DEBT to EQUITY

Wind the clock forward and Langston has been settled.

How will it work?

The only way I can see it is that extra shares will need to be created, lower the present share price and convert the debt into those created shares.

Anyone know?

a new share issue would be the way it happens (i think)

Probably never happen judging by most fans opinions on here mate.

Tan will walk away and cut his loses whilst we will fold and return to blue...and fall down the leagues ala Pompey. But don't fear,the KCB and Anti Tan men will keep us afloat.


Not my opinions, Theirs.

Ian I asked this question before, I'll link the thread below, hopefully there's an answer there

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=103720&hilit=Shares

dunno but good to meet you last night bakedalasker !

dunno but good to meet you last night bakedalasker !

Right miserable bugger I was on the way back up North.

Great meeting you Mozzer.

i bet you were and i can sense that the red scarves issue had a profound negative effect on you !

but it was nice showing you the scenic sights of Cardiff on the way to the game well the back roads of sunny splott and tremorfa anyway

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

Move on Gareth ffs.

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

Move on Gareth ffs.

Call me boring but you know my views on your finances and whilst you are doing well and playing good football it pisses me off when pundits who know nothing about your clubs financial past praise you for being well run.

There are two parts to share capital

Authorised - the total amount that can be issued without going back to the shareholders for permission to issue new shares

Issued - the amount of shares actually issued to date out of the total allowed.

At a previous EGM the shareholders approved a big increase in the authorised share capital , giving lots of "headroom" to issue new shares as and when the board saw fit.

From memory (I will have to look up the old paperwork to confirm) however , there was only enough increase to allow just under £40m of new shares to be issued and VT`s debt is already over that amount so a new EGM will have to be called to increase the amount further to allow all of VT`s debt to be converted into shares.

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

Move on Gareth ffs.

Call me boring but you know my views on your finances and whilst you are doing well and playing good football it pisses me off when pundits who know nothing about your clubs financial past praise you for being well run.

The thing is though we are well run, very well run in fact and have been for the last 10 years. But that has nothing to do with this thread so lets not derail it.

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

Move on Gareth ffs.

Call me boring but you know my views on your finances and whilst you are doing well and playing good football it pisses me off when pundits who know nothing about your clubs financial past praise you for being well run.

The thing is though we are well run, very well run in fact and have been for the last 10 years. But that has nothing to do with this thread so lets not derail it.

Fair point about the thread.

There are two parts to share capital

Authorised - the total amount that can be issued without going back to the shareholders for permission to issue new shares

Issued - the amount of shares actually issued to date out of the total allowed.

At a previous EGM the shareholders approved a big increase in the authorised share capital , giving lots of "headroom" to issue new shares as and when the board saw fit.

From memory (I will have to look up the old paperwork to confirm) however , there was only enough increase to allow just under £40m of new shares to be issued and VT`s debt is already over that amount so a new EGM will have to be called to increase the amount further to allow all of VT`s debt to be converted into shares.

well if there have been meetings asking to increase the amount of shares he can convert then it's a good sign that he is still planning to convert the debt!

Probably never happen judging by most fans opinions on here mate.

Tan will walk away and cut his loses whilst we will fold and return to blue...and fall down the leagues ala Pompey. But don't fear,the KCB and Anti Tan men will keep us afloat.


Not my opinions, Theirs.

so do you believe that the malaysians are here to stay?

Probably never happen judging by most fans opinions on here mate.

Tan will walk away and cut his loses whilst we will fold and return to blue...and fall down the leagues ala Pompey. But don't fear,the KCB and Anti Tan men will keep us afloat.


Not my opinions, Theirs.

How can you say that when your avatar is that?

While we are in the championship debt to equity was a good ambition to have to keep fans happy while racking up debts. If we get to the premiership then debts of 60-80m suddenly seem manageable. They shouldn't need to provide additional funding on top of the tv money and can take £5m out of the club each year in interest payments on the loans. If I was them I'd be happy trying to avoid relegation each year, enjoying the exposure around the world and getting money coming back towards them instead of going out. Of course this means any ground expansion or training ground would have to come out of tv money and therefore reduce what we can spend on the squad.

