I can only see us paying & dragged through the mud again

Personally I can only see us paying, dragged through the mud again and costs/lawyers costing us fortunes


Dalman says in here:

And now does not deny that Emilano Sala was registered as a Cardiff player, the reasons he gives in a quite a few pages is that others should take responsibility due to them organising Sala’s return to Cardiff.
Plus Nantes are to blame , he only blames agents.

The problem is Emiliano Sala was registered as a Cardiff City player with the Welsh FA and Nantes have proved it with the right paper work.

As from day one, I see Cardiff having to pay it all, with costs and big lawyers fees.


Dalman:


“There remain so many unanswered questions.”

“If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?


“A club of our size do not have vast resources.”

“It is obvious we cannot hand over £15million . . .  without heading toward bankruptcy.”

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I just cant see the club fighting tooth and nail if it was as simple as you make it sound.

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

I just cant see the club fighting tooth and nail if it was as simple as you make it sound.

Tan fights everything

DJ/PR/SH/OG and lost every case costing our club fortunes in lawyers.

Tan from day one told Dalman/Choo to fight it all the way and I heard he went berserk at them two.

They have already been fighting tooth and nail and lost, now appealing.

We lose so much money in cases/lawyers is etc

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

That’s our main problem insurance ??

I just cant see the club fighting tooth and nail if it was as simple as you make it sound.

Tan fights everything

DJ/PR/SH/OG and lost every case costing our club fortunes in lawyers.

Tan from day one told Dalman/Choo to fight it all the way and I heard he went berserk at them two.

They have already been fighting tooth and nail and lost, now appealing.

We lose so much money in cases/lawyers is etc

We didn't lose, FIFA made it clear they would not look at the legalities involved so i don't see that as lost.

I just cant see the club fighting tooth and nail if it was as simple as you make it sound.

Tan fights everything

DJ/PR/SH/OG and lost every case costing our club fortunes in lawyers.

Tan from day one told Dalman/Choo to fight it all the way and I heard he went berserk at them two.

They have already been fighting tooth and nail and lost, now appealing.

We lose so much money in cases/lawyers is etc

We didn't lose, FIFA made it clear they would not look at the legalities involved so i don't see that as lost.

Here we go again

The case was ordered against us so we lost .


What else does that mean, please explain??

:happy1:

I just cant see the club fighting tooth and nail if it was as simple as you make it sound.

Tan fights everything

DJ/PR/SH/OG and lost every case costing our club fortunes in lawyers.

Tan from day one told Dalman/Choo to fight it all the way and I heard he went berserk at them two.

They have already been fighting tooth and nail and lost, now appealing.

We lose so much money in cases/lawyers is etc

We didn't lose, FIFA made it clear they would not look at the legalities involved so i don't see that as lost.

Here we go again

The case was ordered against us so we lost .


What else does that mean, please explain??

Fifa cannot judge on any legalities of the legal contract, only wether the player registration was complete.
I dont think cardiff are appealing wether the registration went through they are appealing the legal side of the actual contract of sale and any negligence regarding that.

How many times have you seen with us

Transfer complete awaiting international clearance?

Just being used as another stick to beat Mr Tan with!!


This ain't black and white so best left to experts rather than dragged up on numerous threads ( for hits ?? ) which must be upsetting for any friends and family who pick up on it through social media crap.

Annis its not costing our club anything VT paid for all the lawyers etc out of his own pocket, (no costs to the club in the accounts) and we have not lost until the court of arbitration says we have. when someone is found guilty in a court of law and appeal against it until the appeal fails they are not classed as guilty, only guilty when convicted.

Annis its not costing our club anything VT paid for all the lawyers etc out of his own pocket, (no costs to the club in the accounts) and we have not lost until the court of arbitration says we have. when someone is found guilty in a court of law and appeal against it until the appeal fails they are not classed as guilty, only guilty when convicted.

Ok out of his own pocket.

