" A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR EVERYONE ? "

SURELY THE FOLLOWING IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT DEBTS THAT NEED TO BE SORTED MORE THAN ANYTHING ?

I am not siding with anyone, I just what your honest answers/opinions.


So the Malaysians ask Sam/Langston to meet up and discuss sorting out the £24 mill debt.
TG meets Sam and Sam agrees to take less than half £10 mill, as if Sam goes to court now and wins which he would, Sam would prob get peanuts as if the club then went under the Malaysians have first charge on our club. The Malaysians need Langston sorted as fast as possible so it appears as they can then change our debt in to shares as agreed and was suppose to have been done over a year ago at the shareholders meeting.

Solicitors receive all the paper work from the Malaysians(VT)agreeing the £10 mill, but and I mean but, it now says £3 mill upfront and £7 mill next May 2013. Sam/Langston say hold on u have moved the goal posts, no deal.


If the Malaysians want to convert all debts in to shares now, surely they need this settling now ?




My questions to u all.


Why not pay Sam/Langston the £10 mill now upfront and get rid of him once and for all ?

Would u trust them to pay Sam/Langston the £7 mill next May 2013 if we got promotion or never got promotion ?

Why are they then still lending us the money at 7% interest ?

Forget if your a Sam fan/hater or Malaysian fan etc, who is in the right on this ?

How do u expect the Malaysians to give our club £100 mill, interested to see/read fans answers on this one.

I say this as a Sam fan.

If I was Sam, I would take the £3m now and the £7m in May. Like you say if he was to take it to court he would probably get nothing. So take the £3m now and bank it.

If I was Sam I'd wait till we get to the prem then ask or more.

But I have no idea what TG and VT are doing. Just pay the man!!

I'm flabbergasted that despite Sam accepting such a massive reduction of the debt , the Malaysians are STILL trying to negotiate a way out of paying it now, and what seriously worries me is that they are claiming they want to invest £100 million yet are willing to risk adding another £14 million to the debt just for the sake of a few months.... so is there really £100 million there to be invested or are they such incompetent businessmen that they can't see one of the deals of the century when it's biting them on the arse... of course another option could be that it simply boils down to pure arrogance and they think they are that powerful they really can do whatever they want.....

Last edited by Andy1927 on Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I am getting more and more sceptical about the malaysians claims to be honest.

Not wanting to settle the langston debt til next year. If they were so keen to invest £100 million why not spend £10 and get this out the way?

Not increasing the stadium capacity (thought that was a pointless idea initially anyway)

Plans for a new training ground but as yet just plans no guarantee it will be built.

No news of transfers of any kind except mythical rumours of a budget for players.

Seems to me the investors are going to use one season to try and market the club in red and if Malky can't produce prmotion with a squad on a limited budget they will bail out , liquidate the club and leave langston and the fans with nothing.

SURELY THE FOLLOWING IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT DEBTS THAT NEED TO BE SORTED MORE THAN ANYTHING ?

I am not siding with anyone, I just what your honest answers/opinions.


So the Malaysians ask Sam/Langston to meet up and discuss sorting out the £24 mill debt.
TG meets Sam and Sam agrees to take less than half £10 mill, as if Sam goes to court now and wins which he would, Sam would prob get peanuts as if the club then went under the Malaysians have first charge on our club. The Malaysians need Langston sorted as fast as possible so it appears as they can then change our debt in to shares as agreed and was suppose to have been done over a year ago at the shareholders meeting.

Solicitors receive all the paper work from the Malaysians(VT)agreeing the £10 mill, but and I mean but, it now says £3 mill upfront and £7 mill next May 2013. Sam/Langston say hold on u have moved the goal posts, no deal.


If the Malaysians want to convert all debts in to shares now, surely they need this settling now ?




My questions to u all.


Why not pay Sam/Langston the £10 mill now upfront and get rid of him once and for all ?

Would u trust them to pay Sam/Langston the £7 mill next May 2013 if we got promotion or never got promotion ?

Why are they then still lending us the money at 7% interest ?

Forget if your a Sam fan/hater or Malaysian fan etc, who is in the right on this ?

How do u expect the Malaysians to give our club £100 mill, interested to see/read fans answers on this one.

Annis, as i believe it, although the accounts show a lending intrest rate of 7%, VT is not taking any of the intrest money out of the club, as for Langstone, pay them up in a one off payment of £10 million and move on, transfering the debt to equity is a must for the financial future of our club and of course, that wont be done until we get rid of Langstone!!

I am getting more and more sceptical about the malaysians claims to be honest.

Not wanting to settle the langston debt til next year. If they were so keen to invest £100 million why not spend £10 and get this out the way?

