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What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:57 pm

I wonder?

Personally i will give him a round of applause as he's walking off at the end with the rest of his defeated team-mates.

Until then he's just another opposition player trying his hardest to stop us getting three points and I won't be clapping him, cheering him or asking him to do the Ayatollah.

I couldn't give a shit that he plays for Wales or that he comes from Cardiff, he's the enemy until the game is over.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:16 pm

davids wrote:I wonder?

Personally i will give him a round of applause as he's walking off at the end with the rest of his defeated team-mates.

Until then he's just another opposition player trying his hardest to stop us getting three points and I won't be clapping him, cheering him or asking him to do the Ayatollah.

I couldn't give a shit that he plays for Wales or that he comes from Cardiff, he's the enemy until the game is over.


he's a fan of this club and gave us good and loyal service. he left in order to further his career, and the club shot themselves in the foot by not accepting bids that were made. no hard feelings from me.

if someone like steven caulker gets a good reception, then ledley should get a round of applause. clearly i hope we win, but i wish the fella all the best after the game.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:28 pm

SwampCCFC wrote:
davids wrote:I wonder?

Personally i will give him a round of applause as he's walking off at the end with the rest of his defeated team-mates.

Until then he's just another opposition player trying his hardest to stop us getting three points and I won't be clapping him, cheering him or asking him to do the Ayatollah.

I couldn't give a shit that he plays for Wales or that he comes from Cardiff, he's the enemy until the game is over.


he's a fan of this club and gave us good and loyal service. he left in order to further his career, and the club shot themselves in the foot by not accepting bids that were made. no hard feelings from me.

if someone like steven caulker gets a good reception, then ledley should get a round of applause. clearly i hope we win, but i wish the fella all the best after the game.


Fair enough. AFTER the game, not during it.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:35 pm

Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:46 pm

A round of applause when his name is read out and no more. Hope he doesn't get asked to do the ayatollah

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:50 pm

Hope he trips over his beard and strains something. Greedy barsteward.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:16 pm

WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:37 pm

I don't think he got a bad reception when he played against us for Palace if I remember, and he didn't celebrate when he scored. I don't think he should get a bad reception, and it sounds like Warnock wasn't that interested in him.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:51 pm

davids wrote:
SwampCCFC wrote:
davids wrote:I wonder?

Personally i will give him a round of applause as he's walking off at the end with the rest of his defeated team-mates.

Until then he's just another opposition player trying his hardest to stop us getting three points and I won't be clapping him, cheering him or asking him to do the Ayatollah.

I couldn't give a shit that he plays for Wales or that he comes from Cardiff, he's the enemy until the game is over.


he's a fan of this club and gave us good and loyal service. he left in order to further his career, and the club shot themselves in the foot by not accepting bids that were made. no hard feelings from me.

if someone like steven caulker gets a good reception, then ledley should get a round of applause. clearly i hope we win, but i wish the fella all the best after the game.


Fair enough. AFTER the game, not during it.



Agree

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:59 pm

Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:03 pm

All these people saying he's a greedy whatever would turn down a job doubling their salary obviously.
Why would any second division player turn down the chance of playing in front of 60000 fans and the possibility of Champions League?
Its a job. Same as anyone.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:24 pm

Bluemellons wrote:All these people saying he's a greedy whatever would turn down a job doubling their salary obviously.
Why would any second division player turn down the chance of playing in front of 60000 fans and the possibility of Champions League?
Its a job. Same as anyone.


Well said. It was a lot more than doubling his salary too. He was on 3 grand a week at Cardiff. New contract was ONLY offered 9 months before his contract was up. Treated shockingly. People say he should have moved to a club to get us a fee. He wanted to sign for Stoke we wouldn't sell him. By going on a free to Scotland he got a nice chunk of signing on fee. Money he saw Fowler 'earn' at our club while Ledley was our best player playing week in week out for an 8th of what the fat scouser earnt.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:32 pm

maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.


this.

he wasn't appreciated here financially - most academy players are the same, they rarely get paid what they are worth. it must have been galling for him to have compared himself to much worse players being paid far more. you are right that the club were to blame for losing him on a free.

he was right to move on and did so. the fans were disappointed when he left for the SPL, but he proved he is good enough for the PL with palace. as i said on another thread, he should have taken the money on offer in china or turkey.

he'll get an applause from me. lesser players who contributed a fraction of what he did have been given good receptions. i dare say kenwyne jones would get a great reception if he returned, having contributed about 1/4 of what ledley did, for 10 times the pay. selective memories here.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:25 pm

