' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:43 am
' Much better but where would we be without David Marshall ? '
08/11/15
By Paul Evans aka The other Bob Wilson
There was another poll in the local press during last week asking whether Russell Slade should continue as Cardiff City manager – predictably, given events in October and the first few days of November, the majority view was that he shouldn’t.
When asked about this, Mr Slade answered that these polls never seem to take place after his team had won a couple of games – it was a fair point, but I think the truth for this City boss is that he’ll never command the overwhelming backing of the fans.
For myself, I’d become much more critical of our manager after the Bristol City match, but, as I pointed out after the Leeds defeat, any criticism at this stage could only realistically be directed at the level of performance of the team because results, although not great in recent weeks, have been generally satisfactory so far this season.
I stick by what I said about the boring nature of so many of the home matches especially under Russell Slade’s management, but, this morning, he can take satisfaction both from a good 2-0 win over a Reading side who were above us in the table going into yesterday’s match at Cardiff City Stadium and the fact that his team went someway towards answering back the critics when it comes to the dull football people like me accuse them of playing.
In fact, I would go as far as to say that yesterday’s game was in the top two or three for entertainment value when to comes to home matches played under this manager. Now, it should be noted at this point, that, whereas under most managers who have been in charge at a club for over a year, that last sentence may read like high praise indeed, anyone who has seen all of the games in question will know that yesterday’s encounter didn’t need to be that good to get into the top two or three in the entertainment stakes.
Furthermore, one of the reasons why I found yesterday a more enjoyable experience than normal was that there were frequent reasons to applaud a Cardiff player showing a level of ability more suited to the Premier League than the Championship.
I don’t know if this still holds true, but, before the midweek round of matches a few days ago, Reading were the team who’d had the most goal attempts over the Championship season and Cardiff the least. This was reflected in a set of match stats which showed that the visitors had nineteen efforts at goal, compared to our ten, with them having double the number on target to us (ten to five).
While I believe that this was another of those games where the stats don’t tell the whole story, Reading probably headed back up the M4 believing they deserved something from the match and they would be putting the fact that they didn’t get anything down to the performance of one Cardiff player.
Goalkeeper is a strange position in that, unlike anywhere else on the pitch, praise for the individual concerned can often mean that you have problems elsewhere – if I were a manager, I wouldn’t want to be reading about how good my keeper was!
Nevertheless, David Marshall’s performance yesterday brought back memories from two years ago when many critics rated him as the best in his position in the Premier League. Back in 2013/14, there were times when it seemed like Marshall was playing the opposition on his own and, for a two minute spell in the second half yesterday, it felt like that again as he pulled off three great stops following Reading free kicks and corners.
There were other fine saves in the first half, not least the one from the division’s second top scorer Nick Blackman when Reading used their speed on the counter attack to create what was at one time a five on two raid.
Marshall kept on denying the visitors right up until the end and there can be few among the City faithful who would disagree with Russell Slade’s assessment that we have the best goalkeeper in the Championship.
As I mentioned before, when your goalkeepers having a brilliant game, it does ask questions of at least some of his team mates and, certainly, City’s defending from Reading corners during that inspired spell by Marshall, which had some in the crowd giving him a standing ovation, left something to be desired, but, overall, the back four did well as they made it just one goal conceded (and that was a long range stunner) in six matches.
It’s in the nature of things that problems at the sharp end of the pitch will always get more attention than what may be going right at the other end of it, but with the goal drought now ended, you would hope that the team would be given some credit for what has been a spell of outstanding defending in recent weeks.
If yesterday’s game had ended 0-0, then, no doubt, I would now be reeling out the number of minutes it was since we had scored and how long it had been since a City player had found the net. Therefore, it’s only right that I record that in the 582 minutes of Championship football we’ve played since Dale Stephens scored for Brighton on 3 October, we’ve only conceded that belter by Alex Mowatt at Leeds, so, congratulations to all of our players, manager and coaching staff for that record.
So, the back four and keeper certainly played their part in improvement in performance we saw yesterday, but a defensive record of twelve goals conceded in sixteen matches tells you that we can, to some degree at least, take their excellence for granted these days – no, the reason for the upturn in form and entertainment value yesterday tended to lie with the players in front of them.
In what was more of a traditional 4-4-2, Craig Noone had one his better matches since we were relegated – there still were the usual, and probably inevitable, frustrations you get with him, but there was a directness and confidence to his game that certainly came as a surprise to me given some of his recent performances. On the other flank Anthony Pilkington moved infield from time to time to show that the old lopsided midfield system had not entirely been abandoned –although his displays in the couple of matches he played before being dropped merited him being left out, I do think we generally look a better team with him in it.
