Heartbreaking !!

There are even more pictures of the families of more than 50,000 people in the UK alone who have died of COVID. Businesses will go bust for all sorts of reasons, very often through no fault of their own. Pick yourself up and get on with your life.

Not true,the vast majority have died WITH covid,not OF covid!!!
And yes I guess this elderly gentleman shoud"pick himself up" and get on with his life! What f@cking life is that then? Certainly not the one he had ploughed everything into,that's 100% sure.your empathy knows no bounds! You are part of the problem with posts like this!

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

It would be interesting to know the actual figures of the two

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

The point I’m making is business have failed and people have been broken. You wouldn’t care about the guy if it didn’t effect you agenda.

My view is I’m neither here nor there and it’s not my job and I do t know enough. In my opinion you appear to have been scared to death by the government over something that isn’t there.

Question, where have you heard the man in the photo is crying because he "lost his business that he poured his life into due to the bonkers restrictions"?

Using a reverse image search engine the only place this image seems to originate from is a Daily Mail article which mentions nothing like you've described.

The quote attached to the picture says "An anti-lockdown protester weeps as he is arrested by police outside King's Cross station in central London today"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... t-him.html

That's the article the original picture comes from, if you can find something in there to support your claim feel free to point it out to me. The Daily Mail has a horrible website so I only skimmed it.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Get over it we are out

This image from the lockdown demonstrations and I hope it HAUNTS those who have imposed this insanity on us.
A BROKEN man who apparently lost his business that he poured his life into due to the bonkers restrictions in tears as he is arrested for joining the peaceful protest.

A truly heartbreaking situation of a now uncaring Nation that are only concerned about one thing a deadly virus that if you contract it the advice you are given ? Stay home !!

F2D19F4F-818D-431D-8DDC-D5BD58095622.jpeg

This can be a polarising issue and most people are taking one side or the other, I am bang in the middle. I hate the lockdowns and feel they are too harsh, but I don't think the government are doing it to get one over the little people, they are purely trying to get through this without overwhelming the NHS, preying that the vaccines work and then they will do their best to distribute them, then the measures can be stopped or reduced, as early next year as possible.

Out of interest how have you been affected to shape your perspective, what business have you lost or is suffering, and that goes to anyone saying we should have just cracked on with no measures and covid shouldn't be a problem?

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

if there was solid proof that brexit would effect the economy negatively ,remain would have won by quite a margin
equally the opposite way..... Covid and the economical effects of Covid will just muddy the waters further... its not black and white.. but is done...so you might as well throw in the price of sherbet lemons going up...

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

It would be interesting to know the actual figures of the two

I believe the number in the UK is around 6%. This data is available on the Office of National Statistics website. The other 90% died with other comorbidities.

A study in America released this week, that was for a period of time available on the John Hopkins website (they've removed it), finds now excess deaths in the US. You can view it here: https://web.archive.org/web/20201126163 ... o-covid-19

Every single one of you that has used the phrase 'Greater Good' take a long, hard look at this image.

Burn it into your memory, take the time to fully understand this is your doing. All of you.

Your fear has broken this man and many millions of others. Your blind acceptance of propaganda has destroyed them.

Your unwillingness to think critically for yourselves has robbed them of a lifetime's effort, your cowardice to go against the grain, your eagerness to meekly submit and fall in line with the herd, your deafening silence - it has all allowed our governments to steal our livelihoods, our freedoms and our dignities.

You may disagree with my position, and I will respect that, and try to politely discuss the reasoning behind those respective positions, - I've said on many times on this forum polite conversation is more productive than tribal name-calling.

This I still stand by, but the outcome of those positions have very real-world consequences, and we have to also acknowledge that.

The way our government has handled this pandemic and the way the majority have supported their actions, not only through their silence but also through the consistent ridicule of anyone that raises dissent or even questions about the pandemic, is directly to blame for the image you see, and the life that has been ruined.

You may think it is worth the sacrifice, that we need to protect ourselves from the 'end of mankind' (a claim so outrageous that I can hardly bring myself to type it and wouldn't if I hadn't read it on this very board within the last week!)

You may think that all of this was worth it so we can be protected from a virus with a 99.2% survival rate.

You may think people like this man and millions of others, including myself, who have put their life's work into building a business, something of their own, something that adds to society rather than just taking, are worth tossing aside, so we can protect everyone from this virus that has taken the lives of 0.02% of the global population, whose overwhelming majority of victims were above 83 and had other co-morbidities.