CF23 Bluebird wrote:A round of applause when his name is read out and no more. Hope he doesn't get asked to do the ayatollah



he will defo be asked to do the ayatollah...and probably get cheered if he scores too..
its how it is these days..just hope ive gone for a p1ss if either happens.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 2:18 am

SwampCCFC wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.


this.

he wasn't appreciated here financially - most academy players are the same, they rarely get paid what they are worth. it must have been galling for him to have compared himself to much worse players being paid far more. you are right that the club were to blame for losing him on a free.

he was right to move on and did so. the fans were disappointed when he left for the SPL, but he proved he is good enough for the PL with palace. as i said on another thread, he should have taken the money on offer in china or turkey.

he'll get an applause from me. lesser players who contributed a fraction of what he did have been given good receptions. i dare say kenwyne jones would get a great reception if he returned, having contributed about 1/4 of what ledley did, for 10 times the pay. selective memories here.


No selective memories from me, chaps! ;)

You're obviously fans (maybe even friends) of Joe and I respect that but The Riddler indicated early on that Joe had little or no intention of renewing his contract from an early stage and most of us remember the saga that ensued throughout that season as Joe stayed pretty schtum on the subject before declaring his desire to play in the Premier League

Sadly, he conveniently missed out the word 'Scottish' and by doing so cost City much needed cash for his 'development' in the process. City were heading for the wall (maybe a good reason for him to see pastures new) and he didn't take a look in the rear view mirror as he headed over Offah's Dyke and then Hadrian's Wall!

We can bounce this one back and forth for ages but the simple fact is that Joe left (under a cloud IMHO) and now he's back with another team (Derby) so is by default an opposition player and should be treated as such and anything other than a ripple of applause from those who think he deserves it (and there will be many; particularly Wales fans amongst the crowd) should suffice. Once the game starts, he's just another opposition player! ;)

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 6:38 am

Bluemellons wrote:All these people saying he's a greedy whatever would turn down a job doubling their salary obviously.
Why would any second division player turn down the chance of playing in front of 60000 fans and the possibility of Champions League?
Its a job. Same as anyone.

:thumbup:

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 6:41 am

Cardiff boy(when suits),never rated him,plays for Wales (sometimes)don't really care what reception he gets just glad we did'nt sign him and hope his side is on the end of a hammering.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:42 am

Callum Patterson,even though there was no fee involved, when he joined us.
He stipulated that Hearts should have the development fee of £400k , even though we didn't need to pay it.
That my friends is loyalty and a big thank you toward his former club from him, because surely his signing on fee was a lot less than it could have been because of that gesture.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:41 am

davids wrote:I wonder?

Personally i will give him a round of applause as he's walking off at the end with the rest of his defeated team-mates.

Until then he's just another opposition player trying his hardest to stop us getting three points and I won't be clapping him, cheering him or asking him to do the Ayatollah.

I couldn't give a shit that he plays for Wales or that he comes from Cardiff, he's the enemy until the game is over.


Agreed enemy scum until the end of the game :thumbup:

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:43 am

Sven wrote:
SwampCCFC wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.


this.

he wasn't appreciated here financially - most academy players are the same, they rarely get paid what they are worth. it must have been galling for him to have compared himself to much worse players being paid far more. you are right that the club were to blame for losing him on a free.

he was right to move on and did so. the fans were disappointed when he left for the SPL, but he proved he is good enough for the PL with palace. as i said on another thread, he should have taken the money on offer in china or turkey.

he'll get an applause from me. lesser players who contributed a fraction of what he did have been given good receptions. i dare say kenwyne jones would get a great reception if he returned, having contributed about 1/4 of what ledley did, for 10 times the pay. selective memories here.


No selective memories from me, chaps! ;)

You're obviously fans (maybe even friends) of Joe and I respect that but The Riddler indicated early on that Joe had little or no intention of renewing his contract from an early stage and most of us remember the saga that ensued throughout that season as Joe stayed pretty schtum on the subject before declaring his desire to play in the Premier League

Sadly, he conveniently missed out the word 'Scottish' and by doing so cost City much needed cash for his 'development' in the process. City were heading for the wall (maybe a good reason for him to see pastures new) and he didn't take a look in the rear view mirror as he headed over Offah's Dyke and then Hadrian's Wall!

