COME ON IRELAND & FELLOW CELTS

Well you may understand why they try to blow you up, if you learn what the english did to the Irish ,and in there own country. Just to have a small insight into it take a look at a film called, The Wind That Shakes The Barley. That will give you a Very small glimps into what went on. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhn5_gUcO5E

An excellent film by Ken Loach.

Come on Ireland - and France tomorrow

are you watching it with your english son in law or are you going to watch it in the wanderer with your english wolves mates?grade 1 hyocrite

You've got me completely confused here jtc????

What are you talking about? Genuine question

it was to wcd dai.a comment on who he is watching the england game with.his son in law(english)or his wolves fans mates who are in the main very english.i,m sure they will be excited to hear his anti english speach before the game

ah, I see - that makes sense - sorry, I was just genuinely confused then.

Well you may understand why they try to blow you up, if you learn what the english did to the Irish ,and in there own country. Just to have a small insight into it take a look at a film called, The Wind That Shakes The Barley. That will give you a Very small glimps into what went on. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhn5_gUcO5E

An excellent film by Ken Loach.

Come on Ireland - and France tomorrow

are you watching it with your english son in law or are you going to watch it in the wanderer with your english wolves mates?grade 1 hyocrite

You've got me completely confused here jtc????

What are you talking about? Genuine question

it was to wcd dai.a comment on who he is watching the england game with.his son in law(english)or his wolves fans mates who are in the main very english.i,m sure they will be excited to hear his anti english speach before the game

ah, I see - that makes sense - sorry, I was just genuinely confused then.

sorry dia.i can see it could have been mistook for you.sorry pal.

it was to wcd dai.a comment on who he is watching the england game with.his son in law(english)or his wolves fans mates who are in the main very english.i,m sure they will be excited to hear his anti english speach before the game

ah, I see - that makes sense - sorry, I was just genuinely confused then.[/quote]
sorry dia.i can see it could have been mistook for you.sorry pal.[/quote]

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No probs - my dislike of England is more my dislike of the media ramming England down out throats rather than outright nationalism for me - for example, I've got nothing at all against the English rugby team at all and was pleased when they won the world cup in 2003 - in fact, because of the fact the media down here ram Welsh rugby down our throats so much, its Welsh rugby I dislike rather than English rugby. Just to let you know it's not anything against English people generally - I did my degree in the University of Bristol, and always got on well with the vast majority of people I met there, some of whom remain close friends

1 -0 Croatia

well done - cant stand the Southern Irish

What an absolutely moronic statement, you are a class A bell end

1 -0 Croatia

well done - cant stand the Southern Irish

What an absolutely moronic statement, you are a class A bell end

Agreed

it was to wcd dai.a comment on who he is watching the england game with.his son in law(english)or his wolves fans mates who are in the main very english.i,m sure they will be excited to hear his anti english speach before the game

ah, I see - that makes sense - sorry, I was just genuinely confused then.

sorry dia.i can see it could have been mistook for you.sorry pal.[/quote]

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No probs - my dislike of England is more my dislike of the media ramming England down out throats rather than outright nationalism for me - for example, I've got nothing at all against the English rugby team at all and was pleased when they won the world cup in 2003 - in fact, because of the fact the media down here ram Welsh rugby down our throats so much, its Welsh rugby I dislike rather than English rugby. Just to let you know it's not anything against English people generally - I did my degree in the University of Bristol, and always got on well with the vast majority of people I met there, some of whom remain close friends [/quote]
we dislike the media ramming england down our throats dia.over hyped.i,m sick of seeing blokes draped in st georges flags saying england expects.this time round there is no hype.they will not disgrace us .whatever happens they will put in credible shows as the boss will make sure of that.he,ll make sure they behave too.england egg even went the way of the footballers.drunk and over hyped.happens to them all.big time charlies who would do well to remember it,s an honour to play for your country or even a club team.the english working class have suffered as much as any one dia with sucsessive governments.any town built on coal,steel etc has suffered anywhere in the uk.tbh it feels like there is no government here at the moment.

it was to wcd dai.a comment on who he is watching the england game with.his son in law(english)or his wolves fans mates who are in the main very english.i,m sure they will be excited to hear his anti english speach before the game

ah, I see - that makes sense - sorry, I was just genuinely confused then.

sorry dia.i can see it could have been mistook for you.sorry pal.

