Labour now do a U-turn on Welfare!!!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/resentful-taxpayers-prompt-labour-to-get-tough-on-benefits-8563574.html

Public support shows that Labour are 'out of touch!!!!!'

The public believe the deficit is falling.

The public believe that the majority of the cuts have already happened.

The public also believed, when asked, that social security should increase y the rate of inflation rather than 1%. Inflation being nearly 3%.

Many of the so called cuts will result in massive increases on the social security budget.


Oh and if we're going by public support I'd say that you're credibility in Merthyr or this forum is at far lower level's than Labour's at the moment.

That would be interesting to see. Have you done a recent opinion poll..?

No, and unfortunately the Merthyr council website won't load for me at the moment so I can't fetch your Councillor election results.

So are you saying that your meaning of recent is polling from 12 months ago..? Jesus, dont apply to be a political researcher mate FFS!!!

Oh I'm sorry, have you done anything in the last 12 months that would increase you popularity within Methyr?

I was under the impression that all you had done this then was publish "sick" jokes about cockle pickers, receive a three year ban from office and "allegedly" threaten to send some associates around to some tenants. Do you believe that would have improved your reputation within the Merthyr area?

How about leading a group of over 1,100 residents in rallying a call for a local chairty to publish their books as there are serious claims that financial issues that need to be looked into. 'if' these claims are correct then it would mean that the taxpayers of Merthyr and the children of Merthyr have been..... lets just say mislead as to where their money actually went.

My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms

yeah. and i bet most of them are politicians, 2nd morgages. a gardener for the 2nd home. politics, is a job for the boys, gravy train etc, and they wonder why people dont vote, i used to be a labour voter, for the working man. thats all gone now, i dont bother voting no more theres no point. new labour. is conservative. a case of. as long as im alright jack. wheres my 2 fingers smiley

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.

its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians

I do not support any political party, but how on earth are these benefit reforms fair?

because working people should have more income than non-working people!!!!

What you really mean is: 'Every person in work should earn more than every person who isn't in work'

I don't necessarily disagree.

The problem I have with the way the Tories are targetting the Welfare system is that it is pretty clear that children are going to be ones that suffer. Wayne and Waynetta's benefits decrease, they still buy their fags, shitrag magazine and have every channel on sky, the kids just miss a meal to pay for it.

Well if means that the Wayne and Waynettas of this world think twice of having kids because of the affordability of it all.

So basically you're saying "The poor should not have children"...?

No basically Im saying that people should understand that the state shouldn't be bailing out people who dont think about the financial aspect of having children. Its called 'taking personal responsibility'

My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms

Being self employed I wish somebody could show me how not to pay the amount of tax I pay every year

My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms

yeah. and i bet most of them are politicians, 2nd morgages. a gardener for the 2nd home. politics, is a job for the boys, gravy train etc, and they wonder why people dont vote, i used to be a labour voter, for the working man. thats all gone now, i dont bother voting no more theres no point. new labour. is conservative. a case of. as long as im alright jack. wheres my 2 fingers smiley

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.

its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians

Not really,you gone in to register a vote and you didn't like any of the chioces. People died for the right to vote and if it was up to me I'd go the Australian way of fine people a couple of hundred quid who dont vote (think of how much that could raise for the country) as long as there's a 'none of the above' box.

I do not support any political party, but how on earth are these benefit reforms fair?

because working people should have more income than non-working people!!!!

What you really mean is: 'Every person in work should earn more than every person who isn't in work'

I don't necessarily disagree.

The problem I have with the way the Tories are targetting the Welfare system is that it is pretty clear that children are going to be ones that suffer. Wayne and Waynetta's benefits decrease, they still buy their fags, shitrag magazine and have every channel on sky, the kids just miss a meal to pay for it.

Well if means that the Wayne and Waynettas of this world think twice of having kids because of the affordability of it all.

...say it. Its worth a generation of kids living in poverty, go on say it...And they won't think twice anyway (see AFRICA..)

I do not support any political party, but how on earth are these benefit reforms fair?

because working people should have more income than non-working people!!!!

What you really mean is: 'Every person in work should earn more than every person who isn't in work'

I don't necessarily disagree.

