SUNDAY 05th SEPTEMBER UPDATE

This is not so much an update as you have come to expect but more raising questions as to how the club is being run at present, there is a small update at the end though.

There is not a lot of things to talk about at present because of the international break, I believe it is a good thing otherwise I think we would be talking about negative issues but the fact the recent weeks have been somewhat exciting and the whole country is talking about Cardiff City it is a strange feeling being a City fan with things seeming so calm.

There is an issue I would like to focus on and hopefully it will create thought provoking debate and give everyone the chance to offer their opinion no matter what it may be.

My question is about the Malaysians and their plans to take us forward ?

We all appreciate and are thankful to TG and Vincent Tan for saving this club from certain closure and that will never be forgotten but what do you think, on the evidence we have seen so far, is the plan ?

At present we have 5 loan players who are part of the matchday squad, add to that the 6 players in Bothroyd, Whittingham, McPhail, Burke, Matthews and Blake out of contract at the end of the season, it gives you 11 players who most of which, if not all, will be in the matchday squad each week this season.

I believe like most of you that Cardiff City will be promoted this season but nothing is Guaranteed in football/life,many teams have failed over the years,when it seemed certain they would succeed, that is the beauty and the beast of football.

So, what if we fail ? Surely the loan players will go back to their parent clubs and the players whose contracts are due to expire will leave and what will we be left with ? ,

As well as the players I think it is safe to say that failure would result in Dave Jones leaving too, but what about the Malaysians, would they stay to totally rebuild from virtually scratch or would they look to sellout ?

Is the reason that we have invested heavily in top quality players in the loan market and the 6 players that are yet to sign up ,the result of a ' now or never ' campaign. Get the best squad assembled without paying out vast amounts of money ?

If this is the strategy then we are going for it without putting the club in more amounts of debts like other clubs do in chasing success, look at Man City, Chelsea, both are owned by rich foreign owners but if they walked away where would those clubs be ? They would be in huge unsustainable amounts of debt with players on vast amounts of money and long contracts, that is the one thing you cannot blame Cardiff City of doing at present because those on the big money are getting their majority of their wages paid by their parent club.

Every man and his dog knows that Man City are paying the the majority of Bellamy's wages but if we look at Koumas' wage then there is a similarity there too, JK earns £30k pw at Wigan but City are paying £8k pw of it, Olifinjana is similar so too is Keogh. Dave Jones has never used the loan system as much as he has done this season, why the change of strategy, is it that he has been told, you can have free transfers and loans only.

There are those who believe that there is a strategy with the creditors also and that is he who shouts the loudest gets paid, now many see this as a good thing but does it indicate the way that the Malaysians plan to deal all season, is it a case of keeping the wolves the other side of the door, but if they begin to howl loudly and begin to get close enough to bite us that we will feed them ?

So we can all believe, we will succeed, but there is also the possibilty we will fail, where will that leave this club ? What assets will we have on the playing staff ? Will TG and Tan still be around or do they want the Premiership dream and nothing else ?

I am fortunate enough to be able to share information regarding City with many people involved and associated with the club but all of whom own up to the same admission, they do not know what the Malaysians plans are.

I would like to hear peoples opinions on this and a good healthy debate

Saturday's game with Hull is expected to be another home sell out with the club expecting the crowd to be bigger than the Doncaster game because they are expecting a crowd of 500-600 from Hull. The club suggest you get down the City for your ticket on Monday or Tuesday. There is only the corners of the Canton Stand left that can seat 2 or more tickets together.

PMG have again refused to sell the Premier seats on a single match basis.

Chris Riggott has been offered a deal and his thinking over the terms on offer but the club are confident he wil sign this week.

Francis Laurent has not been offered a deal as of yet but again the club are considering their options.

Thanks again Carl. Why has PMG refused to sell Premier seats on a match to match basis?

Carl, you say that the 5 players who have entered the last year of their contract will leave if we don't get promotion. Are you saying that all of them won't be offered a new contract, or they won't sign a new contract?

Thanks for the update

I for one am glad the Malaysians are keeping their strategy to themselves. For too long the club was run like a local football club, amateur and everyone knew everything. I for one welcome our new owners. At the now nfamous EGM Borley confided in me that these guys were big time, in it for the long haul and would bring a level of business professionalism British football, let alone Cardiff City have ever seen before. He had just come back from a stint in Malaysia with them and SB is a man of his word.

