Welsh Independence?

If Scotland can do it, they are pushing for it and are nearly there, then we can f*cking do it

They have far more natural resources and public support than ourselves.

An oil firm has recently discovered alot of oil just of jackland bay, mass amount of shale gas in south Wales(?) and we could re open our coal mines to potential Chinese investors.

Oh yea, gold has been discovered up north Wales, we are selling lamb meat to Canada and we can fish of our coast.

That's great if true however there is more oil in Scoland and the surrounding area, shale gas is ridiculously expensive to extract, we import far more coal than we would ever export, and China has the third largest coal reserve in the world.

There is barely any gold left in wales, certainly not enough to export. Also the exportation of meat would have a minimal effect on the economy as prices are low.

All true but surely there would be other buyers for coal? And the amount of gold is £123mil approx which you're right, isn't alot.

One thing we both missed out, tourism, tourism is growing to my understanding. Cardiff for example is the 6th most visited city on earth with 18mil, approx, visitors per year.

Also all taxes in Wales would go to the government, business tax, income tax etc.

But I'm not saying I want independence, besides I'm joinin the army when the Sargent finds my medical.

If there were other buyers for coal, they would import if from the US, Russia or China for example who have a far greater supply and can consequently afford to sell it for lower prices.

The most visited city on eath is Paris with just over 15 million visitors per year. I suggest you revise that evidence! Cardiff wouldn't make the top 25 Although yes, tourism is growing. However gaining independence would actually DECREASE tourism because it would be more difficult to enter the country and you would require a passport to do so. Why make travelling to Wales more difficult and consequently deter tourists from coming here>

Good luck in the forces

We could get our own currency, with red dragons on one side and bluebirds on the other... we should ask the malaysians to help re-take wales

@Ohhgahh

The capital, Cardiff is the most popular area in Wales for tourists, with 14.6 million visitors in 2009

I think different sites vary on international to national tourists

But you can't deny we have a huge tourist revenue.

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

Its a tricky one mate but it gets easier as we have to create our own energy going forward. If we became a net exporter of our resources drinking water, LNG, Wind and Wave power it could be possible.

Our other problem is there is too much red tape in wales - council, assembly, MPs etc all dipping their hand in to our taxes.

If the assembly had balls - it would drop the rate of tax to make companies come and set up in wales (like hong Kong or Monaco). This would encourage business and development and creation of decent and high tech jobs and not the call centre shite with peanuts for pay we have today.

When you live on peanuts you start a begging culture - its embarrasing us waiting for handouts from whitehall as a country. what an example this sets to our people eh?

If we structured right and got rid of the local government parasites and mis management - we as a large country per head of population, could really do something for ourselves

I posted this is another thread.......

No time for Nationalist pride and leaving the Union.

When it comes to the crunch, the Scots will stay within the Union.

I would hate to be Ireland, Greece and have Germany have major control over us.

London doesn't hold us back.

Germany does control the EU to suit what it wants.

We the Welsh are not a repressed people. That's an insult to those who have been and are being repressed.

And don't forget, we get less money from the EU since Romania has joined.

Romania set the new standard for poverty and that re-branded large parts of Wales as not being poor.

If Scotland can do it, they are pushing for it and are nearly there, then we can f*cking do it

They have far more natural resources and public support than ourselves.

An oil firm has recently discovered alot of oil just of jackland bay, mass amount of shale gas in south Wales(?) and we could re open our coal mines to potential Chinese investors.

Oh yea, gold has been discovered up north Wales, we are selling lamb meat to Canada and we can fish of our coast.

That's great if true however there is more oil in Scoland and the surrounding area, shale gas is ridiculously expensive to extract, we import far more coal than we would ever export, and China has the third largest coal reserve in the world.

There is barely any gold left in wales, certainly not enough to export. Also the exportation of meat would have a minimal effect on the economy as prices are low.

All true but surely there would be other buyers for coal? And the amount of gold is £123mil approx which you're right, isn't alot.

One thing we both missed out, tourism, tourism is growing to my understanding. Cardiff for example is the 6th most visited city on earth with 18mil, approx, visitors per year.

Also all taxes in Wales would go to the government, business tax, income tax etc.

But I'm not saying I want independence, besides I'm joinin the army when the Sargent finds my medical.