You may think that taking away everything people have worked for lifetimes to achieve, is a fair exchange for your protection from the virus. I, of course, disagree, almost anyone that has worked hard to build something of meaning would, but still, I respect your right to the opposing opinion.

But if you are going to make that sacrifice, if you are going to tear peoples lives apart to protect you from a virus that is absolutely no worse than pandemics we've faced before, you must have the honesty and integrity to admit you made the conscious choice to ruin this man and millions of others and that you did it out of fear and cowardice to protect yourselves.

The greater good is a convenient cover to hide behind, an easy way to avoid any personal responsibility but it doesn't cut it, not when you take a good close look at an image like this.

This is your greater good, and it is the direct outcome of your thoughts and your actions.

You did this to this man, each and every one of you. The very least you can do is own it.

Theres no argument against anyone that argues the cost of inconvenience against the cost of a human life.Theres no winner either.

if thats all that you see , your lucky, your financially not effected and your families health is not effected.... its just a case of no hols this year.... should being lucky stop you from giving this a bit more thought about how it effects others..?
i dont believe people are kidding themselves that the thousands of avoidable deaths are not happening...or that thousands more will die..THEY KNOW ....DONT CARE .....ITS NOT THEM....its ok there is furlough.....

inconvenience my arse...ive lost 2 people i knew well over this neither of covid..... they wont see next christmas because death inconvenienced them..

You've completely misunderstood what Iv'e meant The human cost is what I was on about.I've changed one word to make my view a bit clearer perhaps.


Theres no argument against anyone that argues the cost of inconvenience verses the cost of a human life.Theres no winner either.

You can recover from losing money, you can recover from losing your house and even your wife.
Last time I checked you cant recover from death.

Day to day things in a sober environment like cafes / hair dressers / beauty salons should be allowed to continue. Anywhere that allows it's customers to get p!ssed off their heads etc needs to be closed.

Furlough is available I think, assets can be mothballed it is possible to pivot your business in order to tick over (not in all sectors). If it's any consolation to this guy - hopefully he'll still be around to see next christmas

Try telling that to my cousin who put his life savings- almost £200K - opening a restaurant in Manchester last December.

I'll happily tell your cousin that mate. Hopefully he wont catch it and or pass it on. Maybe your cousin would put his name on the death certificate of someone he gave it to ?

In all seriousness , ok 200k on a restaurant. What did he spend that money on ? usually restaurant equipment is on a lease basis - it was when my mate started a restaurant. A lease on a property can and should be done through a Ltd company, so if something bad happens - there is no come back on the individual. Shut down the company, liquidate the assets and walk. The majority of staff would be on temporary basis. The remainder would be on the books of the Ltd (same applies re liabilities ) . Obviously there may have been some building / conversion costs up front, so he would have lost some of his investment - but that's a risk in any business - which is why most people go down the Ltd Co route.
As a get out - there was eat out to help out, there was the option of pivoting the business to do delivery / takeaway and there was the emergency business help available to businesses. There was also the business rate freeze I believe.

It is a massive shock to anyone when their business goes t1ts up (i know) but you have to separate the business from you as an individual, limit your liabilities in the eventuality of things going wrong. I hope your cousin goes on to open a food business when we are all back on the straight and narrow in 12-16 weeks or so

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

It would be interesting to know the actual figures of the two

I believe the number in the UK is around 6%. This data is available on the Office of National Statistics website. The other 90% died with other comorbidities.

A study in America released this week, that was for a period of time available on the John Hopkins website (they've removed it), finds now excess deaths in the US. You can view it here: https://web.archive.org/web/20201126163 ... o-covid-19

So how do you explain 64 thousand excess deaths this year compared to last in the UK ?

72 thousand excess deaths in Spain
78 thousand in Italy

Even if they are not dying of Covid itself it is certainly having a major effect on existing conditions

Question, where have you heard the man in the photo is crying because he "lost his business that he poured his life into due to the bonkers restrictions"?

Using a reverse image search engine the only place this image seems to originate from is a Daily Mail article which mentions nothing like you've described.

The quote attached to the picture says "An anti-lockdown protester weeps as he is arrested by police outside King's Cross station in central London today"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... t-him.html

That's the article the original picture comes from, if you can find something in there to support your claim feel free to point it out to me. The Daily Mail has a horrible website so I only skimmed it.

