MICHU THE ONE SEASON WONDER

fecking knew it 20 million my arse

fecking knew it 20 million my arse

2011-12

Appearances 39 scored 17

2012-13

Apperances 43 scored 22

2013-14

Appearances 19 scored 6 (double the amount any Cardiff player has)

Where can we buy more one season wonders?

2011-12

Appearances 39 scored 17

2012-13

Apperances 43 scored 22

2013-14

Appearances 19 scored 6 (double the amount any Cardiff player has)

Where can we buy more one season wonders?

And you think he's playing at same level as last season?

2011-12

Appearances 39 scored 17

2012-13

Apperances 43 scored 22

2013-14

Appearances 19 scored 6 (double the amount any Cardiff player has)

Where can we buy more one season wonders?

And you think he's playing at same level as last season?

When hes played in midfield, yes.

The whole team isnt performing as well as last year though, nothing to do with Michu. We have played over 30 games and it isnt even xmas, its not easy i can assure you. A bloody good thing to be involved in though.

2011-12

Appearances 39 scored 17

2012-13

Apperances 43 scored 22

2013-14

Appearances 19 scored 6 (double the amount any Cardiff player has)

Where can we buy more one season wonders?

And you think he's playing at same level as last season?

When hes played in midfield, yes.

The whole team isnt performing as well as last year though, nothing to do with Michu. We have played over 30 games and it isnt even xmas, its not easy i can assure you. A bloody good thing to be involved in though.

Maybe so but don't you think it's having effect on the team? But I suppose time will tell but you may think you are established team but take look at last season's relegated teams? 2 were established so you never know what might happen!

Maybe so but don't you think it's having effect on the team? But I suppose time will tell but you may think you are established team but take look at last season's relegated teams? 2 were established so you never know what might happen!

Of course its having an effect on the team. But what is the point in having a fully fit and fresh squad if you dont want to compete in Europe or become the best you can be - isnt that what all clubs are aspiring to do?

If you dont want to be in these competitions then what is the point of football? To just finish between 17th and 7th (just out of european qualification) every year?

People are nuts. Ive said it before and ill say it again, for some people its "we need to get knocked out of europe as its affecting our league form which means we will never qualify for europe at this rate"

We are in the top 10 in the league and the last 32 of European competition. Im sure we will take some understandably tired performances in exchange for that.

2011-12

Appearances 39 scored 17

2012-13

Apperances 43 scored 22

2013-14

Appearances 19 scored 6 (double the amount any Cardiff player has)

Where can we buy more one season wonders?

And you think he's playing at same level as last season?

I reckon he's peaked and not a lot left in his tank. Even the fans on Planet swamp are saying as much.

BTW, Roathie is back Allan!

Back?

Peaked at 27? Deat lord

Only 2 goals in the premiership this year, he's certainly not playing at the same level as last season.

Murmurs about a move being imminent and he didn't look too happy with Laudrup being hauled off the other day.

I'd say he could be off to pastures new in Jan. he said he wanted to play for a "top club" and at 27, now is the time to do it - before it's too late.

Only 2 goals in the premiership this year, he's certainly not playing at the same level as last season.

Murmurs about a move being imminent and he didn't look too happy with Laudrup being hauled off the other day.

I'd say he could be off to pastures new in Jan. he said he wanted to play for a "top club" and at 27, now is the time to do it - before it's too late.

He gets most of his goals from midfield. Last year he scored most of his goals before Jan when we had Graham and Schecter playing up front - its no coincidence we went crap after Jan and continue to look crap when he plays up front (as you saw at the CCS). This year for whatever reason he's been playing up front and hasn't had the impact he usually has from midfield. Footballers aren't robots and score differing amounts.

This year he has played 9 in his attacking midfield position and scored 4 with very high performamce levels.

He has played 6 times as striker amd scored 0 and its affected our side each and every time. He isnt a striker.

As for leaving for a bigger club in Jan - no chance. End of the season maybe. I think we should cash in personally, we seem a better more coherant side without him and Jonjo seems a good replacement.

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Of course there's a chance he could go in January. Either way, I think it will be his last in a Swansea shirt.