The problem I have with the way the Tories are targetting the Welfare system is that it is pretty clear that children are going to be ones that suffer. Wayne and Waynetta's benefits decrease, they still buy their fags, shitrag magazine and have every channel on sky, the kids just miss a meal to pay for it.

People like that should not be allowed kids.

My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms

yeah. and i bet most of them are politicians, 2nd morgages. a gardener for the 2nd home. politics, is a job for the boys, gravy train etc, and they wonder why people dont vote, i used to be a labour voter, for the working man. thats all gone now, i dont bother voting no more theres no point. new labour. is conservative. a case of. as long as im alright jack. wheres my 2 fingers smiley

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.

its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians

Not really,you gone in to register a vote and you didn't like any of the chioces. People died for the right to vote and if it was up to me I'd go the Australian way of fine people a couple of hundred quid who dont vote (think of how much that could raise for the country) as long as there's a 'none of the above' box.

Don't you see the irony in saying that people died for the right to vote yet you're advocating denying them the right to choose not to vote?

My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms

yeah. and i bet most of them are politicians, 2nd morgages. a gardener for the 2nd home. politics, is a job for the boys, gravy train etc, and they wonder why people dont vote, i used to be a labour voter, for the working man. thats all gone now, i dont bother voting no more theres no point. new labour. is conservative. a case of. as long as im alright jack. wheres my 2 fingers smiley

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.

its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians

Not really,you gone in to register a vote and you didn't like any of the chioces. People died for the right to vote and if it was up to me I'd go the Australian way of fine people a couple of hundred quid who dont vote (think of how much that could raise for the country) as long as there's a 'none of the above' box.

Don't you see the irony in saying that people died for the right to vote yet you're advocating denying them the right to choose not to vote?

By having a 'none of the above box' means that they dont have to vote for anyone.

[quote="splottbluebird48"My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms/quote]
yeah. and i bet most of them are politicians, 2nd morgages. a gardener for the 2nd home. politics, is a job for the boys, gravy train etc, and they wonder why people dont vote, i used to be a labour voter, for the working man. thats all gone now, i dont bother voting no more theres no point. new labour. is conservative. a case of. as long as im alright jack. wheres my 2 fingers smiley [/quote]

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.[/quote]
its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians [/quote]

Not really,you gone in to register a vote and you didn't like any of the chioces. People died for the right to vote and if it was up to me I'd go the Australian way of fine people a couple of hundred quid who dont vote (think of how much that could raise for the country) as long as there's a 'none of the above' box.[/quote]

Don't you see the irony in saying that people died for the right to vote yet you're advocating denying them the right to choose not to vote?[/quote]

By having a 'none of the above box' means that they dont have to vote for anyone.[/quote]

I agree with the principle of people spoiling their ballot rather than not voting but I'd feel voting would lose a little bit of its legitimacy if it was a legal requirement.

My understanding is there is more tax evasion than benefit fraud in money terms

yeah. and i bet most of them are politicians, 2nd morgages. a gardener for the 2nd home. politics, is a job for the boys, gravy train etc, and they wonder why people dont vote, i used to be a labour voter, for the working man. thats all gone now, i dont bother voting no more theres no point. new labour. is conservative. a case of. as long as im alright jack. wheres my 2 fingers smiley

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.

its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians

Not really,you gone in to register a vote and you didn't like any of the chioces. People died for the right to vote and if it was up to me I'd go the Australian way of fine people a couple of hundred quid who dont vote (think of how much that could raise for the country) as long as there's a 'none of the above' box.

but who do i vote for, there manifestos, i dont like, and, its a case of what they say and what they do are 2 different things, i think i will leave polotics to others , and i will take the hit, bring back the monster raving party back

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/resentful-taxpayers-prompt-labour-to-get-tough-on-benefits-8563574.html

Public support shows that Labour are 'out of touch!!!!!'

You mean all politicians are out of touch

I am of the opinion that they should all be got rid of preferably t the gallows.

They have consistently only served themselves their family & mates for many years & not the British public.

Anyone reading them comics like the Daily Mail & Sun have the impression that everyone on benefits is a scrounger & like that evil kent Phillpot & no doubt their are some cheats but not everyone as this incompetant goverment makes out.

