' Bobby Reid '
Fri Jul 05, 2019 9:21 am
What Cardiff City can learn from Bristol City to get the best out of Bobby Reid
By Sky Sports presenter and Bristol City podcast Robins on the Wire co-host Michelle Owen.
Friday 5th July 2019
As is often the case, some things have changed for Cardiff City this summer, some things have stayed the same.
Three midfielders have departed, the league is different yet manager Neil Warnock and a large nucleus of his Premier League squad remains.
There may be more changes yet to come before the season starts in August, yet the biggest change most Bluebirds fans will want to see is the fortunes of Bobby Reid.
The forward remains in south Wales after a debut season that showed glimpses of what he could offer, but back in the Championship there's the hope that he will prove to be as prolific as he was in his last spell in the second tier.
In his final season at Bristol City, Reid notched 19 goals in a remarkable season that saw him torment Championship defences and even the two Manchester giants in the Carabao Cup.
So what can Cardiff learn from his time at Bristol City - and the glimpses he showed last season - to ensure Reid hits the ground running on his return to the Championship?
A change of formation?
The first thing to do is to look at what formation Bristol City used Reid in.
More often than not, Reid played as part of a front two for Lee Johnson's men - often along another player who was comfortable dropping deep like Reid does, such as Jamie Paterson.
The two false nines worked well and allowed Johnson's team to overload pockets of space in between the opposition's midfield and defence - allowing for quick passing and one-twos to drag defenders out of position.
However, for Cardiff, he often played behind the main striker - which, while still allowing him to drop deep and dictate play at certain moments, doesn't always allow him to drag defenders out with his hold-up play.
So do Cardiff consider going with two up top?
Michelle Owen:
"I’d play him with another striker," said Sky Sports presenter and Bristol City podcast Robins on the Wire co-host Michelle Owen.
"I’ve only seen him as part of a two so I couldn’t say for sure but I think he’d better in a two up front.
"In the focal point of a three, he might not have as many opportunities with one-twos with his team-mates."
It's a valid point.
If Reid plays alongside another false nine, it gives both the option of dropping deep or playing off the shoulder - either dragging centre-halves out of the backline or turning beyond them.
The problem is that Cardiff rarely, if ever, play with two up top. Would Neil Warnock change his formation to suit how Reid played at the Robins?
It's unlikely and justifiably so.
A change of position?
Bristol City played two up top because they were confident playing out from the back - without taking unnecessary risks.
Warnock's Bluebirds like to play good football, but in the right areas.
And that means getting the ball up to the final third as quickly as possible and then playing in the pockets of space around the defence once there.
Which is why they play with one up front.
Because to do that requires a striker up top who can hold up the ball and compete aerially to supply the talents around him. You could do that with two front-men - a little and large - but that might leave you short in midfield.
And that could be costly given how getting the ball up the field quickly can often lead to a loss in possession.
So it usually has to be one man up top and one who can win the ball in the air and run the channels.
For all his strengths, Reid isn't this.
The opening day of the last season saw this when he played up top against Bournemouth. Cardiff played long and Reid just couldn't compete.
Minutes as an out-and-out striker were few and far between after that. Instead, he played as a number 10 - which he showed moments of magic at - but is that getting the best out of him?
Perhaps not.
Owen is convinced his best position is as a striker. It's a captivating argument.
Michelle Owen:
"He’s an absolute work horse, he closes down like a man possessed and will be the hardest working player on the pitch," she explains.
"He can score poachers goals and play off the shoulder and is great at dropping into pockets of space.
"He’s quick too he just needs to be utilised in the right way - as a striker."
His Championship showing two seasons ago suggests that's the case, but he's realistically not a Warnock striker and never will be.
So how do you get the best out of him?
Without sounding too obvious, you have to try balance what he did well at Bristol City with what he can do in Cardiff's system.
The thinking is he's too small to play as a number nine in the Bluebirds side, but playing as a number 10 doesn't always allow him to play off the shoulder.
Could he play as a false nine alongside a proper aerial threat? Potentially, but that leaves you with two in midfield.
