RELIGION?

People say Religion is the Biggest Killer on the Planet, i can understand why they say this.

Two most deadliest wars in the history of mankind in the last century had nothing to do with religion.

Well lets put this myth to bed.
Hitler was a Roman Catholic, and even if he wasn't (which he was), his foot soldiers were. The soldiers who committed the atrocities of WW2 were either Catholics or Lutherans. The Catholics and Lutherans of Europe had been schooled for many centuries to hate Jews. They had been trained to believe that Jews were responsible for killing Jesus. So Hitler had a ripe field to plough in the Christian heritage of Germany.

This is a reach, Hitler put to death hundreds of thousands of Catholics.

Last edited by greenlawler on Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Thank you MJW6150. You have given an excellent defence of Christianity. As always the difficulty is that most people are literally ignaramus's regarding the Word of God but have an opinion anyway. They don't know what they are talking about but they say it anyway.
Have you noticed it's always the same old stuff they spew out and yet they seem to think that they are saying something nobody else has come up with.
In a serious discussion and debate their positions would be destroyed within minutes by the person who actually knows what the bible says. Good for you brother.
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him would not perish but have everlasting life" JOhn 3:16

But wasn't the Bible actually written by man and not god?

Also it's my understanding that a council in Nicea made up of Bishops decided which books went into the Bible and which were left out.

If this is correct I do struggle to understand how the Bible can be called "the word of God" when it is clearly an amalgamation of writings written by various Men!

Correct, full of man's (various) interpretation (over thousands of years) who had very little little knowledge of the sciences.

Illogical response both of you. If someone can make the leap that Jesus was resurrected from the dead, God parted the Red Sea, created the world, etc... how hard would it be to believe in divine inspiration?
Fun facts as well, there have been many attempts to discredit the Bible's historical accuracy. Most historians who disbelieved in the Bible pointed to the Hittite empire as a mythic society, until archaeologist actually found the Hittite empires remains using the Bible as a guide for location.

You say God damned millions of people. How do we know that? As far as I know none of us know exactly the results of judgement?

I don't know for sure, but if he is all loving, like his followers say he is, then divine intervention would surely take place to the many millions blighted on earth today.
All loving God? Rich churches more like.

On second thought I better back out of this debate, it gets me too fired up. This is one of the reasons I avoid CCMB.

Christians really screwed up a lot of things, but Christ did not. I think even the hardest critics can agree that Christians have benefited society in the last century. I don't understand the need to constantly attack other people's faith, it's theirs not yours. If you think their dull or stupid, fine. They probably think your making a big mistake as well.

how do you know what is right and wrong in the first place?

Reading through your pathetic answers I would have to conclude that God doesn't know the difference either

Thank you MJW6150. You have given an excellent defence of Christianity. As always the difficulty is that most people are literally ignaramus's regarding the Word of God but have an opinion anyway. They don't know what they are talking about but they say it anyway.
Have you noticed it's always the same old stuff they spew out and yet they seem to think that they are saying something nobody else has come up with.
In a serious discussion and debate their positions would be destroyed within minutes by the person who actually knows what the bible says. Good for you brother.
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him would not perish but have everlasting life" JOhn 3:16

But wasn't the Bible actually written by man and not god?

Also it's my understanding that a council in Nicea made up of Bishops decided which books went into the Bible and which were left out.

If this is correct I do struggle to understand how the Bible can be called "the word of God" when it is clearly an amalgamation of writings written by various Men!

Correct, full of man's (various) interpretation (over thousands of years) who had very little little knowledge of the sciences.

Illogical response both of you. If someone can make the leap that Jesus was resurrected from the dead, God parted the Red Sea, created the world, etc... how hard would it be to believe in divine inspiration?
Fun facts as well, there have been many attempts to discredit the Bible's historical accuracy. Most historians who disbelieved in the Bible pointed to the Hittite empire as a mythic society, until archaeologist actually found the Hittite empires remains using the Bible as a guide for location.

You say God damned millions of people. How do we know that? As far as I know none of us know exactly the results of judgement?

I don't know for sure, but if he is all loving, like his followers say he is, then divine intervention would surely take place to the many millions blighted on earth today.
All loving God? Rich churches more like.

Jesus talks a lot about this, churches tend to not. Maybe look into this yourself.

People say Religion is the Biggest Killer on the Planet, i can understand why they say this.