-------------------------------------------
No probs - my dislike of England is more my dislike of the media ramming England down out throats rather than outright nationalism for me - for example, I've got nothing at all against the English rugby team at all and was pleased when they won the world cup in 2003 - in fact, because of the fact the media down here ram Welsh rugby down our throats so much, its Welsh rugby I dislike rather than English rugby. Just to let you know it's not anything against English people generally - I did my degree in the University of Bristol, and always got on well with the vast majority of people I met there, some of whom remain close friends [/quote]
we dislike the media ramming england down our throats dia.over hyped.i,m sick of seeing blokes draped in st georges flags saying england expects.this time round there is no hype.they will not disgrace us .whatever happens they will put in credible shows as the boss will make sure of that.he,ll make sure they behave too.england egg even went the way of the footballers.drunk and over hyped.happens to them all.big time charlies who would do well to remember it,s an honour to play for your country or even a club team.the english working class have suffered as much as any one dia with sucsessive governments.any town built on coal,steel etc has suffered anywhere in the uk.tbh it feels like there is no government here at the moment.[/quote]

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well said

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

You seriously have got problems. You;'re so quick to anger over such insignificant things.


yes he got confused between son in law and daughter's boyfriend, it's not the biggest mistake in the world and quite easy to make. As for English government he's quite right in correcting you that there's no such thing as an English government there's only a British government.

He's also right that it's not just the Welsh working classes that have suffered under successive governments just look up north at places like Newcastle, communities absolutely ruined by the miners' strikes.

Also, to be completely honest, you are an absolutely massive hypocrite. the amount of vitriol that comes out of your mouth against anything remotely English or rather non-Welsh yet you don't speak the bloody language and now I find out you support an English football team? How many teams do you want. You've got Cardiff, the Jacks and now Wolves?

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

You seriously have got problems. You;'re so quick to anger over such insignificant things.


yes he got confused between son in law and daughter's boyfriend, it's not the biggest mistake in the world and quite easy to make. As for English government he's quite right in correcting you that there's no such thing as an English government there's only a British government.

He's also right that it's not just the Welsh working classes that have suffered under successive governments just look up north at places like Newcastle, communities absolutely ruined by the miners' strikes.

Also, to be completely honest, you are an absolutely massive hypocrite. the amount of vitriol that comes out of your mouth against anything remotely English or rather non-Welsh yet you don't speak the bloody language and now I find out you support an English football team? How many teams do you want. You've got Cardiff, the Jacks and now Wolves?

And he jinxed Ireland yesterday

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

You seriously have got problems. You;'re so quick to anger over such insignificant things.


yes he got confused between son in law and daughter's boyfriend, it's not the biggest mistake in the world and quite easy to make. As for English government he's quite right in correcting you that there's no such thing as an English government there's only a British government.

He's also right that it's not just the Welsh working classes that have suffered under successive governments just look up north at places like Newcastle, communities absolutely ruined by the miners' strikes.

Also, to be completely honest, you are an absolutely massive hypocrite. the amount of vitriol that comes out of your mouth against anything remotely English or rather non-Welsh yet you don't speak the bloody language and now I find out you support an English football team? How many teams do you want. You've got Cardiff, the Jacks and now Wolves?

And he jinxed Ireland yesterday

Oh he has my support on that one

And he jinxed Ireland yesterday

I was really gutted the Republic lost yesterday.

Sadly, I think it will be very difficult for them now.

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

anger management for you i,m afraid.i,ll. say this one more time for you wcd but i won,t shout .there is no such thing as an english government.it,s british and you are as much a part of that as i am so stop blaming the english for any problems you percieve you have .no english person is bothered if you speak welsh so you carry on and speak it,or don,t speak it in your case.as for getting people jailed for saying your daughters boyfriend is your son in law.hardly a massive mistake is it a ?term of phrase i believe it,s called.i,ll bid you farewell wcd.you have shown what your made of.dish it out but cannot take it.very pleased with england tonight ,i thought we gave a good account of ourselves

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

You seriously have got problems. You;'re so quick to anger over such insignificant things.


yes he got confused between son in law and daughter's boyfriend, it's not the biggest mistake in the world and quite easy to make. As for English government he's quite right in correcting you that there's no such thing as an English government there's only a British government.

