Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 16/01/22
Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:04 am
Covid in the UK: Reported cases at lowest level for a month -
The UK has reported another 81,713 coronavirus cases, the lowest daily level seen since 15 December.
The apparent ebbing of the Omicron wave comes as some experts claim the end of the pandemic is in sight for the UK.
However, the number of deaths within 28 days of a test remains high, with 1,843 over the past seven days - a 45% rise from the previous week.
The number of hospital patients with Covid has dropped - though the most recent figures date from Monday.
The 15,698 admitted in the seven days to 10 January represented a slight week-on-week fall.
Prof Julian Hiscox, chairman in infection and global health at the University of Liverpool, told the BBC that we are heading towards a new phase of the pandemic where the virus has a lesser impact on daily life.
"We're almost there, it is now the beginning of the end, at least in the UK. I think life in 2022 will be almost back to before the pandemic," he said.
The UK has reported another 81,713 coronavirus cases, the lowest daily level seen since 15 December.
The apparent ebbing of the Omicron wave comes as some experts claim the end of the pandemic is in sight for the UK.
However, the number of deaths within 28 days of a test remains high, with 1,843 over the past seven days - a 45% rise from the previous week.
The number of hospital patients with Covid has dropped - though the most recent figures date from Monday.
The 15,698 admitted in the seven days to 10 January represented a slight week-on-week fall.
Prof Julian Hiscox, chairman in infection and global health at the University of Liverpool, told the BBC that we are heading towards a new phase of the pandemic where the virus has a lesser impact on daily life.
"We're almost there, it is now the beginning of the end, at least in the UK. I think life in 2022 will be almost back to before the pandemic," he said.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 16/01/22
Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:30 pm
The ONS have helpfully –thanks to a FOI request – published the figures for ‘Covid deaths’ of people in England and Wales without underlying conditions.
These relate to the complete year 2020 and the first three Quarters of 2021 and are by date of registration:
‘Please see below for death registrations for 2020 and 2021 (provisional) that were due to COVID-19 and were recorded without any pre-existing conditions, England and Wales.
2020: 9400 (0-64: 1549 / 65 and over: 7851)
2021 Q1: 6483 (0-64: 1560/ 65 and over: 4923)
2021 Q2: 346 (0-64: 153/ 65 and over: 193)
2021 Q3: 1142 (0-64: 512/ 65 and over: 630)’
The totals for this 21 month period of the worst pandemic in human history are:
Under 65 - 3774
Over 65 - 13,327
The figures do not differentiate between ‘jabbed’ and ‘unjabbed.’
The basis of establishing ‘Covid’ infection is not stated. If PCR tests on high threshold cycles were used to establish infection, the figures will overstate the true infection level to a significant degree. Also bear in mind that recorded ‘flu’ deaths have been remarkably low.
Link below:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulation ... ndandwales
There is a link within this referenced link to a fuller breakdown of these figures if anyone is interested.
These relate to the complete year 2020 and the first three Quarters of 2021 and are by date of registration:
‘Please see below for death registrations for 2020 and 2021 (provisional) that were due to COVID-19 and were recorded without any pre-existing conditions, England and Wales.
2020: 9400 (0-64: 1549 / 65 and over: 7851)
2021 Q1: 6483 (0-64: 1560/ 65 and over: 4923)
2021 Q2: 346 (0-64: 153/ 65 and over: 193)
2021 Q3: 1142 (0-64: 512/ 65 and over: 630)’
The totals for this 21 month period of the worst pandemic in human history are:
Under 65 - 3774
Over 65 - 13,327
The figures do not differentiate between ‘jabbed’ and ‘unjabbed.’
The basis of establishing ‘Covid’ infection is not stated. If PCR tests on high threshold cycles were used to establish infection, the figures will overstate the true infection level to a significant degree. Also bear in mind that recorded ‘flu’ deaths have been remarkably low.
Link below:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulation ... ndandwales
There is a link within this referenced link to a fuller breakdown of these figures if anyone is interested.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 16/01/22
Sun Jan 16, 2022 10:36 pm
Endemic Covid: Is the pandemic entering its endgame?
By James Gallagher - Health & Science Correspondent
Who hasn't let out an exasperated "Is the pandemic finished yet?" or a "When can I just get on with my life?" over the past two years? I know I have.
The answer to those questions could be... very soon.
There is growing confidence that Omicron could be hurtling the UK into the pandemic endgame.
But what comes next? There will be no snap of the fingers to make the virus disappear. Instead, the new buzzword we'll have to get used to is "endemic" - which means that Covid is, without doubt, here to stay.
So, is a new Covid-era truly imminent and what will that actually mean for our lives?
"We're almost there, it is now the beginning of the end, at least in the UK," Prof Julian Hiscox, chairman in infection and global health at the University of Liverpool, tells me. "I think life in 2022 will be almost back to before the pandemic."
What's changing is our immunity. The new coronavirus first emerged two years ago in Wuhan, China, and we were vulnerable. It was a completely new virus that our immune systems had not experienced before and we had no drugs or vaccines to help.
The result was like taking a flamethrower into a fireworks factory. Covid spread explosively around the world - but that fire cannot burn at such high intensity forever.
