It's such a shame......

Whist I totally empathise with all that the Hanged man has said and have considered the option of walking away until Tan and his dictatorial regime disappear, I do feel in doing so we are forgetting what supporting OUR club is all about.
I have like many supported OUR club for 35 years+ and have as many witnessed the highs and the lows of OUR club.
I will agree that this is probably the worst scenario we have seen for many a year and for me as others the Season of Dreams has become a nightmare.
What I do believe is we as fans can still have an influence in supporting OUR club and that can only be achieved by UNITY of the fans.
We should not look to vilify fans whether red or blue, we are all Cardiff City fans and new or old should be recognised as such.
If Tan's objective is to divide the fan-base and destroy everything I hold dear concerning OUR club, then I for one am not prepared to allow this without a fight.
I WILL continue to support OUR club, I WILL continue to respect our fan-base and I WILL still be a BLUEBIRD long after he has gone and taken his cronies with him.
Whether we are rebuilding in the lower divisions or possibly still in the Premiership, we will still have the most important thing in my eyes that FORGE the club >> THE FANS
All I ask currently is that we remember that UNITY is strength and that WE are the club despite what others would have you believe.
PLEASE UNITE AND RESPECT ALL CARDIFF FANS !!!

Tan caused the initial split in the fanbase (on the messageboards as in real life there is hardly a split at all) but its the fans that are driving the enormous wedge in that split.

So which group of fans fault is it Craig ?

Those who March and demonstrate they wish to remain blue ?

Another question is that the case that in real life it's different ? .... I wouldn't know as obviously don't attend those real life situations , from what I have seen there are plenty wandering around in red and stacks of kids going around in red kits too, all professing to be Cardiff Supporters albeit only really started going , so is that the " real life " situation that the old blue fan has been watered Down totally and Tans rebranding plans and vision has become a real life success ?

Or is the Apathy of the former blue supporting fan formed by premiership delights ?

Every "group" of fan thinks they are right. Given a straight choice between blue or red i would be gobsmacked if anybody actually chose red.

Different people think different things. If the name changed I would be gone because to me, the clubs identity is in the name. To others its the colour we play in at home.

I worry that if Tan went we would be crippled, not just relegation (been through that a few times) but liquidation. Its a gamble im not willing to take. Others are willing to take it and thats up to them. We didnt exactly have queues of buyers when Tan came onboard and saved us from HMRC (there is no disputing that)

I wish there was a local businessman who would take charge because he loves the club, but they aren't interested.

People peddle the line "id rather be blue in league 2" but in my head the choice isnt that simple as I think league 2 wouldnt happen and we would be dissolved. People think different but there is no proof either way.

Steve, I believe, and have done for a while that Tan is the fall guy and taking the shit for a bigger fish who is pulling his strings.......time will tell.

Sometimes its a case of better the devil you know.

Thanks for the feed back..... In the main it seems Tans plans are working then and the rebrand is going to plan and watering down the resistance bit by bit and also the " customers " as he calls them are adapting to change...... Shame really.

Seems he's won though and got his way.

Tan the fall guy? That is interesting.

Craig concern rests in the early days of the taxman closing us down. Some of us had faith that this was not going to happen while other not so much. If Tan is being an intermediate for someone else then that tells me we were far from dead even with the taxman calling. Would you say there were other scooping around?

The taxman was trying to close us down,NOT put us into admin but to close us down.That is an indisputable fact and also a matter of record.Tan stopped that, no-one else-Fact.Even the biggest Tan haters cannot argue without lying that we wouldn't be here today if it wasn't for him.There wouldn't be a club today to argue about if it wasn't for him-fact.Though I disagree with alot of what he's done since i'm glad I just have club to support.

I you know that for a FACT that would have happened?

Yes I do.As I said,its a matter of record,A COURT RECORD.Please don't take my word for it,look for yourself.The taxman was NOT trying to put us into administration,he was looking to wind us up.Baked, if this was bullshit there would be at least a dozen big time Tan haters queuing up to slaughter me-the board owner not the least of them but call me old fashioned but I just can't slag a man thats kept going something that I have followed for 40yrs even though I don't agree with what he's done.

Look at you all coming out now. You all accepted the red, defended Tan at every opportunity and shot down people like me because all you cared about is Premier League football. Now we're in the relegation zone, getting bad results here and there and all of a sudden you can see how much of a clown Tan is. Unbelievable.

Yo....for the shortsighted.....read the WHOLE post again dummy....

