RUSSIA'S INVOLVEMENT WITH SYRIA

Does anyone feel this is starting to get pretty serious with americans backing an attack on syria and russia likely to intervene any attack.
I think this could go 3 strikes and out should they cross that barrier there is a real possibility russia would attack america or go into syria to fight.
The potential this has could be devastating, although I dont think in this day and age
''I dont think'' americans would be stupid enough to risk mass destruction to their own country in future due to cold relationship with soviet union

People are seriously underestimating Syria's threat as well. So many think the allies will just in there, destroy the place and come out. They should know better than that but the media has manipulated to think that way.

Ever notice as well that they NEVER put Assad on the television to humanise him in any way? Its clever but its of course done to keep him dehumanised and seen as 'the threat we must all fear'.

Of course he's done A LOT of wrong and some won't see him as human because of that but the propaganda machine is well and truly underway. The difference is, propaganda in past era's was easy to spot but now its all cleverly done and a lot of people can't sift through the bullshit to see the real agenda.

The US will go into Syria whether the people want it or not and we will support them. Even when that happens a lot of people won't wake up.

The USA probably will go into Syria as Obama is too thick to understand what is really happening there. He just wants to make a name for himself before retiring, to look like an active international leader - just like Blair did. Stuff the consequences.

Assad is probably no worse (I'm not supporting him) than any other arab/muslim leader. There is no evidence of who used the chemical weapons (if any were used). In my opinion it is most likely they were used by the opposition to encourage the West to go in to help them. Why would Assad risk a USA led attack for a very very small gain in one area of a massive conflict? Why would he attack women and children, it would be far better to attack a military target and gain a strategic advantage. But the opposition would use the weapons on civilians (mainly children ) to gain a political advantage.

Who are the opposition anyway? A ragbag collection of terrorists and criminal gangs. There is no real political opposition party. They are just opportunists and gangsters making the most of an unstable situation.

Let them get on with it and we stay well away. We have had enough of other people's conflicts. Let them sort their own problems out. Anyone who says we should send troops in, should go themselves or send their sons in there first. We have the Ministry of DEFENCE (to defend our country) it is not the Ministry of Interfere in other people's problems.

Does anyone feel this is starting to get pretty serious with americans backing an attack on syria and russia likely to intervene any attack.
I think this could go 3 strikes and out should they cross that barrier there is a real possibility russia would attack america or go into syria to fight.
The potential this has could be devastating, although I dont think in this day and age
''I dont think'' americans would be stupid enough to risk mass destruction to their own country in future due to cold relationship with soviet union

Russia are playing games, The Russians aren't the force they once were and they know it, the Russian government would be over thrown by it's own people after one week of America bombing Moscow. Nobody can touch America and her allies millitarily. However Obama has made a mess of this at every turn and Putin is laughing his bollocks off. I fear Obama is likea lot of rappers on stage, all talk and no substance.

I'm stillnot really clear what Russia have to gain from propping up Assad

I was watching the debate on Capitol Hill last week and although it looks like a strike on Syria will be reluctantly authorised by congress, it won't be by any majority margin . It looks like it will be air strikes with NO soldiers on the ground .

I'm with glas on this, straight away i thought that rebels had let go the gas to get outside help as they knew that the population of Syria weren't with them and that they were onto a loser.
As for Russian involvement, I think that Putin has not been seen as a strong leader around the world by many as the US and its allies 'police' the world so has decided to make a stand and just be awkward for the sake of it.

This war is so messed up, no one actually knows who's the bad ones as it seems. There is no major proof its actually the Government of syria, or the army calling the air strikes.

There have been plenty of talk that american soldiers have put pictures up with quotes saying they didn't join the US Army to fight for the taliban etc.

Very odd indeed, I personally think we should stay well clear.

I also believe Russia will get involved. And if Russia gets involved we sadly would get involved, which could cause China etc to get involved too.

Last edited by Ccfc Shane on Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

Russia are playing games, The Russians aren't the force they once were and they know it, the Russian government would be over thrown by it's own people after one week of America bombing Moscow. Nobody can touch America and her allies millitarily. However Obama has made a mess of this at every turn and Putin is laughing his bollocks off. I fear Obama is likea lot of rappers on stage, all talk and no substance.