It’s a Cardiff City matter so the club will be paying.

I would love to see all the itemised expenses every year.

Every year we get a massive income from tv, sky, sponsors , merchandise, tickets sales, but some how now what our outgoings are more.

Lately even fans who don’t usually question why we are still losing £millions are now asking ??

As to the case yes it went against us we lost, but as we are appealing then everything is on hold until the outcome of the appeal.

Just being used as another stick to beat Mr Tan with!!


This ain't black and white so best left to experts rather than dragged up on numerous threads ( for hits ?? ) which must be upsetting for any friends and family who pick up on it through social media crap.

Jules,
Actually all this week and last week everything on here has been put out by Media Wales & The Daily Telegraph.

We can’t sweep it under the carpet to suit some of you.

Everything should be put out, good and bad


Our Chairman has spoken and we should be allowed say what we feel, not be silenced like you always want.

Everything that can be put out there (good, bad and indifferent, depending on individual views) should be put out there

My only question is "Do City have a right to question the sale/events surrounding the Sala transfer and his subsequent handling?

If, as seems clear, the answer is yes, then City (like FC Nantes in response) are doing what they see as being best for themselves and most in their position would do the same and I cannot see why the club should be 'dragged through the mud' for defending their own ground?

Irrespective of the ultimate decision by the courts Cardiff are not coming out of this looking good.

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

This is probably quite close to actual position. I don't know but this action might even be funded by our insurance company on the basis that it might well remove/reduce their liability even if we are found liable.

Similarly the insurers might well have told the club(s) they won't pay out until there has been a legally binding finding as to liability.

This is all pretty standard practise and I don't know why people are so surprised.

I haven't got a clue whether we're liable of not; but even if we are I don't see any problem in ensuring there is a finding on liability.

My only question is "Do City have a right to question the sale/events surrounding the Sala transfer and his subsequent handling?

If, as seems clear, the answer is yes, then City (like FC Nantes in response) are doing what they see as being best for themselves and most in their position would do the same and I cannot see why the club should be 'dragged through the mud' for defending their own ground?

That's how I see it aswell Sven.

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

That has always been my opinion.

Annis its not costing our club anything VT paid for all the lawyers etc out of his own pocket, (no costs to the club in the accounts) and we have not lost until the court of arbitration says we have. when someone is found guilty in a court of law and appeal against it until the appeal fails they are not classed as guilty, only guilty when convicted.

Ok out of his own pocket.

It’s a Cardiff City matter so the club will be paying.

I would love to see all the itemised expenses every year.

Every year we get a massive income from tv, sky, sponsors , merchandise, tickets sales, but some how now what our outgoings are more.

Lately even fans who don’t usually question why we are still losing £millions are now asking ??

As to the case yes it went against us we lost, but as we are appealing then everything is on hold until the outcome of the appeal.

Annis

As the poster you are replying to said, the costs of the legal action are being paid for by Vincent Tan personally so NO cost to the club even though it is a club matter.

Because I have been privileged to see detailed historical accounts of the club I can say that there is no evidence to show that VT takes anything out of the club by way of remuneration, management charges or dividends ( which he couldn’t take legally anyway in the case of dividends).

The club has NOT received a massive income from t.v or Sky in the past. The kind of income only really started to benefit the club last season ( which will be reflected in the May 2019 accounts when published) and, to a lesser extent this season with parachute payments which are at a level about half of last year’s broadcasting income.

Why are fans saying the club is still losing £millions as if it shouldn’t be? The club lost money in the year to 31 May 2018 but a large part of the loss was down to paying promotion bonuses.The May 2019 accounts haven’t been published but I expect them to show a profit. This season’s results won’t be known for some time but won’t be as good as last season’s because costs such as player wages won’ t have been brought down as quickly or as much as the fall in broadcasting income.