Same number of goals in the premiership as Whittingham & not really done much of note. He was rightfully getting the plaudits last season, but this year - he's the forgotten man almost.

No doubt - an excellent player, just not seen as much of it this season.

Of course there's a chance he could go in January. Either way, I think it will be his last in a Swansea shirt.

Same number of goals in the premiership as Whittingham & not really done much of note. He was rightfully getting the plaudits last season, but this year - he's the forgotten man almost.

No doubt - an excellent player, just not seen as much of it this season.

There really isnt any chance worth mentioning - why would we sell and hamper our season and options? We dont need the money and its not how Laudrup works.

Whittingham has played in his natural position of central midfield. When Michu has done that he almost has a goal every other game.

There really isnt any chance worth mentioning - why would we sell and hamper our season and options? We dont need the money and its not how Laudrup works.

Whittingham has played in his natural position of central midfield. When Michu has done that he almost has a goal every other game.

Ah but that's just it, he could we go & nobody can say for definite that he won't.

Actually, Whittingham hasn't been utilised in his natural position at all. He's been left on the wing on a number of occasions.

There really isnt any chance worth mentioning - why would we sell and hamper our season and options? We dont need the money and its not how Laudrup works.

Whittingham has played in his natural position of central midfield. When Michu has done that he almost has a goal every other game.

Ah but that's just it, he could we go & nobody can say for definite that he won't.

Actually, Whittingham hasn't been utilised in his natural position at all. He's been left on the wing on a number of occasions.

Of course, but as i said the chances are negligible. It makes mo sense to sell him in January, its not as if he has a contract running down to the point he can go for free in the summer and we dont need the money. Ronaldo could sign for Liverpool in January but he probably isnt going to, to the point it probably isnt worth mentioning. Its pretty safe to say hes here for the season.

Whittingham came to you as a winger, he just gets most of his goals centrally. Michu isnt a striker and has never performed well there, you will have to ask Laudrup why he continues to do it as we are all baffled, and so is Michu id say.

Back?

Peaked at 27? Deat lord

I think you'll find age has nothing to do with it.
Many a player have had their best season before they reach thirty.
That's why I said peaked and not got older.

Back?

Peaked at 27? Deat lord

I think you'll find age has nothing to do with it.
Many a player have had their best season before they reach thirty.
That's why I said peaked and not got older.

I cant think of many players to have peaked prior to 27 years old. Fake african passports aside.

As I have shown, when played in his rightful position he has performed excellently and scored a goal every other game.

Stick Van Persie in central midfield, see if he scores as many.

Of course, but as i said the chances are negligible. It makes mo sense to sell him in January, its not as if he has a contract running down to the point he can go for free in the summer and we dont need the money. Ronaldo could sign for Liverpool in January but he probably isnt going to, to the point it probably isnt worth mentioning. Its pretty safe to say hes here for the season.

Whittingham came to you as a winger, he just gets most of his goals centrally. Michu isnt a striker and has never performed well there, you will have to ask Laudrup why he continues to do it as we are all baffled, and so is Michu id say.

That doesn't mean that it won't happen though. The discontent he's showing on the pitch and in interviews shows that it could well happen.

Unless you're seriously trying to suggest that Michu leaving Swansea is as likely as Ronaldo joining Liverpool.

As for Whittingham, his natural position is CM these days. Has been for many years. He's played there this season about as often as Michu and scored the same amount of goals.

Of course, but as i said the chances are negligible. It makes mo sense to sell him in January, its not as if he has a contract running down to the point he can go for free in the summer and we dont need the money. Ronaldo could sign for Liverpool in January but he probably isnt going to, to the point it probably isnt worth mentioning. Its pretty safe to say hes here for the season.

Whittingham came to you as a winger, he just gets most of his goals centrally. Michu isnt a striker and has never performed well there, you will have to ask Laudrup why he continues to do it as we are all baffled, and so is Michu id say.

That doesn't mean that it won't happen though. The discontent he's showing on the pitch and in interviews shows that it could well happen.

Unless you're seriously trying to suggest that Michu leaving Swansea is as likely as Ronaldo joining Liverpool.

As for Whittingham, his natural position is CM these days. Has been for many years. He's played there this season about as often as Michu and scored the same amount of goals.