What utter bollocks. Russia are still a force that can cause enough mass casualties and just like any other bully, America doesn't like getting hit. Russia can hit them back and will, with force. You are also forgetting Russia can call on plenty of Eastern Bloc nations for help or they will cut off their gas and oil supplies at their peril. Russia has cut off their supplies for far less in the past and they have got them by the balls. Its already happening as well as cargo ships are leaving Ukrainian ports to supply Syria.

Plus, America won't just go and blitz Russia, thats an absolutely ludicrous suggestion. America will realise soon enough that bombing Syria isn't going to work and they will need to intervene on ground level. Its at this point where they are vulnerable as Russia's threat will come when they are ground level and the Russian's can send armed personnel in to support the Syrians.

You'd think America would learn from the past that fighting the enemy on their own garden patch doesn't end very well.

The real reason they want the war is to draw in Iran so the USA then have an excuse to intervene, attack Iran and destroy their nuclear program or at least set it back a few decades. They need an excuse to go in and invade and Syria is the gateway to that but the problem occurs because they are (1) being backed by a superpower in Russia, (2) being publicly supported by another superpower, China and (3) neighbouring countries Lebanon, Iraq and Jordan are all allies of Syria and supporting them.

America can't just go in and invade Iran so they are using the situation in Syria to try and provoke Iran into a reaction so that they then have an excuse to do so.

I'm stillnot really clear what Russia have to gain from propping up Assad

Billions of dollars. They have a deep vested economic interest in Syria. The same reason China is opposing the US' intervention.

Very interesting read.
America now taking the moral high ground, when someone else uses chemical weapons....
http://www.policymic.com/mobile/article ... talk-about

Russia are playing games, The Russians aren't the force they once were and they know it, the Russian government would be over thrown by it's own people after one week of America bombing Moscow. Nobody can touch America and her allies millitarily. However Obama has made a mess of this at every turn and Putin is laughing his bollocks off. I fear Obama is likea lot of rappers on stage, all talk and no substance.

What utter bollocks. Russia are still a force that can cause enough mass casualties and just like any other bully, America doesn't like getting hit. Russia can hit them back and will, with force. You are also forgetting Russia can call on plenty of Eastern Bloc nations for help or they will cut off their gas and oil supplies at their peril. Russia has cut off their supplies for far less in the past and they have got them by the balls. Its already happening as well as cargo ships are leaving Ukrainian ports to supply Syria.

Plus, America won't just go and blitz Russia, thats an absolutely ludicrous suggestion. America will realise soon enough that bombing Syria isn't going to work and they will need to intervene on ground level. Its at this point where they are vulnerable as Russia's threat will come when they are ground level and the Russian's can send armed personnel in to support the Syrians.

You'd think America would learn from the past that fighting the enemy on their own garden patch doesn't end very well.

The real reason they want the war is to draw in Iran so the USA then have an excuse to intervene, attack Iran and destroy their nuclear program or at least set it back a few decades. They need an excuse to go in and invade and Syria is the gateway to that but the problem occurs because they are (1) being backed by a superpower in Russia, (2) being publicly supported by another superpower, China and (3) neighbouring countries Lebanon, Iraq and Jordan are all allies of Syria and supporting them.

America can't just go in and invade Iran so they are using the situation in Syria to try and provoke Iran into a reaction so that they then have an excuse to do so.

I don't believe Russia will get involved because nearly all the nations have condemned the Chemical attacks but they are clearly placing a lot of obstacles in Obamas path because of their added interest in Syria.
The problem as I see it is what happens after the air strikes ?
The Americans would like to see Assad removed but are unwilling to take him out. I can see the Russian supporting the infrastructure build up of Syria again .

If there is hard evidence that Syria are using chemical weapons against its own people Russia will have no choice but to back military intervention.

Russia are playing games, The Russians aren't the force they once were and they know it, the Russian government would be over thrown by it's own people after one week of America bombing Moscow. Nobody can touch America and her allies millitarily. However Obama has made a mess of this at every turn and Putin is laughing his bollocks off. I fear Obama is likea lot of rappers on stage, all talk and no substance.

What utter bollocks. Russia are still a force that can cause enough mass casualties and just like any other bully, America doesn't like getting hit. Russia can hit them back and will, with force. You are also forgetting Russia can call on plenty of Eastern Bloc nations for help or they will cut off their gas and oil supplies at their peril. Russia has cut off their supplies for far less in the past and they have got them by the balls. Its already happening as well as cargo ships are leaving Ukrainian ports to supply Syria.

