Administration - Private Messages

You have. Waffle all you like, but until you back up your statement with quotes attributed to Tan at the time of the rebrand proposal, saying that he will put only 50million of debt into equity & not all of it, you're going to continue to look silly.

You have. Waffle all you like, but until you back up your statement with quotes attributed to Tan at the time of the rebrand proposal, saying that he will put only 50million of debt into equity & not all of it, you're going to continue to look silly.

you dont take kindly to logic do you Think i just did friend, common untwisted knowledge

All you have done is post an article which actually backs my point and blows your points to bits.

“We are days away from an agreement and then we can convert all the loans to equity.”

Vincent Tan, July 22, 2013

“We are in the process of turning loans into equity. We are talking to shareholders now and after that I will convert my loan into equity. It will take the club to almost debt-free, probably in the next couple of months, God willing.”

Vincent Tan, August 15, 2013

"ALL THE LOANS" - says nothing about only 50 million here?

"ALMOST DEBT FREE" - since when was 100m almost debt free?

Thanks for proving yourself wrong. I'll let you have the last word.

All you have done is post an article which actually backs my point and blows your points to bits.

“We are days away from an agreement and then we can convert all the loans to equity.”

Vincent Tan, July 22, 2013

“We are in the process of turning loans into equity. We are talking to shareholders now and after that I will convert my loan into equity. It will take the club to almost debt-free, probably in the next couple of months, God willing.”

Vincent Tan, August 15, 2013

"ALL THE LOANS" - says nothing about only 50 million here?

"ALMOST DEBT FREE" - since when was 100m almost debt free?

Thanks for proving yourself wrong. I'll let you have the last word.

What part of sticking to a promise from the time it was made dont you understand? And what about circumstances change is confusing? If he put in 50 mill he will honour his original promise. 100 mill is disasters, and he either get that right or he sell.
If he dont, then you can call him a liar. I have to say you puzzle me if this is difficult to understand The club dont have assets to cover the dept yet. Surely you wouldnt donate 100 mil just for the fun of it?

Please please no more questions for the really clever Roath tragic the fantasist is busy trying to work out how he is going to get out of eating a Cardiff shirt

when Tan originally talked about converting the debt to equity how much did we owe him?

Certainly wasnt 150 million then

Of course the club won't go into administration.

We don't owe Tan anything.

Tan owes himself money.

What does going into administration mean? ..."temporary respite from having to pay his creditors!". It temporarily protects a company from having to sell assets to pay creditors.

So by stopping paying interest to himself (his biggest creditor) it is as though he has already declared an "unofficial" administration on himself to relieve himself from paying interest to himself.

Also he has the freedom to sell assets if he is not in administration.

He has done this without a points reduction...

Please please no more questions for the really clever Roath tragic the fantasist is busy trying to work out how he is going to get out of eating a Cardiff shirt

Which bit is "fantasist" like? Fascinating opinion.

And im not trying to get out of eating a short at all.

meek due to the fear some have regarding the consequences of him being forced out.

He cannot be forced out he is 80% shareholder!!

Forced to sell, not forced to leave.

IF priced right........you really dont know..or do i..or does anyone.....140mil was quoted to carl ,the figure will vary depending if and how much assets had gone...........so you dont know,just pretend to know because it suits your tan out because he is a threat,agenda.
the books nonsense is taking the p duh...........your posts are like text books,dont take into account anything other than maths.......business isnt pure.......you said the other day you were considering selling your property in cardiff.......considering?......the way you go on about business on here where does consider come into it?...surely it either is or isnt the time to sell........or is it rules for roath,different rules for the rest...

Why do you assume im using text books?

Yes IF priced right, tan can set the price he wishes. £140 million has nothing to do with anything you are seemingly confused.

Your point was buyers dont grow on trees, my point was there will always be a buyer if priced right - always. With future guaranteed parachute money the club completely asset stripped still has a value of way over £10m. So why would he fold it for no reason?
No issue talking with you soulofthesea but try and be sensible otherwise it becomes rather pointless

lets saY tan rakes back 30 million in player assets, 23 million from the parachute payments, and converts 50 million from debt to equity like hes now saying, thats (lets call it) 100 million off what we owe him.

So, we get to like, xmas, and Tan is owed 50 million by the club (at this point of course it would be higher, as i imagine he is constatly ploughing money into the club.

So unless he sells the club for circa 50 million we are still going to owe him a shed load of money right?

150 million is, just about managable (assuming he does eventually convert some of the debt) we would need to get rid of a significant amount of players who are the top earners (caulker, bellamy, jones, medel, mutch, marshall, fabio), that, along with the 23 million should significantly reduce the figure, but i cant see anyway that Tan leaves the club and we are then debt free immediately.

A debt free club is worth a lot more than a club that owes £50 million.

I could probably see a deal being struck between buyer and Tan to increase the selling price and eradicate the debt. Maybe even incorperate a sponsorship deal with it too.

If tan wants to sell then the debt of the club will have to be minimal and that is within his interests to do. But with future parachute payments you will have a foundation. But the longer he stays, the more of the parachute payments get wasted.

right, but any new guy coming in to buy the club is just going loan the money to buy the club against the club (like United?) meaning likely interest on the payments too.

i cant see a way we can be debt free in 12 months if Tan leaves, which isnt a bad thing anyway so long as the debt is less.

one thing thats important whatever happens, is that the club is run sensibly starting from now, and for me that means selling a load of players and using the money to clear a large chunk of what we owe

No, i very much doubt you can buy a club with loans placed against a club you don't own yet. The club cannot be liable for a transaction of sale between owners.

Tan needs to leave soon. The longer he stays the harder it will be to clean up as the parachute money will be whittled away.

For example if he was to leave in the coming months. He would keep parachute payments, sell players, keep ticket money, set up sponsorships, sell training ground (or keep and lease), sell shares and hold a small amount of debt over the club for future payment, maybe even wiping the debt for a non controlling % of the club where he may receive dividends in the future.

I cant see the club being in much if any debt once he leaves. But it will literally have nothing.

Anyway must dash, check back tomorrow.

Thought the glaziers had loans against the club to purchase united.

Most businesses have debt, it is a healthy way to grow, and the basis of all capitalism. This is why we have stock markets.

Debt only becomes an issue when it gets out of hand and there are issues covering interest payments.
Cardiff City doesn't need to be "debt free", but it would be a nice present to receive from VT.

The issue here is the "extreme" debt, and that it is growing. Base on the Cardiff City business model, it is hard to see how the debt will be paid off from business activities.

Debt can be helpful to let you "grow, but if unhealthy if it is used to manage the day to day in a non-growth environment.