Two most deadliest wars in the history of mankind in the last century had nothing to do with religion.

Well lets put this myth to bed.
Hitler was a Roman Catholic, and even if he wasn't (which he was), his foot soldiers were. The soldiers who committed the atrocities of WW2 were either Catholics or Lutherans. The Catholics and Lutherans of Europe had been schooled for many centuries to hate Jews. They had been trained to believe that Jews were responsible for killing Jesus. So Hitler had a ripe field to plough in the Christian heritage of Germany.

well thats wrong wholly. Hitler was raised a Catholic, but questioned many of its teachings, he had respect for the position of the church. I cant speak for Lutherans but Catholics have never been taught to hate Jews I never have thats for sure. Anti-semitics within the Catholic church always raised the argument that the Jews killed Jesus. Its an idiotic argument as Jesus had to die to save us all and if it wasnt the Jews it would have been somebody else.

The Waffen-SS the military wing directly responsible for the holocaust, commanded by Heinrich Himmler created their own religious beliefs surrounded by mysticism and symbolism of ancient german religions. The SS was to be considered as a holy order along the same lines as the Teutonic Knights the military order of the Catholic Church during the Crusades. Heinrich Himmler started the process of replacing christianity in Germany with a new moral code that rejected humanitarianism and challenged the christian concept of marriage (though marriage to a woman was deemed necessary to produce children, extra-marital affairs were not considered a sin and actively encouraged for SS soldiers also homosexual relations between soldiers were encouraged to create a special brotherhood.). The Ahnenerbe, a research society was created by Himmler to prove his theory that Germans were an ancient pure and superior race.

So no the Catholic church does not teach the hatred of Jews and no the Waffen SS did not use Catholicism or Lutheran beliefs as their main religions.

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

Worth a watch

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

That is 100% not true. James was Jesus' brother. Matthew an apostle, John an apostle.

Never heard even the most anti-Christian atheist argue that.

I always felt that if you don't know a lot about someone's religion you should probably not comment.

Oh and Bill Maher real objective guy

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

THE RELIGIOUS PAXMAN

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

THE RELIGIOUS PAXMAN

Except he's actually right.

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

That is 100% not true. James was Jesus' brother. Matthew an apostle, John an apostle.

Never heard even the most anti-Christian atheist argue that.

I always felt that if you don't know a lot about someone's religion you should probably not comment.

Oh and Bill Maher real objective guy

Bollocks

This threads hilarious, what next people around the world trying to convince others that jack frost and the boogie man exists because of some book and myth made up.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

This threads hilarious, what next people around the world trying to convince others that jack frost and the boogie man exists because of some book and myth made up.

Santa Claus is real.

I read about him in a book.

The fact that there are so many religions around the world, past and present, points to a god being a human invention as a way to understand why we exist. Sometimes I think there may well be a God, but not the version people claim to worship in their religion. I think if he had the power to create the universe, why would he do it just for people to worship him? Bit big headed and I doubt he needs it.

And what was he doing before he created the universe, and how was he created?

I know what you mean, but then if there isn't a god then how and why did it all begin? Scientists talk of the Big Bang, yet who started it, why, and how could something be created out of nothing? I've no doubt religion is man made as people had to assume a higher being to explain why we are here, but sometimes belief in god seems just as likely as the scientific version.

I also think you can believe in both. God created the universe via the Big Bang and then let evolution do its thing. Yet nature is truly mind blowing at times and I find it hard to believe evolution and natural selection can explain everything.
I'm not religious though, just can see all arguments.

Last edited by Carpe Diem on Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

That is 100% not true. James was Jesus' brother. Matthew an apostle, John an apostle.

Never heard even the most anti-Christian atheist argue that.

I always felt that if you don't know a lot about someone's religion you should probably not comment.

Oh and Bill Maher real objective guy

Bollocks

Whatever you say, but the New Testament is the absolute most scrutinized book in history. Don't you think if Christianity's critics they could disprove a single claim they would not have already? But they cannot. Oh and there are other eye witness "authors" who wrote in the New Testament including Luke and Peter. And those are facts.

This threads hilarious, what next people around the world trying to convince others that jack frost and the boogie man exists because of some book and myth made up.

Always respect your post. I am not sure why people abuse Christians who are simply defending their faith, and then cry bullocks when they fight back.