It was in the central midfield area that the more interesting improvements came. Moving Joe Ralls into his favourite position in the middle of the park saw him more involved and authoritative – his willingness to accept responsibility, work hard for the cause and delivery of quality dead balls made him our best outfield player in my book (this was one game where there should be no argument as to who our man of the match was!).
As someone who has always had faith in him, Ralls’ excellence did not surprise, but the display of Aron Gunnarsson certainly did. For me, Iceland’s captain put in his best showing in a City shirt for months. True, he was the man who lost possession as City managed to turn what was a promising position deep in Reading’s half into the chance for Blackman I mentioned earlier, but, like one or two others, he seemed reinvigorated and it was great to see a central midfield player making a run beyond the strikers again – the second half move which ended with Gunnarsson shooting across goal and not too far wide was City’s best of the match for me.
Inevitably, after a match where the midfield looked more fluent and vibrant than it has been for weeks, there was as much discussion about the man who wasn’t playing as there was on those who were.
Peter Whittingham’s booking at Leeds was his fifth of the campaign, so that meant he had to miss yesterday’s match with suspension and, of course, now the question is should he come straight back into the team at Derby in a fortnight’s time after the latest international break ends?
Before I answer that, I’m going to give you a stat which I believe should be borne in mind when considering the question. Peter Whittingham has now missed four matches during Russell Slade’s time in charge and we’ve won all of them – of as much interest to that though is that we’ve scored ten times in doing so.
Now, I think that Whitts has generally played better this season than he did last, so I’m not quite as inclined to automatically answer the question by saying leave him out as I once was. However, if we are going to stick to 4-4-2 at Derby (I’m sure we will), I’d argue that yesterday’s midfield should be given another chance.
What I would say though is that, as someone who, in recent seasons, has always advocated us playing three central midfielders if we are going to use Whittingham in that area, I’d be inclined to play 4-5-1/4-3-3 with a single striker and two attacking wide men.
With Kagisho Dikgacoi back on the bench yesterday after his latest injury, it’s difficult to settle on personnel for the central midfield roles – for me, Joe Ralls has to be one of them and an Aron Gunnarsson back in the habit of making runs past the striker has to merit consideration, but, if I had to bet as to what our midfield will look like at Derby, I’d go for a return to the lopsided four with Whitts back in, Ralls shifted out to the left again for Pilkington and Gunnarsson retaining his place.
If we were to play with a single striker, then Kenwyne Jones has always seemed the most likely candidate to me. Regular readers of this blog and the comments my pieces attract will know that a few of the regulars on here (plus myself) as not as big Kenwyne fans as most of those who earn a living writing for the local press.
However, it was the big man who was there to score the header just before half time which gave the City fans in the bigger than I expected gate the chance to remember what your team scoring a goal felt like and his lovely flick in the passage of play that led to Gunnarsson’s chance was a reminder of what he can do with the ball at his feet.
Jones also managed to make a fool out of me by scoring about a minute after I said “Kenwyne looks like his afternoon siesta has begun”, but I still think the point is a fair one which reinforces the suggestion that, if he plays every week, then others are going to have to be prepared to do a lot of his running for him. If he was to play up by himself, then it becomes imperative that one of those central midfielders runs past him pretty regularly.
Whether we play with one or two strikers, there was a first look at someone who, hopefully, will become a realistic candidate to fill the role(s) as Idriss Saadi was surprisingly named on the bench and came on for Joe Mason for the last half an hour or so to make his first team debut.
Saadi wasted little time in firing away a well struck twenty yard effort which drew a diving save from Al Habsi in the Reading goal, but it was quite difficult for him to make a positive first impression because, hardly surprisingly I suppose given the match situation, the gap between the front two and the rest of the side got much bigger while he was on.
08/11/15
By Paul Evans aka The other Bob Wilson
There was another poll in the local press during last week asking whether Russell Slade should continue as Cardiff City manager – predictably, given events in October and the first few days of November, the majority view was that he shouldn’t.
When asked about this, Mr Slade answered that these polls never seem to take place after his team had won a couple of games – it was a fair point, but I think the truth for this City boss is that he’ll never command the overwhelming backing of the fans.
For myself, I’d become much more critical of our manager after the Bristol City match, but, as I pointed out after the Leeds defeat, any criticism at this stage could only realistically be directed at the level of performance of the team because results, although not great in recent weeks, have been generally satisfactory so far this season.
