RELIGION?

how do you know what is right and wrong in the first place?

Reading through your pathetic answers I would have to conclude that God doesn't know the difference either

I am assuming this ad hominem means you have no response of your own. I have justification for right and wrong through the word of a higher power.

How do you know what is right and wrong?

Thank you MJW6150. You have given an excellent defence of Christianity. As always the difficulty is that most people are literally ignaramus's regarding the Word of God but have an opinion anyway. They don't know what they are talking about but they say it anyway.
Have you noticed it's always the same old stuff they spew out and yet they seem to think that they are saying something nobody else has come up with.
In a serious discussion and debate their positions would be destroyed within minutes by the person who actually knows what the bible says. Good for you brother.
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him would not perish but have everlasting life" JOhn 3:16

But wasn't the Bible actually written by man and not god?

Also it's my understanding that a council in Nicea made up of Bishops decided which books went into the Bible and which were left out.

If this is correct I do struggle to understand how the Bible can be called "the word of God" when it is clearly an amalgamation of writings written by various Men!

Correct, full of man's (various) interpretation (over thousands of years) who had very little little knowledge of the sciences.

Illogical response both of you. If someone can make the leap that Jesus was resurrected from the dead, God parted the Red Sea, created the world, etc... how hard would it be to believe in divine inspiration?
Fun facts as well, there have been many attempts to discredit the Bible's historical accuracy. Most historians who disbelieved in the Bible pointed to the Hittite empire as a mythic society, until archaeologist actually found the Hittite empires remains using the Bible as a guide for location.

You say God damned millions of people. How do we know that? As far as I know none of us know exactly the results of judgement?

I don't know for sure, but if he is all loving, like his followers say he is, then divine intervention would surely take place to the many millions blighted on earth today.
All loving God? Rich churches more like.

You cannot even tell us why these supposed bad things that happen are even bad in the first place, most of the Churches I know are certainly not rich (one I know gives away 50% of their income to others) though as the poster above states, whilst the Church isn't perfect, Christ is.

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

idiotic not many christian beliefs now insist that you do nothing on the sabbath and only a small groups of Jews insist nothing is done on the sabbath.

you are the exact problem with athiests and anti-religious types, you criticise religions for using the bible word for word and then do exactly the same thing to prove your point. Its stupid and uneducated.

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

Wrong, Matthew, Mark & John were all Jesus' disciples therefore witnessed a great deal of what they saw. The books of Luke & Acts were written by a doctor who interrogated many witnesses of his own.

Even a secular historian, Josephus, wrote about some of the events in the Bible thus confirming them independently.

I guess you also missed this link - http://carm.org/manuscript-evidence

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

I would say a creator of the universe and our very existence would deserve such worship, wouldn't you?

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

I would say a creator of the universe and our very existence would deserve such worship, wouldn't you?

Deserve it yes, but why would he want it?

Last edited by Carpe Diem on Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

how do you know what is right and wrong in the first place?

Reading through your pathetic answers I would have to conclude that God doesn't know the difference either

I am assuming this ad hominem means you have no response of your own. I have justification for right and wrong through the word of a higher power.

How do you know what is right and wrong?

I use my own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, if I get it right I'm a productive member of society if I'm wrong I end up in a criminal or civil court and I'm judged by my peers and not St Peter .

What I don't do is hide behind a mythical being to justify a load of cobblers because I have been totally brianwashed by a 2000 year-old version of the Sun newspaper.

Honestly mate people like you are completely pathetic and cause far more problems than you think you solve.

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

My personal favourite was the post earlier suggesting Jesus couldn't exist because how could you find people with the names Matthew, Simon, Peter etc. in the middle east!!!

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

I don't know as I've seen no conclusive proof of anything. You seem to have though.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

I don't know as I've seen no conclusive proof of anything. You seem to have though.

You've seen no conclusive proof of anything yet you try and smash us down the way you have?

Are you sure you are not fighting something working within you?

Sometimes God comes nowhere near us until we let Him in.

I definitely have, I could never be an atheist or even an agnostic with what I've seen and experienced

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

Could you please answer NJ73 question? What was God doing before he created the universe?

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

You've seen no conclusive proof of anything yet you try and smash us down the way you have?

Are you sure you are not fighting something working within you?

Sometimes God comes nowhere near us until we let Him in.

