OT: 'THE DONALD' EDGES TOWARDS THE DOOR

ive always thought it happened during the Welsh Assembly referendum...the way the final vote that came in turned it on its head was so out of sinc ..

At the time I was an enthusiastic supporter of a Welsh Assembly and voted for it. My enthusiasm has waned a bit now but I would still probably still vote for it to stay if I was asked.

However, the same idea as you crossed my mind with regard to the 1999 vote. I remember before the vote thinking there was no chance Wales would vote for an assembly and during the count it looked that would be the result. I was astonished when I heard that 'yes' had nicked it at the final whistle. I can't remember the exact result but it was something like 50.1% to 49.9%.

You do have to wonder about what went on? As I got the result I wanted I didn't think about it for too long but I wouldn't discount anyone who claims that something went on behind closed doors

Without Covid Trump would have had a landslide over that old grandad.

It’d be the same here if there was an election. Boris and his blue wall would be beaten by a non politician without any ideas simply because the gullible British folk think the grass is greener and Starmer would manage an unforeseen and indefensible pandemic better.

Same with USA, the pandemic isn’t going to disappear.

It’s cruel that this has happened thereby preventing Trump and Johnson get on with their mandated plans.

Plus the smiling grandad has made it clear he’s no fan of Brexit. Great. Not.

Thanks a bunch China.

ive always thought it happened during the Welsh Assembly referendum...the way the final vote that came in turned it on its head was so out of sinc ..

At the time I was an enthusiastic supporter of a Welsh Assembly and voted for it. My enthusiasm has waned a bit now but I would still probably still vote for it to stay if I was asked.

However, the same idea as you crossed my mind with regard to the 1999 vote. I remember before the vote thinking there was no chance Wales would vote for an assembly and during the count it looked that would be the result. I was astonished when I heard that 'yes' had nicked it at the final whistle. I can't remember the exact result but it was something like 50.1% to 49.9%.

You do have to wonder about what went on? As I got the result I wanted I didn't think about it for too long but I wouldn't discount anyone who claims that something went on behind closed doors

i stayed up to watch it.. ron and his cronies had left the venue they had been at with long faces... it was over... then the final result comes in and its astonishing and back they came celebrating... the yes campaign had full government support..
pretty sure unlike with brexit where mps chose sides labour Mps were not allowed to have a free choice ..and the no campaign..was almost non existent and certainly in no position to question or challenge the result...it just didnt feel right...and still does not

Without Covid Trump would have had a landslide over that old grandad.

It’d be the same here if there was an election. Boris and his blue wall would be beaten by a non politician without any ideas simply because the gullible British folk think the grass is greener and Starmer would manage an unforeseen and indefensible pandemic better.

Same with USA, the pandemic isn’t going to disappear.

It’s cruel that this has happened thereby preventing Trump and Johnson get on with their mandated plans.

Plus the smiling grandad has made it clear he’s no fan of Brexit. Great. Not.

Thanks a bunch China.

he doesnt know who his wife is or what city he is in..so tomorrow he will be pro brexit thinking its a cure for covid...

So alot of people I think have gone "Biden is from the democratic party" he must be a lefty. The truth is Bidens record shows he would today be considered an old school centre republican. He was pro war when the Democrats were against it... He actually isn't against fracking, and I'm sure he was one of the Democrats who voted to keep segregation in place.

The immediate after math of him being elected will probably see the stock market go up, as they have ploughed millions into his campaign so they need to look like they backed the right horse.

And I agree with "Welsh man in CA" electoral college is only illogical to those who don't understand it.. I do however think some states have too many votes compared to its population.

However the thing you will find now and probably in 4 years is.. People have been told you need to vote Biden because trump is all evil. So people might vote for someone they don't agree with, just because they don't like someone else... Its build as the most important election ever... Now in 4 years your probably gonna get a pence campaign. And it will be built as the most important election in history... And people are going to be told again you HAVE to vote Biden to stop pence getting the job... Which ends up resulting in nothing ever changing and no one ever really voting for people they agree with.

So alot of people I think have gone "Biden is from the democratic party" he must be a lefty. The truth is Bidens record shows he would today be considered an old school centre republican. He was pro war when the Democrats were against it... He actually isn't against fracking, and I'm sure he was one of the Democrats who voted to keep segregation in place.