He's also right that it's not just the Welsh working classes that have suffered under successive governments just look up north at places like Newcastle, communities absolutely ruined by the miners' strikes.

Also, to be completely honest, you are an absolutely massive hypocrite. the amount of vitriol that comes out of your mouth against anything remotely English or rather non-Welsh yet you don't speak the bloody language and now I find out you support an English football team? How many teams do you want. You've got Cardiff, the Jacks and now Wolves?

And he jinxed Ireland yesterday

I will let someone from the north speak for the north ( Newcastle ) although I do know all about the Jaro.
Im more intrested about what happens here in Wales and to its people. Yes the north did suffer along like Wales. But never did the so called British gonernment send to troops in against its own people, where it ended in the troops opening fire on people as they did in Wales., and also ended in the hanging of an inoccent man in public. AS for me not speaking Welsh I do speak a little but I make sure that my children go to Welsh school. Its not hypocritical to defend a language that is the language of your country. In fact by defending it stops it from being lay to rest which is what your british govenment try to do to it . I was never allowed to Learn Welsh in school , which should have been my right to do so. So every Tuesday I stood out side a class room and had 2 of the best ( The stick) cos I refused to learn german or French till they teach me my own langauge Welsh in my own country. This is not the act of a hypocrite ,but the act by someone who wants to defend there country against people who didnt and still dont give a fk about Wales.

As for me having a 2nd team Wolves so what ? I have already said many times its not the english people in gen I hate but there government and people who run Wales down, be they english or so called Welshmen or Scottish and so on.
As for me liking Swans , I like the football they played last season, and I can give credit where its due. Even the panel on the football show on TV also like the way the Swans play, and as they are a Welsh team , its follows I want to see any and all Welsh teams do well,be it Jacks Wrexham or Even Newport. Just one more thing for you to swollow is that 100s of years ago Welsh was spoken up as far as Wolverhampton.

as far up as wolverhampton?wouldn,t know about that but my family from durham so it wouldn,t be in my d.n.a so to speak.just for the record i like wales and have no problems with welsh people.yes i believe in the union but if it is to split so be it.anybody who knows me would tell you i,m no over the top englishman but i will defend my country . we,ve been mashed up by british governments just like you.by the way i,d expect a welshman to defend wales if he were on a english clubs website.tonight ,for the first time in years i,m proud of the national side.no hype,got on with it and no drunken antics-yet england herself has various differing cultures which are hundreds of years old which make her an interesting place to be so i can assure you people speaking welsh isn,t a prob for me.tbh i,d love to see wales qualify for a major tourn so ramsey and bale can play on a massive stage.they are good enough.

You really are one hell of a prick head jtc, I will shout this as I can see you dont read very well. I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES ON HERE , ITS THE ENGLISH GOVERNMENT I HATE AND ANYONE WHO HAS A GO AT WALES AND ITS LANGUAGE AND PEOPLE.
AS FOR MY 2ND TEAM BEING WOLVES , I HAVE FOLLOWED THEM SINCE I WAS AROUND 10 OR 12 YEARS OF AGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ALSO I NEVER SAID I HAVE A ENGLISH SON IN LAW, I DID SAY MY DAUGHTER WAS GOING OUT WITH AN ENGLISH GUY, AND THEY MAY GET MARRIED I DONT KNOW YET. YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE LIKE YOU JTC THAT GET PEOPLE SENT TO JAIL OR EVEN TO THE HANGMAN . COS YOU JUST THINK PEOPLE SAID THIS, THAT, OR THE OTHER, IT SAD TO THINK WHAT, JUST ONE BRAIN CELL CAN DO ALL ON ITS OWN !

