To be FREE....or not to be FREE....

It's life Jim,but not as we know it,

Indeed, and that did have me chuckling.

Was ok until got to bit where he's basically saying he doesnt care get covid or doesnt care he gives it to anyone else? List being argument immediately he said that.. selfish is an understatement to describe him.

That's unfair allan, we all know even double jabbed people, can still catch and spread covid, so in reality, how would you decide who passed it on ?? Are the double jabbed selfish then? Because it doesnt make you safe from it.

Right from the start what the Government feared most was the NHS being overwhelmed. The Tory Government would never have recovered if there had been TV pictures beamed into every home of people dying in corridors because there wasn't enough hospital beds.

Hence the "protect the NHS" message and curtailment of freedoms.

That said there was other routes which could have been pursued (better shielding of vulnerable and elderly people) whilst allowing younger fitter people to carry on as normal.

The Government have certainly been too cautious since the vaccine programme started and I believe they will continue to be for some considerable time.

Of all of the posts on this subject, I have to agree with everything stated by Tony.

As we are slowly approaching nearly 90% of adults being fully vaccinated by September, I would like to see freedoms fully restored now. Personally, I wish 100% of those who could be jabbed would accept the vaccination, but while this freedom of choice remains in place, this obviously will never be achieved.
However, the Welsh Government has already made the decision for us to remain wearing face coverings for a while longer yet.
Some, like myself find no problem with this, while others disagree. If it helps to protect the more vulnerable amongst us, then fine!
Nevertheless, early this morning I witnessed an onslaught of verbal abuse by a thoughtless gob-shite bully, aimed at one of the two middle aged women in the petrol station shop on Western Avenue when she simply asked him to use a mandatory face covering.
It's this sort of confrontation that we could all do without irrespective of which side of the fence you sit.
The women in the shop were visibly shaken up after simply trying to remind the idiot of the rules laid out by the government.
They told me that this reaction has become a regular occurrence as I should imagine many other shop workers etc would have experienced.

I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least

Ask the families of those who have died from Covid if they think it is a conspiracy.
The initial post is a load of Bollocks.

by Blueberry Jam » Tue Aug 03, 2021 8:22 am

Ask the families of those who have died from Covid if they think it is a conspiracy.
The initial post is a load of Bollocks.
Blueberry Jam

Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:04 am

Totally agree, and the slant is invariably that it's just the UK and not the whole world.

Ask the families of those who have died from Covid if they think it is a conspiracy.
The initial post is a load of Bollocks.

Those who have sadly died from Covid are an extremely small percentage of the population and predominately elderly (over 80) or have co-mobilities'.

That group of people may well of died of something else in normal circumstances such as flu or chest infection.

We don't close the country down because of flu or chest infections and the same should be true of Covid especially as 95% of the population now have antibodies.

Using the emotional argument to hijack the morale high ground doesn't make you right.

I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least

would imagine if your faced with multiple covid deaths in a very short space of time your going to have a skewed view on what its like nationwide ........been 3 deaths with covid on the DC in the village i live in { roughly 1800 people } during the last 18 months which looking at the national stats is more or less what you would expect everywhere... all three were cases where there were other things involved...1 massive stroke...1 terminally ill with cancer and one 84 years old with multiple illnesses..

Unread postby skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:47 pm

Tuggi wrote:
I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least




would imagine if your faced with multiple covid deaths in a very short space of time your going to have a skewed view on what its like nationwide ........been 3 deaths with covid on the DC in the village i live in { roughly 1800 people } during the last 18 months which looking at the national stats is more or less what you would expect everywhere... all three were cases where there were other things involved...1 massive stroke...1 terminally ill with cancer and one 84 years old with multiple illnesses..
skidemin

Posts: 6244
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm

Looks like you've been very lucky in your village. Do you really think that doctors and nurses (not the media) all around the world would have been stressed the way they have been if your village was anywhere near typical? Do you really think that they are so dumb that they would have stopped treating other seriously ill patients?

Unread postby skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:47 pm

Tuggi wrote:
I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least




would imagine if your faced with multiple covid deaths in a very short space of time your going to have a skewed view on what its like nationwide ........been 3 deaths with covid on the DC in the village i live in { roughly 1800 people } during the last 18 months which looking at the national stats is more or less what you would expect everywhere... all three were cases where there were other things involved...1 massive stroke...1 terminally ill with cancer and one 84 years old with multiple illnesses..
skidemin

Posts: 6244
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm

Looks like you've been very lucky in your village. Do you really think that doctors and nurses (not the media) all around the world would have been stressed the way they have been if your village was anywhere near typical? Do you really think that they are so dumb that they would have stopped treating other seriously ill patients?

its 130,000 deaths out of 68 million people across the UK ... which means you would expect 3.4 deaths in the 20 months in a pop of 1800 ..so 3 deaths is slightly below average and 4 deaths would be slightly above.....so not sure if you want to call that lucky. .......and yes they did stop treating people and cancelled appointments and scans... i have a cousin who is now terminal with cancer who probably wouldnt be had he been diagnosed and therefore treated earlier only they all but shut our hospitals last year...over 4 million cancer scans alone missed ....
so yes i do think they were that dumb ... yes no doubt NHS staff are stressed now due to the record waiting lists and backlog but back in april last year our bed occupancy was at 33% instead of its normal 95% plus.... so what exactly happened to the 80k a day that would normally be occupying those beds ?