Their long term strategy is simple. Get the club promoted. But if you don't succeed make sure there is still a club on existence to have another go.

how long do pmg get a say on how prem seats are sold ? surely we/they are missing on alot of sales here

This is not so much an update as you have come to expect but more raising questions as to how the club is being run at present, there is a small update at the end though.

There is not a lot of things to talk about at present because of the international break, I believe it is a good thing otherwise I think we would be talking about negative issues but the fact the recent weeks have been somewhat exciting and the whole country is talking about Cardiff City it is a strange feeling being a City fan with things seeming so calm.

There is an issue I would like to focus on and hopefully it will create thought provoking debate and give everyone the chance to offer their opinion no matter what it may be.

My question is about the Malaysians and their plans to take us forward ?

We all appreciate and are thankful to TG and Vincent Tan for saving this club from certain closure and that will never be forgotten but what do you think, on the evidence we have seen so far, is the plan ?

At present we have 5 loan players who are part of the matchday squad, add to that the 6 players in Bothroyd, Whittingham, McPhail, Burke, Matthews and Blake out of contract at the end of the season, it gives you 11 players who most of which, if not all, will be in the matchday squad each week this season.

I believe like most of you that Cardiff City will be promoted this season but nothing is Guaranteed in football/life,many teams have failed over the years,when it seemed certain they would succeed, that is the beauty and the beast of football.

So, what if we fail ? Surely the loan players will go back to their parent clubs and the players whose contracts are due to expire will leave and what will we be left with ? ,

As well as the players I think it is safe to say that failure would result in Dave Jones leaving too, but what about the Malaysians, would they stay to totally rebuild from virtually scratch or would they look to sellout ?

Is the reason that we have invested heavily in top quality players in the loan market and the 6 players that are yet to sign up ,the result of a ' now or never ' campaign. Get the best squad assembled without paying out vast amounts of money ?

If this is the strategy then we are going for it without putting the club in more amounts of debts like other clubs do in chasing success, look at Man City, Chelsea, both are owned by rich foreign owners but if they walked away where would those clubs be ? They would be in huge unsustainable amounts of debt with players on vast amounts of money and long contracts, that is the one thing you cannot blame Cardiff City of doing at present because those on the big money are getting their majority of their wages paid by their parent club.

Every man and his dog knows that Man City are paying the the majority of Bellamy's wages but if we look at Koumas' wage then there is a similarity there too, JK earns £30k pw at Wigan but City are paying £8k pw of it, Olifinjana is similar so too is Keogh. Dave Jones has never used the loan system as much as he has done this season, why the change of strategy, is it that he has been told, you can have free transfers and loans only.

There are those who believe that there is a strategy with the creditors also and that is he who shouts the loudest gets paid, now many see this as a good thing but does it indicate the way that the Malaysians plan to deal all season, is it a case of keeping the wolves the other side of the door, but if they begin to howl loudly and begin to get close enough to bite us that we will feed them ?

So we can all believe, we will succeed, but there is also the possibilty we will fail, where will that leave this club ? What assets will we have on the playing staff ? Will TG and Tan still be around or do they want the Premiership dream and nothing else ?

I am fortunate enough to be able to share information regarding City with many people involved and associated with the club but all of whom own up to the same admission, they do not know what the Malaysians plans are.

I would like to hear peoples opinions on this and a good healthy debate

Saturday's game with Hull is expected to be another home sell out with the club expecting the crowd to be bigger than the Doncaster game because they are expecting a crowd of 500-600 from Hull. The club suggest you get down the City for your ticket on Monday or Tuesday. There is only the corners of the Canton Stand left that can seat 2 or more tickets together.

PMG have again refused to sell the Premier seats on a single match basis.

Chris Riggott has been offered a deal and his thinking over the terms on offer but the club are confident he wil sign this week.

Francis Laurent has not been offered a deal as of yet but again the club are considering their options.

Annis said 8 p.m.. You are late

Carl, seems to me like a one off £90m gamble.Great if it comes off but we are in serious trouble if we don't go up.