Nothing in life is certain apart from death and taxes as they say. However you can make decisions based on what we know, and just as i can be fairly certain Ronaldo wont be signing for Liverpool in Jan, I can be fairly certain we wont be selling Michu in Jan. not that this has anything to do with him being a one season wonder though.

Yes i am suggesting that. There is next to no chance we will sell him in jan unless someone comes in and bids £30m, and the chances of someone doing that are probably as slim as Brendan stumping up £100m to land Ronaldo. Not going to happen.

As for Whittingham, he is more than adept at playing on the left. He has been a left sided player most of his life - its completely different to comparing that to Michu who has never been a striker until Laudrup has tried to force the issue without much success over the last 10-12 months.

As for Whittingham, he is more than adept at playing on the left. He has been a left sided player most of his life - its completely different to comparing that to Michu who has never been a striker until Laudrup has tried to force the issue without much success over the last 10-12 months.

No he hasn't. he hasn't played on the wing for many a year & only did so as a youngster. James Collins played up front as a youngster, does that mean he's adept at doing so now? No.

Michu and a Whittingham have found themselves in their most natural position only a number of occasions this season & both scored 2. Those are facts.

This time last year, I was pretty fed up of hearing about Michu. This year, nobody is talking about him at all. Excellent player, but to suggest that he's playing anywhere near the same level as last season, is fanciful in my opinion.

Back?

Peaked at 27? Deat lord

I think you'll find age has nothing to do with it.
Many a player have had their best season before they reach thirty.
That's why I said peaked and not got older.

I cant think of many players to have peaked prior to 27 years old. Fake african passports aside.

As I have shown, when played in his rightful position he has performed excellently and scored a goal every other game.

Stick Van Persie in central midfield, see if he scores as many.

I know you can't think of any, but most players do peak at 25/26 .

So your "Dear lord" comment is way off the mark.
But then again Roathie, you always know best.


Some things, like a good wine, get better with age. Footballers do, too, but unfortunately only up to a point. Even in the era of Giggs, Scholes, and Friedel, no matter where athletes do their work, they will eventually see a decline in performance. If that's true, and if we assume that a player's performance is linked to his market value, both should increase during the first half of a player's career and decline thereafter.

But is that really the case? And if it is, where exactly is that turning point – the time at which players become more and less valuable? One way to answer that question is examine their performance; another way is to see what the market says. It's the latter we focus on here. We wanted to know: what is the connection between a player’s age and the price he can command?

To answer these questions, we collected data from the respected Transfermarkt website for all players currently on Premier League squads and performed a variety of calculations on their transfer values (complete data were available for a total of 502 players; we collected these data in early October).*

As in our previous analyses, we estimated a set of of regression models with the aim of accurately predicting a player’s valuation based on a variety of factors, including things like position, nationality, club, contract length, experience in the league, and so on. But critically, we also included two variables to assess the influence of a player’s age on his valuation – the actual age, to capture any linear trend in age and age squared, to see if the connection between age and valuation is curvilinear.


Lo and behold, our results reveal that the conventional wisdom holds.** Players’ valuations look like an inverted U, rising for some years but then peaking and falling afterwards. While these regression results confirm conventional wisdom, they don't tell us the exact shape of that inverted U.

To pinpoint when exactly the market says players peak, we used the regression models to calculate the average player's values in different age groups (and plotted them in the graph below).

We were surprised. According to these results, the current Premier League market valuations tell us that players peak relatively early in their careers.


Data source: Transfermarkt.

(c) 2012 soccerbythenumbers.com

In fact, our calculations suggest that players' market valuations are highest at age 26, at a price of £7.24m. The data also show that 18 and 33 year-olds are valued roughly the same, with players beyond 33 continuing to decline significantly - a 35 year old is half as valuable as a 31 year old or the average 20 year old.

Of course, there is no such thing as the "average" player - it's a figment of our statistical imagination by controlling for things like positions or nationality. Moreover, these calculations don't tell us whether there are differences in age curves for different positions or nationalities or players with different sets of skills (we strongly suspect there are, as Mr. Friedel would probably point out). And admittedly, the data are from a single season and therefore it's impossible to say whether they are generalizable beyond this year or how they have evolved and will continue to evolve over time.