You are FREE to be "exempt" and not wear a mask, you are FREE to mix and mingle with others that feel the same way as you etc etc.

A virus has no boundaries, it doesnt care about gender, nationality, skin colour - it is also free to do what it wants.

Every transaction you make is already tracked - not by govt but by credit card companies, banks, shops, amazon , ebay etc. Every web page you look at - can be tracked with cookies (I know there are ways around that one).

Things are different and have changed for everyone and every country. It was the same back when we had the plague and spanish flu I expect. The only thing you can guarantee other than death and tax - is that things never stay the same - they always change.

I would rather be in the UK than India / Brazil / Japan , parts of Europe, Australia or Africa.

The only thing BIG pharma and Govts are colluding on - is trying to deliver a route out of the mess, in the hope that they dont bankrupt themselves in the process. There were over 150 vax candidates from companies at the start - before the UK went with AZ/Ox, Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson and Johnson etc..

I get all the George Orwell "Were doomed" stuff - but the reality is a lot simpler.

As of a couple of weeks ago - there were 3 people in ICU at the Heath. One had terminal cancer and could not be "jabbed" - the other 2 were anti vaxxers - who have since changed their opinion. The nurses should have just left nature take it's course - so they could also be 'free'.

It will and is getting better - more importantly - Barnsley on Saturday and will Vassell be able to make it from the changing room to the pitch without injuring himself

two anti vaxxers....or just 2 people who were free to decide they did not want the jab...

2 people who decided they did not want the jab - even though they were offered it and with pre medical condition preventing them from having the jab.

You can call that people who made a free choice or anti vaxxers etc - 2 sides of the same coin,
There was a problem - they were offered a solution that is known to work. They decided not to take the solution on offer. The result is there on 2 hospital beds for everyone to see.

yes it a free choice (as we all know) , it's also a free choice of business to set their terms and conditions of entry be that a mask or proof of the jab.

I have a friend who runs a shop in Queens arcade - there was a man / wife and kid 2 weeks came in. He refused to wear a mask in the shop - security were called - he was explained the terms of entering her shop, he was escorted out of the shop.

I have never known so many people get triggered by youtube and facebook to suddenly think of themselves as epidemiologists and virologists on the back of watching a video or FB post.

by skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 2:22 pm

Scoularite wrote:
Unread postby skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:47 pm

Tuggi wrote:
I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least




would imagine if your faced with multiple covid deaths in a very short space of time your going to have a skewed view on what its like nationwide ........been 3 deaths with covid on the DC in the village i live in { roughly 1800 people } during the last 18 months which looking at the national stats is more or less what you would expect everywhere... all three were cases where there were other things involved...1 massive stroke...1 terminally ill with cancer and one 84 years old with multiple illnesses..
skidemin

Posts: 6244
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm


Looks like you've been very lucky in your village. Do you really think that doctors and nurses (not the media) all around the world would have been stressed the way they have been if your village was anywhere near typical? Do you really think that they are so dumb that they would have stopped treating other seriously ill patients?



its 130,000 deaths out of 68 million people across the UK ... which means you would expect 3.4 deaths in the 20 months in a pop of 1800 ..so 3 deaths is slightly below average and 4 deaths would be slightly above.....so not sure if you want to call that lucky. .......and yes they did stop treating people and cancelled appointments and scans... i have a cousin who is now terminal with cancer who probably wouldnt be had he been diagnosed and therefore treated earlier only they all but shut our hospitals last year...over 4 million cancer scans alone missed ....
so yes i do think they were that dumb ... yes no doubt NHS staff are stressed now due to the record waiting lists and backlog but back in april last year our bed occupancy was at 33% instead of its normal 95% plus.... so what exactly happened to the 80k a day that would normally be occupying those beds ?

Why do you think virtually all the governments across the world and their doctors and nurses seem to see it differently to you, even though they are all aware of the consequences, both to their economies and other seriously ill patients? Why do you think that there have been so many lockdowns across the globe, such as Japan and parts of Australia now?

What's in it for them, or are you saying that they're all dumb?

You are FREE to be "exempt" and not wear a mask, you are FREE to mix and mingle with others that feel the same way as you etc etc.

A virus has no boundaries, it doesnt care about gender, nationality, skin colour - it is also free to do what it wants.