I stick by what I said about the boring nature of so many of the home matches especially under Russell Slade’s management, but, this morning, he can take satisfaction both from a good 2-0 win over a Reading side who were above us in the table going into yesterday’s match at Cardiff City Stadium and the fact that his team went someway towards answering back the critics when it comes to the dull football people like me accuse them of playing.
In fact, I would go as far as to say that yesterday’s game was in the top two or three for entertainment value when to comes to home matches played under this manager. Now, it should be noted at this point, that, whereas under most managers who have been in charge at a club for over a year, that last sentence may read like high praise indeed, anyone who has seen all of the games in question will know that yesterday’s encounter didn’t need to be that good to get into the top two or three in the entertainment stakes.
Furthermore, one of the reasons why I found yesterday a more enjoyable experience than normal was that there were frequent reasons to applaud a Cardiff player showing a level of ability more suited to the Premier League than the Championship.
I don’t know if this still holds true, but, before the midweek round of matches a few days ago, Reading were the team who’d had the most goal attempts over the Championship season and Cardiff the least. This was reflected in a set of match stats which showed that the visitors had nineteen efforts at goal, compared to our ten, with them having double the number on target to us (ten to five).
While I believe that this was another of those games where the stats don’t tell the whole story, Reading probably headed back up the M4 believing they deserved something from the match and they would be putting the fact that they didn’t get anything down to the performance of one Cardiff player.
Goalkeeper is a strange position in that, unlike anywhere else on the pitch, praise for the individual concerned can often mean that you have problems elsewhere – if I were a manager, I wouldn’t want to be reading about how good my keeper was!
Nevertheless, David Marshall’s performance yesterday brought back memories from two years ago when many critics rated him as the best in his position in the Premier League. Back in 2013/14, there were times when it seemed like Marshall was playing the opposition on his own and, for a two minute spell in the second half yesterday, it felt like that again as he pulled off three great stops following Reading free kicks and corners.
There were other fine saves in the first half, not least the one from the division’s second top scorer Nick Blackman when Reading used their speed on the counter attack to create what was at one time a five on two raid.
Marshall kept on denying the visitors right up until the end and there can be few among the City faithful who would disagree with Russell Slade’s assessment that we have the best goalkeeper in the Championship.
As I mentioned before, when your goalkeepers having a brilliant game, it does ask questions of at least some of his team mates and, certainly, City’s defending from Reading corners during that inspired spell by Marshall, which had some in the crowd giving him a standing ovation, left something to be desired, but, overall, the back four did well as they made it just one goal conceded (and that was a long range stunner) in six matches.
It’s in the nature of things that problems at the sharp end of the pitch will always get more attention than what may be going right at the other end of it, but with the goal drought now ended, you would hope that the team would be given some credit for what has been a spell of outstanding defending in recent weeks.
If yesterday’s game had ended 0-0, then, no doubt, I would now be reeling out the number of minutes it was since we had scored and how long it had been since a City player had found the net. Therefore, it’s only right that I record that in the 582 minutes of Championship football we’ve played since Dale Stephens scored for Brighton on 3 October, we’ve only conceded that belter by Alex Mowatt at Leeds, so, congratulations to all of our players, manager and coaching staff for that record.
So, the back four and keeper certainly played their part in improvement in performance we saw yesterday, but a defensive record of twelve goals conceded in sixteen matches tells you that we can, to some degree at least, take their excellence for granted these days – no, the reason for the upturn in form and entertainment value yesterday tended to lie with the players in front of them.
In what was more of a traditional 4-4-2, Craig Noone had one his better matches since we were relegated – there still were the usual, and probably inevitable, frustrations you get with him, but there was a directness and confidence to his game that certainly came as a surprise to me given some of his recent performances. On the other flank Anthony Pilkington moved infield from time to time to show that the old lopsided midfield system had not entirely been abandoned –although his displays in the couple of matches he played before being dropped merited him being left out, I do think we generally look a better team with him in it.
It was in the central midfield area that the more interesting improvements came. Moving Joe Ralls into his favourite position in the middle of the park saw him more involved and authoritative – his willingness to accept responsibility, work hard for the cause and delivery of quality dead balls made him our best outfield player in my book (this was one game where there should be no argument as to who our man of the match was!).
