M4 Relief road cancelled

How is it possible that one person, elected with 11,000 votes can alone make such a critical decision impacting so many?

Because its the Welsh gvmnt we are talking about the ones that look after themselves and not the country
The idiot as seen 44m wasted on enquiry that was not required because he already knew it wouldn't be funded and now he's setting up a commission into the problems of traffic congestion on m4 and look into carbon friendly public transport ? Couldn't make it up....

Hmmmm,some of us remember when the M25 was touted as the answer to London's traffic congestion. Not guaranteed to fix the problem and to date no businesses had signed to help with the cost.That would be left to the WAG to levy the cost on us with their new tax raising powers.Too many glib comments.

You think the M25 was a waste, that's your argument??

I dread to think of London without the M25.

Having used that very road this Monday morning, I tend to agree. It was slow (8am) but still a lot better than the stationery traffic on the roads I could see overhead

Glib comments are ones like snaggy's, who cannot see the bigger picture for Wales as a whole. Newport is an environmental and topographical bottle neck that needs to be remedied

I agree something needs to be done,but not at the environmental cost or without those that will benefit most contributing something.And WP I don't think the M25 was a waste at all.it makes a great car-park.How's that for a glib comment.

What's the environmental cost? Same as they said about Cardiff bay Except that the disaster they predicted didn't happen in fact it's well documented that wildlife as thrived a mile away since it was built? Wildlife got great habit of adapting if care is taken to minimise effects.. pollution wise whats worse thousands of cars stuck in traffic jams every day or thousands of cars moving it's a simple choice but reality! What is not an option is doing nothing Which environmentalists prefer

Its a well documented fact that the more roads you build the more cars you get, that's why I used the M25 example.It solved nothing.The other thing nobody seems to have mentioned is we would, as a nation, have to borrow heavily to fund this project.Who would pay?

its also pretty well documented by thousands and thousands of drivers that the M4 { the road in question } runs much better where the road has been made 3 lanes either side of this bottleneck....and yep money gets borrowed by every country in the world to build essential infrastructure .
the M25 example has to be a joke..? if it hasn't solved anything why haven't they closed it. all that money pointlessly spent on its upkeep.. infact why not close all the motorways ?

Hmmmm,some of us remember when the M25 was touted as the answer to London's traffic congestion. Not guaranteed to fix the problem and to date no businesses had signed to help with the cost.That would be left to the WAG to levy the cost on us with their new tax raising powers.Too many glib comments.

You think the M25 was a waste, that's your argument??

I dread to think of London without the M25.

Having used that very road this Monday morning, I tend to agree. It was slow (8am) but still a lot better than the stationery traffic on the roads I could see overhead

Glib comments are ones like snaggy's, who cannot see the bigger picture for Wales as a whole. Newport is an environmental and topographical bottle neck that needs to be remedied

I agree something needs to be done,but not at the environmental cost or without those that will benefit most contributing something.And WP I don't think the M25 was a waste at all.it makes a great car-park.How's that for a glib comment.

You caused others of glib comments, yet yours was the most fitting to be called that. You know me, I'll either agree or not and state it accordingly

Hmmmm,some of us remember when the M25 was touted as the answer to London's traffic congestion. Not guaranteed to fix the problem and to date no businesses had signed to help with the cost.That would be left to the WAG to levy the cost on us with their new tax raising powers.Too many glib comments.

You think the M25 was a waste, that's your argument??

I dread to think of London without the M25.

Having used that very road this Monday morning, I tend to agree. It was slow (8am) but still a lot better than the stationery traffic on the roads I could see overhead

Glib comments are ones like snaggy's, who cannot see the bigger picture for Wales as a whole. Newport is an environmental and topographical bottle neck that needs to be remedied

I agree something needs to be done,but not at the environmental cost or without those that will benefit most contributing something.And WP I don't think the M25 was a waste at all.it makes a great car-park.How's that for a glib comment.