Every transaction you make is already tracked - not by govt but by credit card companies, banks, shops, amazon , ebay etc. Every web page you look at - can be tracked with cookies (I know there are ways around that one).

Things are different and have changed for everyone and every country. It was the same back when we had the plague and spanish flu I expect. The only thing you can guarantee other than death and tax - is that things never stay the same - they always change.

I would rather be in the UK than India / Brazil / Japan , parts of Europe, Australia or Africa.

The only thing BIG pharma and Govts are colluding on - is trying to deliver a route out of the mess, in the hope that they dont bankrupt themselves in the process. There were over 150 vax candidates from companies at the start - before the UK went with AZ/Ox, Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson and Johnson etc..

I get all the George Orwell "Were doomed" stuff - but the reality is a lot simpler.

As of a couple of weeks ago - there were 3 people in ICU at the Heath. One had terminal cancer and could not be "jabbed" - the other 2 were anti vaxxers - who have since changed their opinion. The nurses should have just left nature take it's course - so they could also be 'free'.

It will and is getting better - more importantly - Barnsley on Saturday and will Vassell be able to make it from the changing room to the pitch without injuring himself

two anti vaxxers....or just 2 people who were free to decide they did not want the jab...

2 people who decided they did not want the jab - even though they were offered it and with pre medical condition preventing them from having the jab.

You can call that people who made a free choice or anti vaxxers etc - 2 sides of the same coin,
There was a problem - they were offered a solution that is known to work. They decided not to take the solution on offer. The result is there on 2 hospital beds for everyone to see.

yes it a free choice (as we all know) , it's also a free choice of business to set their terms and conditions of entry be that a mask or proof of the jab.

I have a friend who runs a shop in Queens arcade - there was a man / wife and kid 2 weeks came in. He refused to wear a mask in the shop - security were called - he was explained the terms of entering her shop, he was escorted out of the shop.

I have never known so many people get triggered by youtube and facebook to suddenly think of themselves as epidemiologists and virologists on the back of watching a video or FB post.

you do not need to be a virologist to know that vaccines are normally tested far more vigorously and over a much longer period of time than these have...its common knowledge
or that these vaccines have been rolled out under a temporary license only...its on government sites...
or do you need to be either or a mathematician to look at simple numbers on an ONS or NHS site....
not sure about shop keepers having a right to access your medial records either ..where exactly does that end ?

by skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 2:22 pm

Scoularite wrote:
Unread postby skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:47 pm

Tuggi wrote:
I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least




would imagine if your faced with multiple covid deaths in a very short space of time your going to have a skewed view on what its like nationwide ........been 3 deaths with covid on the DC in the village i live in { roughly 1800 people } during the last 18 months which looking at the national stats is more or less what you would expect everywhere... all three were cases where there were other things involved...1 massive stroke...1 terminally ill with cancer and one 84 years old with multiple illnesses..
skidemin

Posts: 6244
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm


Looks like you've been very lucky in your village. Do you really think that doctors and nurses (not the media) all around the world would have been stressed the way they have been if your village was anywhere near typical? Do you really think that they are so dumb that they would have stopped treating other seriously ill patients?



its 130,000 deaths out of 68 million people across the UK ... which means you would expect 3.4 deaths in the 20 months in a pop of 1800 ..so 3 deaths is slightly below average and 4 deaths would be slightly above.....so not sure if you want to call that lucky. .......and yes they did stop treating people and cancelled appointments and scans... i have a cousin who is now terminal with cancer who probably wouldnt be had he been diagnosed and therefore treated earlier only they all but shut our hospitals last year...over 4 million cancer scans alone missed ....
so yes i do think they were that dumb ... yes no doubt NHS staff are stressed now due to the record waiting lists and backlog but back in april last year our bed occupancy was at 33% instead of its normal 95% plus.... so what exactly happened to the 80k a day that would normally be occupying those beds ?

Why do you think virtually all the governments across the world and their doctors and nurses seem to see it differently to you, even though they are all aware of the consequences, both to their economies and other seriously ill patients? Why do you think that there have been so many lockdowns across the globe, such as Japan and parts of Australia now?

What's in it for them, or are you saying that they're all dumb?

i dont have a conspiracy theory.... but thats not to say i dont think a lot that has happened is not right..
why are our governments lifting restrictions when deaths, hospital admissions and cases are all much higher than when we initially locked down ? does that really make sense ?
i assume you looked up the actual numbers in my previous post and figured what was in your mind regarding the deaths was not the reality....

by skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:00 pm

Scoularite wrote:
by skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 2:22 pm

Scoularite wrote:
Unread postby skidemin » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:47 pm

Tuggi wrote:
I do love how people think this is all made up by big corporations and pharma/media hype.