So come the trip to Wigan in a month, Reid is likely to be playing in the number 10 role behind a lone striker.
Who that striker is poses its own conundrums? Someone like Kenneth Zohore is capable of getting beyond Reid when he drops deep, opening up passing options - as he did against Manchester United and Crystal Palace.
But Zohore doesn't win that many headers so it's hard to get beyond him in turn and play in and around the defenders. Much of Reid's work with Zohore in the final two games of last season was done from deep.
He did it well, but he rarely troubled the centre-backs himself.
If you want him to play as a number ten, you need to find a way of getting him higher up the pitch so he's capable of dragging defenders backwards and forwards, rather than midfielders.
Oddly, Cardiff found that worked best when they played Callum Paterson as a striker last year. Take the 4-2 win over Fulham at home.
The Scot won everything in the air and allowed his team-mates to get the ball down and play.
And with Paterson drifting wide, it gave Reid freedom at times to push forward into central spaces - either breaking beyond defenders, as he did for his goal, or dropping deep and playing balls to the wingers who pushed infield as Paterson moved out.
The question is whether Warnock would ever consider Paterson as a forward option again or whether he'll persevere with Zohore.
Regardless, the priority has to be getting the best out of Reid.
By Sky Sports presenter and Bristol City podcast Robins on the Wire co-host Michelle Owen.
Friday 5th July 2019
As is often the case, some things have changed for Cardiff City this summer, some things have stayed the same.
Three midfielders have departed, the league is different yet manager Neil Warnock and a large nucleus of his Premier League squad remains.
There may be more changes yet to come before the season starts in August, yet the biggest change most Bluebirds fans will want to see is the fortunes of Bobby Reid.
The forward remains in south Wales after a debut season that showed glimpses of what he could offer, but back in the Championship there's the hope that he will prove to be as prolific as he was in his last spell in the second tier.
In his final season at Bristol City, Reid notched 19 goals in a remarkable season that saw him torment Championship defences and even the two Manchester giants in the Carabao Cup.
So what can Cardiff learn from his time at Bristol City - and the glimpses he showed last season - to ensure Reid hits the ground running on his return to the Championship?
A change of formation?
The first thing to do is to look at what formation Bristol City used Reid in.
More often than not, Reid played as part of a front two for Lee Johnson's men - often along another player who was comfortable dropping deep like Reid does, such as Jamie Paterson.
The two false nines worked well and allowed Johnson's team to overload pockets of space in between the opposition's midfield and defence - allowing for quick passing and one-twos to drag defenders out of position.
However, for Cardiff, he often played behind the main striker - which, while still allowing him to drop deep and dictate play at certain moments, doesn't always allow him to drag defenders out with his hold-up play.
So do Cardiff consider going with two up top?
Michelle Owen:
"I’d play him with another striker," said Sky Sports presenter and Bristol City podcast Robins on the Wire co-host Michelle Owen.
"I’ve only seen him as part of a two so I couldn’t say for sure but I think he’d better in a two up front.
"In the focal point of a three, he might not have as many opportunities with one-twos with his team-mates."
It's a valid point.
If Reid plays alongside another false nine, it gives both the option of dropping deep or playing off the shoulder - either dragging centre-halves out of the backline or turning beyond them.
The problem is that Cardiff rarely, if ever, play with two up top. Would Neil Warnock change his formation to suit how Reid played at the Robins?
It's unlikely and justifiably so.
A change of position?
Bristol City played two up top because they were confident playing out from the back - without taking unnecessary risks.
Warnock's Bluebirds like to play good football, but in the right areas.
And that means getting the ball up to the final third as quickly as possible and then playing in the pockets of space around the defence once there.
Which is why they play with one up front.
Because to do that requires a striker up top who can hold up the ball and compete aerially to supply the talents around him. You could do that with two front-men - a little and large - but that might leave you short in midfield.
And that could be costly given how getting the ball up the field quickly can often lead to a loss in possession.
So it usually has to be one man up top and one who can win the ball in the air and run the channels.
For all his strengths, Reid isn't this.