Plus, America won't just go and blitz Russia, thats an absolutely ludicrous suggestion. America will realise soon enough that bombing Syria isn't going to work and they will need to intervene on ground level. Its at this point where they are vulnerable as Russia's threat will come when they are ground level and the Russian's can send armed personnel in to support the Syrians.

You'd think America would learn from the past that fighting the enemy on their own garden patch doesn't end very well.

The real reason they want the war is to draw in Iran so the USA then have an excuse to intervene, attack Iran and destroy their nuclear program or at least set it back a few decades. They need an excuse to go in and invade and Syria is the gateway to that but the problem occurs because they are (1) being backed by a superpower in Russia, (2) being publicly supported by another superpower, China and (3) neighbouring countries Lebanon, Iraq and Jordan are all allies of Syria and supporting them.

America can't just go in and invade Iran so they are using the situation in Syria to try and provoke Iran into a reaction so that they then have an excuse to do so.

Russia's only threat is a nuclear one, their conventional army is light years behind America. Why would the Russian government risk being over thrown by it's own people for Syria?
You say Russia can cause mass casualties, True, but why would they want to if it means their own destruction? Once again you built a rant on a false premiss ( Russia being a verile super power). All Russia are doing is playing diplomatic games, the moment things get serious they will back off, as with all the other american conflicts they oppose. Russia asa super powerare secondrateto America, and China aren't really bothered but will oppose the over throwing ofa dictator on principle. It's all a storm in a tea cup, i'm still not sure excactly why Russiaare clinging to Syria, do you know?

I'm stillnot really clear what Russia have to gain from propping up Assad

Billions of dollars. They have a deep vested economic interest in Syria. The same reason China is opposing the US' intervention.

I don't believe there are billions of dollars in Syria. In what form? they're economy is fuedal and they have few natural resources. Russias interest is geopolitical but why

I'm stillnot really clear what Russia have to gain from propping up Assad

Billions of dollars. They have a deep vested economic interest in Syria. The same reason China is opposing the US' intervention.

I don't believe there are billions of dollars in Syria. In what form? they're economy is fuedal and they have few natural resources. Russias interest is geopolitical but why

I suggest you read this. There are massive economic reasons people are unaware of. I'll admit I was a bit of a dick in my original response so I apologise for jumping down your throat.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2% ... _relations

Russia has significant trade relations with Syria. Its exports to Syria were worth $1.1 billion in 2010 and its investments in the country were valued at $19.4 billion in 2009 according to The Moscow Times.[11][12] Besides lucrative arms contracts worth at least $4 billion, Russian firms have a substantial presence in Syria's infrastructure, energy and tourism industries.[8] Stroitransgaz, a natural gas facility construction company, has the largest Russian operation in Syria. In 2010, it was involved in projects worth $1.1 billion and had a staff of 80 Russians working in Syria. Stroitransgaz is building a natural gas processing plant 200 kilometers east of Homs in the Al-Raqqa region and is involved in technical support for the construction of the Arab Gas Pipeline. Tatneft is the most significant Russian energy firm in Syria. The company began in 2010 through a joint venture with the Syrian national oil company to pump Syrian oil and it planned to spend $12 million on exploratory wells near the Iraqi border.[11] Other firms with large business interests in Syria include steel pipe manufacturer TMK, gas producer ITERA, and national carrier Aeroflot.[8]

Russia's only threat is a nuclear one, their conventional army is light years behind America. Why would the Russian government risk being over thrown by it's own people for Syria?

Russia's military is larger in terms of total personnel as they have a massive backup pool of those trained to fight. Also, America would be fighting on Russia's doorstep near enough so therefore the threat is instantly there. How many times have America got to fight on someone's doorstep to realise it's a terrible idea?

Their main target is Iran and they won't admit it because it goes against International Law as they have no evidence to invade Iran and disrupt their supposed nuclear programme. They invade Syria, an ally of Iran's, Iran retaliates as they have already threatened and the US then have a reason to attack Iran.

Its time people stopped thinking America gave a crap about the situation in Syria. Its all to do with their interests and what is best for them, no one else. A country that has a history of nuclear/chemical attacks itself giving a crap about them being used elsewhere? Yeah, good one.

