UPDATED: " Brexit deal NOT to be agreed tonight "

UPDATED 17/10/19


'Knife-edge' vote for referendum on deal

BBC assistant political editor Norman Smith says Labour has indicated that "it's possible" the party could support a referendum on Boris Johnson's deal.

He says it "significantly strengthens" the chances of a motion for a confirmatory referendum being passed if the party whips its MPs to support it.

But he says the backing of former Tory MPs who rebelled from the party over Brext will be crucial. It looks like a "knife-edge vote", he says.





Problems once again with the DUP over Northern Ireland.



Brexit: DUP rejects deal 'as things stand' as PM heads to EU summit


17 October 2019 UK Politics



The support of Arlene Foster's party, the DUP, is seen as crucial if Prime Minister Boris Johnson is to get his proposed Brexit deal through Parliament


Boris Johnson has suffered a blow to his proposed Brexit deal as the Democratic Unionist Party said it cannot support plans "as things stand".

The support of the Northern Irish party is seen as crucial if the PM is to win Parliament's approval for the deal in time for his 31 October deadline.

The DUP said it would continue to work with the government to try to get a "sensible" deal.

It comes as Mr Johnson heads to a crunch summit to get the EU's approval.








A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

No Deal the only option, as any re-hash of the May Deal would be a betrayal of the original vote

However, I don't blame Boris on this one; it's the non-acceptors of the democratic decision that are to blame 100%

Halfway in or halfway out?

Not an option for me and my preference is to leave completely now Europe has shown its true colours; but if that cannot happen, I'd rather stay in completely and influence from within than be a 2nd Class passenger on a train I cannot stop

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Ooops miss read so it's no deal less get out while we can

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

Agree with you.

But as I said, he has no chance of winning an election. He will do worse than Miliband four years ago. He reached his peak in 2017, and is not capable of bringing in the votes.

Like I said in my above post, things may have been different if Starmer was Leader.

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

Agree with you.

But as I said, he has no chance of winning an election. He will do worse than Miliband four years ago. He reached his peak in 2017, and is not capable of bringing in the votes.

Like I said in my above post, things may have been different if Starmer was Leader.

Yes, agree with both; Corbyn is a spent force, and his options do not include following the real democratic decision of the people. I would also back Sir Keir Starmer; at least he seems to have some decency about him

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

Agree with you.

But as I said, he has no chance of winning an election. He will do worse than Miliband four years ago. He reached his peak in 2017, and is not capable of bringing in the votes.

Like I said in my above post, things may have been different if Starmer was Leader.

Yes, agree with both; Corbyn is a spent force, and his options do not include following the real democratic decision of the people. I would also back Sir Keir Starmer; at least he seems to have some decency about him

Think Corbyn is deluded thinking he will be PM when no one trusts him enough to put him as interim pm!

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

why should the rest of parliament accept it if the DUP and the irish do? the DUP certainly dont represent the complicated tapestry of northern ireland at all

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

theres no way of knowing...no one was asked about the finer details...so everyone is just guessing/assuming what "brexit" meant. some say it meant no deal, but the leave campaign spent millions telling people it would be the "easiest deal in history" so...yknow....it was a silly question to ask to begin with

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

why should the rest of parliament accept it if the DUP and the irish do? the DUP certainly dont represent the complicated tapestry of northern ireland at all

Because without their support it wont get passed parliament as cons are in minority thats why? dup needs to be on board hence PM meeting them today otherwise no point in negotiating a deal... if you remember may failed simple because dup wouldn't back her deal.. : and one news report an hour ago says deal technically as been done so wait and see

No option for waving the white flag

None of the above.....

If a deal can’t be reached then we leave with no deal, no loopholes nothing, we’re out. If a deal can be reached then even better as long as it benefits us more than the EU.

This is the usual EU negotiating tactic...it’s a very odd way to do business and if this was practiced in business would lead to poor relation and mistrust. The Russians do it too and it gets everyone nowhere.

None of the above.....

If a deal can’t be reached then we leave with no deal, no loopholes nothing, we’re out. If a deal can be reached then even better as long as it benefits us more than the EU.

That's one of the options?

For a No Deal, then the Government need to find a way to make this legal. That would mean finding a loophole in the Benn act.

For the record, I agree that No Deal delivers the wish of the referendum. I say this as a remainer.

The worst outcome is a 2nd ref. If remain wins, its irrelevant because it'll be 1-1. If Leave wins again, what happens then? More negotiating or what most people want and No Deal?

No Deal is the only way to deliver what the people voted for. I still don't agree with it but we live in a democracy and it has to be delivered.