You beat me to it. I reverse imaged it as well. ive lost count the number of images Ive seen posted that someone has then attributed it to something else

Question, where have you heard the man in the photo is crying because he "lost his business that he poured his life into due to the bonkers restrictions"?

Using a reverse image search engine the only place this image seems to originate from is a Daily Mail article which mentions nothing like you've described.

The quote attached to the picture says "An anti-lockdown protester weeps as he is arrested by police outside King's Cross station in central London today"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... t-him.html

That's the article the original picture comes from, if you can find something in there to support your claim feel free to point it out to me. The Daily Mail has a horrible website so I only skimmed it.

You beat me to it. I reverse imaged it as well. ive lost count the number of images Ive seen posted that someone has then attributed it to something else

I've lost count of the number of times Nukes has done it

The trick is use words like "apparently" "I've been told" "a friend said" etc and ignore anyone who questions it

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

It would be interesting to know the actual figures of the two

I believe the number in the UK is around 6%. This data is available on the Office of National Statistics website. The other 90% died with other comorbidities.

A study in America released this week, that was for a period of time available on the John Hopkins website (they've removed it), finds now excess deaths in the US. You can view it here: https://web.archive.org/web/20201126163 ... o-covid-19

So how do you explain 64 thousand excess deaths this year compared to last in the UK ?

72 thousand excess deaths in Spain
78 thousand in Italy

Even if they are not dying of Covid itself it is certainly having a major effect on existing conditions

There has been an increase in suicides, cancer related, heart related and dementia related deaths in the UK this year, all above 70% I believe. I don't know how many people this tallies to, but it would make up some of that number.

People have been broken before for many reasons business succeed and fail all the time. That picture happens al the timewith or without COVID unfortunately it’s in the spot light to fit certain agendas.

The whole thing is a sad and sorry state.

I throw my hands In the air. Nothing can be said to make people realise what is happening. And a global pandemic I do laugh at that one. The biggest lie ever told.
50.000 dead but how many died out of that lot solely by Covid ? Not many at all You lot have got me rolling my eyes now

It would be interesting to know the actual figures of the two

I believe the number in the UK is around 6%. This data is available on the Office of National Statistics website. The other 90% died with other comorbidities.

A study in America released this week, that was for a period of time available on the John Hopkins website (they've removed it), finds now excess deaths in the US. You can view it here: https://web.archive.org/web/20201126163 ... o-covid-19

How many people die from dementia a year? Then look up how many people die exclusively of dementia a year.
The answer to the first question would show that it's at the top of the cause of death chart. The answer to the second would show a very small number.

Cancer usually massively weakens the body leaving you vulnerable to infections. If an infection kills you do you think cancer should be mentioned on the death certificate somewhere?

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Get over it we are out

Now all you need to do is tell the lockdown haters to get over it as well.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

I was talking financially. You can't be against lockdowns due to the economic losses but pro brexit which, even according to government figures, will be greater than covid.

I do look forward to corona being the excuse from the brexiteers for the next few years though (as well as anyone but themselves).

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

I was talking financially. You can't be against lockdowns due to the economic losses but pro brexit which, even according to government figures, will be greater than covid.

I do look forward to corona being the excuse from the brexiteers for the next few years though (as well as anyone but themselves).

There is no comparison between the economic impact of an enforced shut down of the economy and Brexit. Literally none.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

I was talking financially. You can't be against lockdowns due to the economic losses but pro brexit which, even according to government figures, will be greater than covid.

I do look forward to corona being the excuse from the brexiteers for the next few years though (as well as anyone but themselves).

There is no comparison between the economic impact of an enforced shut down of the economy and Brexit. Literally none.

So the circus that is josh begins!

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

Can't the argument be made that the 2019 General election was the democratic choice, made by the people to choose a government to determine the direction we go in as a nation?
This Government was chosen by the people the same way Brexit was.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

I was talking financially. You can't be against lockdowns due to the economic losses but pro brexit which, even according to government figures, will be greater than covid.

I do look forward to corona being the excuse from the brexiteers for the next few years though (as well as anyone but themselves).

There is no comparison between the economic impact of an enforced shut down of the economy and Brexit. Literally none.

What? Both have an impact. Both will negatively effect the economy.