At the same time, the numbers do tell us something about the logic of the transfer market. Players' valuations peak in their mid-20s rather than the late 20s, as is commonly assumed by people in the know. By the way, that doesn't mean you should sell your stellar 26 year old midfielder - his performance probably is in line with his value. Instead, to find value in the market, see if there are great bargains to be had among players whose valuations haven't peaked or who the market thinks are past their prime. You don't need to field 11 of those kinds of players - one or two will probably do.

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As for Whittingham, he is more than adept at playing on the left. He has been a left sided player most of his life - its completely different to comparing that to Michu who has never been a striker until Laudrup has tried to force the issue without much success over the last 10-12 months.

No he hasn't. he hasn't played on the wing for many a year & only did so as a youngster. James Collins played up front as a youngster, does that mean he's adept at doing so now? No.

Michu and a Whittingham have found themselves in their most natural position only a number of occasions this season & both scored 2. Those are facts.

This time last year, I was pretty fed up of hearing about Michu. This year, nobody is talking about him at all. Excellent player, but to suggest that he's playing anywhere near the same level as last season, is fanciful in my opinion.

Yes he has. He came to you as a left sided midfield player. He played most of his 70 apparances prior to joining you 6 years ago as a left sided midfielder and has done so on occasion for you too. You played him predomenantly as a central midfielder at the age of 23/24, he was a predominantly left sided player for the best part of 15 years.

However even so. "In his natural position" Whittingham has scored 1 in 7 games, Michu has scored 2 in 4 games.

When Michu is played in his righful position he is playing very much the same as last year. 4 goals in 9 games and 2 assists woth very high performance levels. You haven't heard much about him because in the premier league hes been played as a striker which hes played off and on for 11 months as opposed to Whittinghams 15-20 years.

Back?

Peaked at 27? Deat lord

I think you'll find age has nothing to do with it.
Many a player have had their best season before they reach thirty.
That's why I said peaked and not got older.

I cant think of many players to have peaked prior to 27 years old. Fake african passports aside.

As I have shown, when played in his rightful position he has performed excellently and scored a goal every other game.

Stick Van Persie in central midfield, see if he scores as many.

I know you can't think of any, but most players do peak at 25/26 .

So your "Dear lord" comment is way off the mark.
But then again Roathie, you always know best.


Some things, like a good wine, get better with age. Footballers do, too, but unfortunately only up to a point. Even in the era of Giggs, Scholes, and Friedel, no matter where athletes do their work, they will eventually see a decline in performance. If that's true, and if we assume that a player's performance is linked to his market value, both should increase during the first half of a player's career and decline thereafter.

But is that really the case? And if it is, where exactly is that turning point – the time at which players become more and less valuable? One way to answer that question is examine their performance; another way is to see what the market says. It's the latter we focus on here. We wanted to know: what is the connection between a player’s age and the price he can command?

To answer these questions, we collected data from the respected Transfermarkt website for all players currently on Premier League squads and performed a variety of calculations on their transfer values (complete data were available for a total of 502 players; we collected these data in early October).*

As in our previous analyses, we estimated a set of of regression models with the aim of accurately predicting a player’s valuation based on a variety of factors, including things like position, nationality, club, contract length, experience in the league, and so on. But critically, we also included two variables to assess the influence of a player’s age on his valuation – the actual age, to capture any linear trend in age and age squared, to see if the connection between age and valuation is curvilinear.


Lo and behold, our results reveal that the conventional wisdom holds.** Players’ valuations look like an inverted U, rising for some years but then peaking and falling afterwards. While these regression results confirm conventional wisdom, they don't tell us the exact shape of that inverted U.

To pinpoint when exactly the market says players peak, we used the regression models to calculate the average player's values in different age groups (and plotted them in the graph below).

We were surprised. According to these results, the current Premier League market valuations tell us that players peak relatively early in their careers.


Data source: Transfermarkt.