The opening day of the last season saw this when he played up top against Bournemouth. Cardiff played long and Reid just couldn't compete.
Minutes as an out-and-out striker were few and far between after that. Instead, he played as a number 10 - which he showed moments of magic at - but is that getting the best out of him?
Perhaps not.
Owen is convinced his best position is as a striker. It's a captivating argument.
Michelle Owen:
"He’s an absolute work horse, he closes down like a man possessed and will be the hardest working player on the pitch," she explains.
"He can score poachers goals and play off the shoulder and is great at dropping into pockets of space.
"He’s quick too he just needs to be utilised in the right way - as a striker."
His Championship showing two seasons ago suggests that's the case, but he's realistically not a Warnock striker and never will be.
So how do you get the best out of him?
Without sounding too obvious, you have to try balance what he did well at Bristol City with what he can do in Cardiff's system.
The thinking is he's too small to play as a number nine in the Bluebirds side, but playing as a number 10 doesn't always allow him to play off the shoulder.
Could he play as a false nine alongside a proper aerial threat? Potentially, but that leaves you with two in midfield.
So come the trip to Wigan in a month, Reid is likely to be playing in the number 10 role behind a lone striker.
Who that striker is poses its own conundrums? Someone like Kenneth Zohore is capable of getting beyond Reid when he drops deep, opening up passing options - as he did against Manchester United and Crystal Palace.
But Zohore doesn't win that many headers so it's hard to get beyond him in turn and play in and around the defenders. Much of Reid's work with Zohore in the final two games of last season was done from deep.
He did it well, but he rarely troubled the centre-backs himself.
If you want him to play as a number ten, you need to find a way of getting him higher up the pitch so he's capable of dragging defenders backwards and forwards, rather than midfielders.
Oddly, Cardiff found that worked best when they played Callum Paterson as a striker last year. Take the 4-2 win over Fulham at home.
The Scot won everything in the air and allowed his team-mates to get the ball down and play.
And with Paterson drifting wide, it gave Reid freedom at times to push forward into central spaces - either breaking beyond defenders, as he did for his goal, or dropping deep and playing balls to the wingers who pushed infield as Paterson moved out.
The question is whether Warnock would ever consider Paterson as a forward option again or whether he'll persevere with Zohore.
Regardless, the priority has to be getting the best out of Reid.
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Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Fri Jul 05, 2019 1:00 pm
number 10 would easily be his position for us and I totally think it would get the best out of him, his work and energy covers enough ground to help the midfield out and press and also gives him the chance to find the spaces in-between the opposition defence and midfield. Its a no brainer as far as I can see, I think he would be wasted upfront as we don't play with the ball enough in that final third.
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Fri Jul 05, 2019 8:31 pm
2blue2handle wrote:number 10 would easily be his position for us and I totally think it would get the best out of him, his work and energy covers enough ground to help the midfield out and press and also gives him the chance to find the spaces in-between the opposition defence and midfield. Its a no brainer as far as I can see, I think he would be wasted upfront as we don't play with the ball enough in that final third.
Fully agree, it’s been clear that 4-3-3 is the best formation under Warnock and Reid has proven he has the quality to play the attacking midfield role when given the chance
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Fri Jul 05, 2019 9:26 pm
All i want to see is what i asked for last season - So may be this season more game time for Bobby Reid .
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Sat Jul 06, 2019 7:56 am
Rather than starting a new topic, I’ll leave the following questions here as it sort of links in.
1. For this season, who would be your first choice combination for our top two, whether that be two strikers or a lone striker with someone playing in the hole behind?
2. Eliminating any mental health issues or perceived desires to leave Cardiff City, who would you select based solely on ability and the potential to forge a partnership?
My choices would be:
1. Ward up top with Reid playing off his shoulder in the hole.
2. Madine up top with Reid in the hole as I think they would compliment each other given a run of 6 plus games.
1. For this season, who would be your first choice combination for our top two, whether that be two strikers or a lone striker with someone playing in the hole behind?
2. Eliminating any mental health issues or perceived desires to leave Cardiff City, who would you select based solely on ability and the potential to forge a partnership?