Not increasing the stadium capacity (thought that was a pointless idea initially anyway)

Plans for a new training ground but as yet just plans no guarantee it will be built.

No news of transfers of any kind except mythical rumours of a budget for players.

Seems to me the investors are going to use one season to try and market the club in red and if Malky can't produce prmotion with a squad on a limited budget they will bail out , liquidate the club and leave langston and the fans with nothing.

The training ground is now not def as they are now back in talks with Leekes regarding longer renting the Vale and also they have not decided where they want this new training ground yet.

whats ten mllion to a billionaire, its like me betting a fiver on the euros

I have a feeling there is more to this than meets the eye.

Are they also negotiating the buying of PMG's shares too?

whats ten mllion to a billionaire, its like me betting a fiver on the euros

That's exactly what I thought.... Now I'm no billionaire business genius, but I had a debt of just under a thousand pounds a few years ago and the company came to me and said that if I made a one off payment of just over £250 it would clear it all together... now did I argue over this and say, any chance I can pay it in 10 months time.... Did I heck as like... I bit their bloody hands off and cleared it....

Well I'm absolutely convinced that details of these delicate negotiations have not been made public by the club and I believe that is the best policy. In my opinion it's a pity SH cannot do the same.

Confidential business negotiations should be respected and not made public in this way. My question in responce is why is it being made public.

Surely not more Malaysian bashing.

I am not siding with anyone, I just what your honest answers/opinions.


So the Malaysians ask Sam/Langston to meet up and discuss sorting out the £24 mill debt.
TG meets Sam and Sam agrees to take less than half £10 mill, as if Sam goes to court now and wins which he would, Sam would prob get peanuts as if the club then went under the Malaysians have first charge on our club. The Malaysians need Langston sorted as fast as possible so it appears as they can then change our debt in to shares as agreed and was suppose to have been done over a year ago at the shareholders meeting.

Solicitors receive all the paper work from the Malaysians(VT)agreeing the £10 mill, but and I mean but, it now says £3 mill upfront and £7 mill next May 2013. Sam/Langston say hold on u have moved the goal posts, no deal.


If the Malaysians want to convert all debts in to shares now, surely they need this settling now ?




My questions to u all.


Why not pay Sam/Langston the £10 mill now upfront and get rid of him once and for all ?
My guess would be cashflow, as simple as that. That extra 7 mill can be spent on transfers or pretty much anything else for that matter. It's a no brainer.

Sam should have secured the debt if he wanted to be in charge of the repayment schedule.

Would u trust them to pay Sam/Langston the £7 mill next May 2013 if we got promotion or never got promotion ?
That would depend on Sam's lawyers. Hopefully they would write a pretty water tight contract.

Why are they then still lending us the money at 7% interest ?
Becasue they want a return on what they are investing. 7 percent is pretty reasonable for a business with our, shall we say chequered, credit history.

Forget if your a Sam fan/hater or Malaysian fan etc, who is in the right on this ?
Both, there's no wrong. Sam should just accept the deal. If it's a good contract he'll get what he wants. He's been waiting this long, after all, what difference does another 10 months make? Not much in the great scheme of things.

How do u expect the Malaysians to give our club £100 mill, interested to see/read fans answers on this one.
There's been some smoke and mirrors on this one, no doubt.

Well I'm absolutely convinced that details of these delicate negotiations have not been made public by the club and I believe that is the best policy. In my opinion it's a pity SH cannot do the same.

Confidential business negotiations should be respected and not made public in this way. My question in responce is why is it being made public.

Surely not more Malaysian bashing.

Gary its common knowledge in the club and surely this debt is the one that needs sorting once and for all, so we can all move on and get rid of Langston once and for all ? By the way no Malaysian bashing, even though they have taken my Bluebirds away from me, just stating some facts and then asking questions.

I honestly dont understand why they dont just pay Langston off, do u ?

I say this as a Sam fan.

If I was Sam, I would take the £3m now and the £7m in May. Like you say if he was to take it to court he would probably get nothing. So take the £3m now and bank it.

Dont think the money is an issue here. Its the principle which counts.

If you were told you were being given 10 million and both sides agree to it; changing the terms would be very unfair.I say to Sam, stick to your guns, because the Malaysians seem to being going back on their word in regards to the agreement.

I'm not a big fan of either the Malaysians or Sam Hammam, the most important issue is the welfare of our club. Some fans are so deluded at the moment that we're getting the investment to benefit our club.

Yes, I do agree at present it benefits our club, otherwise we be out of business.....but remember we're paying interest and debt is rising fast. But the key issue here is, werent we suppose to be self sufficient now, there shouldnt be a need of 1 million + investment a month to keep us going.