Always use your vote mate even if you spoil it because you dont like any of the choices.

its a bit like saying, who do you want to win the prem. man ure. man city or chelsea? i dont care. there all over paid wankers. like politicians [/quote]

Not really,you gone in to register a vote and you didn't like any of the chioces. People died for the right to vote and if it was up to me I'd go the Australian way of fine people a couple of hundred quid who dont vote (think of how much that could raise for the country) as long as there's a 'none of the above' box.[/quote]

Don't you see the irony in saying that people died for the right to vote yet you're advocating denying them the right to choose not to vote?[/quote]

By having a 'none of the above box' means that they dont have to vote for anyone.[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

I agree with the principle of people spoiling their ballot rather than not voting but I'd feel voting would lose a little bit of its legitimacy if it was a legal requirement.[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

Surely you would have more legitimacy if you had a 'none of the above' box.Believe it or not the amount of people Ive spoken to over the years and said 'I forgot it was voting day' is unbelievable so in fact if you made it a legal requirement it would make the result more legit as you wouldn't have the people who forgot anymore.

Here's the facts

1. The 3 main parties now are basically the same. Yes I said it because its true. They may be 3 different brands but when it comes down to it they're all the same drink just repackaged. Coca Coca, Diet Coke and Cherry Coke.

2. Any attempt to cut tax evasion is not for the good of the people but to increase the total pot that the government and bankers can slice a percentage off the top from. The government dont want you being charitable directly to the cause because it makes them look weak and not have a purpose. They'd rather take it from you as a tax, distribute as much as they deem necessary and keep the rest for themselves so that they can fund extra houses etc. The government are essentially the router in your network which they want everything to go through to keep on record and operate with. They don't want direct transactions or P2P in networking terms because it keeps them out of the loop. For example, a real world application of this is the police force. If you have a bump you are required by law, even if you both wish to settle it without the insurers, to report the incident to the police. Why? So they can put it on record.

3. Is everyone on benefits a scrounger? No, they most certainly are not but there are plenty who have no desire to work and people who have never worked a day in their lives because the system is too generous or does not filter these people out. Will the system change for the better? By better, Im sure you agree that the minimum wage should rise, benefits should slightly drop to make employment look more appealing as a life choice. This will never happen. It does not suit a political parties interests to do so because by doing that they do not keep you dependent on them. Keeping you dependant on them means they have a purpose and by having that purpose they can line their own pockets.

Britain is heading towards a plutocratic police state and people are either too stupid or naive to see it happening because of the political rhetoric used in the media as well as the agendas the media have.

Here's the facts

1. The 3 main parties now are basically the same. Yes I said it because its true. They may be 3 different brands but when it comes down to it they're all the same drink just repackaged. Coca Coca, Diet Coke and Cherry Coke.

2. Any attempt to cut tax evasion is not for the good of the people but to increase the total pot that the government and bankers can slice a percentage off the top from. The government dont want you being charitable directly to the cause because it makes them look weak and not have a purpose. They'd rather take it from you as a tax, distribute as much as they deem necessary and keep the rest for themselves so that they can fund extra houses etc. The government are essentially the router in your network which they want everything to go through to keep on record and operate with. They don't want direct transactions or P2P in networking terms because it keeps them out of the loop. For example, a real world application of this is the police force. If you have a bump you are required by law, even if you both wish to settle it without the insurers, to report the incident to the police. Why? So they can put it on record.

3. Is everyone on benefits a scrounger? No, they most certainly are not but there are plenty who have no desire to work and people who have never worked a day in their lives because the system is too generous or does not filter these people out. Will the system change for the better? By better, Im sure you agree that the minimum wage should rise, benefits should slightly drop to make employment look more appealing as a life choice. This will never happen. It does not suit a political parties interests to do so because by doing that they do not keep you dependent on them. Keeping you dependant on them means they have a purpose and by having that purpose they can line their own pockets.

Britain is heading towards a plutocratic police state and people are either too stupid or naive to see it happening because of the political rhetoric used in the media as well as the agendas the media have.

Its the truth and you know it.

Its the truth and you know it.

Oh yes.


Cutting the tax evasion of millionaires is really bad for the people. Far better to let them leave trillions of pounds offshore in tax havens where none of us plebs can get to it. Money is bad for the poor everyone knows that.

I do agree on minimum wage being increased and that the three are getting too similar for my liking. Still, would take a majority /coalition Labour/Lib Dems government than Torys.

