Sunderland and why football is screwed

I'm watching the 2nd series of Sunderland till I die.

Sunderland League 1.

He just said the players wage bill is £34 million but what shocked me is he says the 'non playing wage bill' is £12 million, that sounds like an awfull lot to me, if 100 non playing staff were on 25k a year that's only 2.5 million, how many non playing staff does a club even have, how can you get to that amount on non playing staff? No wonder football is fucked.

just read that Spurs have 550 non playing staff.. seems an awful lot of people ?

I had to rewind it mate to make sure I was hearing it right.

550 is also crazy, how do you get to that unless it includes stewards?

I had to rewind it mate to make sure I was hearing it right.

550 is also crazy, how do you get to that unless it includes stewards?

no idea who it includes but I have thought a few times when our club accounts have been put up that the wage bill makes no sense..
football clubs seem to have changed an awful lot over a relatively short space of time..

I had to rewind it mate to make sure I was hearing it right.

550 is also crazy, how do you get to that unless it includes stewards?

no idea who it includes but I have thought a few times when our club accounts have been put up that the wage bill makes no sense..
football clubs seem to have changed an awful lot over a relatively short space of time..

Does that not include stewards, bar staffs, waiting staffs, ticket sellers, programme sellers and a whole host more?

I know the MillStad (or whatever they call it these days) has a match day staff in the thousands and they are pretty much all classed as employees and paid/taxed accordingly

I had to rewind it mate to make sure I was hearing it right.

550 is also crazy, how do you get to that unless it includes stewards?

no idea who it includes but I have thought a few times when our club accounts have been put up that the wage bill makes no sense..
football clubs seem to have changed an awful lot over a relatively short space of time..

Does that not include stewards, bar staffs, waiting staffs, ticket sellers, programme sellers and a whole host more?

I know the MillStad (or whatever they call it these days) has a match day staff in the thousands and they are pretty much all classed as employees and paid/taxed accordingly

I don't know mate...I assumed the majority of those you mentioned were agency staff or employed by the caterers .
would love to see a breakdown..

Look,I know times have changed a lot but i can remember nearly all the stewards at NP,if you went in the bob bank you’d see the same ones every game,same for the other stands.
Now it’s an army of people decked in lanyards every 2 foot,I always think to myself,crikey these are all on a wage and what exactly are they doing ,it’s the same wherever you go,even after 4/5 checks god help you if you lose your ticket,surely it doesn’t take that many to ensure a smooth run.

I had to rewind it mate to make sure I was hearing it right.

550 is also crazy, how do you get to that unless it includes stewards?

no idea who it includes but I have thought a few times when our club accounts have been put up that the wage bill makes no sense..
football clubs seem to have changed an awful lot over a relatively short space of time..

Does that not include stewards, bar staffs, waiting staffs, ticket sellers, programme sellers and a whole host more?

I know the MillStad (or whatever they call it these days) has a match day staff in the thousands and they are pretty much all classed as employees and paid/taxed accordingly

I don't know mate...I assumed the majority of those you mentioned were agency staff or employed by the caterers .
would love to see a breakdown..

Probably changes from club/sport to club/sport but I know the MillStad employ most of their match day staffs, so they are on their books as official employees

Even if it includes Stewards/Matchday Staff I'm still amazed that as a League 1 Club Sunderland 'non playing' wage bill was £12 Million.

I just can't work out how and would love to see a breakdown? Having said that, I just finished the series and they had 3 girls working in the Marketing Department that on the face of the programme did bugger all and the one girl disappeared in about episode 4/5 clearly she couldn't handle the new guys way of doing things, which was abrasive but he was just protecting the Clubs interests tbf and I don't blame him, the Club been haemorrhaging money for years.

I know things adds up, but most of the matchday staff won't earn a lot, probably less than a grand each over a season so they must have been paying some heavy wages out elsewhere to the Full Time 'non playing staff'.

Even if it includes Stewards/Matchday Staff I'm still amazed that as a League 1 Club Sunderland 'non playing' wage bill was £12 Million.