There were two options - either we would extinguish Covid, as we did with Ebola in West Africa, or it would die down but be with us for the long term. It would join the swarm of endemic diseases - such as common colds, HIV, measles, malaria and tuberculosis - that are always there.
For many, this was the inevitable fate of a virus that spreads through the air before you even know you're sick. "Endemicity was written into this virus," says Dr Elisabetta Groppelli, a virologist at St George's, University of London.
"I am very optimistic," she says. "We'll soon be in a situation where the virus is circulating, we will take care of people at risk, but for anybody else we accept they will catch it - and your average person will be fine."
Epidemiologists, who study the spread of diseases, would consider a disease endemic when levels are consistent and predictable - unlike the "boom and bust" waves so far in the pandemic.
But Prof Azra Ghani, an epidemiologist at Imperial College London, says other people are using it to mean Covid is still around, but that we no longer need to restrict our lives.
She thinks we'll get there "rapidly", adding: "It seems like it's taken a long time, but only a year ago we started vaccinating and we're already an awful lot freer because of that."
The only major curve ball would be a new variant that can outcompete Omicron and cause significantly more severe disease.
How bad?
It is important to remember that endemic does not automatically mean mild. "We have some huge killer diseases that we consider endemic," says Prof Ghani. Smallpox was endemic for thousands of years and killed a third of people who were infected. Malaria is endemic and causes around 600,000 deaths a year."
But we are already seeing the signs that Covid is becoming less deadly as our bodies become more familiar with fighting it.
In the UK there has been a vaccination campaign, a booster campaign and waves of Covid involving four different variants of the virus.
"When Omicron has finished and moved through, immunity in the UK will be high, at least for a while," says Prof Eleanor Riley, an immunologist at the University of Edinburgh.
The high level of infections has come at a price, with more than 150,000 deaths in the UK. But it has left a protective legacy in our immune systems. That immunity will wane so we should expect to catch Covid in the future, but it should still reduce the chances of becoming seriously ill.
Prof Hiscox - who sits on the government's New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group - says that means most people won't be badly affected.
"Should a new variant or old variant come along, for most of us, like any other common cold coronavirus, we'll get the sniffles and a bit of a headache and then we're OK.
What will it mean for our lives?
There will be people - mostly the old and vulnerable - who will die from endemic Covid. So there is still a decision to be made about how we live alongside it.
"If you're willing to tolerate zero deaths from Covid, then we're facing a whole raft of restrictions and it's not game over," Prof Hiscox explains.
But, he says, "In a bad flu season, 200-300 die a day over winter and nobody wears a mask or socially distances, that's perhaps a right line to draw in the sand."
Lockdowns and restrictions on mass gatherings will not come back and mass testing for Covid will end this year, he expects.
The near certainty is there will be booster vaccines for the vulnerable come the autumn in order to top up their protection through winter.
"We need to accept the fact that our flu season is also going to be a coronavirus season, and that is going to be a challenge for us," says Dr Groppelli.
However, it is still uncertain how bad winters will be as the people who die from flu and Covid tend to be the same. As one scientist put it, "You can't die twice."
Prof Riley thinks we won't be compelled to wear face masks after Omicron, but they will become "a much more common sight" as they are in parts of Asia as people choose to wear them in crowded places.
She adds: "The likely scenario is life won't look much different to the autumn of 2019, when we all turned up for our flu vaccines."
What about the rest of the world?
While the UK is ahead of most of the world due to a combination of vaccines and a large number of infections, the planet is not remotely close to seeing the end of the pandemic.
Poorer countries are still waiting for vaccines to give to their most vulnerable people. Meanwhile countries that kept Covid at arms' length have had very few deaths, but also have less immunity in their populations.
The World Health Organization has been clear the world is a long way off describing Covid as endemic.
"For the world it is still a pandemic and an acute emergency," Dr Groppelli concludes.
By James Gallagher - Health & Science Correspondent
Who hasn't let out an exasperated "Is the pandemic finished yet?" or a "When can I just get on with my life?" over the past two years? I know I have.
The answer to those questions could be... very soon.
There is growing confidence that Omicron could be hurtling the UK into the pandemic endgame.
But what comes next? There will be no snap of the fingers to make the virus disappear. Instead, the new buzzword we'll have to get used to is "endemic" - which means that Covid is, without doubt, here to stay.
So, is a new Covid-era truly imminent and what will that actually mean for our lives?
"We're almost there, it is now the beginning of the end, at least in the UK," Prof Julian Hiscox, chairman in infection and global health at the University of Liverpool, tells me. "I think life in 2022 will be almost back to before the pandemic."
What's changing is our immunity. The new coronavirus first emerged two years ago in Wuhan, China, and we were vulnerable. It was a completely new virus that our immune systems had not experienced before and we had no drugs or vaccines to help.
The result was like taking a flamethrower into a fireworks factory. Covid spread explosively around the world - but that fire cannot burn at such high intensity forever.
There were two options - either we would extinguish Covid, as we did with Ebola in West Africa, or it would die down but be with us for the long term. It would join the swarm of endemic diseases - such as common colds, HIV, measles, malaria and tuberculosis - that are always there.