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

That is 100% not true. James was Jesus' brother. Matthew an apostle, John an apostle.

Never heard even the most anti-Christian atheist argue that.

I always felt that if you don't know a lot about someone's religion you should probably not comment.

Oh and Bill Maher real objective guy

Bollocks

Whatever you say, but the New Testament is the absolute most scrutinized book in history. Don't you think if Christianity's critics they could disprove a single claim they would not have already? But they cannot. Oh and there are other eye witness "authors" who wrote in the New Testament including Luke and Peter. And those are facts.

If you want to believe in fairy stories, that's your choice

Worth a watch

really good watch and really does make you think and makes you understand some of the idiotic notions people believe and do in the name of God.

he really is a guy who does give religion a fair argument whilst asking very difficult questions.

problems that he highlights is that people dont understand their own religions and interperate their understanding with their own beliefs and make them one and the same.

for example you maybe homophobic and you maybe catholic, these are two different entities. Now if you combine the two to support your homophobic beliefs you give a false interpretation of your religion. People have it the wrong way round they mould their religious belief to suit their personal belief what they should do is mould their personal beliefs around their religious beliefs, unfortunately the latter is the harder option.

The New Testament is one of the most verified and accurate books in history -

Jesus f*cking Christ are you serious?

The new testament is heresay and not written by anyone who witnessed the claimed events. To base anything on a book of heresay from 2000 years ago is quite simply, barking.

That is 100% not true. James was Jesus' brother. Matthew an apostle, John an apostle.

Never heard even the most anti-Christian atheist argue that.

I always felt that if you don't know a lot about someone's religion you should probably not comment.

Oh and Bill Maher real objective guy

Bollocks

Whatever you say, but the New Testament is the absolute most scrutinized book in history. Don't you think if Christianity's critics they could disprove a single claim they would not have already? But they cannot. Oh and there are other eye witness "authors" who wrote in the New Testament including Luke and Peter. And those are facts.

If you want to believe in fairy stories, that's your choice

I don't.

'Yet he will still condemn people to hell (according to the bible) even though he loves us all?'

God loves us, as the Bible says, but whilst God is loving He is also Just, which means He will ensure justice is done. Just as if someone did a wrong to our family and friends we would expect them to pay for it, God ensures that no wrong goes unpunished. God actually cannot stand sin, hence why Jesus, when on the cross said 'Why have you forsaken me?'. Jesus Christ was taking on the sin of mankind and God refused to be present. If we want to go into God's presence we must be free of sin. YET, God came and died Himself to give us the chance to go to Heaven and not hell.

According to your god, the commandments tell you what is wrong (the commandments) If there is a God and he is all loving then there would be none of the above. Try telling the starving millions around the world "Don't worry you are going to starve to death, god loves you" I don't think it will help much.

As I said in my previous post, God gave us a choice to do either what is right and what is wrong. Just as a tiny bit of poison pollutes water fully, sin pollutes creation. I've been to Africa and seen terrible poverty and actually their faith is the one thing that keeps them going. In fact, those people were happier than most of the people I see in my daily life here. Not that their problems don't need seeing to and God calls many workers to help over there and by giving money.

'If someone gets hurt, it's not good that's for sure.'

What about when people are hurt by musclebuilding, or by operations to save their lives? What about when someone gives someone a few home truths, they need to hear it but it hurts?

We make the laws, not god. God (if you believe the bible) has given you guidelines and that's up to you.

Our laws come from God's laws. The law isn't perfect, many things that are illegal now were legal in the past, were they okay then? Is North Korean law a justifiable case for morality?

So how do you know what is right and wrong?

So, being good to some-one or being bad to someone was not around before the Bible? You're having a laugh!!

I'm not saying that as clearly the Bible was written after the Commandments were given. Remember, you are the one who said you don't know what is right or wrong, even today.

Man first, because man made the law of logic. Before man it mattered not a jot to man.

So now I ask you, did the world exist and not exist at the same time before logic was made? (since the law of non contradiction was man made)

Phew, this could go on for ever.

I don't have the will to keep answering you as everything contradicts itself, like god being all forgiving??
Hence to say, when I die I do not want everlasting life in a place they call heaven, it seems so boring, it would be hell to me.
Be good.

Who said God was all forgiving? God forgives those who truly repent, not anyone and everyone.