You seriously have got problems. You;'re so quick to anger over such insignificant things.


yes he got confused between son in law and daughter's boyfriend, it's not the biggest mistake in the world and quite easy to make. As for English government he's quite right in correcting you that there's no such thing as an English government there's only a British government.

He's also right that it's not just the Welsh working classes that have suffered under successive governments just look up north at places like Newcastle, communities absolutely ruined by the miners' strikes.

Also, to be completely honest, you are an absolutely massive hypocrite. the amount of vitriol that comes out of your mouth against anything remotely English or rather non-Welsh yet you don't speak the bloody language and now I find out you support an English football team? How many teams do you want. You've got Cardiff, the Jacks and now Wolves?

And he jinxed Ireland yesterday

I will let someone from the north speak for the north ( Newcastle ) although I do know all about the Jaro.
Im more intrested about what happens here in Wales and to its people. Yes the north did suffer along like Wales. But never did the so called British gonernment send to troops in against its own people, where it ended in the troops opening fire on people as they did in Wales., and also ended in the hanging of an inoccent man in public. AS for me not speaking Welsh I do speak a little but I make sure that my children go to Welsh school. Its not hypocritical to defend a language that is the language of your country. In fact by defending it stops it from being lay to rest which is what your british govenment try to do to it . I was never allowed to Learn Welsh in school , which should have been my right to do so. So every Tuesday I stood out side a class room and had 2 of the best ( The stick) cos I refused to learn german or French till they teach me my own langauge Welsh in my own country. This is not the act of a hypocrite ,but the act by someone who wants to defend there country against people who didnt and still dont give a fk about Wales.

As for me having a 2nd team Wolves so what ? I have already said many times its not the english people in gen I hate but there government and people who run Wales down, be they english or so called Welshmen or Scottish and so on.
As for me liking Swans , I like the football they played last season, and I can give credit where its due. Even the panel on the football show on TV also like the way the Swans play, and as they are a Welsh team , its follows I want to see any and all Welsh teams do well,be it Jacks Wrexham or Even Newport. Just one more thing for you to swollow is that 100s of years ago Welsh was spoken up as far as Wolverhampton.

wdc.the british troops were sent to shoot the jarrow marchers i believe .the people of leicester took them in their homes .my uncle was on it.later killed in the british army as he joined cos he had too.believe me it,s not just the welsh who have been taken for mugs.anyway times have changed thankfully in some ways but mass unemployment still makes kids who want a job join the army to fight wars for minerals instead of jewels.i support the lads in the army but don,t believe we should be in these places.clean coal for me in the uk to create jobs and maintain our energy needs.

Whats Ireland got to do with us ?
its nothing to do with our country, unless we are talking about Northern Ireland, Wales and the Welsh have far more in common with England than Eire, all of our trade s done mainly with England and the English

Whats Ireland got to do with us ?
its nothing to do with our country, unless we are talking about Northern Ireland, Wales and the Welsh have far more in common with England than Eire, all of our trade s done mainly with England and the English

well said that man

I much prefer the English the the Southern Irish.

They (Eire) wanted nothing to do with the UK - so we gave them their independence. We kept 6 counties which they still try to claim.

Do you know that when Hitler committed suicide the Irish Government actually sent a meesage of sympathy to the Germans!!!

They however still moan about what Cromwell. Elizabeth 1st did to them ..............feck em!!

I much prefer the English the the Southern Irish.

They (Eire) wanted nothing to do with the UK - so we gave them their independence. We kept 6 counties which they still try to claim.

Do you know that when Hitler committed suicide the Irish Government actually sent a meesage of sympathy to the Germans!!!

They however still moan about what Cromwell. Elizabeth 1st did to them ..............feck em!!

What about the eastern and western Irish

Whats Ireland got to do with us ?
its nothing to do with our country, unless we are talking about Northern Ireland, Wales and the Welsh have far more in common with England than Eire, all of our trade s done mainly with England and the English

This^^^^ I got an irish name and i don't go on about them as if we're the same country.

I much prefer the English the the Southern Irish.

They (Eire) wanted nothing to do with the UK - so we gave them their independence. We kept 6 counties which they still try to claim.