For many, this was the inevitable fate of a virus that spreads through the air before you even know you're sick. "Endemicity was written into this virus," says Dr Elisabetta Groppelli, a virologist at St George's, University of London.
"I am very optimistic," she says. "We'll soon be in a situation where the virus is circulating, we will take care of people at risk, but for anybody else we accept they will catch it - and your average person will be fine."
Epidemiologists, who study the spread of diseases, would consider a disease endemic when levels are consistent and predictable - unlike the "boom and bust" waves so far in the pandemic.
But Prof Azra Ghani, an epidemiologist at Imperial College London, says other people are using it to mean Covid is still around, but that we no longer need to restrict our lives.
She thinks we'll get there "rapidly", adding: "It seems like it's taken a long time, but only a year ago we started vaccinating and we're already an awful lot freer because of that."
The only major curve ball would be a new variant that can outcompete Omicron and cause significantly more severe disease.
How bad?
It is important to remember that endemic does not automatically mean mild. "We have some huge killer diseases that we consider endemic," says Prof Ghani. Smallpox was endemic for thousands of years and killed a third of people who were infected. Malaria is endemic and causes around 600,000 deaths a year."
But we are already seeing the signs that Covid is becoming less deadly as our bodies become more familiar with fighting it.
In the UK there has been a vaccination campaign, a booster campaign and waves of Covid involving four different variants of the virus.
"When Omicron has finished and moved through, immunity in the UK will be high, at least for a while," says Prof Eleanor Riley, an immunologist at the University of Edinburgh.
The high level of infections has come at a price, with more than 150,000 deaths in the UK. But it has left a protective legacy in our immune systems. That immunity will wane so we should expect to catch Covid in the future, but it should still reduce the chances of becoming seriously ill.
Prof Hiscox - who sits on the government's New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group - says that means most people won't be badly affected.
"Should a new variant or old variant come along, for most of us, like any other common cold coronavirus, we'll get the sniffles and a bit of a headache and then we're OK.
What will it mean for our lives?
There will be people - mostly the old and vulnerable - who will die from endemic Covid. So there is still a decision to be made about how we live alongside it.
"If you're willing to tolerate zero deaths from Covid, then we're facing a whole raft of restrictions and it's not game over," Prof Hiscox explains.
But, he says, "In a bad flu season, 200-300 die a day over winter and nobody wears a mask or socially distances, that's perhaps a right line to draw in the sand."
Lockdowns and restrictions on mass gatherings will not come back and mass testing for Covid will end this year, he expects.
The near certainty is there will be booster vaccines for the vulnerable come the autumn in order to top up their protection through winter.
"We need to accept the fact that our flu season is also going to be a coronavirus season, and that is going to be a challenge for us," says Dr Groppelli.
However, it is still uncertain how bad winters will be as the people who die from flu and Covid tend to be the same. As one scientist put it, "You can't die twice."
Prof Riley thinks we won't be compelled to wear face masks after Omicron, but they will become "a much more common sight" as they are in parts of Asia as people choose to wear them in crowded places.
She adds: "The likely scenario is life won't look much different to the autumn of 2019, when we all turned up for our flu vaccines."
What about the rest of the world?
While the UK is ahead of most of the world due to a combination of vaccines and a large number of infections, the planet is not remotely close to seeing the end of the pandemic.
Poorer countries are still waiting for vaccines to give to their most vulnerable people. Meanwhile countries that kept Covid at arms' length have had very few deaths, but also have less immunity in their populations.
The World Health Organization has been clear the world is a long way off describing Covid as endemic.
"For the world it is still a pandemic and an acute emergency," Dr Groppelli concludes.
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Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 18/01/22
Tue Jan 18, 2022 12:19 am
Covid: Call to cut self-isolation to five days in Wales -
Cutting Wales' Covid self-isolation period to five days would help Labour ministers "atone for the damage" they have done to business, opposition Tories have said.
The party has joined calls for Wales to adopt England's new rules.
A charity boss said cutting the isolation period would help people return to work more quickly.
Wales' chief medical officer (CMO) said nations that took a more precautionary approach have seen better Covid rates.
Dr Sir Frank Atherton said ministers would look at whether they should change the self-isolation rules this week.
Wales case rate has fallen to the lowest level since 18 December - 650.02 cases per 100,000 people.
Cutting Wales' Covid self-isolation period to five days would help Labour ministers "atone for the damage" they have done to business, opposition Tories have said.
The party has joined calls for Wales to adopt England's new rules.
A charity boss said cutting the isolation period would help people return to work more quickly.
Wales' chief medical officer (CMO) said nations that took a more precautionary approach have seen better Covid rates.
Dr Sir Frank Atherton said ministers would look at whether they should change the self-isolation rules this week.
Wales case rate has fallen to the lowest level since 18 December - 650.02 cases per 100,000 people.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 20/01/22
Thu Jan 20, 2022 12:20 am
Covid: Face mask rules and Covid passes to end in England -
England's Plan B measures are to end from next Thursday, with mandatory face coverings in public places and Covid passports both dropped, Boris Johnson has announced.