Surely if TG and Co. were in it for the long haul they would be looking to take over the club and not sit on a 30 odd percent stake.

Last edited by Cardiff Crazy on Sun Sep 05, 2010 7:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Good way to get a debate going Carl... IMO I think that we should just let it ride for a while and not get into it too much until we see how things develop this year. Yes i think if we dont make it up this year that the malaysians could walk, but their only going to sell to someone else who wants to have a good bash, cause when we do make it, we are going to make whoever is in charge alot of money...

I think the things in place are amazing, and do not see DJ not taking us up. To me he's another fergie, and will be with us for a long, long time. I just want to enjoy the moment and the great season we have got ahead

Just confirms it really promotion or we are f*cked

I think the Malaysians are slowly dipping their toes in the water at the moment and treading quite carefully. Buying into Cardiff City is a small part of their overall business strategy to move into the british business market and what better way to get yourself known in a foreign country than through a football club (one taken from the brink of administration to a success story in the Premier League) and what a job they have done so far. We may very well see a much clearer picture come 31st December and the January transfer window may very well be in stark contrast to last January and be quite exciting for us all

Thanks Carl.

My opinion is that the malaysians are in it for the long haul, they could have let the club go into administration, and paid a pittance, instead of the amount of money they have put in. The loan system is a system that we should be exploiting, the same way that other clubs in this division have (blackpool last year being one of them!) and it obviously helps that the majority of wages are being paid by the parenty clubs. I dont think TG and his business associates will just walk away after putting in so much work, making sure people are paid on time, including HMRC. This in my eyes only goes to show their commitment to the club, and that after all these years of us saying we are a sleeping giant, we are actually at the stage where premier league football is a reality. The additions to the squad this year are nothing short of unbelievable. Who would have thought we could take the wales captain off to replace him with Jason Koumas this time last year! In regards to the Riggott deal, from what I have heard, is that the offer on the table isnt enough for him. I dont know the figures, but not what he wants. But i cant see how beggars can be choosers, there are hardly clubs beating down the door to get him in, hence the reason hes been here for a few weeks training.

Thanks again Carl. Why has PMG refused to sell Premier seats on a match to match basis?

Rick because they believe they will earn more money through the Bellamy signing by selling them as a season seat.

I can see why your asking the question about the matchday players Carl....but.....I think that the majority of the out of contract players will sign up soon enough, especially if we are doing well. Clubs loan players all the time but I don't think it's any coincidence that DJ's stratergy has been slightly changed in the same year the 25 man squad rules come in to affect. Signing hardly any loans hasn't worked before so maybe this is the right time. I don't think we can allow ourselves to think abou what if the malaysians leave at tr moment because that is a huge what if.

I'm very happy with the club and tr way we are heading. Hopefully this will be our year

Carl, you say that the 5 players who have entered the last year of their contract will leave if we don't get promotion. Are you saying that all of them won't be offered a new contract, or they won't sign a new contract?

Thanks for the update

It is 6 mate but what I am saying is, if they don't sign then they will leave !

With TG and Co my optinion is that with so many creditors it would be foolish to go out and spend transfer fees on anyone and I agree. To have signed Oli, Koumas, Keogh, Bellamy would have cost potentially close to 15m and all those players would have wanted the wages matched from there current clubs on current terms and on new deals for at least a couple of season - thats we can all agree is impossible. IMO the club in its current financial position should not be signing players on big wages and long contracts like them so a loan is ideal.


So they have backed DJ in the loan market and brought in well and we now have a strong squad. If we dont go up the loans go back and we go back to having a small squad but a low wage bill again which I think is part of the strategy. They can then re-evaluate the financial position on season to season.
I think players being out of contract are unfortunate and more down to the RIddler not signing them up earlier because we had no money. I think the club had it right bringing in players before sorting the new contract and im sure they are now looking to extend the players contracts. Also lets remember the RIddler did all the previous contracts so maybe they are already on to much and we dont want to pay anymore?

I think someone mentioned that TG and co could have turned some of Isaacs debt into shares recently but didnt? (any info carl?)
If true I think that shows they plan on a full take over once other debts are sorted but are taking the time they need to put themselves in a stronger position.
Im not concerned at all and pleased that even if TG and co pulled out that all the high earners on loan at the club would be gone.