We can bounce this one back and forth for ages but the simple fact is that Joe left (under a cloud IMHO) and now he's back with another team (Derby) so is by default an opposition player and should be treated as such and anything other than a ripple of applause from those who think he deserves it (and there will be many; particularly Wales fans amongst the crowd) should suffice. Once the game starts, he's just another opposition player! ;)



Because Riddler always tells the truth.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:43 am

Bluebina wrote:
davids wrote:I wonder?

Personally i will give him a round of applause as he's walking off at the end with the rest of his defeated team-mates.

Until then he's just another opposition player trying his hardest to stop us getting three points and I won't be clapping him, cheering him or asking him to do the Ayatollah.

I couldn't give a shit that he plays for Wales or that he comes from Cardiff, he's the enemy until the game is over.


Agreed enemy scum until the end of the game :thumbup:


Then he’s good old Ledley, until the next time

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:48 am

Not interested in Ledley. He is not our player, and has'nt been for a long time. No different to any of the opposition players as far as I am concerned.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:20 am

maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
SwampCCFC wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.


this.

he wasn't appreciated here financially - most academy players are the same, they rarely get paid what they are worth. it must have been galling for him to have compared himself to much worse players being paid far more. you are right that the club were to blame for losing him on a free.

he was right to move on and did so. the fans were disappointed when he left for the SPL, but he proved he is good enough for the PL with palace. as i said on another thread, he should have taken the money on offer in china or turkey.

he'll get an applause from me. lesser players who contributed a fraction of what he did have been given good receptions. i dare say kenwyne jones would get a great reception if he returned, having contributed about 1/4 of what ledley did, for 10 times the pay. selective memories here.


No selective memories from me, chaps! ;)

You're obviously fans (maybe even friends) of Joe and I respect that but The Riddler indicated early on that Joe had little or no intention of renewing his contract from an early stage and most of us remember the saga that ensued throughout that season as Joe stayed pretty schtum on the subject before declaring his desire to play in the Premier League

Sadly, he conveniently missed out the word 'Scottish' and by doing so cost City much needed cash for his 'development' in the process. City were heading for the wall (maybe a good reason for him to see pastures new) and he didn't take a look in the rear view mirror as he headed over Offah's Dyke and then Hadrian's Wall!

We can bounce this one back and forth for ages but the simple fact is that Joe left (under a cloud IMHO) and now he's back with another team (Derby) so is by default an opposition player and should be treated as such and anything other than a ripple of applause from those who think he deserves it (and there will be many; particularly Wales fans amongst the crowd) should suffice. Once the game starts, he's just another opposition player! ;)



Because Riddler always tells the truth.


Nothing to do with Riddler, Lesley himselfand his agent confirmed he had turned down a deal Cardiff had offered. He chose to wind down his contract not Cardiff not the riddler, he chose to ensure he got the signing on fee and his home club who brought him up through the academy got zero not a Penny at a time the club danced with closure.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:25 am

He gets nothing from me either way......Just another ex player, Welsh or not.

He is a professional player in a professional system, i don't think anything he did was wrong. Every season we move players on, some for a profit some at a loss.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:29 am

i will be cheering as it was peter ridsdale fault not joes they was messing him around and i speak and drink with his dad chris nice guy

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:48 am

Hope he plays could suit our quick players!!

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 12:11 pm

maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
SwampCCFC wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.


this.

he wasn't appreciated here financially - most academy players are the same, they rarely get paid what they are worth. it must have been galling for him to have compared himself to much worse players being paid far more. you are right that the club were to blame for losing him on a free.

he was right to move on and did so. the fans were disappointed when he left for the SPL, but he proved he is good enough for the PL with palace. as i said on another thread, he should have taken the money on offer in china or turkey.

he'll get an applause from me. lesser players who contributed a fraction of what he did have been given good receptions. i dare say kenwyne jones would get a great reception if he returned, having contributed about 1/4 of what ledley did, for 10 times the pay. selective memories here.


No selective memories from me, chaps! ;)

You're obviously fans (maybe even friends) of Joe and I respect that but The Riddler indicated early on that Joe had little or no intention of renewing his contract from an early stage and most of us remember the saga that ensued throughout that season as Joe stayed pretty schtum on the subject before declaring his desire to play in the Premier League

Sadly, he conveniently missed out the word 'Scottish' and by doing so cost City much needed cash for his 'development' in the process. City were heading for the wall (maybe a good reason for him to see pastures new) and he didn't take a look in the rear view mirror as he headed over Offah's Dyke and then Hadrian's Wall!