FIFA themselves only look at a narrow part of the whole dispute between CCFC and Nantes, as they have admired hence the appeal to CAS who will look at the whole legal picture and rule accordingly

Having spoken to Mehmet , what he was trying to say in his ( edited) statement was that the directors of the club have a fiduciary duty in law to make only authorised proper payments for the benefit of the club and if instead they made payments only on the basis of public pressure or to settle disputed claims then the directors would run the risk of personal bankruptcy and the club would run the risk of insolvency.

Hope this clarifies some of the points raised.

Regardless of everything else.

This is amateurish and embarrassing from the people who are running the club. So many dumb things happened in all of this why does it only happen here.

I don’t think any other club would have handled it like we have.

I don’t think any other club would have handled it like we have.

For once I slightly agree with you,only because this was the 1st such event in football,so hopefully others will have learned from it,but you cannot presume how other clubs would have handled it,if we'd have just handed over £15m,then spent years chasing it back,through whatever channels ,that would be wrong in some people's eyes,especially if it was money we could use elswherethe club has decided to do it this way,for their reasons they have said,and I have no doubt,it will be paid if they lose the case,either way I for one will be happy when it's ended,and we can move on with football.

It is an assumption entirely. But similar assumptions have been made on this thread about us acting as any other club would do in the situation. I think they wouldn’t have. I do wonder though had we stayed up would we have paid up.

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

Insurance companies and lawyers don't decide anything when it comes to the fee. FIFA decided then CAS, once CAS decide then it doesn't matter what insurance companies or lawyers say.

Personally I can only see us paying, dragged through the mud again and costs/lawyers costing us fortunes


Dalman says in here:

And now does not deny that Emilano Sala was registered as a Cardiff player, the reasons he gives in a quite a few pages is that others should take responsibility due to them organising Sala’s return to Cardiff.
Plus Nantes are to blame , he only blames agents.

The problem is Emiliano Sala was registered as a Cardiff City player with the Welsh FA and Nantes have proved it with the right paper work.

As from day one, I see Cardiff having to pay it all, with costs and big lawyers fees.


Dalman:


“There remain so many unanswered questions.”

“If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?


“A club of our size do not have vast resources.”

“It is obvious we cannot hand over £15million . . .  without heading toward bankruptcy.”

I find Dalman's comments not only disrespectful but totally misinformed and misguided.

What does he mean by:-

''If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?''

It is a ludicrous argument to make. Nobody made a decision on the clubs behalf, it was a personal trip not a professional one. Players travel, they are people - they do it every day. The club offered to pay for a very inconvenient budget flight, he refused and chose another mode of transport - as is his right to do so.

For him to say Sala was not allowed to decide how he travelled in his own free time is barmy and a key indicator that their argument lacks any sort of sense whatsoever. This will be a very quick CAS hearing, can only hope his ''bankrupt'' statement was more a threat than reality.

Of course, we won't pay unless it's proved we have too, the same point has been done to death for years!!!!

Not one person on here would pay if it was there money!

Personally I can only see us paying, dragged through the mud again and costs/lawyers costing us fortunes


Dalman says in here:

And now does not deny that Emilano Sala was registered as a Cardiff player, the reasons he gives in a quite a few pages is that others should take responsibility due to them organising Sala’s return to Cardiff.
Plus Nantes are to blame , he only blames agents.

The problem is Emiliano Sala was registered as a Cardiff City player with the Welsh FA and Nantes have proved it with the right paper work.

As from day one, I see Cardiff having to pay it all, with costs and big lawyers fees.


Dalman:


“There remain so many unanswered questions.”

“If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?


“A club of our size do not have vast resources.”

“It is obvious we cannot hand over £15million . . .  without heading toward bankruptcy.”

I find Dalman's comments not only disrespectful but totally misinformed and misguided.

What does he mean by:-

''If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?''

It is a ludicrous argument to make. Nobody made a decision on the clubs behalf, it was a personal trip not a professional one. Players travel, they are people - they do it every day. The club offered to pay for a very inconvenient budget flight, he refused and chose another mode of transport - as is his right to do so.