It's all a storm in a tea cup, i'm still not sure excactly why Russiaare clinging to Syria, do you know?

Economic reasons as already pointed out in this thread numerous times.

Russia's only threat is a nuclear one, their conventional army is light years behind America. Why would the Russian government risk being over thrown by it's own people for Syria?

Russia's military is larger in terms of total personnel as they have a massive backup pool of those trained to fight. Also, America would be fighting on Russia's doorstep near enough so therefore the threat is instantly there. How many times have America got to fight on someone's doorstep to realise it's a terrible idea?

Their main target is Iran and they won't admit it because it goes against International Law as they have no evidence to invade Iran and disrupt their supposed nuclear programme. They invade Syria, an ally of Iran's, Iran retaliates as they have already threatened and the US then have a reason to attack Iran.

Its time people stopped thinking America gave a crap about the situation in Syria. Its all to do with their interests and what is best for them, no one else. A country that has a history of nuclear/chemical attacks itself giving a crap about them being used elsewhere? Yeah, good one.

It's all a storm in a tea cup, i'm still not sure excactly why Russiaare clinging to Syria, do you know?

Economic reasons as already pointed out in this thread numerous times.

Barnett, wars are not fought on army size in todays world, Iraq had the 4th biggest army in the world remember?
There is no way the Russian army would want this war, let alone the Russian people backing Putin in a war to support a muslim dictator. are you crazy? Putin isn't that far off being over-thrown by a peoples revolt himself. Americawould embarrass russia on the battle field, Americaare now desert combat veterans, America aren't really bothered by Syria or Iran since their new moerate leader took charge, infact, now they're becomming energy self sufficient, they are trying to move away from the middle east, towards the far east. This confrontation has come about because Obama foolishly drew a line in the sand last year regarding chemical weapons and he is now desperate to do something in order to save face for himself and the hard earned (by bush) reputation of America as a no nonesense force.
I concede on the economic point slightly, but Syria still isn't that big economically to Russia in the grand scheme. Certainly not worth going to war over. The very worst Russian involvementwould be arming Syriawith Modern-ish wearponary but America would wipe it out & show Russian technology for what it is, second rate slavic junk. , so what's the point?

Barnett, wars are not fought on army size in todays world, Iraq had the 4th biggest army in the world remember?

I never said it was but you think America is going to go nuclear on Russia's doorstep? No of course they won't.

There is no way the Russian army would want this war, let alone the Russian people backing Putin in a war to support a muslim dictator. are you crazy? Putin isn't that far off being over-thrown by a peoples revolt himself. Americawould embarrass russia on the battle field, Americaare now desert combat veterans, America aren't really bothered by Syria or Iran since their new moerate leader took charge, infact, now they're becomming energy self sufficient, they are trying to move away from the middle east, towards the far east. This confrontation has come about because Obama foolishly drew a line in the sand last year regarding chemical weapons and he is now desperate to do something in order to save face for himself and the hard earned (by bush) reputation of America as a no nonesense force.
I concede on the economic point slightly, but Syria still isn't that big economically to Russia in the grand scheme. Certainly not worth going to war over. The very worst Russian involvementwould be arming Syriawith Modern-ish wearponary but America would wipe it out & show Russian technology for what it is, second rate slavic junk. , so what's the point?

So many of our own people, just like the government, are so firmly lodged up the US' arse its embarrassing. They're not as powerful as people make out and just like any other bully can be beat, especially when they go and try and do their business on someone else's doorstep.

I see all the scaremongering though from the news has worked a treat. Ever notice how America never bothers attacking countries with proven nuclear capability, North Korea being one of them?

If you think that Russia's economic investment and relations with Syria is nothing to go to war about then you are deluded. Who plugs the financial hole caused by the damage to Russian owned investments in Syria? Who plugs the financial hole left in the damage to on going trade with Syria?

Also, second rate Slavic junk - America, as they have also admitted, have no idea what Russia has in terms of true fire power and its all done based on ' alleged intelligence' to use the term lightly and not factual information. Russia, likewise probably doesn't know much of what the US is capable of in true terms. It's all talk and war propaganda as usual.

Also the country that created the historically renown and admired AK47 and has had a foothold in setting precedents in the arms and artillery industry is not going to enter any battle or support one without what they believe is a trump card up their sleeve.