My thoughts were same, he hasn't read your full post bit it appears he just wants to have a go, I agree with you I was over the moon in getting to the promised land but it has been one big disappointment. Caused by Tan and his hangers on, I have just renewed by season ticket for next season, but that is because of Cardiff City not Tan, not Red or Blue. All we can do now is hope things get better where ever we are next season.

Personally I find the term "Pro Blue" offensive.
It would mean to suggest there is an "Anti-Blue" faction within our Fan Base.
There is not.
It's another example of how self destructive our fan base is without the rebrand.
It's laughable that posters have been trying all of the past 18 months to get reluctant reds to Ditch the idea and when someone openly says they're going to do it, the get slated by the judgmental I told you so brigade.

You come out with some rubbish.

The only people who deserve slating are those who thrived on belittling the pro blue. Most reluctant reds just left it at that with some even admitting they sold out. They are the ones that will be welcomed back.

Well said, plenty on here were ready to belittle anyone who wanted to stand up against the red.

Bullshit.
How and in what way were they belittled?
I have never attacked anyone for being a pro blue.
I have only argued the fact that people pay the money so they can support the team anyway they choose.

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

taken like a true gent sir.good post

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

I knew you'd ignore my reply.

I knew you'd ignore my reply.

Hello Jon....what do you want me to say that will feed your ego?

Argument is detrimental to growth, but if you want me to reply to one specific what is it?

I knew you'd ignore my reply.

Hello Jon....what do you want me to say that will feed your ego?

Argument is detrimental to growth, but if you want me to reply to one specific what is it?

I'm not saying I want you to reply, I'm just saying that your ignorance proved my point.

I knew you'd ignore my reply.

Hello Jon....what do you want me to say that will feed your ego?

Argument is detrimental to growth, but if you want me to reply to one specific what is it?

I'm not saying I want you to reply, I'm just saying that your ignorance proved my point.

Ignorance is a state of being uninformed (lack of knowledge).

Do you actually mean I ignored your post? A different matter completely. And if you do mean that, to which post do you specify?

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

yes, because there are 19 other companies watching me where I could potentially earn more

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

yes, because there are 19 other companies watching me where I could potentially earn more

I think I've got you.......totally mercenary with no commitment to your current employer as many others would pay you the dollar? mmmmm..........maybe therein lies the problem?

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

yes, because there are 19 other companies watching me where I could potentially earn more

I think I've got you.......totally mercenary with no commitment to your current employer as many others would pay you the dollar? mmmmm..........maybe therein lies the problem?

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

yes, because there are 19 other companies watching me where I could potentially earn more

I think I've got you.......totally mercenary with no commitment to your current employer as many others would pay you the dollar? mmmmm..........maybe therein lies the problem?

Im commited to my family. Employers matter very little except to pay me. I work to live not live to work. If you think players actually give a shit about the club you are deluded. All they care about is their paycheck arriving on time.

I think I know where you're coming from Craig.....and good on you mate, always look after you and your family.

On a slightly bigger scale, which you may or may not understand, you and your family are part of a bigger collective, it's called the world, but don't give a shit about that cos you have bigger fish to fry, namely your family.

Good luck my friend. I hope you succeed.

I knew you'd ignore my reply.

Hello Jon....what do you want me to say that will feed your ego?

Argument is detrimental to growth, but if you want me to reply to one specific what is it?

I'm not saying I want you to reply, I'm just saying that your ignorance proved my point.

Ignorance is a state of being uninformed (lack of knowledge).

Do you actually mean I ignored your post? A different matter completely. And if you do mean that, to which post do you specify?

The one you didn't reply to when you thought I was misquoting you.

The OP has spent the last two seasons belittling the likes of myself and Jon for our views on the rebrand, but now he's in agreement, he says he's got a right to vent it.

The double standards are strong here.

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

yes, because there are 19 other companies watching me where I could potentially earn more

I think I've got you.......totally mercenary with no commitment to your current employer as many others would pay you the dollar? mmmmm..........maybe therein lies the problem?

Im commited to my family. Employers matter very little except to pay me. I work to live not live to work. If you think players actually give a shit about the club you are deluded. All they care about is their paycheck arriving on time.

Can you back that statement though Craig?

The OP has spent the last two seasons belittling the likes of myself and Jon for our views on the rebrand, but now he's in agreement, he says he's got a right to vent it.

The double standards are strong here.

You have never tried to belittle anyone on here have you Chuckles dear. Bloody cry baby. And as for double standards , well if you live in a glass house, dont throw stones! (or grass people up for that matter.)

this o/p is a bit like a bloke saying i didnt mind the next door neighbour having sex with my wife or even smashing her back doors in.but enough was enough when i saw him kiss her on cheek.

That made me giggle

It made me laugh too.....even if it was decontextualised.