(c) 2012 soccerbythenumbers.com

In fact, our calculations suggest that players' market valuations are highest at age 26, at a price of £7.24m. The data also show that 18 and 33 year-olds are valued roughly the same, with players beyond 33 continuing to decline significantly - a 35 year old is half as valuable as a 31 year old or the average 20 year old.

Of course, there is no such thing as the "average" player - it's a figment of our statistical imagination by controlling for things like positions or nationality. Moreover, these calculations don't tell us whether there are differences in age curves for different positions or nationalities or players with different sets of skills (we strongly suspect there are, as Mr. Friedel would probably point out). And admittedly, the data are from a single season and therefore it's impossible to say whether they are generalizable beyond this year or how they have evolved and will continue to evolve over time.

At the same time, the numbers do tell us something about the logic of the transfer market. Players' valuations peak in their mid-20s rather than the late 20s, as is commonly assumed by people in the know. By the way, that doesn't mean you should sell your stellar 26 year old midfielder - his performance probably is in line with his value. Instead, to find value in the market, see if there are great bargains to be had among players whose valuations haven't peaked or who the market thinks are past their prime. You don't need to field 11 of those kinds of players - one or two will probably do.

Im sorry to be so abrupt in reply to your lengthy post... But

You have confused peak performance levels with peak transfer value.

An on form 24 year old giggs is worth more than an on form 28 year old Giggs. Thats because the years they have to offer and not what their current performance levels are.

Back?

Peaked at 27? Deat lord

I think you'll find age has nothing to do with it.
Many a player have had their best season before they reach thirty.
That's why I said peaked and not got older.

I cant think of many players to have peaked prior to 27 years old. Fake african passports aside.

As I have shown, when played in his rightful position he has performed excellently and scored a goal every other game.

Stick Van Persie in central midfield, see if he scores as many.

I know you can't think of any, but most players do peak at 25/26 .

So your "Dear lord" comment is way off the mark.
But then again Roathie, you always know best.


Some things, like a good wine, get better with age. Footballers do, too, but unfortunately only up to a point. Even in the era of Giggs, Scholes, and Friedel, no matter where athletes do their work, they will eventually see a decline in performance. If that's true, and if we assume that a player's performance is linked to his market value, both should increase during the first half of a player's career and decline thereafter.

But is that really the case? And if it is, where exactly is that turning point – the time at which players become more and less valuable? One way to answer that question is examine their performance; another way is to see what the market says. It's the latter we focus on here. We wanted to know: what is the connection between a player’s age and the price he can command?

To answer these questions, we collected data from the respected Transfermarkt website for all players currently on Premier League squads and performed a variety of calculations on their transfer values (complete data were available for a total of 502 players; we collected these data in early October).*

As in our previous analyses, we estimated a set of of regression models with the aim of accurately predicting a player’s valuation based on a variety of factors, including things like position, nationality, club, contract length, experience in the league, and so on. But critically, we also included two variables to assess the influence of a player’s age on his valuation – the actual age, to capture any linear trend in age and age squared, to see if the connection between age and valuation is curvilinear.


Lo and behold, our results reveal that the conventional wisdom holds.** Players’ valuations look like an inverted U, rising for some years but then peaking and falling afterwards. While these regression results confirm conventional wisdom, they don't tell us the exact shape of that inverted U.

To pinpoint when exactly the market says players peak, we used the regression models to calculate the average player's values in different age groups (and plotted them in the graph below).

We were surprised. According to these results, the current Premier League market valuations tell us that players peak relatively early in their careers.


Data source: Transfermarkt.

(c) 2012 soccerbythenumbers.com

In fact, our calculations suggest that players' market valuations are highest at age 26, at a price of £7.24m. The data also show that 18 and 33 year-olds are valued roughly the same, with players beyond 33 continuing to decline significantly - a 35 year old is half as valuable as a 31 year old or the average 20 year old.

Of course, there is no such thing as the "average" player - it's a figment of our statistical imagination by controlling for things like positions or nationality. Moreover, these calculations don't tell us whether there are differences in age curves for different positions or nationalities or players with different sets of skills (we strongly suspect there are, as Mr. Friedel would probably point out). And admittedly, the data are from a single season and therefore it's impossible to say whether they are generalizable beyond this year or how they have evolved and will continue to evolve over time.