Neither Russia or the USA will use nuclear weapons on the other if any ground attacks took place as the moment they did the country responsible would become seen as the enemy internationally as its against international law. On the basis of that and it being on Russia's doorstep in a country surrounded by Syrian allies (excluding Turkey) its fair to say Russia are in a very strong position.

You seem to think American can go all nuclear and just press a button and start blowing shit up with no come back on what they do. I highly suggest you stop watching programmes like 24 as they're obviously clouding your judgement.

I've genuinely never seen one episode of 24 so there

You talk about russian millitary engineering but the ak-47 is an assualt rifle from the 60's?
In comparison America is famous for cruise missiles, a distance of 1000 thousand miles? accurate to within 5 metres. stealth bombers(invisible to radar), with the best fighter jets on earth. Russian capability is known due to it selling arms to Iraq and yugoslavia and guess what? America had over estimated the effectiveness of slavic junk.

I've genuinely never seen one episode of 24 so there
But you have to admire the awesome power of Uncle Sam when you see a cruise missile flare up off a frigate in the med. It's just ashame they are now being led by a vain lilly-livered, egotistical, man in Obama, His poor diplomacy and indecisiveness may well lead us all meandering into world war 4, never again must the American people be allowed to elect a rapper into the white house.

Barnett, your foray into geopolitics has been a bit of a shambles.

Barnett, your foray into geopolitics has been a bit of a shambles.

He's retreated to a bunker in Brecon to reload his spud gun.

Barnett, your foray into geopolitics has been a bit of a shambles.

He's retreated to a bunker in Brecon to reload his spud gun.

Poor Barnett.

He probably thinks the Western world currently sits in ruins because Russia unleashed its full arsenal after we went into Libya.

No, wait, that didn't happen.

Barnett, your foray into geopolitics has been a bit of a shambles.

He's retreated to a bunker in Brecon to reload his spud gun.

Poor Barnett.

He probably thinks the Western world currently sits in ruins because Russia unleashed its full arsenal after we went into Libya.

No, wait, that didn't happen.

They did ring their fists and smash a few plates. Firing a few warning shots into the Moscow sky with an AK-47 mounted on the the roof of a Lada riva.

If the Rebels had these chemical weapons they would use them to. And then they would use them on us. Both sides are serious bad eggs, we should just let them kill each other. Pity innocents are being killed but that is happening all over the world. Humans are the most uncivilised creatures there is. Cruel and sadistic.
But we should all keep out of it unless they decide to Nuke the place and wipe the lot of em out. That sounds the best option.

Barnett, your foray into geopolitics has been a bit of a shambles.

He's retreated to a bunker in Brecon to reload his spud gun.

Poor Barnett.

He probably thinks the Western world currently sits in ruins because Russia unleashed its full arsenal after we went into Libya.

No, wait, that didn't happen.

They did ring their fists and smash a few plates. Firing a few warning shots into the Moscow sky with an AK-47 mounted on the the roof of a Lada riva.

I also think they may have used some of these high tech weapons that were so advanced no one saw them or felt any of their effects.

I think they may have complained to the UN, too.

If the Rebels had these chemical weapons they would use them to. And then they would use them on us. Both sides are serious bad eggs, we should just let them kill each other. Pity innocents are being killed but that is happening all over the world. Humans are the most uncivilised creatures there is. Cruel and sadistic.
But we should all keep out of it unless they decide to Nuke the place and wipe the lot of em out. That sounds the best option.

I feel sorry for the majority of decent people, It must be like hell in there, i've seen first hand how civilised humans quickly descend into animalistic entities you illustrate above. Our peaceful existence is fragile & unusual in the history of mankind. I put credit for this unusually peaceful period in the hands of America, while they are top dog the world is a safe place.

I'm sure Putin has had plastic surgery

He's starting to look like a male Joan Rivers

I'm sure Putin has had plastic surgery

He's starting to look like a male Joan Rivers

They should change roles, Rivers running a quasi democracy in Russia and Putin doing a gigs on Letterman.


Wonder what his stand up routine would go like ......

Very interesting read.
America now taking the moral high ground, when someone else uses chemical weapons....
http://www.policymic.com/mobile/article ... talk-about

Totally agree with you America have had their hands dirtied on so many occasions