Remember, we were only 30-40 million (someone correct me) in debt, prior to the Malaysians coming into the club. Now we're over 80 million in debt, with an investment of nearly 1 million + to keep us operating with a 7% interest. Our debt is rising until they turn that debt to equity. Then we got that mess of Ray Ransom, PMG and Mike Hall.

Where have these sustainable cost cutting measures disappeared too, we're still losing money; we're paying riduclous wages (Miller 25k; Hudson 15k not quite sure about Earnie expect that to be high).

I am not going to buy into the Malaysian dream of shirt sales in the far east; lets be honest having a poxy dragon doesnt necessarily mean every asian fan will come running to VT outlets in China etc to buy our new jerseys. Only successful clubs like Liverpool, Man Utd and Chelsea are able to do this. The only place we be selling East would be as far as Chepstow!!!!

In my opinion in order for our club to generate further interest in Malaysia we should have arranged a pre season tour there and promoted the red away jersey for shirt sales. Lets be honest; I cant see thousands of Malaysian fans catching flights to the UK to come and watch us.

Especially these days we have excellent video editing technology; so for example if games are showed live in Malaysia they could edit the blue colour red.....so it looks as if we're playing red at home (some foul play; but would keep us happy at least )

Well I'm absolutely convinced that details of these delicate negotiations have not been made public by the club and I believe that is the best policy. In my opinion it's a pity SH cannot do the same.

Confidential business negotiations should be respected and not made public in this way. My question in responce is why is it being made public.

Surely not more Malaysian bashing.

Gary its common knowledge in the club and surely this debt is the one that needs sorting once and for all, so we can all move on and get rid of Langston once and for all ? By the way no Malaysian bashing, even though they have taken my Bluebirds away,just stating some facts and then asking questions.

I honestly dont understand why they dont just pay Langston off, do u ?

Annis everyone wants this issue settled but my point here is that the negotiations appear to be at a delicate stage and it is better, again in my opinion, to leave the details private and confidential and not publish them on a messageboard.

You have started two threads this afternoon and both appear to cast doubts on the true intentions of the Malaysians in relation to this rebranding and the promised investment.

It's like Groundhog day and as I've said before VT & TG appear unable to do right for doing wrong, no metter what they do.

Sorry mate for me this is just good old fashioned Malaysian bashing.

maybe they want to delay so they dont have to put the rest of the money in that they promised they would do when it was settled

Well I'm absolutely convinced that details of these delicate negotiations have not been made public by the club and I believe that is the best policy. In my opinion it's a pity SH cannot do the same.

Confidential business negotiations should be respected and not made public in this way. My question in responce is why is it being made public.

Surely not more Malaysian bashing.

Gary its common knowledge in the club and surely this debt is the one that needs sorting once and for all, so we can all move on and get rid of Langston once and for all ? By the way no Malaysian bashing, even though they have taken my Bluebirds away,just stating some facts and then asking questions.

I honestly dont understand why they dont just pay Langston off, do u ?

Annis everyone wants this issue settled but my point here is that the negotiations appear to be at a delicate stage and it is better, again in my opinion, to leave the details private and confidential and not publish them on a messageboard.

You have started two threads this afternoon and both appear to cast doubts on the true intentions of the Malaysians in relation to this rebranding and the promised investment.

It's like Groundhog day and as I've said before VT & TG appear unable to do right for doing wrong, no metter what they do.

Sorry mate for me this is just good old fashioned Malaysian bashing.

Gary,

I am just stating the biggest obstacle the club has, is suppose to be Langston and yet we have a chance to finally get rid and I honestly cant understand why we are not, can u ?

Well I'm absolutely convinced that details of these delicate negotiations have not been made public by the club and I believe that is the best policy. In my opinion it's a pity SH cannot do the same.

Confidential business negotiations should be respected and not made public in this way. My question in responce is why is it being made public.

Surely not more Malaysian bashing.

Gary its common knowledge in the club and surely this debt is the one that needs sorting once and for all, so we can all move on and get rid of Langston once and for all ? By the way no Malaysian bashing, even though they have taken my Bluebirds away,just stating some facts and then asking questions.

I honestly dont understand why they dont just pay Langston off, do u ?

Annis everyone wants this issue settled but my point here is that the negotiations appear to be at a delicate stage and it is better, again in my opinion, to leave the details private and confidential and not publish them on a messageboard.

You have started two threads this afternoon and both appear to cast doubts on the true intentions of the Malaysians in relation to this rebranding and the promised investment.

It's like Groundhog day and as I've said before VT & TG appear unable to do right for doing wrong, no metter what they do.

Sorry mate for me this is just good old fashioned Malaysian bashing.

Gary,

I am just stating the biggest obstacle the club has, is suppose to be Langston and yet we have a chance to finally get rid and I honestly cant understand why we are not, can u ?