As someone who has always had faith in him, Ralls’ excellence did not surprise, but the display of Aron Gunnarsson certainly did. For me, Iceland’s captain put in his best showing in a City shirt for months. True, he was the man who lost possession as City managed to turn what was a promising position deep in Reading’s half into the chance for Blackman I mentioned earlier, but, like one or two others, he seemed reinvigorated and it was great to see a central midfield player making a run beyond the strikers again – the second half move which ended with Gunnarsson shooting across goal and not too far wide was City’s best of the match for me.
Inevitably, after a match where the midfield looked more fluent and vibrant than it has been for weeks, there was as much discussion about the man who wasn’t playing as there was on those who were.
Peter Whittingham’s booking at Leeds was his fifth of the campaign, so that meant he had to miss yesterday’s match with suspension and, of course, now the question is should he come straight back into the team at Derby in a fortnight’s time after the latest international break ends?
Before I answer that, I’m going to give you a stat which I believe should be borne in mind when considering the question. Peter Whittingham has now missed four matches during Russell Slade’s time in charge and we’ve won all of them – of as much interest to that though is that we’ve scored ten times in doing so.
Now, I think that Whitts has generally played better this season than he did last, so I’m not quite as inclined to automatically answer the question by saying leave him out as I once was. However, if we are going to stick to 4-4-2 at Derby (I’m sure we will), I’d argue that yesterday’s midfield should be given another chance.
What I would say though is that, as someone who, in recent seasons, has always advocated us playing three central midfielders if we are going to use Whittingham in that area, I’d be inclined to play 4-5-1/4-3-3 with a single striker and two attacking wide men.
With Kagisho Dikgacoi back on the bench yesterday after his latest injury, it’s difficult to settle on personnel for the central midfield roles – for me, Joe Ralls has to be one of them and an Aron Gunnarsson back in the habit of making runs past the striker has to merit consideration, but, if I had to bet as to what our midfield will look like at Derby, I’d go for a return to the lopsided four with Whitts back in, Ralls shifted out to the left again for Pilkington and Gunnarsson retaining his place.
If we were to play with a single striker, then Kenwyne Jones has always seemed the most likely candidate to me. Regular readers of this blog and the comments my pieces attract will know that a few of the regulars on here (plus myself) as not as big Kenwyne fans as most of those who earn a living writing for the local press.
However, it was the big man who was there to score the header just before half time which gave the City fans in the bigger than I expected gate the chance to remember what your team scoring a goal felt like and his lovely flick in the passage of play that led to Gunnarsson’s chance was a reminder of what he can do with the ball at his feet.
Jones also managed to make a fool out of me by scoring about a minute after I said “Kenwyne looks like his afternoon siesta has begun”, but I still think the point is a fair one which reinforces the suggestion that, if he plays every week, then others are going to have to be prepared to do a lot of his running for him. If he was to play up by himself, then it becomes imperative that one of those central midfielders runs past him pretty regularly.
Whether we play with one or two strikers, there was a first look at someone who, hopefully, will become a realistic candidate to fill the role(s) as Idriss Saadi was surprisingly named on the bench and came on for Joe Mason for the last half an hour or so to make his first team debut.
Saadi wasted little time in firing away a well struck twenty yard effort which drew a diving save from Al Habsi in the Reading goal, but it was quite difficult for him to make a positive first impression because, hardly surprisingly I suppose given the match situation, the gap between the front two and the rest of the side got much bigger while he was on.
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:04 am
Marshall is in top ten of British goalkeepers. I only saw highlights on football league show and he was clearly man of the match. He is clearly worth 15-20 points a season for us.
As regards Whitts if we play 4-4-2 at Derby he should be left on bench as Ralls is at this moment in time playing better than Whitts. The problem Whittingham has is the lack of pace up front. When he had the likes of chopra, Bellamy and McCormack around him he was able to play killer balls into the channels plus we were more of an attacking side then and he had license to roam forwards and he was able to get his fair share of goals. If Slade goes 4-5-1 which against Derby I feel he should given the strength of their midfield then Whitts should play just off centre with noone outside him on left. Have Ralls and gunner in middle and Kennedy on right. Sadly Slade is one dimensional and only seems to know 4-4-2.
As regards Whitts if we play 4-4-2 at Derby he should be left on bench as Ralls is at this moment in time playing better than Whitts. The problem Whittingham has is the lack of pace up front. When he had the likes of chopra, Bellamy and McCormack around him he was able to play killer balls into the channels plus we were more of an attacking side then and he had license to roam forwards and he was able to get his fair share of goals. If Slade goes 4-5-1 which against Derby I feel he should given the strength of their midfield then Whitts should play just off centre with noone outside him on left. Have Ralls and gunner in middle and Kennedy on right. Sadly Slade is one dimensional and only seems to know 4-4-2.