Thanks Carl

Carl YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THIS MOST IMPORTANT UPDATE

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21679

how long do pmg get a say on how prem seats are sold ? surely we/they are missing on alot of sales here

2013.

Carl YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THIS MOST IMPORTANT UPDATE

http://www.cardiffcityforum.co.uk/viewt ... =2&t=21679

I thought this was going to be the bigger signing than Bellamy

Carl YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THIS MOST IMPORTANT UPDATE

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21679

I thought this was going to be the bigger signing than Bellamy

IT IS MY BOOKS

Carl YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THIS MOST IMPORTANT UPDATE

http://www.cardiffcityforum.co.uk/viewt ... =2&t=21679

When the club implement my plans then these great books will become part of the update

This is not so much an update as you have come to expect but more raising questions as to how the club is being run at present, there is a small update at the end though.

There is not a lot of things to talk about at present because of the international break, I believe it is a good thing otherwise I think we would be talking about negative issues but the fact the recent weeks have been somewhat exciting and the whole country is talking about Cardiff City it is a strange feeling being a City fan with things seeming so calm.

There is an issue I would like to focus on and hopefully it will create thought provoking debate and give everyone the chance to offer their opinion no matter what it may be.

My question is about the Malaysians and their plans to take us forward ?

We all appreciate and are thankful to TG and Vincent Tan for saving this club from certain closure and that will never be forgotten but what do you think, on the evidence we have seen so far, is the plan ?

At present we have 5 loan players who are part of the matchday squad, add to that the 6 players in Bothroyd, Whittingham, McPhail, Burke, Matthews and Blake out of contract at the end of the season, it gives you 11 players who most of which, if not all, will be in the matchday squad each week this season.

I believe like most of you that Cardiff City will be promoted this season but nothing is Guaranteed in football/life,many teams have failed over the years,when it seemed certain they would succeed, that is the beauty and the beast of football.

So, what if we fail ? Surely the loan players will go back to their parent clubs and the players whose contracts are due to expire will leave and what will we be left with ? ,

As well as the players I think it is safe to say that failure would result in Dave Jones leaving too, but what about the Malaysians, would they stay to totally rebuild from virtually scratch or would they look to sellout ?

Is the reason that we have invested heavily in top quality players in the loan market and the 6 players that are yet to sign up ,the result of a ' now or never ' campaign. Get the best squad assembled without paying out vast amounts of money ?

If this is the strategy then we are going for it without putting the club in more amounts of debts like other clubs do in chasing success, look at Man City, Chelsea, both are owned by rich foreign owners but if they walked away where would those clubs be ? They would be in huge unsustainable amounts of debt with players on vast amounts of money and long contracts, that is the one thing you cannot blame Cardiff City of doing at present because those on the big money are getting their majority of their wages paid by their parent club.

Every man and his dog knows that Man City are paying the the majority of Bellamy's wages but if we look at Koumas' wage then there is a similarity there too, JK earns £30k pw at Wigan but City are paying £8k pw of it, Olifinjana is similar so too is Keogh. Dave Jones has never used the loan system as much as he has done this season, why the change of strategy, is it that he has been told, you can have free transfers and loans only.

There are those who believe that there is a strategy with the creditors also and that is he who shouts the loudest gets paid, now many see this as a good thing but does it indicate the way that the Malaysians plan to deal all season, is it a case of keeping the wolves the other side of the door, but if they begin to howl loudly and begin to get close enough to bite us that we will feed them ?

So we can all believe, we will succeed, but there is also the possibilty we will fail, where will that leave this club ? What assets will we have on the playing staff ? Will TG and Tan still be around or do they want the Premiership dream and nothing else ?

I am fortunate enough to be able to share information regarding City with many people involved and associated with the club but all of whom own up to the same admission, they do not know what the Malaysians plans are.

I would like to hear peoples opinions on this and a good healthy debate

Saturday's game with Hull is expected to be another home sell out with the club expecting the crowd to be bigger than the Doncaster game because they are expecting a crowd of 500-600 from Hull. The club suggest you get down the City for your ticket on Monday or Tuesday. There is only the corners of the Canton Stand left that can seat 2 or more tickets together.

PMG have again refused to sell the Premier seats on a single match basis.