Earlier, in a statement to MPs in the House of Commons, the prime minister said:
Mandatory Covid passports for entering nightclubs and large events would end, though organisations could choose to use the NHS Covid pass if they wished
People would no longer be advised to work from home and should discuss their return to offices with employers
Face masks will no longer be mandated, though people are still advised to wear coverings in enclosed or crowded spaces and when meeting strangers
From Thursday, secondary school pupils will no longer have to wear face masks in classrooms and government guidance on their use in communal areas would be removed "shortly"
England's Plan B measures are to end from next Thursday, with mandatory face coverings in public places and Covid passports both dropped, Boris Johnson has announced.
Earlier, in a statement to MPs in the House of Commons, the prime minister said:
Mandatory Covid passports for entering nightclubs and large events would end, though organisations could choose to use the NHS Covid pass if they wished
People would no longer be advised to work from home and should discuss their return to offices with employers
Face masks will no longer be mandated, though people are still advised to wear coverings in enclosed or crowded spaces and when meeting strangers
From Thursday, secondary school pupils will no longer have to wear face masks in classrooms and government guidance on their use in communal areas would be removed "shortly"
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:55 am
Covid in Wales: Fans to return to stadiums as rules ease -
Thousands of fans are set to return to watch sports fixtures in Wales as Covid rules limiting crowds at stadiums ease.
After Christmas, limits on the numbers of people who could attend events indoors and outdoors meant fans were effectively banned from games in Wales.
The Welsh government confirmed that from Friday, all limits on sports events will be scrapped.
Pubs and restaurants will also be able to operate outdoors without the rule of six or social distancing.
It is the second part of a three-week roadmap to scrap restrictions imposed because of the Omicron variant.
Thousands of fans are set to return to watch sports fixtures in Wales as Covid rules limiting crowds at stadiums ease.
After Christmas, limits on the numbers of people who could attend events indoors and outdoors meant fans were effectively banned from games in Wales.
The Welsh government confirmed that from Friday, all limits on sports events will be scrapped.
Pubs and restaurants will also be able to operate outdoors without the rule of six or social distancing.
It is the second part of a three-week roadmap to scrap restrictions imposed because of the Omicron variant.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:07 am
Spain:
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Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:16 am
Forever Blue wrote:Spain:
So what some people have said for the last two years and been berated for, cancelled, ridiculed, even locked up... is now being celebrated.
The whole world needs to get a grip.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:55 am
WAG to allow crowds and outdoor events, inc. sport, to fully open from today (Friday 21st January)
Other restrictions to return to 'Level Zero' next Friday
See: https://cardiffcityforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=225776
Other restrictions to return to 'Level Zero' next Friday
See: https://cardiffcityforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=225776
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:57 am
jimmy_rat wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Spain:
So what some people have said for the last two years and been berated for, cancelled, ridiculed, even locked up... is now being celebrated.
The whole world needs to get a grip.
Spot on
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 9:37 am
jimmy_rat wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Spain:
So what some people have said for the last two years and been berated for, cancelled, ridiculed, even locked up... is now being celebrated.
The whole world needs to get a grip.
But we couldn’t treat it like flu two years ago.
Vaccination rates will allow countries to do that and because of a variant that is milder.
Previously we weren’t in a position to do this. Certainly not two years ago.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:05 am
maccydee wrote:jimmy_rat wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Spain:
So what some people have said for the last two years and been berated for, cancelled, ridiculed, even locked up... is now being celebrated.
The whole world needs to get a grip.
But we couldn’t treat it like flu two years ago.
Vaccination rates will allow countries to do that and because of a variant that is milder.
Previously we weren’t in a position to do this. Certainly not two years ago.
No. I agree. I should've been more specific, the people who foresaw this outcome that were vilified.
And maybe not treated like ebola!!
I've said it all along. Time will tell and the outcomes and enquiries won't be pretty. Can't fault the vaccine roll out, but I can't think of many other positives.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:16 am
jimmy_rat wrote:maccydee wrote:jimmy_rat wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Spain:
So what some people have said for the last two years and been berated for, cancelled, ridiculed, even locked up... is now being celebrated.
The whole world needs to get a grip.
But we couldn’t treat it like flu two years ago.
Vaccination rates will allow countries to do that and because of a variant that is milder.
Previously we weren’t in a position to do this. Certainly not two years ago.
No. I agree. I should've been more specific, the people who foresaw this outcome that were vilified.
And maybe not treated like ebola!!
I've said it all along. Time will tell and the outcomes and enquiries won't be pretty. Can't fault the vaccine roll out, but I can't think of many other positives.
Everybody has been shooting in the dark with this. There were some, from the very start who said there would be variants that were milder as the virus killed too many hosts. Omicron appears to be that variant as it doesn’t affect the lungs and stays in the airway.
That’s why it was so severe. Affecting the lungs while having the R rate it had was scary.
I think they are pretty confident that any future variants should be milder again although likely more transmissible. Only worry is what’s happening abroad. Lots of countries still to get the pain we have had.
Vaccines have been amazing at helping with this. I think (rightly) scorn has been placed on those who refuse to believe the benefits of vaccines and think covid is a conspiracy. They are dangerous. In proper Darwinism irony many are now brown bread.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:12 pm
maccydee wrote:
Vaccines have been amazing at helping with this. I think (rightly) scorn has been placed on those who refuse to believe the benefits of vaccines and think covid is a conspiracy. They are dangerous. In proper Darwinism irony many are now brown bread.