Wind the clock forward and Langston has been settled.

How will it work?

The only way I can see it is that extra shares will need to be created, lower the present share price and convert the debt into those created shares.

Anyone know?

Only Tan knows exactly how he intends to put all the pieces in place to allow him to complete on hisdebt to equity promise. One thing I will say is that is every statement issued by the club I have read the term used is "Virtually debt free" or "Improving the balance sheet". It's only on messageboards that I have read it will leave the club "Debt Free".

We already know that following the 2010 & 2011 club AGM there are big blocks of shares, valued I think over £20m+ available for any debt to equity moves, including TAN, PMG and other directors. TLG has written a few informative blogs on this issue where PMG for instance is yet to make his promised debt to equity switch. Apparently the club has failed to make agreed payments so in my opinion there appears to be some sort of power struggle going on inside the club, however I'm sure the club are due to settle the PMG situation by May this year. Will that happen

As regards Langston until this is tested in court again none of this money is due until September 2016, forget about settling for reduced amount because it takes 2 parties to agree the deal and if we do get promoted it may well be possible for the club to settle this from the additional PL revenue.

Any money advanced by Tan to develop the stadium or new training ground would increase the value of the club because both would become assets of the business. That allows for the issue of new shares to reflect the assets. What about the PL revenue, if we get there, will that affect the value of the business I'm no accountant but will £90m+ of new revenue affect the value or ability of the club to service any debts.

In my opinion a lot of water will need to flow under the bridge before any debt to equity swap will take place but I'm not sure we will ever be "Debt Free". What football club is and more importantly has Tan ever claimed we would be.

The way i see it tan will get nothing in return untill its done eitherway.

As already mentioned the club could call an Emergency General Meeting of shareholders or simply put a share issue on the agenda of an Annual General Meeting.

I have no idea if there is a limit to what can be issued or authorised, but surely there are other ways of lowering the debt? I mean Tan could right off debts against shirt sponsorship or stadium naming rights (once Langston has been settleed) as well as using the debt to equity route.

The way i see it tan will get nothing in return untill its done eitherway.

VT will get no return until his Far East ventures are in place. Obviously I'm not privy to his exact plans/visions but from some of the snipits that come out now and again, his plans do seem to be extremely radical as well as very lucrative.

The way i see it tan will get nothing in return untill its done eitherway.

VT will get no return until his Far East ventures are in place. Obviously I'm not privy to his exact plans/visions but from some of the snipits that come out now and again, his plans do seem to be extremely radical as well as very lucrative.

Of course tony but i dont think it will go boom untill hes got ownership 100% while we have sharks around on money owed or wages per month who are all owed money by the club. The thing is if he is owed 100million which is say already in the club or due to go in the club then how will he make any money if the debt to equity is not changed before next season then because as i see it the prem money will not cover that hole for a season and he will still have the monthly wages to cover like now which will be much more i assume due to better players for prem football, meaning once again hes taking nothing out the club as they have stated many times. I can not pay myself £600quid a week if im putting £800 a week back in to my own company, wheres the logic in that, so he has to get rid of the debts all in all 100% and own it outrite, once people like ranson, pmg, sam and every fucker else is payed off who are owned money or are on the wage book are all gone at a lesser rate will he start to make money monthly but of course its going to cost alot to get rid of these folk and the intrest alone would be shocking to most on what there already owed. Thats how i see it anyway or maybe ive mossed something.

The way i see it tan will get nothing in return untill its done eitherway.

VT will get no return until his Far East ventures are in place. Obviously I'm not privy to his exact plans/visions but from some of the snipits that come out now and again, his plans do seem to be extremely radical as well as very lucrative.