What's the environmental cost? Same as they said about Cardiff bay Except that the disaster they predicted didn't happen in fact it's well documented that wildlife as thrived a mile away since it was built? Wildlife got great habit of adapting if care is taken to minimise effects.. pollution wise whats worse thousands of cars stuck in traffic jams every day or thousands of cars moving it's a simple choice but reality! What is not an option is doing nothing Which environmentalists prefer

Its a well documented fact that the more roads you build the more cars you get, that's why I used the M25 example.It solved nothing.The other thing nobody seems to have mentioned is we would, as a nation, have to borrow heavily to fund this project.Who would pay?

its also pretty well documented by thousands and thousands of drivers that the M4 { the road in question } runs much better where the road has been made 3 lanes either side of this bottleneck....and yep money gets borrowed by every country in the world to build essential infrastructure .
the M25 example has to be a joke..? if it hasn't solved anything why haven't they closed it. all that money pointlessly spent on its upkeep.. infact why not close all the motorways ?

The m25 was built to let vehicles go around London and not through it? The m4 relief rd as same idea go around Newports bottleneck which is essential as everyone knows ? Well almost everyone...... we were supposed to have same for cdf but it was shelved when got to the bay and funnily enough the dead end was completed 2yrs ago only 20yrs late so only rovr way to tredegar park to complete?

Last edited by pembroke allan on Tue Jun 04, 2019 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Hmmmm,some of us remember when the M25 was touted as the answer to London's traffic congestion. Not guaranteed to fix the problem and to date no businesses had signed to help with the cost.That would be left to the WAG to levy the cost on us with their new tax raising powers.Too many glib comments.

You think the M25 was a waste, that's your argument??

I dread to think of London without the M25.

Having used that very road this Monday morning, I tend to agree. It was slow (8am) but still a lot better than the stationery traffic on the roads I could see overhead

Glib comments are ones like snaggy's, who cannot see the bigger picture for Wales as a whole. Newport is an environmental and topographical bottle neck that needs to be remedied

I agree something needs to be done,but not at the environmental cost or without those that will benefit most contributing something.And WP I don't think the M25 was a waste at all.it makes a great car-park.How's that for a glib comment.

What's the environmental cost? Same as they said about Cardiff bay Except that the disaster they predicted didn't happen in fact it's well documented that wildlife as thrived a mile away since it was built? Wildlife got great habit of adapting if care is taken to minimise effects.. pollution wise whats worse thousands of cars stuck in traffic jams every day or thousands of cars moving it's a simple choice but reality! What is not an option is doing nothing Which environmentalists prefer

Just for the record - the wildlife didn't move one mile away, some of the more adaptable species moved to the Gwent Levels some 15 or so miles away to the very sites which were at threat from this road. One of the big problems with the route proposed was that it would pass through a unique habitat where the effect of it being destroyed could not be minimized. Not passing judgement here but please try and get the facts right...

Hmmmm,some of us remember when the M25 was touted as the answer to London's traffic congestion. Not guaranteed to fix the problem and to date no businesses had signed to help with the cost.That would be left to the WAG to levy the cost on us with their new tax raising powers.Too many glib comments.

You think the M25 was a waste, that's your argument??

I dread to think of London without the M25.

Having used that very road this Monday morning, I tend to agree. It was slow (8am) but still a lot better than the stationery traffic on the roads I could see overhead

Glib comments are ones like snaggy's, who cannot see the bigger picture for Wales as a whole. Newport is an environmental and topographical bottle neck that needs to be remedied

I agree something needs to be done,but not at the environmental cost or without those that will benefit most contributing something.And WP I don't think the M25 was a waste at all.it makes a great car-park.How's that for a glib comment.

What's the environmental cost? Same as they said about Cardiff bay Except that the disaster they predicted didn't happen in fact it's well documented that wildlife as thrived a mile away since it was built? Wildlife got great habit of adapting if care is taken to minimise effects.. pollution wise whats worse thousands of cars stuck in traffic jams every day or thousands of cars moving it's a simple choice but reality! What is not an option is doing nothing Which environmentalists prefer

Just for the record - the wildlife didn't move one mile away, some of the more adaptable species moved to the Gwent Levels some 15 or so miles away to the very sites which were at threat from this road. One of the big problems with the route proposed was that it would pass through a unique habitat where the effect of it being destroyed could not be minimized. Not passing judgement here but please try and get the facts right...

Also went to mud flats on rover way/wentloog how far is that from bay? Point is wildlife adapts doesnt it or wouldn't get pedigree Falcons in centre of London? But take point about route but that begs question why go somewhere where it would cause most problems? Someone didn't want rd built bit like Brexit put in an insurmountable situation and hey presto doesnt happen....