Maccy (or anyone else who wants to chime in) respect as always but a couple of polite questions on this.
Not trying to be antagonistic just trying to better understand your viewpoint on this as I fully accept it is the majority view but I'll be honest, a lot of it just doesn't add up for me (in fairness most things don't mind so nothing new there
)Anyway, a couple of questions i have if anyone fancies helping me better understand the perspective?
- Given that the median age of death in the UK when looking at numbers both involving COVID and due to COVID is 83 years which is two years higher than the average life expectancy in the UK of 81 years, yet 96% of the population aged over 75 were vaccinated by May last year...
How can we be so sure that the vaccines were sufficiently effective to protect the most vulnerable? [1] - Given that at the time the biggest spike of Delta cases the UK 86% of the UK population had received the first vaccination and over half had received their second, and that the vaccines showed little to no protection from Omicron...
How can we be so sure that the vaccines were effective in stopping the spread of the virus?[2], [3] - Should the protection from death of an elderly population be a sufficient benchmark for the vaccine's effectiveness? Similarly, should reduction of vaccine transmission be a benchmark of success? What levels are sufficient to be deemed failure, success or amazing? Can we measure success in isolation or do other variables need consideration (summer/amount of daylight for example)?
The key question that I'm getting at here I suppose is 'are we at risk or attributing too much weight on the success of the vaccines without sufficient evidence/data to really confirm or deny that position?' - Finally, given that the lab-leak hypothesis, federal/national vaccination mandates, and vaccine passports required to access restaurants etc were all dismissed as conspiracy theorist nonsense when first discussed, yet all ultimately came true...
Which is more dangerous? Pushing discussions that don't fit into the approved narrative underground or fostering open and robust debate that allows good ideas (regardless of whether they are pro or anti-vaccination) to win out over bad ones in the light of day? [4], [5], [6]
I think we are in the final mile of this whole sorry saga which is great news - the next challenge is how do we overcome the polarization of society that has been exacerbated by the vax/anti-vax narrative. We're only going to get there if we can ask honest questions and have honest conversations - so hopefully the above is taken in that spirit.
Sources:
[1] https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transpar ... ithcovid19
[2] https://www.google.com/search?q=covid+c ... e&ie=UTF-8
[3] https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/w ... y-2021.pdf
[4]https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1656
[5] https://edition.cnn.com/2022/01/20/euro ... index.html
[6] https://nypost.com/2021/12/29/nyc-mom-a ... ine-cards/
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 21/01/22
Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:46 pm
ealing_ayatollah wrote:maccydee wrote:
Vaccines have been amazing at helping with this. I think (rightly) scorn has been placed on those who refuse to believe the benefits of vaccines and think covid is a conspiracy. They are dangerous. In proper Darwinism irony many are now brown bread.
Maccy (or anyone else who wants to chime in) respect as always but a couple of polite questions on this.
Not trying to be antagonistic just trying to better understand your viewpoint on this as I fully accept it is the majority view but I'll be honest, a lot of it just doesn't add up for me (in fairness most things don't mind so nothing new there
Anyway, a couple of questions i have if anyone fancies helping me better understand the perspective?
- Given that the median age of death in the UK when looking at numbers both involving COVID and due to COVID is 83 years which is two years higher than the average life expectancy in the UK of 81 years, yet 96% of the population aged over 75 were vaccinated by May last year...
How can we be so sure that the vaccines were sufficiently effective to protect the most vulnerable? [1]- Given that at the time the biggest spike of Delta cases the UK 86% of the UK population had received the first vaccination and over half had received their second, and that the vaccines showed little to no protection from Omicron...
How can we be so sure that the vaccines were effective in stopping the spread of the virus?[2], [3]- Should the protection from death of an elderly population be a sufficient benchmark for the vaccine's effectiveness? Similarly, should reduction of vaccine transmission be a benchmark of success? What levels are sufficient to be deemed failure, success or amazing? Can we measure success in isolation or do other variables need consideration (summer/amount of daylight for example)?
The key question that I'm getting at here I suppose is 'are we at risk or attributing too much weight on the success of the vaccines without sufficient evidence/data to really confirm or deny that position?'- Finally, given that the lab-leak hypothesis, federal/national vaccination mandates, and vaccine passports required to access restaurants etc were all dismissed as conspiracy theorist nonsense when first discussed, yet all ultimately came true...
Which is more dangerous? Pushing discussions that don't fit into the approved narrative underground or fostering open and robust debate that allows good ideas (regardless of whether they are pro or anti-vaccination) to win out over bad ones in the light of day? [4], [5], [6]
I think we are in the final mile of this whole sorry saga which is great news - the next challenge is how do we overcome the polarization of society that has been exacerbated by the vax/anti-vax narrative. We're only going to get there if we can ask honest questions and have honest conversations - so hopefully the above is taken in that spirit.