Its the truth and you know it.

Oh yes.


Cutting the tax evasion of millionaires is really bad for the people. Far better to let them leave trillions of pounds offshore in tax havens where none of us plebs can get to it. Money is bad for the poor everyone knows that.

I do agree on minimum wage being increased and that the three are getting too similar for my liking. Still, would take a majority /coalition Labour/Lib Dems government than Torys.

When Labour were in power the higher tax rate was 40% it was pushed up to 50% when this government first come in but seeing that the income was pushing money out of the country they are now cutting it to 45%. It is still 5% higher than what Labour had in place yet you never hear that from Balls and Miliband!!!

Cutting the tax evasion of millionaires is really bad for the people. Far better to let them leave trillions of pounds offshore in tax havens where none of us plebs can get to it. Money is bad for the poor everyone knows that.

You really didn't read it properly did you? The money that comes in from tax evasion wont go to the people. They will still profess cuts need to be made whilst slicing a percentage off the top of that money generated for themselves.

Also, what happens when you try and push too hard with tax evasion? Oh right thats it companies leave British shores, people are out of jobs, we have to pay import taxes and duties on these items because the company has decided to set up in a country where labour is cheaper and the regulations are less strict on tax.

So you get;

more unemployment because companies have left Britain
you get higher cost of goods i.e. inflated prices due to import costs
you get a country dependent on other nations as its not producing enough of its own
you get people not wanting to want to set up business in the UK due to strict tax regulations

I for example will be setting up business abroad after university.

1. cheaper property rental and cheaper bills i.e. less overheads
2. I can still charge international rates online whilst serving the local people at a rate that suits them because my profession allows me to do that
3. I can pay less to professionals in those countries and even if i pay them more than the norm in that country they will be loving it because they'd be deemed as well off in that country
4. Less tax and restrictions

You force companies out and its worse for the people because of less jobs and the cost of goods whilst wages do not increase at the same rate. Great idea.

Its the truth and you know it.

Oh yes.


Cutting the tax evasion of millionaires is really bad for the people. Far better to let them leave trillions of pounds offshore in tax havens where none of us plebs can get to it. Money is bad for the poor everyone knows that.

I do agree on minimum wage being increased and that the three are getting too similar for my liking. Still, would take a majority /coalition Labour/Lib Dems government than Torys.

When Labour were in power the higher tax rate was 40% it was pushed up to 50% when this government first come in but seeing that the income was pushing money out of the country they are now cutting it to 45%. It is still 5% higher than what Labour had in place yet you never hear that from Balls and Miliband!!!

Labour raised it to 50% just before they left power although realistically that was just a political trap for the Tories.

It's still irresponsible to lower the highest rate of tax when they're cutting support for low income families. Especially when anyone that hated paying 50% will have sorted their finances to a lower rate country and definitely won't be tempted back by a 5% reduction.

Its the truth and you know it.

Oh yes.


Cutting the tax evasion of millionaires is really bad for the people. Far better to let them leave trillions of pounds offshore in tax havens where none of us plebs can get to it. Money is bad for the poor everyone knows that.

I do agree on minimum wage being increased and that the three are getting too similar for my liking. Still, would take a majority /coalition Labour/Lib Dems government than Torys.

When Labour were in power the higher tax rate was 40% it was pushed up to 50% when this government first come in but seeing that the income was pushing money out of the country they are now cutting it to 45%. It is still 5% higher than what Labour had in place yet you never hear that from Balls and Miliband!!!

Labour raised it to 50% just before they left power although realistically that was just a political trap for the Tories.

It's still irresponsible to lower the highest rate of tax when they're cutting support for low income families. Especially when anyone that hated paying 50% will have sorted their finances to a lower rate country and definitely won't be tempted back by a 5% reduction.

I apologise for being 3 weeks out as the 50% tax bracket was brought in by Labour 3 weeks before the 2010 election which to some could be seen as electioneering especially when they had the 40% tax bracket as the top rate for many of their 13 years in power.

The wealthy are the job creators and without them the country would be in a far worse state I can assure you and this government are chasing tax evaders far more aggesively than any other government before them.

The wealthy are the job creators and without them the country would be in a far worse state I can assure you and this government are chasing tax evaders far more aggesively than any other government before them.