I definitely have, I could never be an atheist or even an agnostic with what I've seen and experienced

Sad b*stard

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

I don't know as I've seen no conclusive proof of anything. You seem to have though.

You've seen no conclusive proof of anything yet you try and smash us down the way you have?

Are you sure you are not fighting something working within you?

Sometimes God comes nowhere near us until we let Him in.

I definitely have, I could never be an atheist or even an agnostic with what I've seen and experienced

I'm sure you're happy to share your conclusive proof. So here's your chance.

how do you know what is right and wrong in the first place?

Reading through your pathetic answers I would have to conclude that God doesn't know the difference either

I am assuming this ad hominem means you have no response of your own. I have justification for right and wrong through the word of a higher power.

How do you know what is right and wrong?

I use my own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, if I get it right I'm a productive member of society if I'm wrong I end up in a criminal or civil court and I'm judged by my peers and not St Peter .

What I don't do is hide behind a mythical being to justify a load of cobblers because I have been totally brianwashed by a 2000 year-old version of the Sun newspaper.

Honestly mate people like you are completely pathetic and cause far more problems than you think you solve.

how do you figure that out?

you can live a good life as religious follower regardless of what religion that is, you can also live a good life as an atheist.

you say you use you own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, cant argue with that everyone is the same. As a Catholic the ability to use my own judgement is free will, which I believe is a gift from God, which gives us the ability to choose our own paths. You believe that its just common sense either way we hopefully make the same right decisions and live a happy life. I use the teachings of a religious book and the laws the govern this state to lead a productive life, you just use the laws of state. Hopefully our individual paths both make us happy and content in life and let us accept that what I or you may believe people have differing opinions.

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

It's the Old Testament dude, it is Levitical Law (the era of the priest).
You can read Romans and Hebrews if you want to learn a little. No offense mate.

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

It's the Old Testament dude, it is Levitical Law (the era of the priest). Romans 6 and 7, Hebrews 10 and 13.

Same book dude. It seems people are only picking bits from the book they like.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

Could you please answer NJ73 question? What was God doing before he created the universe?

I said 'No idea'. I wasn't there and there is nothing about that in the Bible aside from the passage at the start of John.

You've seen no conclusive proof of anything yet you try and smash us down the way you have?

Are you sure you are not fighting something working within you?

Sometimes God comes nowhere near us until we let Him in.

I definitely have, I could never be an atheist or even an agnostic with what I've seen and experienced

Sad b*stard

I'm actually very happy mate are you?

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

It's the Old Testament dude, it is Levitical Law (the era of the priest). Romans 6 and 7, Hebrews 10 and 13.

Same book dude. It seems people are only picking bits from the book they like.

not at all actually the bible is a collection of different books, mostly split into two the old testament and the new testament,

the old testament is shared between christianity and and judaism and the teachings are the same, the new testament introduces the teachings of Jesus Christ which christians believe is the son of god and judaism doesnt, jews still believe the saviour is yet to come. They respect and listen to the teachings of Jesus Christ but regard him as a great prophet rather than the messiah the same as islam believes Jesus is a prophet.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

No idea. If you don't believe God created then what do you think was happening before the universe came to be? Where did the initial factors that brought the universe into being come from?

I would saying believing God is far less of a stretch.

I don't know as I've seen no conclusive proof of anything. You seem to have though.

You've seen no conclusive proof of anything yet you try and smash us down the way you have?

Are you sure you are not fighting something working within you?

Sometimes God comes nowhere near us until we let Him in.

I definitely have, I could never be an atheist or even an agnostic with what I've seen and experienced

I'm sure you're happy to share your conclusive proof. So here's your chance.

Well the bits I have allured to on here is personal experience that obviously cannot be tangibly shared.

But the ultimate proof of God is that without God you cannot prove anything.

Because to know something for sure you either:-

1. Have to know everything
2. Have to have revelation from someone who does (i.e. The Word of God)

Otherwise you are just using your own reasoning to justify your own reasoning.

Evidence means little as all evidence is interpreted differently to suit different presuppositions.

The universe doesn't make sense with God, as I allured to earlier the laws of logic without God are nonsensical. They would have to be man made which means contradiction could exist rationally before they were made. You also need a higher power to justify morality.

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

It's the Old Testament dude, it is Levitical Law (the era of the priest). Romans 6 and 7, Hebrews 10 and 13.