If you can't compare them then I hope you don't work with finances.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

I was talking financially. You can't be against lockdowns due to the economic losses but pro brexit which, even according to government figures, will be greater than covid.

I do look forward to corona being the excuse from the brexiteers for the next few years though (as well as anyone but themselves).

There is no comparison between the economic impact of an enforced shut down of the economy and Brexit. Literally none.

What? Both have an impact. Both will negatively effect the economy.

If you can't compare them then I hope you don't work with finances.

They both impact the economy yes, just like my decision whether to go to the shop or not tonight will. If you cannot see the difference between an enforced lock down, shutting down entire industries, and Brexit, without it being explained to you, then it's not really worth getting into a discussion about.

[

Question, where have you heard the man in the photo is crying because he "lost his business that he poured his life into due to the bonkers restrictions"?

Using a reverse image search engine the only place this image seems to originate from is a Daily Mail article which mentions nothing like you've described.

The quote attached to the picture says "An anti-lockdown protester weeps as he is arrested by police outside King's Cross station in central London today"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... t-him.html

That's the article the original picture comes from, if you can find something in there to support your claim feel free to point it out to me. The Daily Mail has a horrible website so I only skimmed it.

You beat me to it. I reverse imaged it as well. ive lost count the number of images Ive seen posted that someone has then attributed it to something else

I've lost count of the number of times Nukes has done it

The trick is use words like "apparently" "I've been told" "a friend said" etc and ignore anyone who questions it

Regardless of who the man is, the point serves to highlight the huge sacrifice we are making to many millions of small business owners who are just being discarded in the draconian measures to protect us from a disease so deadly most of us need a test to know we even have it.

I understand the government's initial reaction, they like every other government on the planet were doing with an unknown threat.

But there was an opportunity to change tack when we first came out of lockdown, realise our mistakes and taken a new, better path.

The money we have thrown away would have been enough to fund protecting the weak and vulnerable, placing a much smaller part of our society in isolation, while the rest of us got back to normal, all while edging us closer to herd immunity.

The overwhelming majority who have had Covid, have had little or mild symptoms. The government and media could have easily have used there platforms to advise us all what to expect and not to panic if we have it, only to visit the doctor if your condition worsens.

Telemedicine could have been deployed, the tools are already well established to allow doctors/medical advisors to give patients reassurance in the large percentage of cases and direct them to emergency channels in the small percentage that are severe.

If you have the illness, you stay at home and isolate for a week.

(We did all of this for swine flu by the way.)

This would have been a sensible way to move forward, that could have reduced the impact of the virus on the vulnerable, helped keep the NHS demand manageable and kept our economy moving. The psychological impact could even have built further upon the 'in it together' spirit that emerged early in the pandemic, rather than the pervasive mood of fear and defeat that we have now.

It would have meant an awful lot of people holding their hands up nd saying we got this wrong, I wonder if that is the simple reason why we've carried on with an approach that has not worked and hurt so many?

Regardless, the decision was made not to do any of this.

The decision was made that it would be the small business owners who would have to be sacrificed while Amazon and the likes have record profits. 2020 is one of the greatest shift in wealth we will ever have seen.

The decision was made that to protect the small percentage of our society who are vulnerable to Covid19, others would need to be sacrificed, including those with mental health issues long under-served by government after government who pay us lip service and make empty promises and then forget their hollow words everytime.

They made their decision, they weighed up their choices and they chose their path, but we only ever hear about one side of the equation, the covid side.

We at least deserve to know about the other side of that equation so we can understand the sacrifices being made and those who have made the decisions, and those who supported them should at least be able to hold their hands up and say, it was worth destroying these millions of lives.

If only 10% of this country were as well informed, questioning the status quo and motives behind it, and articulate as ealing_ayatollah this country would be in a much better place.

For the life of me I cannot understand how so many of you have just turned into sheep, blindly following MSM's scare tactics, believing politicians that do not give a f**k about you, and ultimately surrendering your freedoms at a whim!!!

You are the same people who laud our valiant servicemen for their achievements on D Day and beyond. Those poor Souls will be turning in their graves looking at us lot now and think "Why did I even bother"!!!

The trick is use words like "apparently" "I've been told" "a friend said" etc and ignore anyone who questions it

Regardless of who the man is, the point serves to highlight the huge sacrifice we are making to many millions of small business owners who are just being discarded in the draconian measures to protect us from a disease so deadly most of us need a test to know we even have it.