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:38 am
Obvious answer, in the play offs or auto positions. Points lost at Leeds and Rotherham due to Marshall. Cash in time? Oh and bye bye Whitts as well.
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:49 am
Trying to stay out of a relegation battle, Marshall has saved us time and time again.
We can't afford to be without him, def not with Slades type of football
We can't afford to be without him, def not with Slades type of football
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:50 am
Blazing Saddles wrote:Obvious answer, in the play offs or auto positions. Points lost at Leeds and Rotherham due to Marshall. Cash in time? Oh and bye bye Whitts as well.
Good point. Only 2 months ago this board was full of moaning about David Marshall after his sending off at Rotherham.
Carl's post made a good point about if the praise is for your goalkeeper then there are clearly problems elsewhere.
Our defence isn't as good as we think; we do keep clean sheets but that is more due to a combination of David Marshall and luck.
If we are to make the play-offs (my tip is we will and will get promoted that way) then Marshall has to stay as our defence will not be fit for purpose without him.
Also I really hope Saddi builds on that cameo yesterday because K Jones is our only realistic option and if he was to go long term then we really would be up the creek.....
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:54 am
Tony, many including myself on this forum stuck up for Marshall and called the fans to stand by him 
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:04 pm
Forever Blue wrote:Tony, many including myself on this forum stuck up for Marshall and called the fans to stand by him
TBH He deserved the stick at the time it was a stupid act. But there were some suggesting he shouldn't play again which now looks somewhat silly.
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:12 pm
Tony Blue Williams wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Tony, many including myself on this forum stuck up for Marshall and called the fans to stand by him
TBH He deserved the stick at the time it was a stupid act. But there were some suggesting he shouldn't play again which now looks somewhat silly.
Tony, We all make mistakes we are only human, but some fans did go over the top.
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:15 pm
I think we better get used to the idea......
We need to get into the Christmas period in the top 6 otherwise the offers may be too tempting for both the club and Marshy.....
We need to get into the Christmas period in the top 6 otherwise the offers may be too tempting for both the club and Marshy.....
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:25 pm
Marshall is not a number 2 keeper! but thats only what he will be if sign for premier club , thats not what he wants as he proved at bbeginning of season! not sure if any club have a bad no1 needing replacing either. 
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:39 pm
He's absolute top draw, I wasn't for having a go at him when he made a few mistakes that does happen. I did however say cash in on him over the summer as I believe Moore is a decent keeper who will get better. But no doubt Marshall is in a different level. I don't like the " what if posts " u can have a million scenarios, what if we sold Marshall and bought two Strikers? One never knows, just glad he is our keeper. Class
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 1:24 pm
Where would every team in the world be without their best player ????
Probably like every other team, 12 to 15 points futher behind at the end of the season.........
He is way to good for us, and is a top half premier keeper, we are very lucky to have him.......
Probably like every other team, 12 to 15 points futher behind at the end of the season.........
He is way to good for us, and is a top half premier keeper, we are very lucky to have him.......
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 4:06 pm
I was really frustrated when he got sent off at Rotherham no doubt he will save us points. 
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 4:29 pm
Forever Blue wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Tony, many including myself on this forum stuck up for Marshall and called the fans to stand by him
TBH He deserved the stick at the time it was a stupid act. But there were some suggesting he shouldn't play again which now looks somewhat silly.
Tony, We all make mistakes we are only human, but some fans did go over the top.
I was livid with the guy.
Marshalls temper has got him into some deep water a few times. Being the best keeper in the league is pointless if you don't make yourself available. Well he cost us 3 points at Rotherham but saved us a point against the Wurzels and 3 against yesterdays opponents so I suppose he should be back in favour. We would be back in the top six if it was not for his stupid act at the New York Stadium. Juxt hope this does apply come the end of the season.
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:06 pm
Without Marshall we would have lost yesterday, those saves would have become goals if it wasnt for hime and we would have been lucky to draw if not probably lose
Re: ' WHERE WOULD WE BE ? '
Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:48 am
no point in even thinking about it.
i think its just a perfect thing to say for people who want to remain negative about whats going on. We dont need to worry about where we would be without him because we arent without him
i think its just a perfect thing to say for people who want to remain negative about whats going on. We dont need to worry about where we would be without him because we arent without him