The immediate after math of him being elected will probably see the stock market go up, as they have ploughed millions into his campaign so they need to look like they backed the right horse.

And I agree with "Welsh man in CA" electoral college is only illogical to those who don't understand it.. I do however think some states have too many votes compared to its population.

However the thing you will find now and probably in 4 years is.. People have been told you need to vote Biden because trump is all evil. So people might vote for someone they don't agree with, just because they don't like someone else... Its build as the most important election ever... Now in 4 years your probably gonna get a pence campaign. And it will be built as the most important election in history... And people are going to be told again you HAVE to vote Biden to stop pence getting the job... Which ends up resulting in nothing ever changing and no one ever really voting for people they agree with.

yep...politics has got more and more negative ..it contributed to our last election with people unable to find it in themselves to vote for Corbyn...but the anti Trump thing was on a different level... where many of the issues he was being attacked over Biden had at some time taken a similar line , done similar or worse..
apart from that...how on earth does the democratic party come up with this fella... surely there must be someone in the party younger with a bit of charisma who isnt going to hide for another 6 months ?

The whole situation is now getting out of hand and, in regrettable but true Trump style, he is now crying 'fix' because his (very) silly and premature claim that (quote) "We have won...!" has quickly bit him on the backside

Why not be a gracious loser and exit stage right in a gentlemanly manner?

I understand he must be smarting right now; but he still has a couple of months to revel in is position and then he can go home with his beautiful wife to is plush pad in West Palm Beach, Florida (I've seen it and it's a beaut) and enjoy his life and his golf in the safe knowledge he beat the system once and it's put him in a place (POTUS) that no one (and he probably includes himself) ever thought he'd achieve

Been there, seen that, now got the t-shirt; now it's time to go home, Donald...!

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The whole situation is now getting out of hand and, in regrettable but true Trump style, he is now crying 'fix' because his (very) silly and premature claim that (quote) "We have won...!" has quickly bit him on the backside

Why not be a gracious loser and exit stage right in a gentlemanly manner?

I understand he must be smarting right now; but he still has a couple of months to revel in is position and then he can go home with his beautiful wife to is plush pad in West Palm Beach, Florida (I've seen it and it's a beaut) and enjoy his life and his golf in the safe knowledge he beat the system once and it's put him in a place (POTUS) that no one (and he probably includes himself) ever thought he'd achieve

Been there, seen that, now got the t-shirt; now it's time to go home, Donald...!

like most things these days it will play out in the courts...
how genuine his claims of fraud are i dont know... but be honest he has been under attack from day1 with people trying and failing to have him removed so why wouldnt he now think they are still playing the same game... the last election might not have been challenged but its hardly like it was taken on the chin either.

So alot of people I think have gone "Biden is from the democratic party" he must be a lefty. The truth is Bidens record shows he would today be considered an old school centre republican. He was pro war when the Democrats were against it... He actually isn't against fracking, and I'm sure he was one of the Democrats who voted to keep segregation in place.

The immediate after math of him being elected will probably see the stock market go up, as they have ploughed millions into his campaign so they need to look like they backed the right horse.

And I agree with "Welsh man in CA" electoral college is only illogical to those who don't understand it.. I do however think some states have too many votes compared to its population.

However the thing you will find now and probably in 4 years is.. People have been told you need to vote Biden because trump is all evil. So people might vote for someone they don't agree with, just because they don't like someone else... Its build as the most important election ever... Now in 4 years your probably gonna get a pence campaign. And it will be built as the most important election in history... And people are going to be told again you HAVE to vote Biden to stop pence getting the job... Which ends up resulting in nothing ever changing and no one ever really voting for people they agree with.

The electoral college is very much needed otherwise California and new York would decide every election imposing their will on all the other states and look at the morons who currently control both areas they could not be more mental

The system has worked, the stock market likes the result.

A rightish democrat who understands the value of wonga, with a Republican Senate and Democrat house means no change and probably gridlock where nothing too controversial happens.

