Like him or loathe him

And as for Trump "doing more for black people than Obama" .................. well words fail me

Under the Trump administration, the percentage of unemployment for Blacks and Latinos has continuously decreased and have now reached record low levels. The unemployment rate for blacks sunk to 5.9 per cent this May, which is the lowest since 1972.

This is a continuation of a trend that existed within the Obama era but the rate of increase has grown significantly under Trump. A number of reasons for this exist including Baby Boomer retirement creating a more open job market but also Trump's rolling back of much of the heavy-handed and unnecessary regulation implemented under the Obama administration.

The result of such de-regulation has been to establish a far more entrepreneurial environment for small business owners to flourish, not only creating jobs and also creating competition within the workforce sector driving up wages. This is something that has also greatly benefited the black community where again actual wages are showing between a 9 and 16% increase within the black community depending on State.

Add to this he is the first president to introduce prison reform which will have a hugely beneficial impact on the black community that was decimated by Clinton's three-strike law back in the 90s. This is something Obama campaigned on and never delivered. Trump delivered it within the first half of his first term.

The approval numbers for Trump were initially low for two key reasons - firstly the black demographic has for a long time been told, coerced and convinced that they should vote Democrat on mass and secondly, Trump has been wrongly labelled a racist at almost every opportunity by an exceptionally biased media playing to an agenda. (As of October last year an incredible 92% of coverage of his presidency was negative)

However, there is a genuine changing tide not only in Trump's approval rating, which however you want to paint it is an impressive growth of around 260% (citing from lowest to highest) but also of the Blexit movement led by Candace Owens of the black community turning away from historical tribal voting (much like what is happening with both labour and to a lesser extent Tory support here in the UK).

All of the above is factual and based on the raw statistics but they don't fit into the narrative you have been fed so you need to do some work to find them and you won't likely find them in the biased legacy/mainstream media on either side of the Atlantic beyond Fox which for me generally tends to lean too much in the other direction to be truly impartial but at least offers some counterpoints to the dominant Orange Man Bad droning on we get from every other channel.

Equally, the other points you raise around climate change, Trump's financial/business dealings, NRA support, his position on abortion, repealing Obamacare etc can all be fairly easily overcome again by looking at the actual actions the man has taken whilst in Office and contrasting that with the largely empty rhetoric that supports those criticisms of him and his administration.

To be very clear I don't blame you for such rhetoric at all, the media has become a magnificently well oiled and slickly presented propaganda machine and has convinced the masses that the monsters are real - and one of them is now in the White House.

God knows why there is such an agenda, and the fact that we are seeing it occur globally is fairly terrifying, but as Romanian footballing legend Dan Petrescu (or maybe it was TV's Fox Mulder - I always get them confused) famously said "The Truth is Out There" - you just got to look a bit deeper than the crap they give us on the surface.

Now if you'll excuse me I've got a tinfoil hat to go polish.

Meanwhile, in other news, this Welsh legend (apparently she is from Aberystwyth originally) brought a bit of dignitiy back to the country...

https://youtu.be/i0I3yR_3yS4

I am 100% with Annis on this. It's just a pity we seem to differ on matters relating to Cardiff City me being a Tan supporter for example.

I am 100% with Annis on this. It's just a pity we seem to differ on matters relating to Cardiff City me being a Tan supporter for example.

And as for Trump "doing more for black people than Obama" .................. well words fail me

Under the Trump administration, the percentage of unemployment for Blacks and Latinos has continuously decreased and have now reached record low levels. The unemployment rate for blacks sunk to 5.9 per cent this May, which is the lowest since 1972.

This is a continuation of a trend that existed within the Obama era but the rate of increase has grown significantly under Trump. A number of reasons for this exist including Baby Boomer retirement creating a more open job market but also Trump's rolling back of much of the heavy-handed and unnecessary regulation implemented under the Obama administration.

The result of such de-regulation has been to establish a far more entrepreneurial environment for small business owners to flourish, not only creating jobs and also creating competition within the workforce sector driving up wages. This is something that has also greatly benefited the black community where again actual wages are showing between a 9 and 16% increase within the black community depending on State.

Add to this he is the first president to introduce prison reform which will have a hugely beneficial impact on the black community that was decimated by Clinton's three-strike law back in the 90s. This is something Obama campaigned on and never delivered. Trump delivered it within the first half of his first term.