For him to say Sala was not allowed to decide how he travelled in his own free time is barmy and a key indicator that their argument lacks any sort of sense whatsoever. This will be a very quick CAS hearing, can only hope his ''bankrupt'' statement was more a threat than reality.

Obsessed.

Personally I can only see us paying, dragged through the mud again and costs/lawyers costing us fortunes


Dalman says in here:

And now does not deny that Emilano Sala was registered as a Cardiff player, the reasons he gives in a quite a few pages is that others should take responsibility due to them organising Sala’s return to Cardiff.
Plus Nantes are to blame , he only blames agents.

The problem is Emiliano Sala was registered as a Cardiff City player with the Welsh FA and Nantes have proved it with the right paper work.

As from day one, I see Cardiff having to pay it all, with costs and big lawyers fees.


Dalman:


“There remain so many unanswered questions.”

“If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?


“A club of our size do not have vast resources.”

“It is obvious we cannot hand over £15million . . .  without heading toward bankruptcy.”

I find Dalman's comments not only disrespectful but totally misinformed and misguided.

What does he mean by:-

''If the player was an asset of Cardiff, what right did anyone have to make decisions on our behalf about the pilot, the state of the plane and all aspects about the licensing to fly commercially?''

It is a ludicrous argument to make. Nobody made a decision on the clubs behalf, it was a personal trip not a professional one. Players travel, they are people - they do it every day. The club offered to pay for a very inconvenient budget flight, he refused and chose another mode of transport - as is his right to do so.

For him to say Sala was not allowed to decide how he travelled in his own free time is barmy and a key indicator that their argument lacks any sort of sense whatsoever. This will be a very quick CAS hearing, can only hope his ''bankrupt'' statement was more a threat than reality.

bore off Roathy get back on planet shit and write more about your club dropping to a cat 3

bore off Roathy get back on planet shit and write more about your club dropping to a cat 3

Not a shock, said on here in October that cuts would inevitably happen to the academy in terms of category 1 status. It's a PL luxury completely unsustainable in the Championship, but there is another thread on that above please try and keep these on topic.

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

That’s our main problem insurance ??

Not so much insurance as the club's legal team. Lets face it, Mr Tan could pay Nantes £15m without blinking. But that makes it look like its the club's fault ( and like everyone else I have no idea who, if anybody, is really to blame).

Its a difficult decision and unfortunately once business gets involved then the player just becomes a club asset, abhorrent as that is. I'm not saying that's right, but at a time when everyone is clamouring for football clubs to be run as sustainable businesses should we be surprised that the human element is taken out of decisions?

Morally, Emiliano Sala was a Cardiff City player. but if he wasn't [i]legally [i] a Cardiff City player then the club are bound to minimise their liabilities.

As I said in another thread, the lawyers and insurance companies are involved here, and until they have proved who is liable then nothing will be paid to anyone.

That’s our main problem insurance ??

Not so much insurance as the club's legal team. Lets face it, Mr Tan could pay Nantes £15m without blinking. But that makes it look like its the club's fault ( and like everyone else I have no idea who, if anybody, is really to blame).

Its a difficult decision and unfortunately once business gets involved then the player just becomes a club asset, abhorrent as that is. I'm not saying that's right, but at a time when everyone is clamouring for football clubs to be run as sustainable businesses should we be surprised that the human element is taken out of decisions?

Morally, Emiliano Sala was a Cardiff City player. but if he wasn't [i]legally [i] a Cardiff City player then the club are bound to minimise their liabilities.

No legal team in the planet would put together the case they did for FIFA and now presumably CAS. Not even a budget non for profit legal team, it was cringeworthy reading the document released by FIFA.

This has all the hallmarks of a one man protest, that is Vincent Tan. To believe the clubs actions are after legal advice is a huge mistake, doesnt take Einstein to see who is behind it.