I think this will be the term where America finds it not as important as it used to be anymore, especially in Europe. The threat is westwards for the the states and as long as he is compos mentis and has not suddenly changed into Greta Thurnberg, I can't see anything changing.

Berlin not Brussels or London will be the key partner for Biden, but who cares. They all only look after there own country anyway. I can't see Joe making too many foreign visits nor Joe's "people" allowing Camila's to close to the power. She may well be the USA's representative in a lot of occasions. A bit like the queen.

The system has worked, the stock market likes the result.

A rightish democrat who understands the value of wonga, with a Republican Senate and Democrat house means no change and probably gridlock where nothing too controversial happens.

I think this will be the term where America finds it not as important as it used to be anymore, especially in Europe. The threat is westwards for the the states and as long as he is compos mentis and has not suddenly changed into Greta Thurnberg, I can't see anything changing.

Berlin not Brussels or London will be the key partner for Biden, but who cares. They all only look after there own country anyway. I can't see Joe making too many foreign visits nor Joe's "people" allowing Camila's to close to the power. She may well be the USA's representative in a lot of occasions. A bit like the queen.

The stock market is a big indicator for sure.
They must see Biden as being no real threat to capitalism.
But what happens in 4 years time? He couldn’t stand at 81, so this appears to me a veiled path to the election of his Veep.

He may have a point with mail votes , do they check / cross reference them ? Mail votes were always done on trust but also been a single point of failure in the system. If they have anyway of checking the ballot paper somebody used with the actual one they were sent - then that would work - but impractical if the vote is supposed to be anonymous.

Eitherway - as it is - he has no way of proving if the ballot papers are fake or not. What it does give him is the chance to cry foul , leave saying he was robbed and so therfore it gives him the 'out' he needs to stand down.

And in his place comes a man who looks like he has early onset dementia. 78 years old, calls Trump President George, forgets his grand daughters name and calls him by his son's name. The realises he is wrong and introduces her as his other grand daughter. And he is the man in charge of the nuclear codes

If / when Biden wins - he wont last more than 6 months - the democrats will claim the 20th amendment (I think) and say he is not able to do the job - and then we can Welcome President Harris (whoever she is)

My guess is that the echo will claim it's the first Welsh descended president of America as her great great great Grandma came from Barry docks - and secretly she supports the city...

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

How's a watermark going to determine if a ballot is eligible to be counted or not? It's about the date and time the ballot was submitted that's important, if someone was given a watermarked ballot and filled it in and posted it before the polls close it counts watermark or no watermark likewise if it is sent off after the deadline it won't be counted

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

How's a watermark going to determine if a ballot is eligible to be counted or not? It's about the date and time the ballot was submitted that's important, if someone was given a watermarked ballot and filled it in and posted it before the polls close it counts watermark or no watermark likewise if it is sent off after the deadline it won't be counted

Indeed

This is fast becoming a joke and 'The Donald' is not going easily; more kicking and screaming 'foul' in a manner he assumes will work as it has before, i.e. loudly!

Not going to happen and even his own side (if the is a non-sycophanitic one) are now going against him, as they realise the game is up...

National TV have made media history by stopping short the covering of PRESIDENTIAL briefings due to the amount of unsubstantiated claims being made by POTUS; with presenters apologising for the President's false rhetoric (or plain lies)

He is a prime example of narcissism (something we've seen all too well on this very forum) and history won't view 'The Donald' well once the dust settles

Good riddance to the orange baby man - lets hope Johnson, Duda and Orban follow shortly too. The world is a better place today

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

How's a watermark going to determine if a ballot is eligible to be counted or not? It's about the date and time the ballot was submitted that's important, if someone was given a watermarked ballot and filled it in and posted it before the polls close it counts watermark or no watermark likewise if it is sent off after the deadline it won't be counted

Another conspiracy

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

How's a watermark going to determine if a ballot is eligible to be counted or not? It's about the date and time the ballot was submitted that's important, if someone was given a watermarked ballot and filled it in and posted it before the polls close it counts watermark or no watermark likewise if it is sent off after the deadline it won't be counted

Another conspiracy

I would of called it a possible theory........but the brainwashed call anything that is not in the mainstream a "conspiracy theory"......take a look at yourselves for god's sake. Why is anything that is not "the official line" or not agreed with by the MSM called a conspiracy theory. Grow up and think for yourself....whether you agree or disagree is immaterial.....but stop trying to belittle people with your put down words aka Conspiracy Theory.