If there were other buyers for coal, they would import if from the US, Russia or China for example who have a far greater supply and can consequently afford to sell it for lower prices.

The most visited city on eath is Paris with just over 15 million visitors per year. I suggest you revise that evidence! Cardiff wouldn't make the top 25 Although yes, tourism is growing. However gaining independence would actually DECREASE tourism because it would be more difficult to enter the country and you would require a passport to do so. Why make travelling to Wales more difficult and consequently deter tourists from coming here>

Good luck in the forces

Well, I got the 18mil from the BBC, yes the BBC, however, I could've simply mis-interpreted what they meant, they could've meant over all and not in one year.

How would it be more difficult entering the country if we were independant? I used my passport to get to Amsterdam from Cardiff.

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

No other country in the world suffers with an inferiority complex like ours.

I think another question that needs to be asked is, why, when we are one of the poorest regions of Europe (have been since Thatcher's cull of our heavy industry), do we still trust the London Government to 'do what's in our interest' ?

Surely we aren't so devoid of ambition and skill as to not be capable of fomulating policy to stimulate indiginous business and industry? There is an old argument that suggests that we have a hundred years worth of coal left untapped in the ground...well maybe so, but surely an independent Wales CAN work by stimulating our own pivate sector?

The only way Wales 'could've work is if you cut the benefit handouts immensely. However because of the deep routed socialist ideology which is in much of the Welsh population then it has no chance.

As the old political saying goes 'it easier to throw stones than take full responsibility'.

This, I fear, is the cancer in our national psyche...this and a lack of belief.

There are deep rooted problems in our society, but going it alone with a brand new progressive political idelogy, based on hard work and a greater emphasis on education is the way forward...but it's altering the national mindset that's the issue

Correct!!!

Welsh people only support 'tax and spend' policies and always want to have a POP at anyone who's doing well for themselves. Yet its the complete opposite to that mindset which needs to change. The lower taxes give people more money in their pockets to spend and its the rich in this country who people need to aspire too and lambast them because of jealousy

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

No other country in the world suffers with an inferiority complex like ours.

I think another question that needs to be asked is, why, when we are one of the poorest regions of Europe (have been since Thatcher's cull of our heavy industry), do we still trust the London Government to 'do what's in our interest' ?

Surely we aren't so devoid of ambition and skill as to not be capable of fomulating policy to stimulate indiginous business and industry? There is an old argument that suggests that we have a hundred years worth of coal left untapped in the ground...well maybe so, but surely an independent Wales CAN work by stimulating our own pivate sector?

The only way Wales 'could've work is if you cut the benefit handouts immensely. However because of the deep routed socialist ideology which is in much of the Welsh population then it has no chance.

As the old political saying goes 'it easier to throw stones than take full responsibility'.

This, I fear, is the cancer in our national psyche...this and a lack of belief.

There are deep rooted problems in our society, but going it alone with a brand new progressive political idelogy, based on hard work and a greater emphasis on education is the way forward...but it's altering the national mindset that's the issue

Correct!!!

Welsh people only support 'tax and spend' policies and always want to have a POP at anyone who's doing well for themselves. Yet its the complete opposite to that mindset which needs to change. The lower taxes give people more money in their pockets to spend and its the rich in this country who people need to aspire too and lambast them because of jealousy

Making cuts hasn't worked for Britain.

What would our future be like being run by a far Left lunatic government ? We would end up being a third world Nation A lot of you seem to think that Wales run by itself by its own people can only be good. But they cannot see the lunatics that want to run it. It happens at our own peril and if it ever looked like it is going to happen i am moving over the border as my life my house would be worth fook all.

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

No other country in the world suffers with an inferiority complex like ours.

I think another question that needs to be asked is, why, when we are one of the poorest regions of Europe (have been since Thatcher's cull of our heavy industry), do we still trust the London Government to 'do what's in our interest' ?

Surely we aren't so devoid of ambition and skill as to not be capable of fomulating policy to stimulate indiginous business and industry? There is an old argument that suggests that we have a hundred years worth of coal left untapped in the ground...well maybe so, but surely an independent Wales CAN work by stimulating our own pivate sector?

The only way Wales 'could've work is if you cut the benefit handouts immensely. However because of the deep routed socialist ideology which is in much of the Welsh population then it has no chance.

As the old political saying goes 'it easier to throw stones than take full responsibility'.