Hmmmm,some of us remember when the M25 was touted as the answer to London's traffic congestion. Not guaranteed to fix the problem and to date no businesses had signed to help with the cost.That would be left to the WAG to levy the cost on us with their new tax raising powers.Too many glib comments.

You think the M25 was a waste, that's your argument??

I dread to think of London without the M25.

Having used that very road this Monday morning, I tend to agree. It was slow (8am) but still a lot better than the stationery traffic on the roads I could see overhead

Glib comments are ones like snaggy's, who cannot see the bigger picture for Wales as a whole. Newport is an environmental and topographical bottle neck that needs to be remedied

I agree something needs to be done,but not at the environmental cost or without those that will benefit most contributing something.And WP I don't think the M25 was a waste at all.it makes a great car-park.How's that for a glib comment.

What's the environmental cost? Same as they said about Cardiff bay Except that the disaster they predicted didn't happen in fact it's well documented that wildlife as thrived a mile away since it was built? Wildlife got great habit of adapting if care is taken to minimise effects.. pollution wise whats worse thousands of cars stuck in traffic jams every day or thousands of cars moving it's a simple choice but reality! What is not an option is doing nothing Which environmentalists prefer

Just for the record - the wildlife didn't move one mile away, some of the more adaptable species moved to the Gwent Levels some 15 or so miles away to the very sites which were at threat from this road. One of the big problems with the route proposed was that it would pass through a unique habitat where the effect of it being destroyed could not be minimized. Not passing judgement here but please try and get the facts right...

Also went to mud flats on rover way/wentloog how far is that from bay? Point is wildlife adapts doesnt it or wouldn't get pedigree Falcons in centre of London? But take point about route but that begs question why go somewhere where it would cause most problems? Someone didn't want rd built bit like Brexit put in an insurmountable situation and hey presto doesnt happen....

Can Drakeford see the queues from his train window

It took me just aslong to get from Tredegar Park to the Severn Bridge as it did to get from the Severn Bridge to Exeter the other day.

Not right thar and certainly not a one off.

It took me just aslong to get from Tredegar Park to the Severn Bridge as it did to get from the Severn Bridge to Exeter the other day.

Not right thar and certainly not a one off.

Don't worry hes putting a commission together to look at reasons for problem? His idea is to put the money into low carbon public transport the thing that is doomed to failure !

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

Drakeford has been an idiot throughout his time at the Bay. He presided over things like the NHS in Wales and the ambulance service and failed miserably. He has been rewarded for failure. Only half a million or so people voted for this shambles in the first place, so I guess a lot of the blame can be put on people like me who could'nt be bothered to vote. If I remember correctly, if another 6000 of us had bothered to vote against having a Welsh Assembley, this waste of mmoney would never have come into existence.

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

So what's alternative? The consensus is public transport spend 1 billion on it but that is a stupid idea when you consider that large percentage of people driving through Newport m4 actually go beyond there to London west country Midlands how the fck do you cater for them on public transport ? Trains mmmm would have to increase service massively with more tracks as for buses how many would you need to encourage people to use it do get to work ect on time in Bristol and beyond... so can anyone think of what to do to ease jamlog that is brynglas tunnels? Or do we just say think of environment do nothing and choke on the traffic jam fumes that's excellent for
environment

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

so you have a public enquiry that finds reasons for having a relief road are compelling. then ignore it..
in that case it should not be no road we need to find another solution ...it should be no road because we have found another solution ..christ they have had enough time to come up with this magical sustainable alternative surely ? or is there none..

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

so you have a public enquiry that finds reasons for having a relief road are compelling. then ignore it..
in that case it should not be no road we need to find another solution ...it should be no road because we have found another solution ..christ they have had enough time to come up with this magical sustainable alternative surely ? or is there none..

There's always another way bro.

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

so you have a public enquiry that finds reasons for having a relief road are compelling. then ignore it..
in that case it should not be no road we need to find another solution ...it should be no road because we have found another solution ..christ they have had enough time to come up with this magical sustainable alternative surely ? or is there none..

There's always another way bro.

Is there Name it? Because only suggestion from him is a commission to take look at reasons for traffic problems? Ffs spent 44m on inquiry to establish the problem and he rejected what they said.