Corbyn, McDonnell etc go on about Blair and Campbell. They say they created a world where people didn't believe a word a politician said. But they said they'd honour the referendum result and now seem to be backtracking. Hypocrisy? I think so..

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

Agree with you.

But as I said, he has no chance of winning an election. He will do worse than Miliband four years ago. He reached his peak in 2017, and is not capable of bringing in the votes.

Like I said in my above post, things may have been different if Starmer was Leader.

Yes, agree with both; Corbyn is a spent force, and his options do not include following the real democratic decision of the people. I would also back Sir Keir Starmer; at least he seems to have some decency about him

Chris, the term spent force is spot on.

In the 2015 leadership election I voted for Andy Burnham - who was brilliant on many things, both in government and opposition. But when Corbyn won, I said I would support him as our Leader.

But the sad truth is that his peak popularity has long gone. Even his close ally for years, John McDonnell, is starting to change his tone. Corbyn has believed his own hype and its not a good thing.

I've been lucky in that I've met the last four Labour leaders and their key advisors. Last year I met Corbyn. When I looked him in the eye and I knew he wasn't right for the job. That's as Leader of the Opposition, never mind PM. If I'm being honest, I'm not sure he even wants to do this. But the bloke has a lot of bad advisors, people he had no contact with until he won the party's leadership. He was a controversial figure before, but even more so with the bad advice he's been given. I will always try to listen to and respect the Leader of my party but it has become impossible.

I know Alastair Campbell and Jonathan Powell very well. They have done bad things in Politics and I don't refute that, but they always told me that Miliband and Corbyn were unelectable. They are right.

They have said they have different thoughts on Sir Keir and I agree. He has experience in high office, as a former DPP - which, in fairness, can be harder than being and MP at times. And he has a great knowledge of what's right for the UK, whether we're in Europe or not.

As I said, I was part of Burnham's team in 2015. If there is an election, Corbyn will lose. I really hope that he then resigns, and Keir stands to replace him. Because, right now, he's the only Labour candidate where I'd want to be part of his team.

Any other time, the PM would be screwed in a GE... He is lucky there is a poor opponent leading the opposition benches.

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Let's hope so.

If it's the case that Parliament say no, then they bring No Deal on themselves.

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Let's hope so.

If it's the case that Parliament say no, then they bring No Deal on themselves.

It will depend on it being acceptable to those who objected to May's deal? If people like dup and sceptics approve of it there is good chance it will be passed let's hope so.. or no reason not to have no deal! corbyn and others wanted a deal but only acceptable to themselves which generally means customs union so no chance they'll vote for it that's for sure.

Let's see what his deal is , along as we can sign trade deals from day one and control our borders, money , laws then i will be happy, i think if the dup and erg support it i think other leave voting areas mps in labour will as well

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Let's hope so.

If it's the case that Parliament say no, then they bring No Deal on themselves.

It will depend on it being acceptable to those who objected to May's deal? If people like dup and sceptics approve of it there is good chance it will be passed let's hope so.. or no reason not to have no deal! corbyn and others wanted a deal but only acceptable to themselves which generally means customs union so no chance they'll vote for it that's for sure.

Now the liberals want to table a motion saying must have a referendum to approve deal? A motion Which of course will be approved by bercow ! It Shows there's a good chance deal could pass parliament! And of course remain will be on ballot paper if it passes.....

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

Agree with you.

But as I said, he has no chance of winning an election. He will do worse than Miliband four years ago. He reached his peak in 2017, and is not capable of bringing in the votes.

Like I said in my above post, things may have been different if Starmer was Leader.

Yes, agree with both; Corbyn is a spent force, and his options do not include following the real democratic decision of the people. I would also back Sir Keir Starmer; at least he seems to have some decency about him

Kier Starmer has one priority. To reverse Brexit. No decency on that knob.

A Brexit Deal will NOT be agreed tonight between the Government and the European Union.

That's the news coming out of Brussels tonight. Barnier about to brief this.

Still opportunity for a deal by tomorrow's summit, but it would only be a re-hash of May's deal.

So, in your opinion, where should Parliament go from here?

If dup/irish can accept it so should parliament but as we know MPs have their own agenda and suspect it may fail on that basis, but personally we should accept it.

Well I voted remain. But I do think the democratic vote needs to be followed through.

First, a second referendum is more likely but very very controversial.

I'm a Labour voter, despite not being a Corbyn fan, but it worries me very much that a referendum would be in our Manifesto.

Is the deal on the table really Brexit for the 52%? I'm not sure.

If there's an election, I can see no deal happening anyway. Labour would win it if someone like Keir Starmer, who is a great MP and former DPP, was Leader. But we have no chance with Corbyn. The current PM would win a majority in any Election at this point.