I just can't work out how and would love to see a breakdown? Having said that, I just finished the series and they had 3 girls working in the Marketing Department that on the face of the programme did bugger all and the one girl disappeared in about episode 4/5 clearly she couldn't handle the new guys way of doing things, which was abrasive but he was just protecting the Clubs interests tbf and I don't blame him, the Club been haemorrhaging money for years.

I know things adds up, but most of the matchday staff won't earn a lot, probably less than a grand each over a season so they must have been paying some heavy wages out elsewhere to the Full Time 'non playing staff'.

my take on match day staff as always been those working in the food outlets work for the caterers.. and stewards are either agency who also do other events too { I know a couple who regularly do both our games and those at the liberty } or are employed by the club on a casual basis.

non playing staff could also mean, the boardroom getting money, the owners/chairmen might be taking out a few mill for their own expense. however its easy to see, staff such as coaches etc, will earn more than the suggested "25k" a year as someone previously mentioned.

staff includes cleaners at both stadium, training facilties, academy, cooks, security, stewards, coaches, manager, physios, doctors, ticket department, marketing department, lawyers, etc. so this all sounds rather normal, its just people are shocked because no one else in the league pays anywhere near as much, but then none of the other clubs are anywhere as big as sunderland

non playing staff could also mean, the boardroom getting money, the owners/chairmen might be taking out a few mill for their own expense. however its easy to see, staff such as coaches etc, will earn more than the suggested "25k" a year as someone previously mentioned.

staff includes cleaners at both stadium, training facilties, academy, cooks, security, stewards, coaches, manager, physios, doctors, ticket department, marketing department, lawyers, etc. so this all sounds rather normal, its just people are shocked because no one else in the league pays anywhere near as much, but then none of the other clubs are anywhere as big as sunderland

Wouldn't the manager and coaching staff also be classed 'non-playing staff?'

non playing staff could also mean, the boardroom getting money, the owners/chairmen might be taking out a few mill for their own expense. however its easy to see, staff such as coaches etc, will earn more than the suggested "25k" a year as someone previously mentioned.

staff includes cleaners at both stadium, training facilties, academy, cooks, security, stewards, coaches, manager, physios, doctors, ticket department, marketing department, lawyers, etc. so this all sounds rather normal, its just people are shocked because no one else in the league pays anywhere near as much, but then none of the other clubs are anywhere as big as sunderland

Wouldn't the manager and coaching staff also be classed 'non-playing staff?'

They would mate yeah, I guess.

And I get where Bluebird04 is coming from but coaches don't earn that much, even if your manager was on £1 Million a year and he had 3 coaches on £150,000 a year each, that's less than £1.5 million, academy coaches etc don't earn a lot, ticket office staff, cleaners, caterers etc probably on minimum wage.

£12 Million is a big figure to come to, we won't know unless we see a breakdown though I guess, I can't find anything online other than that Sunderland were chucking money about like it was confetti

Ill have a play and I might be miles off (Annual Salaries)

CEO £1 Million a year
Say they were paying their manager £1 Million
4 First Team Coaches on £150,000
Physio on £70,000
Club Doctor £100,000
Club Chef £50,000
5 Full Time Catering Staff £25,000
Kit Man £30,000
Head of Marketing £70,000
2 x Marketing Staff £35,000
Club Receptionist x 2 £30,000 (£60,000)
Ticket Office Manager £30,000
6 x Full Time Ticket Office staff £15,000 each (£105,000)
6 x Full Time Cleaners £15,000 each (£105,000)
The Cost of hiring 100 Stewards at £9 an hour for 6 hours per game over 23 games - £124,000
The Cost of hiring 50 Catering staff at £9 an for 6 hours per game of 23 games - £62,000
Club Solicitor £250,000 a year?
25 other random staff members earning say £25,000 a year each - £625,000

All that comes to £4 and a half million. so you got 7 and a half million to play with on top of that lot to get to Sunderland 'non playing wage bill' of £12 Million

I don't think the boardroom getting money comes under 'wage bill', the wage bill is that isn't it, any directors dividends etc would be classed as separate.