Ok, there have been wars and civil wars within this world for as long as I can remember, Palestine/Israel for example, but yet it’s perfectly plausible that a country who has no interest in co existing can agree on something. It’s not like it’s the big 6 driving it, every sceptical, communist or terrorist run country is being hit with the virus, with similar measures. I’d love to know how you can think every nation got together and said “yeah I’m up for that let’s do it”

The vaccine is much like the Flu one, get it, don’t get it, once it’s internationally rolled out it’ll be a case of if you didn’t get it and die from it that’s your freedom of choice same as refusing treatments. Once it’s clear everyone has the opportunity to have the vaccine I can’t see why normality can’t return.

Nothing to do with being a weak puppet or being controlled, I know of people dying who are close to me from the virus, good friends mothers dying, so to say it’s just a cold is a little disrespectful to say the least




would imagine if your faced with multiple covid deaths in a very short space of time your going to have a skewed view on what its like nationwide ........been 3 deaths with covid on the DC in the village i live in { roughly 1800 people } during the last 18 months which looking at the national stats is more or less what you would expect everywhere... all three were cases where there were other things involved...1 massive stroke...1 terminally ill with cancer and one 84 years old with multiple illnesses..
skidemin

Posts: 6244
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm


Looks like you've been very lucky in your village. Do you really think that doctors and nurses (not the media) all around the world would have been stressed the way they have been if your village was anywhere near typical? Do you really think that they are so dumb that they would have stopped treating other seriously ill patients?



its 130,000 deaths out of 68 million people across the UK ... which means you would expect 3.4 deaths in the 20 months in a pop of 1800 ..so 3 deaths is slightly below average and 4 deaths would be slightly above.....so not sure if you want to call that lucky. .......and yes they did stop treating people and cancelled appointments and scans... i have a cousin who is now terminal with cancer who probably wouldnt be had he been diagnosed and therefore treated earlier only they all but shut our hospitals last year...over 4 million cancer scans alone missed ....
so yes i do think they were that dumb ... yes no doubt NHS staff are stressed now due to the record waiting lists and backlog but back in april last year our bed occupancy was at 33% instead of its normal 95% plus.... so what exactly happened to the 80k a day that would normally be occupying those beds ?


Why do you think virtually all the governments across the world and their doctors and nurses seem to see it differently to you, even though they are all aware of the consequences, both to their economies and other seriously ill patients? Why do you think that there have been so many lockdowns across the globe, such as Japan and parts of Australia now?

What's in it for them, or are you saying that they're all dumb?



i dont have a conspiracy theory.... but thats not to say i dont think a lot that has happened is not right..
why are our governments lifting restrictions when deaths, hospital admissions and cases are all much higher than when we initially locked down ? does that really make sense ?
i assume you looked up the actual numbers in my previous post and figured what was in your mind regarding the deaths was not the reality....

No, I took into account the fact that covid was a potentially deadly virus that spread in so-called "hot spots", whilst large areas followed the guidance of lockdown and wearing masks and appeared to have far lower numbers. For example, the current hot spot in Australia is a suburb of Sydney and action has been taken to try and restrict it to that suburb, though they are not sure whether or not it has already spread to neighboring areas. If that is the case their government has said that the whole of Sydney may be locked down. You might have also seen that large areas of India apparently have had virtually no reported covid cases/deaths whilst others where there are more hospitals have either had people dying in the corridors of hospitals or even been unable to get into a hospital.

Quite a few people have died with underlying health conditions, but they might have been living with those conditions for years anyway. A lot might have also have died of other conditions simply because they were unable to get the hospital for treatment they would normally have received, and whilst it is right that they did not die of covid they very likely died because of it.

Consequently, average national figures are pretty meaningless in the context of the virus as you would get significantly different figures considering death's in hot spots to watering them down by bringing in the populations outside those areas.

Don't have time to go through the whole thread, but just wanted to say what a top opening post TheHangedMan. Agreed 100%

Slightly misguided by Neil Oliver, as the country essentially locked down for 6 years during WWII.

And bollocks to the moaners in this country.. if you grew up here, you are the privileged few.

You are FREE to be "exempt" and not wear a mask, you are FREE to mix and mingle with others that feel the same way as you etc etc.

A virus has no boundaries, it doesnt care about gender, nationality, skin colour - it is also free to do what it wants.

Every transaction you make is already tracked - not by govt but by credit card companies, banks, shops, amazon , ebay etc. Every web page you look at - can be tracked with cookies (I know there are ways around that one).

Things are different and have changed for everyone and every country. It was the same back when we had the plague and spanish flu I expect. The only thing you can guarantee other than death and tax - is that things never stay the same - they always change.

I would rather be in the UK than India / Brazil / Japan , parts of Europe, Australia or Africa.

The only thing BIG pharma and Govts are colluding on - is trying to deliver a route out of the mess, in the hope that they dont bankrupt themselves in the process. There were over 150 vax candidates from companies at the start - before the UK went with AZ/Ox, Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson and Johnson etc..