Sources:
[1] https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transpar ... ithcovid19
[2] https://www.google.com/search?q=covid+c ... e&ie=UTF-8
[3] https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/w ... y-2021.pdf
[4]https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1656
[5] https://edition.cnn.com/2022/01/20/euro ... index.html
[6] https://nypost.com/2021/12/29/nyc-mom-a ... ine-cards/
Firstly, I love your posts and the depth.
So I’ll make some points briefly not in any order as difficult to check on my mobile.
Vaccines never have been said to stop transmission. They reduce the chances but don’t stop transmission.
One vaccination was never enough to fully protect from the delta variant or any variant (including original or alpha). It provided some protection. Alpha ripped when a small number weren’t even protected with one vaccine delta when not many fully vaccinated. Once the numbers fully vaccinated went up deaths decreased significantly. Numbers wise were still high but deaths reduced significantly. Clearly that’s indicates the success of full vaccination.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 22/01/22
Sat Jan 22, 2022 12:22 am
Covid in Wales: More restrictions lifted as case numbers fall -
More restrictions to people's daily lives have been eased in Wales as Omicron cases continue to decline.
Pubs and restaurants in Wales can now operate outdoors without the rule of six or social distancing.
All limits on sports events have been scrapped meaning thousands of fans are set to return to watch fixtures across the country.
First Minister Mark Drakeford said: "We have passed the peak and the situation has improved significantly."
It is the second part of a three-week roadmap to scrap restrictions imposed because of the Omicron variant.
From a peak of more than 2,300 cases per 100,000 people in Wales, the rate has dipped below 500 on Friday.
The latest infection survey from the Office for National Statistics also estimates a fall in the number of people in Wales with Covid - affecting one in 25 of the population.
The number of people in hospital and in intensive care with Covid are also both declining.
More restrictions to people's daily lives have been eased in Wales as Omicron cases continue to decline.
Pubs and restaurants in Wales can now operate outdoors without the rule of six or social distancing.
All limits on sports events have been scrapped meaning thousands of fans are set to return to watch fixtures across the country.
First Minister Mark Drakeford said: "We have passed the peak and the situation has improved significantly."
It is the second part of a three-week roadmap to scrap restrictions imposed because of the Omicron variant.
From a peak of more than 2,300 cases per 100,000 people in Wales, the rate has dipped below 500 on Friday.
The latest infection survey from the Office for National Statistics also estimates a fall in the number of people in Wales with Covid - affecting one in 25 of the population.
The number of people in hospital and in intensive care with Covid are also both declining.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 24/01/22
Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:22 pm
Higher death rate, more damage to an already fragile economy, party politics all the way!
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... icron.html
Were tougher Covid curbs REALLY 'worth it' for rest of UK? Official stats reveal WALES has worst death rate - not England... as scientists claim Sturgeon and Drakeford's extra Omicron-fighting restrictions have made 'little difference'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... icron.html
Were tougher Covid curbs REALLY 'worth it' for rest of UK? Official stats reveal WALES has worst death rate - not England... as scientists claim Sturgeon and Drakeford's extra Omicron-fighting restrictions have made 'little difference'
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 25/01/22
Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:49 am
PM birthday event was held in No 10 during lockdown -
Downing Street has admitted that staff gathered inside No 10 to celebrate Boris Johnson's birthday when the first Covid lockdown was still in place.
ITV News reports up to 30 people attended the June 2020 event, sang Happy Birthday and were served cake.
No 10 said staff had "gathered briefly" to "wish the prime minister a happy birthday", adding that he had been there "for less than 10 minutes".
Rules at the time banned most indoor gatherings of more than two people.
ITV News said the birthday event had taken place in the Cabinet Room just after 2pm on 19 June 2020, adding that it had been a surprise for Mr Johnson after he returned from an official trip to a school in Hertfordshire.
It also reported that family friends had been hosted in the prime minister's residence that evening.
But a No 10 spokesperson said: "This is totally untrue. In line with the rules at the time the prime minister hosted a small number of family members outside that evening."
A source told the BBC this second gathering had involved a barbecue in the No 10 garden with members of Mr Johnson's family.
Downing Street has admitted that staff gathered inside No 10 to celebrate Boris Johnson's birthday when the first Covid lockdown was still in place.
ITV News reports up to 30 people attended the June 2020 event, sang Happy Birthday and were served cake.
No 10 said staff had "gathered briefly" to "wish the prime minister a happy birthday", adding that he had been there "for less than 10 minutes".
Rules at the time banned most indoor gatherings of more than two people.
ITV News said the birthday event had taken place in the Cabinet Room just after 2pm on 19 June 2020, adding that it had been a surprise for Mr Johnson after he returned from an official trip to a school in Hertfordshire.
It also reported that family friends had been hosted in the prime minister's residence that evening.
But a No 10 spokesperson said: "This is totally untrue. In line with the rules at the time the prime minister hosted a small number of family members outside that evening."
A source told the BBC this second gathering had involved a barbecue in the No 10 garden with members of Mr Johnson's family.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 25/01/22
Tue Jan 25, 2022 10:40 am
Booster number two coming
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Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 25/01/22
Tue Jan 25, 2022 11:22 am
I would say get ready for 1 every year along with the flu jab.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 25/01/22
Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:11 pm
BLUE54 wrote:I would say get ready for 1 every year along with the flu jab.