Just to lighten the mood as we await the result...

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It’s all over bar the shouting.

I suppose those Americans who voted for grandpa Joe know now they’ll get what they wished for - a crashed economy, a weakened world status and a female President next year. Oh and btw the pandemic will still go on...

It’s all over bar the shouting.

I suppose those Americans who voted for grandpa Joe know now they’ll get what they wished for .

Because calling people names always works & you obviously missed the fact that Trump is also a grandpa although I'm not sure what that has to do with anything.

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

The ballots being counted at the moment aren't ballots that have come in 'late'. They are mail in ballots that were received in good time. They would have ALL been counted by now, but in some states (e.g.Pennsylvania, Wisconsin) republican legislators did not allow mail-in ballots to be counted early.

As a result Trump can now spew bollocks about these mysterious 'late' mail in ballots coming out of nowhere when it's his own party that have caused this mess. Trump himself has been saying for weeks that his supporters shouldn't vote via mail in because it's prone to fraud, so it's hardly a surprise that these mail in ballots are predominantly Biden too, but again Trump has twisted it into a conspiracy.

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

How's a watermark going to determine if a ballot is eligible to be counted or not? It's about the date and time the ballot was submitted that's important, if someone was given a watermarked ballot and filled it in and posted it before the polls close it counts watermark or no watermark likewise if it is sent off after the deadline it won't be counted

Another conspiracy

I would of called it a possible theory........but the brainwashed call anything that is not in the mainstream a "conspiracy theory"......take a look at yourselves for god's sake. Why is anything that is not "the official line" or not agreed with by the MSM called a conspiracy theory. Grow up and think for yourself....whether you agree or disagree is immaterial.....but stop trying to belittle people with your put down words aka Conspiracy Theory.

Is it really a possible theory though? Watermarking ballots has no way of determining when a vote was made, sent, arrived or counted. If 100k ballots are counted and 50k were signed before Election Day and 50k after, a watermark alone won’t give you any information about that ballot.

So as far as I’m concerned it’s another panicked shout about fraud with no tangible way of it working if you take any time to consider how watermarked ballots can be proof of falsifying results in the election.

Good riddance to the orange baby man - lets hope Johnson, Duda and Orban follow shortly too. The world is a better place today

This - and the reason leading Republicans won't denounce this lunatic is that although he has been ousted from his role as the most ridiculous, uncaring, racist, neo-nazi, legend in his own lunchtime, prone to throwing his toys out of the pram when he doesn't get his own way, USA President, by a legal democratic process - he has carefully entrenched himself in a powerful position in the Republican party and all the senior sycophants in that party will need Trump's support to get their nomination to stand as the Republican candidate in 4 years time - this tripe about cheating will therefore go on for weeks yet as there will be no-one on the Republican side willing to reign in Trump. Mind you, I'd love to see the orange faced, flowing blonde locked imbecile being dragged across the Whitehouse lawn to a helicopter as he is being physically removed from the oval office - now that would be a day for Democracy!!

I've read that apparently, a secret watermark was put on the ballets and all these late ballots coming in for Biden are to be investigated if they have the watermark. I think this is what's holding up the outcome.

I'm looking forward to seeing what unfolds. I think there are going to be a lot of sanctions coming in the near future.

How's a watermark going to determine if a ballot is eligible to be counted or not? It's about the date and time the ballot was submitted that's important, if someone was given a watermarked ballot and filled it in and posted it before the polls close it counts watermark or no watermark likewise if it is sent off after the deadline it won't be counted

Another conspiracy

I would of called it a possible theory........but the brainwashed call anything that is not in the mainstream a "conspiracy theory"......take a look at yourselves for god's sake. Why is anything that is not "the official line" or not agreed with by the MSM called a conspiracy theory. Grow up and think for yourself....whether you agree or disagree is immaterial.....but stop trying to belittle people with your put down words aka Conspiracy Theory.