So I think that No Deal is likely.

Sven Corbyn stated he will ask for referendum with remain as one question and a deal mutually good for EU and us as other? That will worry anyone as it will mean close contact with customs union that's for sure..

Agree with you.

But as I said, he has no chance of winning an election. He will do worse than Miliband four years ago. He reached his peak in 2017, and is not capable of bringing in the votes.

Like I said in my above post, things may have been different if Starmer was Leader.

Yes, agree with both; Corbyn is a spent force, and his options do not include following the real democratic decision of the people. I would also back Sir Keir Starmer; at least he seems to have some decency about him

Kier Starmer has one priority. To reverse Brexit. No decency on that knob.

Often agree with you but not on this.

Keir is another one I have met and he's a great bloke. He wants to see the result go through, despite him believing Remain was the way to go and the fact he'd vote Remain in any 2nd ref (as would I).

The state of parliament would be different if KS was Leader of the Opposition. I think Brexit would be done by now.

If nothing else, you must agree he's the best Labour MP out there and an improvement on Corbyn?

Peston now on ITV.

Cabinet member Nicky Morgan and Head of the ERG Steve Baker are two of the guests. Could get some big opinions.

Stephen Kinnock, part of those involved in the Benn Act, also on the show tonight.

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Let's hope so.

If it's the case that Parliament say no, then they bring No Deal on themselves.

It will depend on it being acceptable to those who objected to May's deal? If people like dup and sceptics approve of it there is good chance it will be passed let's hope so.. or no reason not to have no deal! corbyn and others wanted a deal but only acceptable to themselves which generally means customs union so no chance they'll vote for it that's for sure.

Now the liberals want to table a motion saying must have a referendum to approve deal? A motion Which of course will be approved by bercow ! It Shows there's a good chance deal could pass parliament! And of course remain will be on ballot paper if it passes.....

Like I said previously.. I don't think any referendum will help, say that as Remainer.

Get the deal through or leave with no deal. That's what SHOULD be done. A shame this Parliament doesn't believe in demeocracy.

Oh god.. The man who is insulted by everything, David Lammy, is also on Peston.

Even as a Labour voter, this bloke beggars belief sometimes...

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Let's hope so.

If it's the case that Parliament say no, then they bring No Deal on themselves.

It will depend on it being acceptable to those who objected to May's deal? If people like dup and sceptics approve of it there is good chance it will be passed let's hope so.. or no reason not to have no deal! corbyn and others wanted a deal but only acceptable to themselves which generally means customs union so no chance they'll vote for it that's for sure.

Now the liberals want to table a motion saying must have a referendum to approve deal? A motion Which of course will be approved by bercow ! It Shows there's a good chance deal could pass parliament! And of course remain will be on ballot paper if it passes.....

Like I said previously.. I don't think any referendum will help, say that as Remainer.

Get the deal through or leave with no deal. That's what SHOULD be done. A shame this Parliament doesn't believe in demeocracy.

agree we've gone through the process like him or not he appears to have got a deal, MPs should pass it or accept a no deal cannot simply keep refusing because they dont like brexit thats not democracy thats dictatorship?

Barnier now saying that all issues have been agreed - apart from VAT which is the stumbling block.

It will go through now

Let's hope so.

If it's the case that Parliament say no, then they bring No Deal on themselves.

It will depend on it being acceptable to those who objected to May's deal? If people like dup and sceptics approve of it there is good chance it will be passed let's hope so.. or no reason not to have no deal! corbyn and others wanted a deal but only acceptable to themselves which generally means customs union so no chance they'll vote for it that's for sure.

Now the liberals want to table a motion saying must have a referendum to approve deal? A motion Which of course will be approved by bercow ! It Shows there's a good chance deal could pass parliament! And of course remain will be on ballot paper if it passes.....

Like I said previously.. I don't think any referendum will help, say that as Remainer.

Get the deal through or leave with no deal. That's what SHOULD be done. A shame this Parliament doesn't believe in demeocracy.

agree we've gone through the process like him or not he appears to have got a deal, MPs should pass it or accept a no deal cannot simply keep refusing because they dont like brexit thats not democracy thats dictatorship?

I agree. I'm a remainer but accept that we lost. Sadly it seems many of the MPs in parliament that lost won't accept that fact.

I really hope the government and the EU sort out the VAT tonight so we can get the deal through. According to Peston, the VAT is the issue and the deadline is 8am.

I just hope we can get it through and then focus on domestic issues.

But I don't trust this Parliament to follow it through. I pray that they approve the PM's deal.

Then we can have a General Election - which the PM will win comfortably if Corbyn is Leader of the Labour Party.