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

so you have a public enquiry that finds reasons for having a relief road are compelling. then ignore it..
in that case it should not be no road we need to find another solution ...it should be no road because we have found another solution ..christ they have had enough time to come up with this magical sustainable alternative surely ? or is there none..

There's always another way bro.

clearly....the USS enterprise beaming cars from tredegar park to the severn bridge maybe..

I was long in favour of building the relief road, but on reflection I think Drakeford reached the correct conclusion. Definitely way too much money for just 14 miles of motorway. Also, and I'm not a tree hugger, but I think the environmental costs would be too high a price to pay. We need to find a better, more sustainable solution for the long term.
And for those who say let's get rid of the Welsh government because you don't like the decision or don't like Labour, I say let's get rid of Westminster because they've made bigger f**k ups. Brexit for one.

so you have a public enquiry that finds reasons for having a relief road are compelling. then ignore it..
in that case it should not be no road we need to find another solution ...it should be no road because we have found another solution ..christ they have had enough time to come up with this magical sustainable alternative surely ? or is there none..

There's always another way bro.

clearly....the USS enterprise beaming cars from tredegar park to the severn bridge maybe..

Ahhh don't say that wag may hold public
inquiry to see if it's possible!

Yep, second referendum for me. This Welsh Govt has been stuffed with cretins from day one.
Drakeford is just the latest of them. Only in Labour Wales can a social worker run the place(or not, as is the case).

They have to go.

A fuckin joker.

Callaghan Mark 2.

Remver him saying that Wales doesn't need a motorway!!!

He's put our economy back years.
The same labour councils that sell off land to build industrial estates and houses with no public transport access or even fuckin cycle paths and showers!!!

The trains are full
The jobs aren't by stations
Public transport not flexible enough

Who pays for this,,

Us as b*stard usual.

I work in the environmental industry, and
The gwent levels damage is minimal to us destroying our world when you take the destruction of the amazon,
The African jungle and the indonesion
Rainforest.

No joined up thinking,, as usual.

Yep, second referendum for me. This Welsh Govt has been stuffed with cretins from day one.
Drakeford is just the latest of them. Only in Labour Wales can a social worker run the place(or not, as is the case).

They have to go.

YES was shoved down our throats in the original referendum. and still only just crawled over the line..

first proposed in 1991.
are they real.

I wish there was a campaign for a 2nd assembly referendum

Why, so England can run us cuck?

As you have pointed out, the decision goes back pre Assembly and to a Tory Gov in Westminster.

Also, you absolute pleb, it was the Welsh Labour Government who made the decision. Had you bothered to watch proceedings in the Assembly, you would have seen the majority of AMs going mad at this decision.

You understand the difference between a legislature and executive? You understand the difference between a country and an English county? Cos that’s what you’d relegate Wales to.

Look at it logically the arguement against? Wildlife ect would be a destroyed with the bay what happened wildlife moved 1mile away and is thriving ! Gwent levels same will happen nature as habit of adapting.... alternative public transport what planet are people on to think public transport can transport all the goods all the people from south east Wales that use m4 Its cloud cookoo land to think you can use public transport to cut congestion! Wag is a useless waste of money who undoubtedly will now give themselves a pat on back for wasting £44m of our money knowing they would not build rd before they even started public inquiry..

I noted there was a candidate in the Newport West by election who stood on the ticket of Abolish the Welsh Assembly ". He didn't do very well but a pretty crowded Westminster By election probably wasn't the time or place. I know from my in laws in mid wales they'd be right behind that. So are the people pissed off enough to actually vote for them or are those pissed off, too apathetic to vote anyway. Just under 2 years to the next election.

I think we should go whole hog tbh. If we are going to abolish our national parliament (because of a decision made by the government ), we should just give up as a nation.

Giving power back to unelected officials in London would, and should, be the death of us.

Let’s just have a referendum on the nation itself. So the National Assembly yes, but also the national sports teams too. How does that sound? We can’t pick and choose as far as I’m concerned. We either have spines, or we cut them out

first proposed in 1991.
are they real.

I wish there was a campaign for a 2nd assembly referendum

Why, so England can run us cuck?

As you have pointed out, the decision goes back pre Assembly and to a Tory Gov in Westminster.