I have never heard anything so stupid regarding watermarks, you seem to believe everything that is posted on the internet, I do have a brain so I do think for myself, but it is a shame that more people do not!

Surely if the democratic party has done nothing wrong they should embrace the legal challenges as these will prove once and for all that Biden was elected in a free and fair election?

Stopping the count of votes until representatives of both parties can be witness to the process, especially in an election as close as this is a perfectly reasonable request.

The question has to be asked why in Philadelphia did it require a judge order to allow republicans onsite to monitor the vote counting from closer than the 100 yards which the Democrat count process team were allowing them?

And who is too blame there, those who were not allowing the rules that both parties agreed to or those who have challenged them on that and had to take a legal route to enforce the other side plays by those rules?

There are so many aspects to these results that need answers, Trump has fought against the machine for 5 years, he's not going to let himself be cheated from a second term at the death.

If the democrats were smart and innocent the best thing they can do is let the legal challenges come. If they've won fairly they've nothing to hide and it will make Trump look like a poor loser.

Its a very big if though...

Surely if the democratic party has done nothing wrong they should embrace the legal challenges as these will prove once and for all that Biden was elected in a free and fair election?

They are & even republican installed judges are throwing the challenges out.

Stopping the count of votes until representatives of both parties can be witness to the process, especially in an election as close as this is a perfectly reasonable request.

Why do they need to stop the count only where trump is winning?

The question has to be asked why in Philadelphia did it require a judge order to allow republicans onsite to monitor the vote counting from closer than the 100 yards which the Democrat count process team were allowing them?

The judge originally told them to figure it out and come back, both sides were too childish to do so.

And who is too blame there, those who were not allowing the rules that both parties agreed to or those who have challenged them on that and had to take a legal route to enforce the other side plays by those rules?

They agreed to & followed the rules until it was looking like they might lose if counting continued then they wanted to move closer, why?

There are so many aspects to these results that need answers, Trump has fought against the machine for 5 years, he's not going to let himself be cheated from a second term at the death.

Everyone but trump's family & very closest friends are distancing themselves from him, why?

If the democrats were smart and innocent the best thing they can do is let the legal challenges come. If they've won fairly they've nothing to hide and it will make Trump look like a poor loser.

They have & he does, even the real fox news reporters are saying so.

Its a very big if though...

Not really

If Cardiff were winning 4 - o with 20 minutes to play and the other team decided to stop the game until tomorrow and the following day you found out you were 5 - 4 down with 20 minutes still to play as these mysterious goals had just appeared would you accept it?

If Cardiff were winning 4 - o with 20 minutes to play and the other team decided to stop the game until tomorrow and the following day you found out you were 5 - 4 down with 20 minutes still to play as these mysterious goals had just appeared would you accept it?

What the f**k are you talking about? I've seen some crazy shit on here lately but that was probably the craziest.

Surely if the democratic party has done nothing wrong they should embrace the legal challenges as these will prove once and for all that Biden was elected in a free and fair election?

Stopping the count of votes until representatives of both parties can be witness to the process, especially in an election as close as this is a perfectly reasonable request.

The question has to be asked why in Philadelphia did it require a judge order to allow republicans onsite to monitor the vote counting from closer than the 100 yards which the Democrat count process team were allowing them?

And who is too blame there, those who were not allowing the rules that both parties agreed to or those who have challenged them on that and had to take a legal route to enforce the other side plays by those rules?

There are so many aspects to these results that need answers, Trump has fought against the machine for 5 years, he's not going to let himself be cheated from a second term at the death.

If the democrats were smart and innocent the best thing they can do is let the legal challenges come. If they've won fairly they've nothing to hide and it will make Trump look like a poor loser.

Its a very big if though...

The problem with focusing so much on that issue is that Pennsylvania is likely to be completely irrelevant as Biden is on course to win every undeclared state apart from North Carolina. He could lose Pennsylvania and still comfortably reach 270.

I haven't seen much substance in any claims of fraud in Nevada, Georgia and Arizona so any meaningful legal challenge is going to be something along the lines of 'mail in votes are known to be fraudulent'. If there is anything meaningful that comes up I'm sure it will be investigated but at the moment Trump is just throwing out shit to see what sticks.