At the same time, the numbers do tell us something about the logic of the transfer market. Players' valuations peak in their mid-20s rather than the late 20s, as is commonly assumed by people in the know. By the way, that doesn't mean you should sell your stellar 26 year old midfielder - his performance probably is in line with his value. Instead, to find value in the market, see if there are great bargains to be had among players whose valuations haven't peaked or who the market thinks are past their prime. You don't need to field 11 of those kinds of players - one or two will probably do.

Im sorry to be so abrupt in reply to your lengthy post... But

You have confused peak performance levels with peak transfer value.

An on form 24 year old giggs is worth more than an on form 28 year old Giggs. Thats because the years they have to offer and not what their current performance levels are.

I think you're confused.
Re-read the original post in this thread.

However even so. "In his natural position" Whittingham has scored 1 in 7 games, Michu has scored 2 in 4 games.

When Michu is played in his righful position he is playing very much the same as last year. 4 goals in 9 games and 2 assists woth very high performance levels. You haven't heard much about him because in the premier league hes been played as a striker which hes played off and on for 11 months as opposed to Whittinghams 15-20 years.

Haven't heard much about Michu because he's not playing at the same standard as last seasons. Simple as that.

The fact that you think Whittingham's natural position is on the wing just shows how little you know about Cardiff City as a squad.

Michu and Whittingham have both scored 2 premiership goals this season, despite both not being used in their optimal position.

However even so. "In his natural position" Whittingham has scored 1 in 7 games, Michu has scored 2 in 4 games.

When Michu is played in his righful position he is playing very much the same as last year. 4 goals in 9 games and 2 assists woth very high performance levels. You haven't heard much about him because in the premier league hes been played as a striker which hes played off and on for 11 months as opposed to Whittinghams 15-20 years.

Haven't heard much about Michu because he's not playing at the same standard as last seasons. Simple as that.

The fact that you think Whittingham's natural position is on the wing just shows how little you know about Cardiff City as a squad.

Michu and Whittingham have both scored 2 premiership goals this season, despite both not being used in their optimal position.

Well its not as simple as that is it. He was recieving his plaudits last term while playing in midfield, he and the team went off the boil after January coinciding with the departure of Danny Graham and Michus move to an unnatural striking position. The same is said for this season. 4 in 9 in central midfield and 0 in 6 up front. Stick Van Persie in centrl midfield and you wont hear much about him either.

I didnt say Whittinghams natural position is just on the wing, and it has nothing to do with the squad. If we decide to play alan tate in goals it doesnt mean he isnt a central defender any more.

He played 50 games for Villa as a left sided player and a further 20 odd on loan after being a left sided player all his life, the fact you have successfully adapted him to be able to play the central midfield role doesnt mean he cannot play wide left anymore to the point it is "unnatural". Its what he always was. Comparing that situation to Michus is just stupid.

Whittingham has scored 1 in 7 from his central midfield role - Michu has 2 in 4 from his central midfield role.

I think you're confused.
Re-read the original post in this thread.

I certainly am, so are you by the looks of things. So your argument is he isnt worth as much as he was last season rather than him being passed his best? Because thats not what I believe the thread to be about or indeed the OP to which you refer me to.

If that is the case however, then id probably agree with that, but its a bitif a non subject. Anyone around the 27+ mark is going to decrease in value every year, thats just life. Its not what matters though, we are a football club not a company on the stock exchange. We paid £2m for him and will make a healthy profit regardless. The question is his ability, and as ive shown hes the same of not better this year when played in his position.

Teams have sussed Swansea, they get a lot respect for the way they play the game, but the opposition know what to expect.

Michu seemed to stroll around the penalty box without a marker and nonchalantly knock the ball passed a surprised keeper. He is certainly not a target man, why the manager plays him up there on his own is anyone guess, but I am happy.

Can Shelvey and Michu play in midfield together, do they want the same space. Looks an Everton type player to me nowadays

Scumsea said if they were gonna get rid of Michu they want £30 million for him I wouldn't give them £1 for him

Michu Thinks he's a popstar now I hear he is one of a few members of the swansea spice boys. That spend more time out on the jackland than in the training ground. No wonder his form has dipped