Chris Riggott has been offered a deal and his thinking over the terms on offer but the club are confident he wil sign this week.

Francis Laurent has not been offered a deal as of yet but again the club are considering their options.

Annis said 8 p.m.. You are late

Better late than never

Carl YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THIS MOST IMPORTANT UPDATE

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21679

When the club implement my plans then these great books will become part of the update

GREAT TOPIC Carl

Carl YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THIS MOST IMPORTANT UPDATE

http://www.cardiffcityforum.co.uk/viewt ... =2&t=21679

I thought this was going to be the bigger signing than Bellamy

IT IS MY BOOKS

Already got them Can't we have Messi instead

how long do pmg get a say on how prem seats are sold ? surely we/they are missing on alot of sales here

When I upgraded my season ticket to the prem lounge I was told pmg were owed 9m and they had the prem seating for 5 years or till the 9m was paid.

Carl, seems to me like a one off £90m gamble.Great if it comes off but we are in serious trouble if we don't go up.

Surely if TG and Co. were in it for the long haul they would be looking to take over the club and not sit on a 30 odd percent stake.

It does seem like an odd strategy and that is why I am asking for peoples opinions to see if everyone is happy and convinced we are safe or are there doubts and fears.

Carl, you say that the 5 players who have entered the last year of their contract will leave if we don't get promotion. Are you saying that all of them won't be offered a new contract, or they won't sign a new contract?

Thanks for the update

It is 6 mate but what I am saying is, if they don't sign then they will leave !

Carl, thanks.

But if we are going down the shit or bust route, that may not be a bad thing.
If we go up, those we would want to keep in the Prem should be more than happy to sign and if we don't go up, we loose 6 overpaid players & our highly paid loan players & start again with a new manager & a squad we can afford. Not the end of the world.

Thanks again.

Brilliant post Carl....and appreciated.

I think you've hit the nail on the head where it refers to the Malaysians trying to get promotion not so much 'on the cheap' but certainly by means of spending as little as possible on transfers, as this would put the club in a strange position come the glorious day....always assuming it were to happen. At that point, the club would be able to off-load the players they no longer want and will find it easier to keep the players they still want....

This may appear a little simplistic but I have a feeling the Malaysians were as disappointed as the rest of us when we fell at the last hurdle in 2009/10 because they would have had an immediate (and massive) return on their investment. That it didn't quite happen has made them see that with a few better players we have the nucleus of a promotion team and the best way to get the quality we need is to borrow. We certainly couldnt afford any of them with our current debts unresolved in some areas.

I am, however, confident for the future and believe that the future of our club will be secure when we reach the Premiership.

Thank again, mate....and keep up the good work

I believe this season is 'the big push', we should make automatic, but as you said Carl if we fail then I see a big fall out!

Personally I don't think it will come to this, but lets wait and see what happens over the remaining 42 games

As always with CCFC it will be an interesting season

With TG and Co my optinion is that with so many creditors it would be foolish to go out and spend transfer fees on anyone and I agree. To have signed Oli, Koumas, Keogh, Bellamy would have cost potentially close to 15m and all those players would have wanted the wages matched from there current clubs on current terms and on new deals for at least a couple of season - thats we can all agree is impossible. IMO the club in its current financial position should not be signing players on big wages and long contracts like them so a loan is ideal.


So they have backed DJ in the loan market and brought in well and we now have a strong squad. If we dont go up the loans go back and we go back to having a small squad but a low wage bill again which I think is part of the strategy. They can then re-evaluate the financial position on season to season.
I think players being out of contract are unfortunate and more down to the RIddler not signing them up earlier because we had no money. I think the club had it right bringing in players before sorting the new contract and im sure they are now looking to extend the players contracts. Also lets remember the RIddler did all the previous contracts so maybe they are already on to much and we dont want to pay anymore?

I think someone mentioned that TG and co could have turned some of Isaacs debt into shares recently but didnt? (any info carl?)
If true I think that shows they plan on a full take over once other debts are sorted but are taking the time they need to put themselves in a stronger position.
Im not concerned at all and pleased that even if TG and co pulled out that all the high earners on loan at the club would be gone.

Luke I have tried to find out about the Isaacs deal this weekend but to no joy at the moment but I should know more on it tomorrow.