Also, you absolute pleb, it was the Welsh Labour Government who made the decision. Had you bothered to watch proceedings in the Assembly, you would have seen the majority of AMs going mad at this decision.

You understand the difference between a legislature and executive? You understand the difference between a country and an English county? Cos that’s what you’d relegate Wales to.

It's been put forward 4 times from 91 so really doesnt matter who cancelled it it still bad decision especially as no plan b c or d in place? Besides it shows how pathetic wag is to allow one moron to decide such a massive decision?

Yep, second referendum for me. This Welsh Govt has been stuffed with cretins from day one.
Drakeford is just the latest of them. Only in Labour Wales can a social worker run the place(or not, as is the case).

They have to go.

I think we should go whole hog tbh. If we are going to abolish our national parliament (because of a decision made by the government ), we should just give up as a nation.

Giving power back to unelected officials in London would, and should, be the death of us.

Let’s just have a referendum on the nation itself. So the National Assembly yes, but also the national sports teams too. How does that sound? We can’t pick and choose as far as I’m concerned. We either have spines, or we cut them out

first proposed in 1991.
are they real.

I wish there was a campaign for a 2nd assembly referendum

Why, so England can run us cuck?

As you have pointed out, the decision goes back pre Assembly and to a Tory Gov in Westminster.

Also, you absolute pleb, it was the Welsh Labour Government who made the decision. Had you bothered to watch proceedings in the Assembly, you would have seen the majority of AMs going mad at this decision.

You understand the difference between a legislature and executive? You understand the difference between a country and an English county? Cos that’s what you’d relegate Wales to.

we were an English county before we had the WAG ?

and the west minster government did not make the decision...it was made today ..you do know the difference between a proposal and a decision do you not ?.

Yep, second referendum for me. This Welsh Govt has been stuffed with cretins from day one.
Drakeford is just the latest of them. Only in Labour Wales can a social worker run the place(or not, as is the case).

They have to go.

I think we should go whole hog tbh. If we are going to abolish our national parliament (because of a decision made by the government ), we should just give up as a nation.

Giving power back to unelected officials in London would, and should, be the death of us.

Let’s just have a referendum on the nation itself. So the National Assembly yes, but also the national sports teams too. How does that sound? We can’t pick and choose as far as I’m concerned. We either have spines, or we cut them out

being Welsh is something inside you...you can not be more or less Welsh by having a WAG or a football team even. its part of you...its totally impossible for me to feel more Welsh than I already do whether governed by Westminster or the beauts..

if you dont feel it no amount of legislation is going to make you feel it ..
the spines thing..very dramatic..too much TV

Yep, second referendum for me. This Welsh Govt has been stuffed with cretins from day one.
Drakeford is just the latest of them. Only in Labour Wales can a social worker run the place(or not, as is the case).

They have to go.

I think we should go whole hog tbh. If we are going to abolish our national parliament (because of a decision made by the government ), we should just give up as a nation.

Giving power back to unelected officials in London would, and should, be the death of us.

Let’s just have a referendum on the nation itself. So the National Assembly yes, but also the national sports teams too. How does that sound? We can’t pick and choose as far as I’m concerned. We either have spines, or we cut them out

Unelected officials in London ???
Think you’ll find the unelected officials are in Brussels.

Yep, second referendum for me. This Welsh Govt has been stuffed with cretins from day one.
Drakeford is just the latest of them. Only in Labour Wales can a social worker run the place(or not, as is the case).

They have to go.

I think we should go whole hog tbh. If we are going to abolish our national parliament (because of a decision made by the government ), we should just give up as a nation.

Giving power back to unelected officials in London would, and should, be the death of us.

Let’s just have a referendum on the nation itself. So the National Assembly yes, but also the national sports teams too. How does that sound? We can’t pick and choose as far as I’m concerned. We either have spines, or we cut them out

Unelected officials in London ???
Think you’ll find the unelected officials are in Brussels.

I have absolutely no doubt this crucial bit of infrastructure would have been started in the 90's if the Tories hadn't lost the 97 election. Labour inherited a booming economy and achieved next to f**k all with it.

Its official 1st minister is a numpty? The commission will look at causes of congestion and will look at the 28 different ways to eliviate the problems! So we will spend x amount of millions looking at problem and will come up with the idea of a relief rd around Newport!