I understand the government's initial reaction, they like every other government on the planet were doing with an unknown threat.

But there was an opportunity to change tack when we first came out of lockdown, realise our mistakes and taken a new, better path.

The money we have thrown away would have been enough to fund protecting the weak and vulnerable, placing a much smaller part of our society in isolation, while the rest of us got back to normal, all while edging us closer to herd immunity.

The overwhelming majority who have had Covid, have had little or mild symptoms. The government and media could have easily have used there platforms to advise us all what to expect and not to panic if we have it, only to visit the doctor if your condition worsens.

Telemedicine could have been deployed, the tools are already well established to allow doctors/medical advisors to give patients reassurance in the large percentage of cases and direct them to emergency channels in the small percentage that are severe.

If you have the illness, you stay at home and isolate for a week.

(We did all of this for swine flu by the way.)

This would have been a sensible way to move forward, that could have reduced the impact of the virus on the vulnerable, helped keep the NHS demand manageable and kept our economy moving. The psychological impact could even have built further upon the 'in it together' spirit that emerged early in the pandemic, rather than the pervasive mood of fear and defeat that we have now.

It would have meant an awful lot of people holding their hands up nd saying we got this wrong, I wonder if that is the simple reason why we've carried on with an approach that has not worked and hurt so many?

Regardless, the decision was made not to do any of this.

The decision was made that it would be the small business owners who would have to be sacrificed while Amazon and the likes have record profits. 2020 is one of the greatest shift in wealth we will ever have seen.

The decision was made that to protect the small percentage of our society who are vulnerable to Covid19, others would need to be sacrificed, including those with mental health issues long under-served by government after government who pay us lip service and make empty promises and then forget their hollow words everytime.

They made their decision, they weighed up their choices and they chose their path, but we only ever hear about one side of the equation, the covid side.

We at least deserve to know about the other side of that equation so we can understand the sacrifices being made and those who have made the decisions, and those who supported them should at least be able to hold their hands up and say, it was worth destroying these millions of lives.

I don't disagree with much of your post and the parts I do are minor points. I also understand that there are people all across the country suffering, physically, emotionally, financially, mentally, etc and I am not trying to disregard that with my comments in this thread.

My comments are because I don't believe Nukes truly cares about the man in the photo, it's the agenda, the narrative, the fact he has a picture to put to his arguments. If he did why would he make up an unfounded sob story to accompany the picture.
Were this man crying about losing his business because of Brexit, anti BLM demonstrations, austerity etc Nukes wouldn't care.

Once or twice is fair enough, mistakes happen. For example with the ONS Death numbers he posted the other day, as another user pointed out all his monthly numbers for 2020 were wrong by 1000 - 8000 deaths which was the basis of his argument. Maybe he accidentally used England and Wales numbers instead of all the UK, or maybe the source he got it from misinterpreted the data. Those are all valid excuses but with Nukes it's consistent and has been for months.
Start a thread using information from Facebook, Twitter, a friend, etc.
Make some bold claims without validating any information.
When people point out inconsistencies, deflects. Call people sheep, snowflakes, brainwashed and avoid answering questions.

Rinse and repeat.

At this point it's disingenuous whenever he starts a thread.

Funny how some people can be so worked up about the economic impact of a lockdown but support brexit.

In just over a months time we'll be voluntarily going through something which will lower our economy and gdp by a greater amount and for hell of a lot longer. I can't imagine a similar post being made by nuclear about that.

Brexit was a democratic choice, made by the people to determine the direction we go in as a nation.

The coronavirus act 2020 gives the government the ability to act unilaterally without accountability to the people in the name of our protection.

The two cannot be further removed from each other if one was on Mars.

Can't the argument be made that the 2019 General election was the democratic choice, made by the people to choose a government to determine the direction we go in as a nation?
This Government was chosen by the people the same way Brexit was.

I see where your coming from, but I'd say it was Cameron's government that was elected by the people after which they gave us a referendum on Brexit.

Johnson's government implemented the coronavirus act 2020 without such a mandate from the people. Whether rightly or wrongly, the way the government has responded to covid and thw 2020 coronavirus act are the very antithesis of democratic.

While I disagree vehemently with the governments approach, I can see at the onset at least they were between rock and hard place and they may have felt they needed to act as they did, it doesn't change the fact their actions were undeniably autocratic.

I just can't see how a comparison to Covid and Brexit can be made in that sense.