This is every 6 months. Less than that sometimes.
Expensive
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 26/01/22
Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:08 am
Police to investigate Downing Street lockdown parties -
The Metropolitan Police has launched an investigation into parties held in No 10 during the coronavirus pandemic.
Officers were looking into "potential breaches of Covid-19 regulations" in Downing Street and Whitehall since 2020, Commissioner Cressida Dick said.
She added that the investigation was launched after an internal inquiry led by civil servant Sue Gray passed information to the force.
His spokesman said the PM did not believe he had broken the law.
BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg said Ms Gray's report is essentially complete, and it was likely to be published on Wednesday.
But she added No 10 would not see the report on Tuesday evening, meaning it was not expected to be published before Prime Minister's Questions.
The Metropolitan Police has launched an investigation into parties held in No 10 during the coronavirus pandemic.
Officers were looking into "potential breaches of Covid-19 regulations" in Downing Street and Whitehall since 2020, Commissioner Cressida Dick said.
She added that the investigation was launched after an internal inquiry led by civil servant Sue Gray passed information to the force.
His spokesman said the PM did not believe he had broken the law.
BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg said Ms Gray's report is essentially complete, and it was likely to be published on Wednesday.
But she added No 10 would not see the report on Tuesday evening, meaning it was not expected to be published before Prime Minister's Questions.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 28/01/22
Fri Jan 28, 2022 12:04 am
Covid in Wales: Nightclubs to reopen as Omicron rules scrapped -
Nightclubs can reopen in Wales on Friday as business restrictions brought in to tackle the Omicron variant are scrapped.
The rule of six in pubs and restaurants will be lifted, and businesses will no longer be obliged to impose social distancing rules.
The legal requirement to work from home will also end.
But mask wearing rules - scrapped in England - are staying in shops, hospitals and public transport.
Wales has passed its latest peak of Covid cases, with rates now around levels last seen in early December.
Confirming the changes, First Minister Mark Drakeford said there were "encouraging signs that cases of coronavirus may be starting to stabilise".
But he added: "We all need to continue taking steps to stay safe - unfortunately the pandemic is not over yet."
Nightclubs can reopen in Wales on Friday as business restrictions brought in to tackle the Omicron variant are scrapped.
The rule of six in pubs and restaurants will be lifted, and businesses will no longer be obliged to impose social distancing rules.
The legal requirement to work from home will also end.
But mask wearing rules - scrapped in England - are staying in shops, hospitals and public transport.
Wales has passed its latest peak of Covid cases, with rates now around levels last seen in early December.
Confirming the changes, First Minister Mark Drakeford said there were "encouraging signs that cases of coronavirus may be starting to stabilise".
But he added: "We all need to continue taking steps to stay safe - unfortunately the pandemic is not over yet."
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 01/02/22
Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:09 am
Sue Gray: Failure of leadership over Downing Street lockdown parties -
Sue Gray has blamed a "failure of leadership" for allowing parties to take place in Downing Street when the country was under strict lockdown.
In long-awaited findings, the senior civil servant says some events "should not have been allowed to take place".
Ms Gray investigated 16 separate gatherings - including three that were not previously known about.
Boris Johnson said he accepted the findings in full, as he faced questions and criticism from MPs.
In Ms Gray's findings, she confirms that the Metropolitan Police is investigating 12 events - on eight separate dates - for alleged Covid-rule breaking.
These include the 20 May 2020 "bring your own booze" event in the Downing Street garden, which the PM has apologised for attending, and the PM's birthday party on 19 June 2020.
And the police are also investigating a gathering on 13 November 2020 at Mr Johnson's Downing Street flat.
Sue Gray has blamed a "failure of leadership" for allowing parties to take place in Downing Street when the country was under strict lockdown.
In long-awaited findings, the senior civil servant says some events "should not have been allowed to take place".
Ms Gray investigated 16 separate gatherings - including three that were not previously known about.
Boris Johnson said he accepted the findings in full, as he faced questions and criticism from MPs.
In Ms Gray's findings, she confirms that the Metropolitan Police is investigating 12 events - on eight separate dates - for alleged Covid-rule breaking.
These include the 20 May 2020 "bring your own booze" event in the Downing Street garden, which the PM has apologised for attending, and the PM's birthday party on 19 June 2020.
And the police are also investigating a gathering on 13 November 2020 at Mr Johnson's Downing Street flat.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 05/02/22
Sat Feb 05, 2022 1:26 am
Covid: Cardiff firm gives staff free holiday for pandemic work -
A recruitment company is taking its 55 staff on holiday to Tenerife to thank them for working through the pandemic.
Workers at Yolk Recruitment in Cardiff will set off on an all-inclusive break at a hotel in Tenerife in April.
The firm said it would spend more than £100,000 for the four-day break.
The company started in Cardiff 14 years ago and said the pandemic had seen it go through its hardest time in 2020 but also its most profitable period last year.
Nice Touch
A recruitment company is taking its 55 staff on holiday to Tenerife to thank them for working through the pandemic.
Workers at Yolk Recruitment in Cardiff will set off on an all-inclusive break at a hotel in Tenerife in April.