Do you know that when Hitler committed suicide the Irish Government actually sent a meesage of sympathy to the Germans!!!

They however still moan about what Cromwell. Elizabeth 1st did to them ..............feck em!!

What about the eastern and western Irish

or Donegal - is that Southern or Northern Ireland?

Some people haven't got a clue about Irish history and the culpability of Britain's actions out there.

The partition of Ireland was a blot on British history, and I fully support my Celtic neighbours.

I much prefer the English the the Southern Irish.

They (Eire) wanted nothing to do with the UK - so we gave them their independence. We kept 6 counties which they still try to claim.

Do you know that when Hitler committed suicide the Irish Government actually sent a meesage of sympathy to the Germans!!!

They however still moan about what Cromwell. Elizabeth 1st did to them ..............feck em!!

What about the eastern and western Irish

or Donegal - is that Southern or Northern Ireland?

Some people haven't got a clue about Irish history and the culpability of Britain's actions out there.

The partition of Ireland was a blot on British history, and I fully support my Celtic neighbours.

die,i ain,t got a problem with the irish and can understand why they wanted us out of the south of ireland.to me deal was struck in the 1920,s about the 6counties and until that,s voted on for change then it,s legit in my eyes.i,v read irish history .i think that perhaps a few irish or celts should maybe read the views of some of the british families who have lost loved ones to the i.r.a who have bombed indiscrimatly in the uk.there is an inbred loathing of english/british in some celtic nations which inspires hatred of the english for no other reason that we are er...english.we don,t hate all the irish ,we know the i.r.a are scum and don,t tar the average irish man with that brush.99per cent of englishmen don,t live in castles or own acres of land .we,re just as poor as the celts these days talking of celts i sat in a flat in sudbury hill/s.harrow in 1988 watching the england v scotland game with a load of irish mates.one of them said come on the celts.i wet myself .the jocks had about 8 rangers players on the pitch.history is how you see it.when the cease fire in northern ireland come some may i say the i.r.a leadership saw the light.me?i think they felt the heat.the heat was the first time in the troubles they were out gunned by the u.v.f u.f.f and r.h.c.they knew the young breed of protestant palamilitries were after them and intent on wiping them out.in cities like birmingham the english and the irish get on very well these days

I still dont like the romans for what they did to wales - who can I complain to?

History is history and being very up to date with "British History" is one of my many attributes.............just wish people would stop moaning about "they did this to us" etc etc - its in the past and you should not blame current generations - but it seems to be an Irish thing to blame the "english" for their woes!!

Get over it!!

hate the crown but love the half crown

die,i ain,t got a problem with the irish and can understand why they wanted us out of the south of ireland.to me deal was struck in the 1920,s about the 6counties and until that,s voted on for change then it,s legit in my eyes.i,v read irish history .i think that perhaps a few irish or celts should maybe read the views of some of the british families who have lost loved ones to the i.r.a who have bombed indiscrimatly in the uk.there is an inbred loathing of english/british in some celtic nations which inspires hatred of the english for no other reason that we are er...english.we don,t hate all the irish ,we know the i.r.a are scum and don,t tar the average irish man with that brush.99per cent of englishmen don,t live in castles or own acres of land .we,re just as poor as the celts these days talking of celts i sat in a flat in sudbury hill/s.harrow in 1988 watching the england v scotland game with a load of irish mates.one of them said come on the celts.i wet myself .the jocks had about 8 rangers players on the pitch.history is how you see it.when the cease fire in northern ireland come some may i say the i.r.a leadership saw the light.me?i think they felt the heat.the heat was the first time in the troubles they were out gunned by the u.v.f u.f.f and r.h.c.they knew the young breed of protestant palamilitries were after them and intent on wiping them out.in cities like birmingham the english and the irish get on very well these days

The problem is that the deal that struck in the 1920's is the thing that has caused all the problems.