We can bounce this one back and forth for ages but the simple fact is that Joe left (under a cloud IMHO) and now he's back with another team (Derby) so is by default an opposition player and should be treated as such and anything other than a ripple of applause from those who think he deserves it (and there will be many; particularly Wales fans amongst the crowd) should suffice. Once the game starts, he's just another opposition player! ;)



Because Riddler always tells the truth.


Not really a response that, is it? :roll:

Joe hasn't exactly cleared up the situation either, has he? ;)

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 12:35 pm

lots of twisting going on here...

Fowler etc had long gone before Ledley left...and Kenwynne arrived 4 seasons after while we had premier lge money.
champions lge football ? for every game they play against a decent champions lge club they play 10 against the likes of ross and livingstone and CL clubs even smaller/ worse than those 2...
Joe was better than that..tbh..did neither us or himself any favours..
truth be told if Celtic themselves were offered to swap places with Cardiff one step away from the EPL they would bite your hand off.

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 12:57 pm

Kenbird1983 wrote:i will be cheering as it was peter ridsdale fault not joes they was messing him around and i speak and drink with his dad chris nice guy


Agree that Chris (Ledley) is a nice guy, as is Joe when you speak to him but that's not the issue here. It's whether Joe deserves a heroes welcome or not?

IMHO most definitely not! He's a Derby County player today and we've been 'soft' on other returners in the past who have then not been shy of taking advantage of his former team given the opportunity and remember he did before whether he celebrated or not! :thumbright:

Of to t'game now. Time to get behind the CARDIFF CITY ELEVEN and not the Derby ONE! :ayatollah: :bluescarf: :bluebird:

Re: What reception will Ledley get tomorrow?

Sat Sep 30, 2017 1:40 pm

Sven wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
SwampCCFC wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Sven wrote:
WelshPatriot wrote:Shit on the club he allegedly loves. Nice guy I'm sure but won't be getting a welcome from me.


Yep, his fans can dress it up as much as they like and even blame 'the Riddler' but Joe (and his agent) knew exactly what they were doing and how to time it and it left a taste! :(

We've been through all that though and the simple answer is that there will be no applause from me, no booing and no acknowledgement before, during or after the game. If chosen, he's just another Derby County player we need to contain! ;)


The Riddler is totally to blame. Look at how Warnock rewards excellent performances with new contracts. Riddler paid Fowler 8 times as much as Joe, JFH and Sinclair 5 times as much. Ledley was our best player for 15 months. Riddler took the fact he was a cardiff lad for granted. Turned down millions for him without paying him a wage comparable to the value placed on him.

If I was Ledley I would have done exactly the same as him.


this.

he wasn't appreciated here financially - most academy players are the same, they rarely get paid what they are worth. it must have been galling for him to have compared himself to much worse players being paid far more. you are right that the club were to blame for losing him on a free.

he was right to move on and did so. the fans were disappointed when he left for the SPL, but he proved he is good enough for the PL with palace. as i said on another thread, he should have taken the money on offer in china or turkey.

he'll get an applause from me. lesser players who contributed a fraction of what he did have been given good receptions. i dare say kenwyne jones would get a great reception if he returned, having contributed about 1/4 of what ledley did, for 10 times the pay. selective memories here.


No selective memories from me, chaps! ;)

You're obviously fans (maybe even friends) of Joe and I respect that but The Riddler indicated early on that Joe had little or no intention of renewing his contract from an early stage and most of us remember the saga that ensued throughout that season as Joe stayed pretty schtum on the subject before declaring his desire to play in the Premier League

Sadly, he conveniently missed out the word 'Scottish' and by doing so cost City much needed cash for his 'development' in the process. City were heading for the wall (maybe a good reason for him to see pastures new) and he didn't take a look in the rear view mirror as he headed over Offah's Dyke and then Hadrian's Wall!

We can bounce this one back and forth for ages but the simple fact is that Joe left (under a cloud IMHO) and now he's back with another team (Derby) so is by default an opposition player and should be treated as such and anything other than a ripple of applause from those who think he deserves it (and there will be many; particularly Wales fans amongst the crowd) should suffice. Once the game starts, he's just another opposition player! ;)



Because Riddler always tells the truth.


Not really a response that, is it? :roll:

Joe hasn't exactly cleared up the situation either, has he? ;)
you clearly don't like joe and you haven't got a clue with what really went on and before you ask it's not for me to tell you.