Of course tony but i dont think it will go boom untill hes got ownership 100% while we have sharks around on money owed or wages per month who are all owed money by the club. The thing is if he is owed 100million which is say already in the club or due to go in the club then how will he make any money if the debt to equity is not changed before next season then because as i see it the prem money will not cover that hole for a season and he will still have the monthly wages to cover like now which will be much more i assume due to better players for prem football, meaning once again hes taking nothing out the club as they have stated many times. I can not pay myself £600quid a week if im putting £800 a week back in to my own company, wheres the logic in that, so he has to get rid of the debts all in all 100% and own it outrite, once people like ranson, pmg, sam and every fucker else is payed off who are owned money or are on the wage book are all gone at a lesser rate will he start to make money monthly but of course its going to cost alot to get rid of these folk and the intrest alone would be shocking to most on what there already owed. Thats how i see it anyway or maybe ive mossed something.

Basically we are in total agreement. Yes VT will one day own the club 100% and he will convert his debt to equity. According to the summary of the annual accounts which were recently published, up until May last year VT had put a total of £37m (or around that) into the club in the form of loans.

So in theory he has still got £63m to play with (although I accept there are huge amounts to still be paid out to Langston and on the training ground/stadium expansion)

However, I think there is still room for VT to subsidise us for at least the first couple of seasons in the Premier League whilst we establish ourselves.

By then the Far Eastern revenues should start to come online (betting, TV, Football Academy’s etc.) and it will probably be around then that the debt to equity will happen.

There are two parts to share capital

Authorised - the total amount that can be issued without going back to the shareholders for permission to issue new shares

Issued - the amount of shares actually issued to date out of the total allowed.

At a previous EGM the shareholders approved a big increase in the authorised share capital , giving lots of "headroom" to issue new shares as and when the board saw fit.

From memory (I will have to look up the old paperwork to confirm) however , there was only enough increase to allow just under £40m of new shares to be issued and VT`s debt is already over that amount so a new EGM will have to be called to increase the amount further to allow all of VT`s debt to be converted into shares.

Well said Bakedalasker.

I could almost have written that myself

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

Move on Gareth ffs.

Call me boring but you know my views on your finances and whilst you are doing well and playing good football it pisses me off when pundits who know nothing about your clubs financial past praise you for being well run.

Swansea`s financial affairs used to be shambolic , leading to their Administrations. But , for several years now , they have been extremely well run both on and off the field.

There are two parts to share capital

Authorised - the total amount that can be issued without going back to the shareholders for permission to issue new shares

Issued - the amount of shares actually issued to date out of the total allowed.

At a previous EGM the shareholders approved a big increase in the authorised share capital , giving lots of "headroom" to issue new shares as and when the board saw fit.

From memory (I will have to look up the old paperwork to confirm) however , there was only enough increase to allow just under £40m of new shares to be issued and VT`s debt is already over that amount so a new EGM will have to be called to increase the amount further to allow all of VT`s debt to be converted into shares.

Well said Bakedalasker.

I could almost have written that myself

Oh no not another multiple message board account scandle

The way i see it tan will get nothing in return untill its done eitherway.

VT will get no return until his Far East ventures are in place. Obviously I'm not privy to his exact plans/visions but from some of the snipits that come out now and again, his plans do seem to be extremely radical as well as very lucrative.

Of course tony but i dont think it will go boom untill hes got ownership 100% while we have sharks around on money owed or wages per month who are all owed money by the club. The thing is if he is owed 100million which is say already in the club or due to go in the club then how will he make any money if the debt to equity is not changed before next season then because as i see it the prem money will not cover that hole for a season and he will still have the monthly wages to cover like now which will be much more i assume due to better players for prem football, meaning once again hes taking nothing out the club as they have stated many times. I can not pay myself £600quid a week if im putting £800 a week back in to my own company, wheres the logic in that, so he has to get rid of the debts all in all 100% and own it outrite, once people like ranson, pmg, sam and every fucker else is payed off who are owned money or are on the wage book are all gone at a lesser rate will he start to make money monthly but of course its going to cost alot to get rid of these folk and the intrest alone would be shocking to most on what there already owed. Thats how i see it anyway or maybe ive mossed something.