I get all the George Orwell "Were doomed" stuff - but the reality is a lot simpler.

As of a couple of weeks ago - there were 3 people in ICU at the Heath. One had terminal cancer and could not be "jabbed" - the other 2 were anti vaxxers - who have since changed their opinion. The nurses should have just left nature take it's course - so they could also be 'free'.

It will and is getting better - more importantly - Barnsley on Saturday and will Vassell be able to make it from the changing room to the pitch without injuring himself

two anti vaxxers....or just 2 people who were free to decide they did not want the jab...

2 people who decided they did not want the jab - even though they were offered it and with pre medical condition preventing them from having the jab.

You can call that people who made a free choice or anti vaxxers etc - 2 sides of the same coin,
There was a problem - they were offered a solution that is known to work. They decided not to take the solution on offer. The result is there on 2 hospital beds for everyone to see.

yes it a free choice (as we all know) , it's also a free choice of business to set their terms and conditions of entry be that a mask or proof of the jab.

I have a friend who runs a shop in Queens arcade - there was a man / wife and kid 2 weeks came in. He refused to wear a mask in the shop - security were called - he was explained the terms of entering her shop, he was escorted out of the shop.

I have never known so many people get triggered by youtube and facebook to suddenly think of themselves as epidemiologists and virologists on the back of watching a video or FB post.

you do not need to be a virologist to know that vaccines are normally tested far more vigorously and over a much longer period of time than these have...its common knowledge
or that these vaccines have been rolled out under a temporary license only...its on government sites...
or do you need to be either or a mathematician to look at simple numbers on an ONS or NHS site....
not sure about shop keepers having a right to access your medial records either ..where exactly does that end ?

I'm always interested in listening to different peoples points of view, especially when it comes to the vaccines.
Could I ask our friend skidemin these two questions.

1. Do you think the vaccines have helped to avoid deaths and serious illnesses caused by the spread of covid?
2. Did you decide to accept the vaccine when offered to you?
If so, why, when you question its lack of testing?

I am only asking as you have a strong opinion on many subjects concerning the pandemic and often come across as very critical of people who agree with general medical opinions.

You are FREE to be "exempt" and not wear a mask, you are FREE to mix and mingle with others that feel the same way as you etc etc.

A virus has no boundaries, it doesnt care about gender, nationality, skin colour - it is also free to do what it wants.

Every transaction you make is already tracked - not by govt but by credit card companies, banks, shops, amazon , ebay etc. Every web page you look at - can be tracked with cookies (I know there are ways around that one).

Things are different and have changed for everyone and every country. It was the same back when we had the plague and spanish flu I expect. The only thing you can guarantee other than death and tax - is that things never stay the same - they always change.

I would rather be in the UK than India / Brazil / Japan , parts of Europe, Australia or Africa.

The only thing BIG pharma and Govts are colluding on - is trying to deliver a route out of the mess, in the hope that they dont bankrupt themselves in the process. There were over 150 vax candidates from companies at the start - before the UK went with AZ/Ox, Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson and Johnson etc..

I get all the George Orwell "Were doomed" stuff - but the reality is a lot simpler.

As of a couple of weeks ago - there were 3 people in ICU at the Heath. One had terminal cancer and could not be "jabbed" - the other 2 were anti vaxxers - who have since changed their opinion. The nurses should have just left nature take it's course - so they could also be 'free'.

It will and is getting better - more importantly - Barnsley on Saturday and will Vassell be able to make it from the changing room to the pitch without injuring himself

two anti vaxxers....or just 2 people who were free to decide they did not want the jab...

2 people who decided they did not want the jab - even though they were offered it and with pre medical condition preventing them from having the jab.

You can call that people who made a free choice or anti vaxxers etc - 2 sides of the same coin,
There was a problem - they were offered a solution that is known to work. They decided not to take the solution on offer. The result is there on 2 hospital beds for everyone to see.

yes it a free choice (as we all know) , it's also a free choice of business to set their terms and conditions of entry be that a mask or proof of the jab.

I have a friend who runs a shop in Queens arcade - there was a man / wife and kid 2 weeks came in. He refused to wear a mask in the shop - security were called - he was explained the terms of entering her shop, he was escorted out of the shop.

I have never known so many people get triggered by youtube and facebook to suddenly think of themselves as epidemiologists and virologists on the back of watching a video or FB post.

you do not need to be a virologist to know that vaccines are normally tested far more vigorously and over a much longer period of time than these have...its common knowledge
or that these vaccines have been rolled out under a temporary license only...its on government sites...
or do you need to be either or a mathematician to look at simple numbers on an ONS or NHS site....
not sure about shop keepers having a right to access your medial records either ..where exactly does that end ?