They need to be. Almost their first action taken after the election was to let vodafone off a £6 billion tax bill. At the same time they admitted they had undercharged millions of us 'plebs' and would be clawing every penny of that back.

The wealthy are also the biggest hoarders of money and this country would be far better off if we stopped giving tax cuts to people who aren't going to put that money back into the economy.

Cutting the tax evasion of millionaires is really bad for the people. Far better to let them leave trillions of pounds offshore in tax havens where none of us plebs can get to it. Money is bad for the poor everyone knows that.

You really didn't read it properly did you? The money that comes in from tax evasion wont go to the people. They will still profess cuts need to be made whilst slicing a percentage off the top of that money generated for themselves.

Also, what happens when you try and push too hard with tax evasion? Oh right thats it companies leave British shores, people are out of jobs, we have to pay import taxes and duties on these items because the company has decided to set up in a country where labour is cheaper and the regulations are less strict on tax.

So you get;

more unemployment because companies have left Britain
you get higher cost of goods i.e. inflated prices due to import costs
you get a country dependent on other nations as its not producing enough of its own
you get people not wanting to want to set up business in the UK due to strict tax regulations

I for example will be setting up business abroad after university.

1. cheaper property rental and cheaper bills i.e. less overheads
2. I can still charge international rates online whilst serving the local people at a rate that suits them because my profession allows me to do that
3. I can pay less to professionals in those countries and even if i pay them more than the norm in that country they will be loving it because they'd be deemed as well off in that country
4. Less tax and restrictions

You force companies out and its worse for the people because of less jobs and the cost of goods whilst wages do not increase at the same rate. Great idea.

Tbf you are going to ace your first year business studies module.

You force companies out and its worse for the people because of less jobs and the cost of goods whilst wages do not increase at the same rate. Great idea.

So your answer to creating a fair/balanced economy is to squeeze the poor (because you can) and pander to the rich (because 'you have to'). Try here ...http://www.conservatives.com/Get_involved/Join.aspx

I agree that you shouldn't be rewarded by not working. However, this tori government has demonized everybody on the welfare system and has made everybody on welfare less off. This is not fair. Some people are on welfare because they are actually too ill to work, some people want to work but simply can't find a job.

So what do the tories do, cut support for the people in society who need it most whilst the richest people in Britain are becoming more well off.

The lower class and people on welfare are paying for the mess the bankers created and that is simply not fair. Here is an article I found a very good read about the cuts:

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/com ... %3A%22news.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/resentful-taxpayers-prompt-labour-to-get-tough-on-benefits-8563574.html

Public support shows that Labour are 'out of touch!!!!!'

more u turns than you brownie

People knew the benefits of getting a education that would get a career like politicians. Don't start moaning now. My father paid 90k corporation tax last year and is a small business. People have the cheek to say tax everyone apart from themselves. Equality is not taxing the rich more. That's greed talking. People would vote for a convicted pedophile if he said he'd take 1p off your weekly shopping. We live in the most materialistic country in the world.

People knew the benefits of getting a education that would get a career like politicians. Don't start moaning now. My father paid 90k corporation tax last year and is a small business. People have the cheek to say tax everyone apart from themselves. Equality is not taxing the rich more. That's greed talking. People would vote for a convicted pedophile if he said he'd take 1p off your weekly shopping. We live in the most materialistic country in the world.

So you believe everybody should be taxed the same?

People knew the benefits of getting a education that would get a career like politicians. Don't start moaning now. My father paid 90k corporation tax last year and is a small business. People have the cheek to say tax everyone apart from themselves. Equality is not taxing the rich more. That's greed talking. People would vote for a convicted pedophile if he said he'd take 1p off your weekly shopping. We live in the most materialistic country in the world.

Surely your father would be more outraged than most at the George Osbourne/Vodafone 6 billion tax letoff then?

There is long list of worthwhile careers that wont net you a massive wage, you are basically saying to Mrs Bedpan the Nurse to stick her financial troubles where the sun don't shine, afterall she could have worked harder in school and become a lawyer instead.

It isn't just the plebs of society who think rich people should pay more. Warren Buffett is a big supporter of paying what he believes is his share. There was a survey in america that showed that 51% of people in the top 1% of earnings would welcome being taxed more.

People knew the benefits of getting a education

thank god daddy owns a business ey?