As for the financial impact, any projected losses of Brexit, which had huge variance depending on the analyst, cannot be compared to actual losses of industries being closed down as a response to Covis

Only the most fanatical zealots would suggest that the UK leaving the EU would be as catastrophic as our governments response to the pandemic has been.

If only 10% of this country were as well informed, questioning the status quo and motives behind it, and articulate as ealing_ayatollah this country would be in a much better place.

Thanks for the kind words mate. V much appreciated

The trick is use words like "apparently" "I've been told" "a friend said" etc and ignore anyone who questions it

Regardless of who the man is, the point serves to highlight the huge sacrifice we are making to many millions of small business owners who are just being discarded in the draconian measures to protect us from a disease so deadly most of us need a test to know we even have it.

I understand the government's initial reaction, they like every other government on the planet were doing with an unknown threat.

But there was an opportunity to change tack when we first came out of lockdown, realise our mistakes and taken a new, better path.

The money we have thrown away would have been enough to fund protecting the weak and vulnerable, placing a much smaller part of our society in isolation, while the rest of us got back to normal, all while edging us closer to herd immunity.

The overwhelming majority who have had Covid, have had little or mild symptoms. The government and media could have easily have used there platforms to advise us all what to expect and not to panic if we have it, only to visit the doctor if your condition worsens.

Telemedicine could have been deployed, the tools are already well established to allow doctors/medical advisors to give patients reassurance in the large percentage of cases and direct them to emergency channels in the small percentage that are severe.

If you have the illness, you stay at home and isolate for a week.

(We did all of this for swine flu by the way.)

This would have been a sensible way to move forward, that could have reduced the impact of the virus on the vulnerable, helped keep the NHS demand manageable and kept our economy moving. The psychological impact could even have built further upon the 'in it together' spirit that emerged early in the pandemic, rather than the pervasive mood of fear and defeat that we have now.

It would have meant an awful lot of people holding their hands up nd saying we got this wrong, I wonder if that is the simple reason why we've carried on with an approach that has not worked and hurt so many?

Regardless, the decision was made not to do any of this.

The decision was made that it would be the small business owners who would have to be sacrificed while Amazon and the likes have record profits. 2020 is one of the greatest shift in wealth we will ever have seen.

The decision was made that to protect the small percentage of our society who are vulnerable to Covid19, others would need to be sacrificed, including those with mental health issues long under-served by government after government who pay us lip service and make empty promises and then forget their hollow words everytime.

They made their decision, they weighed up their choices and they chose their path, but we only ever hear about one side of the equation, the covid side.

We at least deserve to know about the other side of that equation so we can understand the sacrifices being made and those who have made the decisions, and those who supported them should at least be able to hold their hands up and say, it was worth destroying these millions of lives.

I don't disagree with much of your post and the parts I do are minor points. I also understand that there are people all across the country suffering, physically, emotionally, financially, mentally, etc and I am not trying to disregard that with my comments in this thread.

My comments are because I don't believe Nukes truly cares about the man in the photo, it's the agenda, the narrative, the fact he has a picture to put to his arguments. If he did why would he make up an unfounded sob story to accompany the picture.
Were this man crying about losing his business because of Brexit, anti BLM demonstrations, austerity etc Nukes wouldn't care.

Once or twice is fair enough, mistakes happen. For example with the ONS Death numbers he posted the other day, as another user pointed out all his monthly numbers for 2020 were wrong by 1000 - 8000 deaths which was the basis of his argument. Maybe he accidentally used England and Wales numbers instead of all the UK, or maybe the source he got it from misinterpreted the data. Those are all valid excuses but with Nukes it's consistent and has been for months.
Start a thread using information from Facebook, Twitter, a friend, etc.
Make some bold claims without validating any information.
When people point out inconsistencies, deflects. Call people sheep, snowflakes, brainwashed and avoid answering questions.

Rinse and repeat.

At this point it's disingenuous whenever he starts a thread.

Just to say, I only just noticed that I missed the other quotes out in that bit of the thread. Wasn't intending to single your comment out, rather just the point in general so sorry if it came across more specifically at you than that

As for Nukes, not my place to speak for him, am sure he's big enough and ugly enough to fight his own corner. All I will say, is his position on all of this has been consistent throughout and I personally think he's coming from a genuine place when he posts.

But that is just the way I see it, and appreciate others may see it differently