I'm always interested in listening to different peoples points of view, especially when it comes to the vaccines.
Could I ask our friend skidemin these two questions.

1. Do you think the vaccines have helped to avoid deaths and serious illnesses caused by the spread of covid?
2. Did you decide to accept the vaccine when offered to you?
If so, why, when you question its lack of testing?

I am only asking as you have a strong opinion on many subjects concerning the pandemic and often come across as very critical of people who agree with general medical opinions.

Regarding your question on the effectiveness of the ‘jab’.

Rather than just let us all carry on life with a few restrictions and common sense in relation to clinical settings, shielding high risk individuals and the use of existing generic medications (which have been banned or suppressed) the powers that be have steered us a course into ‘vaccinations’ that are ineffective, cause an alarming number of deaths and adverse reactions.
They have in essence put us straight back to square one because it appears that the vaccines are most likely driving the variants which are avoiding the vaccines (and now there are ‘boosters’ on the horizon).

From Israel which has an extremely high proportion of vaccinated people:

https://twitter.com/RanIsraeli/status/1 ... 1503028228

"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated". "85-90% of the hospitalizations are in Fully vaccinated people." "We are opening more and more COVID wards." "The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out" (booster alert).

And from Iceland, again highly vaccinated:

https://twitter.com/nbm_1981/status/1423334304071966728

It seems from this Icelandic analysis the ‘jab’ offers no protection against infection and limited protection against hospitalisation, for which I suspect you would have to be of a certain age or health status to be at risk in the first place.

There is another study I have seen which showed the various products provided an average of 1 or 2% protection against infection.

And yet there is no let-up, constant propaganda and an apparent determination to ‘jab ‘the young who are at little or no risk whatsoever (and Hancock stood up in Parliament and said the jabs would not be given to children).

And from day 1, the odds against anyone without co-morbidities or bad health under 70 dying of the coof are 99.9% approx.

I suggest it may be useful to consider why we are in this situation and what the agendas behind it might be.

C. Rombie-Coat » Thu Aug 05, 2021 9:27 pm

MR BIRCHGROVE wrote:
skidemin wrote:
ReesWestonSuperMare wrote:
skidemin wrote:
ReesWestonSuperMare wrote:
You are FREE to be "exempt" and not wear a mask, you are FREE to mix and mingle with others that feel the same way as you etc etc.

A virus has no boundaries, it doesnt care about gender, nationality, skin colour - it is also free to do what it wants.

Every transaction you make is already tracked - not by govt but by credit card companies, banks, shops, amazon , ebay etc. Every web page you look at - can be tracked with cookies (I know there are ways around that one).

Things are different and have changed for everyone and every country. It was the same back when we had the plague and spanish flu I expect. The only thing you can guarantee other than death and tax - is that things never stay the same - they always change.

I would rather be in the UK than India / Brazil / Japan , parts of Europe, Australia or Africa.

The only thing BIG pharma and Govts are colluding on - is trying to deliver a route out of the mess, in the hope that they dont bankrupt themselves in the process. There were over 150 vax candidates from companies at the start - before the UK went with AZ/Ox, Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson and Johnson etc..

I get all the George Orwell "Were doomed" stuff - but the reality is a lot simpler.

As of a couple of weeks ago - there were 3 people in ICU at the Heath. One had terminal cancer and could not be "jabbed" - the other 2 were anti vaxxers - who have since changed their opinion. The nurses should have just left nature take it's course - so they could also be 'free'.

It will and is getting better - more importantly - Barnsley on Saturday and will Vassell be able to make it from the changing room to the pitch without injuring himself




two anti vaxxers....or just 2 people who were free to decide they did not want the jab...


2 people who decided they did not want the jab - even though they were offered it and with pre medical condition preventing them from having the jab.

You can call that people who made a free choice or anti vaxxers etc - 2 sides of the same coin,
There was a problem - they were offered a solution that is known to work. They decided not to take the solution on offer. The result is there on 2 hospital beds for everyone to see.

yes it a free choice (as we all know) , it's also a free choice of business to set their terms and conditions of entry be that a mask or proof of the jab.

I have a friend who runs a shop in Queens arcade - there was a man / wife and kid 2 weeks came in. He refused to wear a mask in the shop - security were called - he was explained the terms of entering her shop, he was escorted out of the shop.

I have never known so many people get triggered by youtube and facebook to suddenly think of themselves as epidemiologists and virologists on the back of watching a video or FB post.



you do not need to be a virologist to know that vaccines are normally tested far more vigorously and over a much longer period of time than these have...its common knowledge
or that these vaccines have been rolled out under a temporary license only...its on government sites...
or do you need to be either or a mathematician to look at simple numbers on an ONS or NHS site....
not sure about shop keepers having a right to access your medial records either ..where exactly does that end ?

I'm always interested in listening to different peoples points of view, especially when it comes to the vaccines.
Could I ask our friend skidemin these two questions.