The approval numbers for Trump were initially low for two key reasons - firstly the black demographic has for a long time been told, coerced and convinced that they should vote Democrat on mass and secondly, Trump has been wrongly labelled a racist at almost every opportunity by an exceptionally biased media playing to an agenda. (As of October last year an incredible 92% of coverage of his presidency was negative)

However, there is a genuine changing tide not only in Trump's approval rating, which however you want to paint it is an impressive growth of around 260% (citing from lowest to highest) but also of the Blexit movement led by Candace Owens of the black community turning away from historical tribal voting (much like what is happening with both labour and to a lesser extent Tory support here in the UK).

All of the above is factual and based on the raw statistics but they don't fit into the narrative you have been fed so you need to do some work to find them and you won't likely find them in the biased legacy/mainstream media on either side of the Atlantic beyond Fox which for me generally tends to lean too much in the other direction to be truly impartial but at least offers some counterpoints to the dominant Orange Man Bad droning on we get from every other channel.

Equally, the other points you raise around climate change, Trump's financial/business dealings, NRA support, his position on abortion, repealing Obamacare etc can all be fairly easily overcome again by looking at the actual actions the man has taken whilst in Office and contrasting that with the largely empty rhetoric that supports those criticisms of him and his administration.

To be very clear I don't blame you for such rhetoric at all, the media has become a magnificently well oiled and slickly presented propaganda machine and has convinced the masses that the monsters are real - and one of them is now in the White House.

God knows why there is such an agenda, and the fact that we are seeing it occur globally is fairly terrifying, but as Romanian footballing legend Dan Petrescu (or maybe it was TV's Fox Mulder - I always get them confused) famously said "The Truth is Out There" - you just got to look a bit deeper than the crap they give us on the surface.

Now if you'll excuse me I've got a tinfoil hat to go polish.

I do not read the "magnificently well oiled and slickly presented propaganda machine" to form my opinions and for you to dismiss my view so flippantly makes me question whether you have actually drawn on the "magnificently well oiled and slickly presented propaganda machine" that emanates from Trump Towers !!

Your claim that "All of the above is factual and based on the raw statistics but they don't fit into the narrative you have been fed" is complete rubbish if you really think about it. Even the stats I have quoted are purely opinion polls and those have been proved time and time again to be wildly out.

So no, your comments are not factually correct, they just reflect a certain opinion poll.

The only polls that are 100% accurate are the actual elections so don't argue semantics with me as if you have some greater power of deduction.

You believe one side, I believe another. Neither are flawless and only history will prove who is right. You are backing the popular view on this board, I don't.

Even your comment "As of October last year an incredible 92% of coverage of his presidency was negative" is obviously slanted at stating that the coverage is biased against Trump.

Whilst I'm no defender of the Press and many have their own agendas, are you really asking me to accept that 92% of the coverage is wrong !!??

From a personal point of view, I'm just glad I don't have Trump as a leader; I wish he'd butt out of expressing opinions on our politics. Leave us to make our own mess, we're quite good at it !!

I do not read the "magnificently well oiled and slickly presented propaganda machine" to form my opinions and for you to dismiss my view so flippantly makes me question

If you took that as dismissive and flippant then honestly that wasn't the attention. I just find so many of these conversations end up in tit for tat name calling eventually and so I wanted to distance any comments I made and opinions I have as not being directed personally at you but at what I see as a key problem in a lot of our problems today, which is a dishonest media.

If you felt I was flippant and if I caused you offence - I apologise. It genuinely wasn't the intention.

So no, your comments are not factually correct, they just reflect a certain opinion poll.

Most of the statistics I quoted were not opinion poll figures but hard verifiable data, the only polling figure I referenced was the one previously brought up earlier in the thread of Black American support growing for Trump.

You asked about showing how Trump had done more for black Americans than Obama. I've shown figures that present some very compelling evidence for that being the case.

The statistics around the record levels of unemployment amongst the black and Hispanic community within the USA and also the increases in wages amongst black workers under the Trump administration are from the Federal Reserve, and the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

You really can't get much more solid hard factual data than that - it is nothing to do with opinion polls at all.

Equally, Trump was the undeniably the president who recently passed the prison reform bill.

This will absolutely impact the black community more than any other as they are disproportionally represented in prison. 33% of the prison populations whilst only representing 12% of the population. (US Census Bureau & Bureau of Justice)

Obama made a lot of noise about Prison reform but never actually achieved it. Trump signed the bill in his first term. Both of these statements are matters of well documented historical record.

All of the above is 100% factually correct

There is no questionable data here, just solid factual evidence from the most reliable sources possible, which do build a very strong case to support the assertion you originally questioned which was that "Trump has done more for black America than Obama did."

Leave us to make our own mess, we're quite good at it !!

Finally, I couldn't agree more with you on this bit, we've plenty of our own mess to sort out without worrying about the USA - so I'll leave it on this common ground and in agreement