My choices would be:
1. Ward up top with Reid playing off his shoulder in the hole.
2. Madine up top with Reid in the hole as I think they would compliment each other given a run of 6 plus games.
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:01 am
103 Barmy Army wrote:Rather than starting a new topic, I’ll leave the following questions here as it sort of links in.
1. For this season, who would be your first choice combination for our top two, whether that be two strikers or a lone striker with someone playing in the hole behind?
2. Eliminating any mental health issues or perceived desires to leave Cardiff City, who would you select based solely on ability and the potential to forge a partnership?
My choices would be:
1. Ward up top with Reid playing off his shoulder in the hole.
2. Madine up top with Reid in the hole as I think they would compliment each other given a run of 6 plus games.
Reid just being and Zohore upfront for both for me, I seen enough in the limited time together to think they have real potential. I think Reid and Medine could also work.
I don't see Ward as anymore than a sub though.
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:54 am
2blue2handle wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:Rather than starting a new topic, I’ll leave the following questions here as it sort of links in.
1. For this season, who would be your first choice combination for our top two, whether that be two strikers or a lone striker with someone playing in the hole behind?
2. Eliminating any mental health issues or perceived desires to leave Cardiff City, who would you select based solely on ability and the potential to forge a partnership?
My choices would be:
1. Ward up top with Reid playing off his shoulder in the hole.
2. Madine up top with Reid in the hole as I think they would compliment each other given a run of 6 plus games.
Reid just being and Zohore upfront for both for me, I seen enough in the limited time together to think they have real potential. I think Reid and Medine could also work.
I don't see Ward as anymore than a sub though.
A valid point from a very sensible poster.
I may have voted with my heart over my head as I do love the effort Ward puts in and I initially wrote Zohore, but changed it to Ward. It’s good we’ve got these options.
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:59 am
103 Barmy Army wrote:2blue2handle wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:Rather than starting a new topic, I’ll leave the following questions here as it sort of links in.
1. For this season, who would be your first choice combination for our top two, whether that be two strikers or a lone striker with someone playing in the hole behind?
2. Eliminating any mental health issues or perceived desires to leave Cardiff City, who would you select based solely on ability and the potential to forge a partnership?
My choices would be:
1. Ward up top with Reid playing off his shoulder in the hole.
2. Madine up top with Reid in the hole as I think they would compliment each other given a run of 6 plus games.
Reid just being and Zohore upfront for both for me, I seen enough in the limited time together to think they have real potential. I think Reid and Medine could also work.
I don't see Ward as anymore than a sub though.
A valid point from a very sensible poster.
I may have voted with my heart over my head as I do love the effort Ward puts in and I initially wrote Zohore, but changed it to Ward. It’s good we’ve got these options.
To be fair if you asked me a couple of weeks before the end of the season I may have said Ward, he has good energy and puts himself about. The one thing I noticed when I watched him closely was he challanges for a lot and makes it difficult for defenders but generally doesn't keep hold of the ball very well, a bit like Patterson upfront really but a bit better.
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Tue Jul 09, 2019 10:33 pm
103 Barmy Army wrote:Rather than starting a new topic, I’ll leave the following questions here as it sort of links in.
1. For this season, who would be your first choice combination for our top two, whether that be two strikers or a lone striker with someone playing in the hole behind?
2. Eliminating any mental health issues or perceived desires to leave Cardiff City, who would you select based solely on ability and the potential to forge a partnership?
My choices would be:
1. Ward up top with Reid playing off his shoulder in the hole.
2. Madine up top with Reid in the hole as I think they would compliment each other given a run of 6 plus games.
Still has to be Reid and Zohore. I really hope we can bring in a striker of Zohore style, but more consistent. I hope that a target has been identified for that role as patience has run thin with Zohore. But as thing standards he is by far the best striker we have.
On top of his game, he is by far the best striker I have seen in a cardiff shirt. Controversially I include Chopra and Bothroyd in that statement.
Re: ' Bobby Reid '
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:36 am
I think we should listen to Michelle Owen cause she's very cute. 