock of PPE in 2009.. Some how they forgot to include masks gowns and bodybags.
Greece went into lockdown 3 weeks before us 170 deaths.
Then we had a P. M who declared he would carry on shaking hands.
Our borders were open to anybody. Quaintine should have been introduced at the start not the end
My opinion the government took their eye off the ball because of Brexit

I would agree Brexit took the whole government a full year to get out, and virtually nothing else was done last year, add to that the Prime Minister almost died, it's been a difficult time to govern the Country.

Those feckers trying to stop democracy should be taking some of the stick for the problems we are facing now, Bercow and his gang of losers!

Cheers Booby B

Just to add Greece was another country who got it right .