non playing staff could also mean, the boardroom getting money, the owners/chairmen might be taking out a few mill for their own expense. however its easy to see, staff such as coaches etc, will earn more than the suggested "25k" a year as someone previously mentioned.

staff includes cleaners at both stadium, training facilties, academy, cooks, security, stewards, coaches, manager, physios, doctors, ticket department, marketing department, lawyers, etc. so this all sounds rather normal, its just people are shocked because no one else in the league pays anywhere near as much, but then none of the other clubs are anywhere as big as sunderland

Wouldn't the manager and coaching staff also be classed 'non-playing staff?'

involved with 1st team ..ive seen that mentioned quite a bit...I suppose it means whatever you want it to mean { club to club } ?

non playing staff could also mean, the boardroom getting money, the owners/chairmen might be taking out a few mill for their own expense. however its easy to see, staff such as coaches etc, will earn more than the suggested "25k" a year as someone previously mentioned.

staff includes cleaners at both stadium, training facilties, academy, cooks, security, stewards, coaches, manager, physios, doctors, ticket department, marketing department, lawyers, etc. so this all sounds rather normal, its just people are shocked because no one else in the league pays anywhere near as much, but then none of the other clubs are anywhere as big as sunderland

Wouldn't the manager and coaching staff also be classed 'non-playing staff?'

They would mate yeah, I guess.

And I get where Bluebird04 is coming from but coaches don't earn that much, even if your manager was on £1 Million a year and he had 3 coaches on £150,000 a year each, that's less than £1.5 million, academy coaches etc don't earn a lot, ticket office staff, cleaners, caterers etc probably on minimum wage.

£12 Million is a big figure to come to, we won't know unless we see a breakdown though I guess, I can't find anything online other than that Sunderland were chucking money about like it was confetti

Ill have a play and I might be miles off (Annual Salaries)

CEO £1 Million a year
Say they were paying their manager £1 Million
4 First Team Coaches on £150,000
Physio on £70,000
Club Doctor £100,000
Club Chef £50,000
5 Full Time Catering Staff £25,000
Kit Man £30,000
Head of Marketing £70,000
2 x Marketing Staff £35,000
Club Receptionist x 2 £30,000 (£60,000)
Ticket Office Manager £30,000
6 x Full Time Ticket Office staff £15,000 each (£105,000)
6 x Full Time Cleaners £15,000 each (£105,000)
The Cost of hiring 100 Stewards at £9 an hour for 6 hours per game over 23 games - £124,000
The Cost of hiring 50 Catering staff at £9 an for 6 hours per game of 23 games - £62,000
Club Solicitor £250,000 a year?
25 other random staff members earning say £25,000 a year each - £625,000

All that comes to £4 and a half million. so you got 7 and a half million to play with on top of that lot to get to Sunderland 'non playing wage bill' of £12 Million

I don't think the boardroom getting money comes under 'wage bill', the wage bill is that isn't it, any directors dividends etc would be classed as separate.

so in the documentary, you see the two guys who own the club, and they keep showing a spanish guy whom i think was like a executive so there could be 3 guys who are receiving a big pay.

you have the manager, assistant manager and his coaches, you usually have fitness coach, goalkeeping coach, and alot of clubs have coaching for different positions. clubs usually have two physios, a club doctor

when it showed the kitman there was about 5 guys all sorting the kits out, you usually have staff for the academy, the training facility, and the stadium. when ever they had marketing meetings, there was usually between 4-6 people in the room for meetings. you had the ticket staff, but then had a backroom where other people ran the ticketing department.

you have scouting departments, people who work on the online side of things, analyst departments, club shop employees etc

man utd, i know are a much bigger club than sunderland, but they have announced they have just put around 900 non playing staff on furlough.

they could also be paying off former managers, e.g. coleman, so rather than one big payoff, its in installments. i dont know where players they released count as non playing staff, same as academy players i don't know if they count as non playing staff.

i probably have done myself justice trying to explain the above, but i can see how a club can spend a silly amount on non playing staff. i would love to see how much we are spending.