That's your choice but I know where I'm firmly standing

Religion = hate, war and so on, who made this bullshit religion word up to start with anyway, whoever it was wanted shooting before it was even thought of, how can anybody justify some geezer dressed as a tramp riding the local UFO in the sky as his taxi service ffs, you must be bonkers to even think this.

I don't think anyone thinks that to be honest!

You do because you believe in it

Please show me where I said I believed in a 'geezer dressed as a tramp riding the local UFO in the sky as his taxi service' and where in the Bible it makes any reference to such a thing. Thanks

People say Religion is the Biggest Killer on the Planet, i can understand why they say this.

Two most deadliest wars in the history of mankind in the last century had nothing to do with religion.

Well lets put this myth to bed.
Hitler was a Roman Catholic, and even if he wasn't (which he was), his foot soldiers were. The soldiers who committed the atrocities of WW2 were either Catholics or Lutherans. The Catholics and Lutherans of Europe had been schooled for many centuries to hate Jews. They had been trained to believe that Jews were responsible for killing Jesus. So Hitler had a ripe field to plough in the Christian heritage of Germany.

I have studied Nazi Germany greatly and you are so wrong. Hitler claimed Christian ideas in the late 20s, early 30s when trying to win election as a large percentage of Germans were Catholics. However once in dominant power he went on to persecute and murder many Christians amongst other religions.

Are you saying that these Catholics and Lutherans willingly butchered their own people? If so, obviously they were not holding such beliefs.

The church is against abortion.
But recognises that those who are aborted are allowed into heaven.

So although its out of context but you could say if we abort our children then we guarantee their entry into heaven.

But you would deny them life, and a personal choice. As demonstrated by the Garden of Eden, God wants us to choose.

I would consider that the Bible goes against abortion therefore that is simply not an option.

Thank you MJW6150. You have given an excellent defence of Christianity. As always the difficulty is that most people are literally ignaramus's regarding the Word of God but have an opinion anyway. They don't know what they are talking about but they say it anyway.
Have you noticed it's always the same old stuff they spew out and yet they seem to think that they are saying something nobody else has come up with.
In a serious discussion and debate their positions would be destroyed within minutes by the person who actually knows what the bible says. Good for you brother.
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him would not perish but have everlasting life" JOhn 3:16

But wasn't the Bible actually written by man and not god?

Also it's my understanding that a council in Nicea made up of Bishops decided which books went into the Bible and which were left out.

If this is correct I do struggle to understand how the Bible can be called "the word of God" when it is clearly an amalgamation of writings written by various Men!

The Bible was written by men but inspired by God. The Bible is an amazing book because it was written by 40 different authors yet stays consistent, coherent and un-contradictive throughout. It also has predictions written 700 years before they happened, are historically definitely happened. I can speak for myself in that the book helped change my life and I have never found anything in it to be untrue in my experience.

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

The Canon basically declared the books that were already being considered as the Word of God and used by Churches all over the world as the official Word of God.

Thank you MJW6150. You have given an excellent defence of Christianity. As always the difficulty is that most people are literally ignaramus's regarding the Word of God but have an opinion anyway. They don't know what they are talking about but they say it anyway.
Have you noticed it's always the same old stuff they spew out and yet they seem to think that they are saying something nobody else has come up with.
In a serious discussion and debate their positions would be destroyed within minutes by the person who actually knows what the bible says. Good for you brother.
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him would not perish but have everlasting life" JOhn 3:16

But wasn't the Bible actually written by man and not god?

Also it's my understanding that a council in Nicea made up of Bishops decided which books went into the Bible and which were left out.

If this is correct I do struggle to understand how the Bible can be called "the word of God" when it is clearly an amalgamation of writings written by various Men!

Correct, full of man's (various) interpretation (over thousands of years) who had very little little knowledge of the sciences.

Wrong again, the concept of science was actually started by Christians (and nearly all the major scientists in recent centuries were Christians such as Newton, Pascale) and the Bible has been proven right scientifically on a number of occasions not least regarding the amount of water in our bodies (blood & water when Jesus pierced on the cross) and that the earth was spherical (isaiah 40:22)

Did you know that even the Big Bang was a Christian idea?

I find it strange that a football fan would want anyone working on the Sabbath put to death and yet go and support them working.

Unless of course you're only selecting bits from the bible that you like

Equally I could say -

Atheism - the belief that nothing exploded with nothing to create everything