This, I fear, is the cancer in our national psyche...this and a lack of belief.

There are deep rooted problems in our society, but going it alone with a brand new progressive political idelogy, based on hard work and a greater emphasis on education is the way forward...but it's altering the national mindset that's the issue

Correct!!!

Welsh people only support 'tax and spend' policies and always want to have a POP at anyone who's doing well for themselves. Yet its the complete opposite to that mindset which needs to change. The lower taxes give people more money in their pockets to spend and its the rich in this country who people need to aspire too and lambast them because of jealousy

Making cuts hasn't worked for Britain.

Has really been any cuts ? If you slashed the tax you'd pay in fuel in this country you'd make jobs overnight!!! Buy the treehuggers who hate the car won't allow you

["]

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

No other country in the world suffers with an inferiority complex like ours.

I think another question that needs to be asked is, why, when we are one of the poorest regions of Europe (have been since Thatcher's cull of our heavy industry), do we still trust the London Government to 'do what's in our interest' ?

Surely we aren't so devoid of ambition and skill as to not be capable of fomulating policy to stimulate indiginous business and industry? There is an old argument that suggests that we have a hundred years worth of coal left untapped in the ground...well maybe so, but surely an independent Wales CAN work by stimulating our own pivate sector?

The only way Wales 'could've work is if you cut the benefit handouts immensely. However because of the deep routed socialist ideology which is in much of the Welsh population then it has no chance.

As the old political saying goes 'it easier to throw stones than take full responsibility'.

This, I fear, is the cancer in our national psyche...this and a lack of belief.

There are deep rooted problems in our society, but going it alone with a brand new progressive political idelogy, based on hard work and a greater emphasis on education is the way forward...but it's altering the national mindset that's the issue

Correct!!!

Welsh people only support 'tax and spend' policies and always want to have a POP at anyone who's doing well for themselves. Yet its the complete opposite to that mindset which needs to change. The lower taxes give people more money in their pockets to spend and its the rich in this country who people need to aspire too and lambast them because of jealousy

Making cuts hasn't worked for Britain.[/quote]

Has really been any cuts ? If you slashed the tax you'd pay in fuel in this country you'd make jobs overnight!!! Buy the treehuggers who hate the car won't allow you[/quote]

My apolagies, let me specify, cuts in general I meant. I actually agree with you for a change regarding fuel tax.

But, I'm guessing its high (don't drive so don;t know how much it costs) due to events at Iran and Syria.

["]

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

No other country in the world suffers with an inferiority complex like ours.

I think another question that needs to be asked is, why, when we are one of the poorest regions of Europe (have been since Thatcher's cull of our heavy industry), do we still trust the London Government to 'do what's in our interest' ?

Surely we aren't so devoid of ambition and skill as to not be capable of fomulating policy to stimulate indiginous business and industry? There is an old argument that suggests that we have a hundred years worth of coal left untapped in the ground...well maybe so, but surely an independent Wales CAN work by stimulating our own pivate sector?

The only way Wales 'could've work is if you cut the benefit handouts immensely. However because of the deep routed socialist ideology which is in much of the Welsh population then it has no chance.

As the old political saying goes 'it easier to throw stones than take full responsibility'.

This, I fear, is the cancer in our national psyche...this and a lack of belief.

There are deep rooted problems in our society, but going it alone with a brand new progressive political idelogy, based on hard work and a greater emphasis on education is the way forward...but it's altering the national mindset that's the issue

Correct!!!

Welsh people only support 'tax and spend' policies and always want to have a POP at anyone who's doing well for themselves. Yet its the complete opposite to that mindset which needs to change. The lower taxes give people more money in their pockets to spend and its the rich in this country who people need to aspire too and lambast them because of jealousy

Making cuts hasn't worked for Britain.

Has really been any cuts ? If you slashed the tax you'd pay in fuel in this country you'd make jobs overnight!!! Buy the treehuggers who hate the car won't allow you[/quote]

My apolagies, let me specify, cuts in general I meant. I actually agree with you for a change regarding fuel tax.

But, I'm guessing its high (don't drive so don;t know how much it costs) due to events at Iran and Syria.[/quote]

It's high because the government would lose an absoulte fortune if they removed the tax. I heard somewhere you need to earn something like £100 to pay for £40 worth of petrol because of income and fuel taxes.