Same book dude. It seems people are only picking bits from the book they like.

Might seem that way to you, I get that. But that is not what is happening.

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

It's the Old Testament dude, it is Levitical Law (the era of the priest). Romans 6 and 7, Hebrews 10 and 13.

Same book dude. It seems people are only picking bits from the book they like.

Which you have already demonstrated a complete lack of knowledge or, dare I say, ignorance of.

how do you know what is right and wrong in the first place?

Reading through your pathetic answers I would have to conclude that God doesn't know the difference either

I am assuming this ad hominem means you have no response of your own. I have justification for right and wrong through the word of a higher power.

How do you know what is right and wrong?

I use my own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, if I get it right I'm a productive member of society if I'm wrong I end up in a criminal or civil court and I'm judged by my peers and not St Peter .

What I don't do is hide behind a mythical being to justify a load of cobblers because I have been totally brianwashed by a 2000 year-old version of the Sun newspaper.

Honestly mate people like you are completely pathetic and cause far more problems than you think you solve.

how do you figure that out?

you can live a good life as religious follower regardless of what religion that is, you can also live a good life as an atheist.

you say you use you own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, cant argue with that everyone is the same. As a Catholic the ability to use my own judgement is free will, which I believe is a gift from God, which gives us the ability to choose our own paths. You believe that its just common sense either way we hopefully make the same right decisions and live a happy life. I use the teachings of a religious book and the laws the govern this state to lead a productive life, you just use the laws of state. Hopefully our individual paths both make us happy and content in life and let us accept that what I or you may believe people have differing opinions.

Appreciate your intellectually honest posts mate but if anyone can choose their own path then that means you could justify any action?

The Bible is an amazing book because it was written by 40 different authors yet stays consistent, coherent and un-contradictive throughout.

http://www.skeptically.org/bible/id6.html

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Yeah the Bible you know so well

The Sabbath Laws are Jewish Levitical Law

So Exodus 35:2 isn't in the Bible?

It's the Old Testament dude, it is Levitical Law (the era of the priest). Romans 6 and 7, Hebrews 10 and 13.

Same book dude. It seems people are only picking bits from the book they like.

Which you have already demonstrated a complete lack of knowledge or, dare I say, ignorance of.

Ok. So the Old Testament is a load of old nonsense that you don't believe?

You have to admit Jonny and mjw have held their own in this debate and unless you have their knowledge, the counter arguments are falling way short. I may not agree with them but I'm impressed.

how do you know what is right and wrong in the first place?

Reading through your pathetic answers I would have to conclude that God doesn't know the difference either

I am assuming this ad hominem means you have no response of your own. I have justification for right and wrong through the word of a higher power.

How do you know what is right and wrong?

I use my own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, if I get it right I'm a productive member of society if I'm wrong I end up in a criminal or civil court and I'm judged by my peers and not St Peter .

What I don't do is hide behind a mythical being to justify a load of cobblers because I have been totally brianwashed by a 2000 year-old version of the Sun newspaper.

Honestly mate people like you are completely pathetic and cause far more problems than you think you solve.

how do you figure that out?

you can live a good life as religious follower regardless of what religion that is, you can also live a good life as an atheist.

you say you use you own judgement to determine what is right or wrong, cant argue with that everyone is the same. As a Catholic the ability to use my own judgement is free will, which I believe is a gift from God, which gives us the ability to choose our own paths. You believe that its just common sense either way we hopefully make the same right decisions and live a happy life. I use the teachings of a religious book and the laws the govern this state to lead a productive life, you just use the laws of state. Hopefully our individual paths both make us happy and content in life and let us accept that what I or you may believe people have differing opinions.

Appreciate your intellectually honest posts mate but if anyone can choose their own path then that means you could justify any action?

but you do have to justify your actions in life and you can. Whatever I do in life are my choices free will, regardless of whether Gods teachings allow it or not. God will always forgive me aslong as I repent (apologise), forgive the sinner not the sin. However on this world we have laws of state which are outside religious belief which requires punishment if are broken.

So if a committed murder, I can have faith that God will forgive me and use my strength to get through the punishment for murder regarded by state. What I cant do is justify actions and make them innocent because its ok God has forgiven me.

I would have to justify my actions to the state, I do not have to justify my actions to God I just have to repent as God is all forgiving.