In the 1918 general election, a massive majority in the whole of Ireland voted for Sinn Fein.
They did not take their seats in Westminster, but set up their own Parliament in Dublin.
The British did not accept this democratic decision and sent in the Black & Tans (who I think all sides accept behaved deplorably).
The IRA was founded by Collins and co. and brought the British establishment to the negotiating table.
Collins then agrees a teaty partitioning not just Ireland, but Ulster as well, as only the 6 of the 9 counties of ancient Ulster will remain as part of UK.
This is when the real problems arise, as the Irish in the 6 counties had fought and died for their freedom as much as people in Dublin and what is now the Republic.
The treaty is agreed by Collins and a narrow majority in a referendum.

I firmly believe Collins felt he had little alternative, as if he had rejected the treaty, the British would have sent in even more troops to subjugate the democratic wishes of the Irish people, causing much more suffering. However, the splitting of Ulster in 2 and artificially creating a Loyalist majority in what remained was fundamentally undemocratic, in my view.

What then happens in the 6 counties for the next 70 years gets even worse, as the Nationalists are effectively made 2nd class citizens in their own country - the infamous gerrymandering in Derry etc.

The reason why I outline the above, is that this is not merely historical (in the same way that 4th Century Romans subjugating Britain is), but something that has happened within the living memory of many people, and the injustices of what happened are still acutely felt.

I am a supporter of the Good Friday agreement, and I think all sides deserve massive credit for the way this has been dealt with, including the British Government - but it still doesn't detract from the continuing injustice that the partition of botha country and a province was done in a fundamentally unfair way.

I have sympathy for any innocent victims of war and one of my best friends was almost killed in the Harrods bombing, as he was in the store when the warning was given and left the store and was knocked to the pavement outside by the force of the blast. But equally, what about the countless number of Irish people killed by the British - Thatcher's response to the Hunger strikes and the brutal killing of 14 innocent civilians in Derry in January 1972 for example.

What I keep coming back to is, who caused this in the first place, and for me the answer is the British Government, as if they had accepted the democratic will of the Irish people in the 1918 General Election, then the rest of the problems would not have occured. Of course, Britain still had an Empire at that stage, and would have been fearful that allowing Ireland the freedom she wanted may have meant other countries would have jumped on the bandwagon.

This does not mean that I hate all English people for what happened - but at a state level, I hold the British Government to blame.

Similarly, at the time of the Hunger strikes, the prisoners had not even been allowed the basic right that you and me and everybody else who lives in Britain has, of being tried by 12 of our peers in a jury trial for serious allegations. Those prisoners were only allowed to be tried by an English Judge and not a jury. Given this fact, it had been previously accepted that their position was distinct from other common criminals - however this was taken away at the time when Thatcher came to power, and led to the Hunger strikes. It's hard to believe these basic human rights of being tried by your peers were withheld from people as late as the UK in the early 1980's.

Whilst I tend to dislike Nationalism in general (the last refuge of the scoundrel etc.), I do feel an emotional bond with my fellow celts (as I see them) who were treated this way by the British establishment. It's the establishment that I have a problem with, and not the working class people of this country, and to that extent, I agree with a lot of your points above about the working class people from all countrie shaving a common bond.

I don't know if this answers the points you raise, but just my thoughts on the situation.

well put die.i don,t disagree with some of it.my main point is though there has to be a cut off line with this english/british fault thing.would for example it be ok to say all germans now are nazi,s because of adolf hilter?it wouldn,t.we both know it,s a diff generation.collins took a bullet i believe.shot by his own people.it would happen now die.if wales got independence i doubt that the factors would get on.there are only so many purely welsh speakers.in parts of wales cardiffians are considered worse than english for speaking english.we are more or less the same in these islands whether we like it or not.ok the british empire did some crap things but it also did some good things.every major power had an empire.the dutch ,french etc.in fact the british luvvy left love a bit of french culture.they forget to mention this culture was exported to other countries regardless of whether they wanted it.it was just how it was in those days.right or wrong it happen.even the belguims had rwanda and they can,t decicde if they,re dutch or french i,d better go and do some work now.great chatting.

COME ON YOU BOYS IN GREEN

Viva Espania!!!

and anyone else who plays Eire!!

Viva Espania!!!

and anyone else who plays Eire!!

Fascist