1. Do you think the vaccines have helped to avoid deaths and serious illnesses caused by the spread of covid?
2. Did you decide to accept the vaccine when offered to you?
If so, why, when you question its lack of testing?

I am only asking as you have a strong opinion on many subjects concerning the pandemic and often come across as very critical of people who agree with general medical opinions.


Regarding your question on the effectiveness of the ‘jab’.

Rather than just let us all carry on life with a few restrictions and common sense in relation to clinical settings, shielding high risk individuals and the use of existing generic medications (which have been banned or suppressed) the powers that be have steered us a course into ‘vaccinations’ that are ineffective, cause an alarming number of deaths and adverse reactions.
They have in essence put us straight back to square one because it appears that the vaccines are most likely driving the variants which are avoiding the vaccines (and now there are ‘boosters’ on the horizon).

From Israel which has an extremely high proportion of vaccinated people:

https://twitter.com/RanIsraeli/status/1 ... 1503028228

"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated". "85-90% of the hospitalizations are in Fully vaccinated people." "We are opening more and more COVID wards." "The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out" (booster alert).

And from Iceland, again highly vaccinated:

https://twitter.com/nbm_1981/status/1423334304071966728

It seems from this Icelandic analysis the ‘jab’ offers no protection against infection and limited protection against hospitalisation, for which I suspect you would have to be of a certain age or health status to be at risk in the first place.

There is another study I have seen which showed the various products provided an average of 1 or 2% protection against infection.

And yet there is no let-up, constant propaganda and an apparent determination to ‘jab ‘the young who are at little or no risk whatsoever (and Hancock stood up in Parliament and said the jabs would not be given to children).

And from day 1, the odds against anyone without co-morbidities or bad health under 70 dying of the coof are 99.9% approx.

I suggest it may be useful to consider why we are in this situation and what the agendas behind it might be.

My understanding was not that the vaccinations prevented you from contracting coronavirus, but that they reduced the likelihood of you becoming seriously ill or dying.

The following is an extract from a Reuters.com report regarding Iceland today -

“According to the Chief Epidemiologist, evidence shows that the vaccines used in Iceland protect about 60 percent of those fully vaccinated against any kind of infection caused by the delta variant of the virus and over 90 percent against serious illnesses,” she said.

“Currently there are 1072 people in isolation due to COVID-19 in Iceland, ten of which are hospitalised. About 97 percent of those infected have mild or no symptoms,” Knútsdóttir added. This latter statistic is not taken into consideration by the alarmist posts on social media.

“The fact that many vaccinated people are testing positive after the vaccine with the delta does not mean the vaccine doesn’t work,” Prof Monica Gandhi, Professor of Medicine and Associate Division Chief of the Division of HIV, Infectious Diseases, and Global Medicine at the University of California San Francisco, told Reuters.

And here is an extract from Israel -

Haaretz hosted Prof. Ran Balicer, the chairman of Israel’s expert panel on COVID-19, for a special Zoom briefing Wednesday on the delta variant’s spread in Israel and the impact of the country’s vaccination effort.

Israel was lauded as a global leader in vaccinations and deemed “the first country in the world to get over COVID.” But in recent weeks, the delta variant has taken the country by storm and its spread has forced Israel’s new government to bring back old restrictions – and even float the idea of another national lockdown.


Experts explain: If most Israelis are vaccinated, why is COVID surging?
Haaretz writers Allison Kaplan Sommer and Amir Tibon discussed the ongoing battle between the variant and the vaccine with Prof. Balicer in an hour-long session. Haaretz readers from all over the world were invited to submit questions to him on the subject, and here are some of his responses...

Can you say that right now, here in Israel, the data shows us that people who are not vaccinated are at a higher risk of getting severe illness from COVID-19, including the delta variant? And if that’s the case, why is Israel enacting new restrictions and considering another lockdown?

“Absolutely, there’s no question about that, it’s quite obvious. You can see this in the most simple graphs published by the Health Ministry. When you look at Israelis above the age of 60 and you examine severe illness rates – not numbers, rates, which means the number of illnesses per a specific number of the population – then what you see is that among those who are unvaccinated, there’s a considerably higher rate of severe illness than among the vaccinated.


“You can see vaccine effectiveness from those Health Ministry numbers, but we’re also now involved in much more sophisticated analytical research that’s trying to tease out the exact measures of vaccine effectiveness for severe cases. Very soon, we’ll be able to release our first assessments that were properly, meticulously done, which will show vaccine effectiveness. It’s already quite clear from our interim analysis that vaccine effectiveness for severe illness is very good.

“But that being said, when you have a problem in vaccine effectiveness against mild illness and infection, then disease dissemination continues to happen unchecked – and unless you introduce non-pharmaceutical interventions of sorts into the equation, the doubling of cases will eventually hurt your hospital capacity.”