I'm not surprised by certain individual attacks at me by particular posters, that is human nature as they are the posters that I have critisised in the past.....and they require their piece of flesh.

But on a broader scale, I honestly believe that our club is getting very close to a tipping point. I don't give a shit whether we are in the Premier League, or any other for that matter, I've been there through every league. Does that make me better than the fan who started supporting yesterday? Of course not, but equally it does not make me worse.

There is a deeper issue to my discontent, and quite frankly I have a right to vent it.

I gave this regime "the benefit of the doubt" and reluctantly swallowed a colour change to keep us in business. When the "regime" starts spouting all the crap that they have this year I'm concerned. Why? because it totally disunifies the team.....those poor players who have to get on the pitch and pretend all is good!

Say what you want about "being a professional".....but contrary to popular belief, these are also human beings, harsh but true!

I'll be back when Tan has gone. Cardiff City will outlive that dictator by a long chalk, have no fear.

Ahhhhh those poor players

Im sure the £30k a week plus they earn a week just doesnt cut it

Question Craig?

If you are/were in a job on a massive salary but wasn't sure what was going on in your company tomorrow......would you perform to your best? Just a thought.......

yes, because there are 19 other companies watching me where I could potentially earn more

I think I've got you.......totally mercenary with no commitment to your current employer as many others would pay you the dollar? mmmmm..........maybe therein lies the problem?

Im commited to my family. Employers matter very little except to pay me. I work to live not live to work. If you think players actually give a shit about the club you are deluded. All they care about is their paycheck arriving on time.

Can you back that statement though Craig?

What do you mean "can I back it?"

I was referring to the 19 other employers bit. Just seems a bit "Trumpet Blowing"

I was referring to the 19 other employers bit. Just seems a bit "Trumpet Blowing"

Read it again. I was using an analogy that a player has 19 other employers watching him......as in 19 other clubs in the premier league not actually me personally

I was referring to the 19 other employers bit. Just seems a bit "Trumpet Blowing"

Read it again. I was using an analogy that a player has 19 other employers watching him......as in 19 other clubs in the premier league not actually me personally

The OP has spent the last two seasons belittling the likes of myself and Jon for our views on the rebrand, but now he's in agreement, he says he's got a right to vent it.

The double standards are strong here.

Chuckmeister.....it's not your views that were being "belittled".....it was your incessant statements about the same point, which incidentally I understood the first time, and the second, and third and umpteenth time, that got my back up........especially when it derailed many other threads that had nothing whatsoever to do with the rebrand.

Please note...I was not belittling your views......I was belittling you, there's a huge difference between the two.

The OP has spent the last two seasons belittling the likes of myself and Jon for our views on the rebrand, but now he's in agreement, he says he's got a right to vent it.

The double standards are strong here.

Chuckmeister.....it's not your views that were being "belittled".....it was your incessant statements about the same point, which incidentally I understood the first time, and the second, and third and umpteenth time, that got my back up........especially when it derailed many other threads that had nothing whatsoever to do with the rebrand.

Please note...I was not belittling your views......I was belittling you, there's a huge difference between the two.

What nonsense. Stop back pedalling. You were wrong, just admit it.

Jon and Bakedalasker have also said the same thing.

The OP has spent the last two seasons belittling the likes of myself and Jon for our views on the rebrand, but now he's in agreement, he says he's got a right to vent it.

The double standards are strong here.

Chuckmeister.....it's not your views that were being "belittled".....it was your incessant statements about the same point, which incidentally I understood the first time, and the second, and third and umpteenth time, that got my back up........especially when it derailed many other threads that had nothing whatsoever to do with the rebrand.

Please note...I was not belittling your views......I was belittling you, there's a huge difference between the two.

What nonsense. Stop back pedalling. You were wrong, just admit it.

Jon and Bakedalasker have also said the same thing.

FFS Chuckles dear give it a rest . Your mum will be calling you for your lunch soon.

The OP has spent the last two seasons belittling the likes of myself and Jon for our views on the rebrand, but now he's in agreement, he says he's got a right to vent it.

The double standards are strong here.

Chuckmeister.....it's not your views that were being "belittled".....it was your incessant statements about the same point, which incidentally I understood the first time, and the second, and third and umpteenth time, that got my back up........especially when it derailed many other threads that had nothing whatsoever to do with the rebrand.

Please note...I was not belittling your views......I was belittling you, there's a huge difference between the two.

What nonsense. Stop back pedalling. You were wrong, just admit it.

Jon and Bakedalasker have also said the same thing.

If Jon and Bakedalaskar said it it MUST be true......consider me hung!