The firm said it would spend more than £100,000 for the four-day break.
The company started in Cardiff 14 years ago and said the pandemic had seen it go through its hardest time in 2020 but also its most profitable period last year.
Nice Touch
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 05/02/22
Sat Feb 05, 2022 10:48 pm
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 05/02/22
Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:30 am
maccydee wrote:https://apple.news/AKMOZWtDiTaevEATQcpj3ew
Future is more boosters I think.
Why.......in all honesty everyone I know who has had the booster has come down with covid a few days later. It's weird.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 09/02/22
Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:07 am
Vaccine rollout continuing .....
More than 52 million people, 91% of those aged 12 and over in the UK, have now received a first dose of a vaccine.
The number of people who have received a second vaccine dose is more than 48 million, or 85% of people aged 12 and over.
So far, more than 37 million booster doses have been administered across the UK, with about 31.3 million in England, 3.3 million in Scotland, 1.9 million in Wales and 950,000 in Northern Ireland.
Daily deaths levelling off......
There were 314 deaths within 28 days of a positive test reported on Tuesday.
Of those deaths, there were 294 in England,14 in Scotland and six in Northern Ireland. There were no deaths reported in Wales.
More than 52 million people, 91% of those aged 12 and over in the UK, have now received a first dose of a vaccine.
The number of people who have received a second vaccine dose is more than 48 million, or 85% of people aged 12 and over.
So far, more than 37 million booster doses have been administered across the UK, with about 31.3 million in England, 3.3 million in Scotland, 1.9 million in Wales and 950,000 in Northern Ireland.
Daily deaths levelling off......
There were 314 deaths within 28 days of a positive test reported on Tuesday.
Of those deaths, there were 294 in England,14 in Scotland and six in Northern Ireland. There were no deaths reported in Wales.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 10/02/22
Thu Feb 10, 2022 12:29 am
Covid: Self-isolation law could be scrapped in England this month -
All remaining Covid restrictions in England - including the legal rule to self-isolate - could end later this month, Boris Johnson has said.
Under the current rules, anyone who tests positive must self-isolate for at least five full days.
The current restrictions are due to expire on 24 March.
But Mr Johnson told MPs he expected the last domestic rules would end early as long as the positive trends in the data continued.
He said he intended to return after parliamentary recess - which runs from Thursday to 21 February - to outline the government's strategy for living with Covid.
"It is my intention to return on the first day after the half-term recess to present our strategy for living with Covid," Mr Johnson said at the start of Prime Minister's Questions.
"Provided the current encouraging trends in the data continue, it is my expectation that we will be able to end the last domestic restrictions - including the legal requirement to self-isolate if you test positive - a full month early."
The law will be replaced with guidance, Downing Street said - and for example people will be urged not to go to work if they have Covid.
All remaining Covid restrictions in England - including the legal rule to self-isolate - could end later this month, Boris Johnson has said.
Under the current rules, anyone who tests positive must self-isolate for at least five full days.
The current restrictions are due to expire on 24 March.
But Mr Johnson told MPs he expected the last domestic rules would end early as long as the positive trends in the data continued.
He said he intended to return after parliamentary recess - which runs from Thursday to 21 February - to outline the government's strategy for living with Covid.
"It is my intention to return on the first day after the half-term recess to present our strategy for living with Covid," Mr Johnson said at the start of Prime Minister's Questions.
"Provided the current encouraging trends in the data continue, it is my expectation that we will be able to end the last domestic restrictions - including the legal requirement to self-isolate if you test positive - a full month early."
The law will be replaced with guidance, Downing Street said - and for example people will be urged not to go to work if they have Covid.
Re: UPDATED DAILY : UK CORONAVIRUS - UPDATED 11/02/22
Fri Feb 11, 2022 12:19 am
Face masks and Covid passes to be scrapped in latest Welsh Government lockdown review
First Minister Mark Drakeford has set dates for relaxing Covid restrictions in Wales
Covid passes are being scrapped in Wales, and within weeks people will no longer need to wear masks in most indoor public places.
The latest review of the Covid rules for Wales has been carried out by Welsh Government. The cabinet met for the final time on Thursday morning to decide on what further measures could be relaxed.
Covid passes will no longer be required from next Friday, February 18. And ten days later, from February 28, people will no longer need to wear face coverings in all indoor places. However masks will still be required in shops, health and care facilities and public transport. If cases continue to fall, the Welsh Government hopes to lift all masks rules by the end of March.
Schools will be able to make their own decisions on facemasks from February 28.
First Minister Mark Drakeford has set dates for relaxing Covid restrictions in Wales
Covid passes are being scrapped in Wales, and within weeks people will no longer need to wear masks in most indoor public places.
The latest review of the Covid rules for Wales has been carried out by Welsh Government. The cabinet met for the final time on Thursday morning to decide on what further measures could be relaxed.
Covid passes will no longer be required from next Friday, February 18. And ten days later, from February 28, people will no longer need to wear face coverings in all indoor places. However masks will still be required in shops, health and care facilities and public transport. If cases continue to fall, the Welsh Government hopes to lift all masks rules by the end of March.
Schools will be able to make their own decisions on facemasks from February 28.