Just to add that the post by C. Rombie-Coat supplied information posted on "Twitter", the way Donald Trump used to mislead voters until his account was closed.

It appears that it can be an unreliable source of information.

The facts as we know them...

1. The vaccinations offers protection against COVID.

2. The vaccine does not not stop someone catching COVID. But it dramatically reduces the chances of it being fatal/significant impact on health.

3. Vaccinated people can still be carriers and therefore pass the virus on, but will not suffer the impact of the disease.

4. The disease is not airborne but the transmission vector is droplet based - this is why masks are still advised. If it was airborne masks would be ineffective as the virus molecules are smaller than most surgical masks can filter.

5.The fatality of COVID is largely dependent on age and potential co-morbidities.

6. The average age of death of COVID associated deaths is higher than the average age of death in most countries.

7. The vaccines are possibly not effective against new variants.

Questions for those who like to throw anti-vaxxer around as a pejorative.

As far as I am aware all of the above is now fairly well accepted science.

Given all of above, what danger can an unvaccinated person pose to a vaccinated one?

A second question, why should vaccination be in all but title mandatory of it doesn't prevent the spread of the virus and potential new variants?

You are FREE to be "exempt" and not wear a mask, you are FREE to mix and mingle with others that feel the same way as you etc etc.

A virus has no boundaries, it doesnt care about gender, nationality, skin colour - it is also free to do what it wants.

Every transaction you make is already tracked - not by govt but by credit card companies, banks, shops, amazon , ebay etc. Every web page you look at - can be tracked with cookies (I know there are ways around that one).

Things are different and have changed for everyone and every country. It was the same back when we had the plague and spanish flu I expect. The only thing you can guarantee other than death and tax - is that things never stay the same - they always change.

I would rather be in the UK than India / Brazil / Japan , parts of Europe, Australia or Africa.

The only thing BIG pharma and Govts are colluding on - is trying to deliver a route out of the mess, in the hope that they dont bankrupt themselves in the process. There were over 150 vax candidates from companies at the start - before the UK went with AZ/Ox, Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson and Johnson etc..

I get all the George Orwell "Were doomed" stuff - but the reality is a lot simpler.

As of a couple of weeks ago - there were 3 people in ICU at the Heath. One had terminal cancer and could not be "jabbed" - the other 2 were anti vaxxers - who have since changed their opinion. The nurses should have just left nature take it's course - so they could also be 'free'.

It will and is getting better - more importantly - Barnsley on Saturday and will Vassell be able to make it from the changing room to the pitch without injuring himself

two anti vaxxers....or just 2 people who were free to decide they did not want the jab...

2 people who decided they did not want the jab - even though they were offered it and with pre medical condition preventing them from having the jab.

You can call that people who made a free choice or anti vaxxers etc - 2 sides of the same coin,
There was a problem - they were offered a solution that is known to work. They decided not to take the solution on offer. The result is there on 2 hospital beds for everyone to see.

yes it a free choice (as we all know) , it's also a free choice of business to set their terms and conditions of entry be that a mask or proof of the jab.

I have a friend who runs a shop in Queens arcade - there was a man / wife and kid 2 weeks came in. He refused to wear a mask in the shop - security were called - he was explained the terms of entering her shop, he was escorted out of the shop.

I have never known so many people get triggered by youtube and facebook to suddenly think of themselves as epidemiologists and virologists on the back of watching a video or FB post.

you do not need to be a virologist to know that vaccines are normally tested far more vigorously and over a much longer period of time than these have...its common knowledge
or that these vaccines have been rolled out under a temporary license only...its on government sites...
or do you need to be either or a mathematician to look at simple numbers on an ONS or NHS site....
not sure about shop keepers having a right to access your medial records either ..where exactly does that end ?

I'm always interested in listening to different peoples points of view, especially when it comes to the vaccines.
Could I ask our friend skidemin these two questions.

1. Do you think the vaccines have helped to avoid deaths and serious illnesses caused by the spread of covid?
2. Did you decide to accept the vaccine when offered to you?
If so, why, when you question its lack of testing?

I am only asking as you have a strong opinion on many subjects concerning the pandemic and often come across as very critical of people who agree with general medical opinions.

1...deaths are higher now than they were this time last year.... ? so do not know...have a feeling that if they get worse they will blame the omega strain that mork brought back from ork....
2.. i declined.... because i question the lack of testing... im not anti vaccines just anti not tested properly vaccines { im using the term vaccines for covid loosely } . not against anyone accepting the vaccines either providing they have been given the whole truth.. and that 100% is not what has been pushed .... i did however think they { the vaccines } were the way out even if it were orange squash that people were being jabbed with just to subdue fear, but thats not really worked ..people now seem to think that unjabbed people can pass some super covid that can kill them where as the jabbed can only pass on an inferior strain...