If Wales was independent, then all Welsh clubs would have to play in the Welsh League

If Wales was independent, then all Welsh clubs would have to play in the Welsh League

Here f*cking here pal, there would be squawking from Blazing saddles and little Rhys then. I can imagine it now:

"The English cunts have thrown us out of the league"

"They are still suppressing us despite independence, we need to invade those twats"

"We have the right to play in the English leagues"

Yabba yabba yabba, such a flawed mindset these small minded nationalists have

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

Of course it's possible. We just lack confidence after hundreds of years of english rule and being brain-washed to think that we are not capable. We would get by no problem at all because we wouldn't be bogged down by class warfare (because we're all working class in Wales) and because we'd work hard to make a success of things and because of self-esteem and pride in our own country

English rule?

Welsh don't get a vote?

The NHS wasn't created by a Welshman?

I f*cking hate Welsh nationalists.

They are nationalists and socialists.

Can anyone give me the last party to come to power in Europe that was both nationalist and socialist?

English rule?

Welsh don't get a vote?

The NHS wasn't created by a Welshman?

I f*cking hate Welsh nationalists.

They are nationalists and socialists.

Can anyone give me the last party to come to power in Europe that was both nationalist and socialist?

SNP?

Glad you brought up the NAZI Scottish Party....

I meant SNP.

Alex Salmond is well educated man and much better than the fucktards that make up Plaid Cymru.

Without Google, can you name me the new leader of Plaid Cymru?

Glad you brought up the NAZI Scottish Party....

I meant SNP.

Alex Salmond is well educated man and much better than the fucktards that make up Plaid Cymru.

Without Google, can you name me the new leader of Plaid Cymru?

Don't know don't care.


Would never vote for them even if they were giving out free money.

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

U

Of course it's possible. We just lack confidence after hundreds of years of english rule and being brain-washed to think that we are not capable. We would get by no problem at all because we wouldn't be bogWged down by class warfare (because we're all working class in Wales) and because we'd work hard to make a success of things and because of self-esteem and pride in our own country

What utter bollicks fella. Around here in the Valleys is a considerable amount who will not work because they are to Fooking lazy to get of there arses and work. Take your rose tinted glasses off and jump into the real world of benefits.
Just because someone is Welsh does not mean they know how to run a Fooking Country. Is there any real difference between ordinary folk of England Scotland Ireland or Wales ? No there Fooking isn't each country has there fair share of scroungers layabouts, hard working people, and proud of there heratage .
Give this country to Plaid and we will be a third world nation, they are backward and anti progress IMO

welsh and proud, but also proud to be British. plaid cymru are off their tits.

Is it actually possible. My automatic feeling has always been 'no'. But why? The general opinion is that we could not support ourselves. Our fathers were too stupid, we are too stupid and our sons and daughters will be too stupid. We need to go begging to the English in order to survive. But is this true?

http://cambriapolitico.com/is-wales-eco ... ly-viable/

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adam-pr ... 11083.html

I am still undecided. But for those against, please offer something other than the usual drivel. Diolch yn fawr

U

Of course it's possible. We just lack confidence after hundreds of years of english rule and being brain-washed to think that we are not capable. We would get by no problem at all because we wouldn't be bogWged down by class warfare (because we're all working class in Wales) and because we'd work hard to make a success of things and because of self-esteem and pride in our own country

What utter bollicks fella. Around here in the Valleys is a considerable amount who will not work because they are to Fooking lazy to get of there arses and work. Take your rose tinted glasses off and jump into the real world of benefits.
Just because someone is Welsh does not mean they know how to run a Fooking Country. Is there any real difference between ordinary folk of England Scotland Ireland or Wales ? No there Fooking isn't each country has there fair share of scroungers layabouts, hard working people, and proud of there heratage .
Give this country to Plaid and we will be a third world nation, they are backward and anti progress IMO

That's the point though mate...we're arguably a third world country now. Have been since the old industries were taken away.
I agree with you about the scrounging mindset that's prevelant through huge areas of the country, but it appars to be the old school socialists within those areas that want the status quo to continue because they've got a vested interest in keeping Wales pennyless with an outdated notion of being 'working class'. . . and thereby keep getting the votes.
The question is, do we remain like this in perpetuity?