Basically we are in total agreement. Yes VT will one day own the club 100% and he will convert his debt to equity. According to the summary of the annual accounts which were recently published, up until May last year VT had put a total of £37m (or around that) into the club in the form of loans.

So in theory he has still got £63m to play with (although I accept there are huge amounts to still be paid out to Langston and on the training ground/stadium expansion)

However, I think there is still room for VT to subsidise us for at least the first couple of seasons in the Premier League whilst we establish ourselves.

By then the Far Eastern revenues should start to come online (betting, TV, Football Academy’s etc.) and it will probably be around then that the debt to equity will happen.

The BIG question is when will this happen nobody really knows, the trouble is people carnt stand the man because of all this whole red thing hes got going and and will carry on in the future but can you imagine if everything was still blue and nothing done to the badge, fans would think hes some kind of hero and worship him but as it is they dont nore do i on a personal level but whats best for me and other fans is not always best for the club as much as we type shite on here and talk with other fans about what we would like to change.

Last edited by Bluebird1977 on Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

So if this guy is going to turn around £100m into equity, what price is your club being valued at exactly?

£5 million (think about it jack)

Move on Gareth ffs.

Call me boring but you know my views on your finances and whilst you are doing well and playing good football it pisses me off when pundits who know nothing about your clubs financial past praise you for being well run.

Swansea`s financial affairs used to be shambolic , leading to their Administrations. But , for several years now , they have been extremely well run both on and off the field.

True but another version would be dead lucky.

The way i see it tan will get nothing in return untill its done eitherway.

VT will get no return until his Far East ventures are in place. Obviously I'm not privy to his exact plans/visions but from some of the snipits that come out now and again, his plans do seem to be extremely radical as well as very lucrative.

Of course tony but i dont think it will go boom untill hes got ownership 100% while we have sharks around on money owed or wages per month who are all owed money by the club. The thing is if he is owed 100million which is say already in the club or due to go in the club then how will he make any money if the debt to equity is not changed before next season then because as i see it the prem money will not cover that hole for a season and he will still have the monthly wages to cover like now which will be much more i assume due to better players for prem football, meaning once again hes taking nothing out the club as they have stated many times. I can not pay myself £600quid a week if im putting £800 a week back in to my own company, wheres the logic in that, so he has to get rid of the debts all in all 100% and own it outrite, once people like ranson, pmg, sam and every fucker else is payed off who are owned money or are on the wage book are all gone at a lesser rate will he start to make money monthly but of course its going to cost alot to get rid of these folk and the intrest alone would be shocking to most on what there already owed. Thats how i see it anyway or maybe ive mossed something.

Basically we are in total agreement. Yes VT will one day own the club 100% and he will convert his debt to equity. According to the summary of the annual accounts which were recently published, up until May last year VT had put a total of £37m (or around that) into the club in the form of loans.

So in theory he has still got £63m to play with (although I accept there are huge amounts to still be paid out to Langston and on the training ground/stadium expansion)

However, I think there is still room for VT to subsidise us for at least the first couple of seasons in the Premier League whilst we establish ourselves.

By then the Far Eastern revenues should start to come online (betting, TV, Football Academy’s etc.) and it will probably be around then that the debt to equity will happen.

The BIG question is when will this happen nobody really knows, the trouble is people carnt stand the man because of all this whole red thing hes got going and and will carry on in the future but can you imagine if everything was still blue and nothing done to the badge, fans would think hes some kind of hero and worship him but as it is they dont nore do i on a personal level but whats best for me and other fans is not always best for the club as much as we type shite on here and talk with other fans about what we would like to change.

forgot to add, im bored to death with this topic theres f**k all we can do about it and worrying will make you sick tbh