If public opinion were to sway towards independence this country would need to embrace a far more dynamic economic mindset...one that WOULD work imo. It's getting rid of the lazy and subserviant mindset that's the problem

English rule?

Welsh don't get a vote?

The NHS wasn't created by a Welshman?

I f*cking hate Welsh nationalists.

They are nationalists and socialists.

Can anyone give me the last party to come to power in Europe that was both nationalist and socialist?

Not all Welsh nationalists are socialists, and even so, there is no problem with being a socialist per se.

The uk in its self is on its knees so why the f**k do pepole think wales could run its self and be a success??
We need the uk as it is not split,because how and what does wales have to sustain our selfs??same goes for scotland
No the uk should stay as it is and not broken up because we dislike the englush because most of what we get is from westminster..

The uk in its self is on its knees so why the f**k do pepole think wales could run its self and be a success??
We need the uk as it is not split,because how and what does wales have to sustain our selfs??same goes for scotland
No the uk should stay as it is and not broken up because we dislike the englush because most of what we get is from westminster..

Fcuk me I agree with Jacklad !!!!

I love the nationalists, they buy the propaganda from the SNP and Plaid. What they don't shout aloud is all there plans all end up in joining the Euro project. Power from London to Brussels/Strasbourg, but an elected official of a sovereign government gets a greater salary and perks than those of devolved leaders. We need less government.

We have an example of what happens when you gain independence across the Irish Sea, at what point did they overtake the UK in living standards, at the height of the Euro boom, it lasted for 18 month.......now they have a long painful road ahead. It took about 90 years to get parity.

Leanne Wood and her 1970's socialism is exactly the opposite to what we need. We need big business back, the WDA had a lot of detractors, but they did bring decently paid job in.

Glad you brought up the NAZI Scottish Party....

I meant SNP.

Alex Salmond is well educated man and much better than the fucktards that make up Plaid Cymru.

Without Google, can you name me the new leader of Plaid Cymru?

Leanne wood.

If Wales should become an independent nation is entirely up to the Welsh. I just think it won't happen, just as the Scots eventually won't break away of the United Kingdom.

First of all, I hope if Scotland breaks away, that the ultimate Rasputin in the form of Alex Salmond won't lead the country. This man has again and again proven to be a liar and a man that changes his opinion (according to the national mood) on the Scottish future just to pursuade the electorate that Scottish independence is the right thing. This man is willing to give up Scottish self-government to the EU, just for the sake of 'ending London rule'.

There've been more discussions on here about the Welsh language, culture and the possibility of Welsh independence. As a Dutchman I've always tried not to interfere in these debates too much, but I've always tried to express my respect for the Welsh culture and language (two key elements of the Welsh soul that, in my opinion, should be cherished). In my opinion the UK would be stronger if all the parts of it (Nothern Ireland, Scotland, Wales, England and perhaps in the future Cornwall) have their own parliament, can take al lot of matters in their own hands and can govern themselves. There's still a lot of power in the hands of Westminster and why don't the English have their own parliament?

If the UK can become a kind of federal state with the same rights and obligations for every single part of it, it can survive without countries breaking away. But ultimately it's up to the Welsh (or for that matter the Scots or the Northern Irish) to determine their own future.

And do you promise you didn't use Google?

I must admit I'm not a fan.

She has nothing on Alex Salmond and I can't see Plaid making gains under her.

Are you a fan?

The uk in its self is on its knees so why the f**k do pepole think wales could run its self and be a success??
We need the uk as it is not split,because how and what does wales have to sustain our selfs??same goes for scotland
No the uk should stay as it is and not broken up because we dislike the englush because most of what we get is from westminster..

Fcuk me I agree with Jacklad !!!!

I love the nationalists, they buy the propaganda from the SNP and Plaid. What they don't shout aloud is all there plans all end up in joining the Euro project. Power from London to Brussels/Strasbourg, but an elected official of a sovereign government gets a greater salary and perks than those of devolved leaders. We need less government.

We have an example of what happens when you gain independence across the Irish Sea, at what point did they overtake the UK in living standards, at the height of the Euro boom, it lasted for 18 month.......now they have a long painful road ahead. It took about 90 years to get parity.

Leanne Wood and her 1970's socialism is exactly the opposite to what we need. We need big business back, the WDA had a lot of detractors, but they did bring decently paid job in.

Exactly