I don't know Annis but I guess one party, either the club or SH, are unhappy with the proposed agreement. That's doesn't mean that there won't be an agreement it's just about finding the details acceptable to both parties.

The best news is that we appear to be getting closer to the agreement, as you rightly say Annis this is the news most all Cardiff fans want to hear Langston has been settled.

Best possible news lets just hang on in there and let the club and SH sort out the details I'm convinced they will.

SURELY THE FOLLOWING IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT DEBTS THAT NEED TO BE SORTED MORE THAN ANYTHING ?

I am not siding with anyone, I just what your honest answers/opinions.


So the Malaysians ask Sam/Langston to meet up and discuss sorting out the £24 mill debt.
TG meets Sam and Sam agrees to take less than half £10 mill, as if Sam goes to court now and wins which he would, Sam would prob get peanuts as if the club then went under the Malaysians have first charge on our club. The Malaysians need Langston sorted as fast as possible so it appears as they can then change our debt in to shares as agreed and was suppose to have been done over a year ago at the shareholders meeting.

Solicitors receive all the paper work from the Malaysians(VT)agreeing the £10 mill, but and I mean but, it now says £3 mill upfront and £7 mill next May 2013. Sam/Langston say hold on u have moved the goal posts, no deal.


If the Malaysians want to convert all debts in to shares now, surely they need this settling now ?




My questions to u all.


Why not pay Sam/Langston the £10 mill now upfront and get rid of him once and for all ?

Would u trust them to pay Sam/Langston the £7 mill next May 2013 if we got promotion or never got promotion ?

Why are they then still lending us the money at 7% interest ?

Forget if your a Sam fan/hater or Malaysian fan etc, who is in the right on this ?

How do u expect the Malaysians to give our club £100 mill, interested to see/read fans answers on this one.

I have researched VT for 2 years now and around 14/15 months ago I predicted that if we had not been promoted to the Premier League by the summer of 2012, he would throw the kitchen sink at an attempt to get up this season (Malky’s & Cardiff’s biggest ever budget).

The reason? There is a general election in Malaysia in June/July 2013 and if the current UMNO Government (whose official party colour is red btw) is returned VT gets his betting licence which will be worth billions to him.

That is why he is only offering Langston/Sam this deal now because VT doesn't need control of Cardiff City until next summer when hopefully he gets his betting licence and we are in the Premier League.

Personally if I were Langston I'd take the £3m now/£7m later offer. After all if UMNO don't get elected back into power who is to say VT might not up sticks leave the club and pay them nothing?

There is no right or wrong in business, you do what is best for yourself and that is what the Malaysians are doing, as is Sam for himself.

Finally I assume VT/TG charge 7% interest because that is the amount PMG charge on their loans and indeed Langston also currently charge 7% but will not collect it if they agree a settlement with VT.

3m now 7m in ten months?

Take it Sam. It will be watertight. Whats ten more months if the rest of what
your owed is secured? You cant play hard ball if you havent got the ball!!!

Not the best scenario for Sam but if the 7m is used to buy new players for
Cardiff Citys serious promotion bid next season then its sensible by Tan.

Thats totally unbiased cos i dont trust either of them

SURELY THE FOLLOWING IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT DEBTS THAT NEED TO BE SORTED MORE THAN ANYTHING ?

I am not siding with anyone, I just what your honest answers/opinions.


So the Malaysians ask Sam/Langston to meet up and discuss sorting out the £24 mill debt.
TG meets Sam and Sam agrees to take less than half £10 mill, as if Sam goes to court now and wins which he would, Sam would prob get peanuts as if the club then went under the Malaysians have first charge on our club. The Malaysians need Langston sorted as fast as possible so it appears as they can then change our debt in to shares as agreed and was suppose to have been done over a year ago at the shareholders meeting.

Solicitors receive all the paper work from the Malaysians(VT)agreeing the £10 mill, but and I mean but, it now says £3 mill upfront and £7 mill next May 2013. Sam/Langston say hold on u have moved the goal posts, no deal.


If the Malaysians want to convert all debts in to shares now, surely they need this settling now ?




My questions to u all.


Why not pay Sam/Langston the £10 mill now upfront and get rid of him once and for all ?

Would u trust them to pay Sam/Langston the £7 mill next May 2013 if we got promotion or never got promotion ?

Why are they then still lending us the money at 7% interest ?

Forget if your a Sam fan/hater or Malaysian fan etc, who is in the right on this ?

How do u expect the Malaysians to give our club £100 mill, interested to see/read fans answers on this one.

annis,my honest answer is "earnie can play a major part next season"....and what i mean is i simply dont believe one word the malaysians say...and obviously neither does sam

I don't know Sam only met him the once, but it is obvious he does not trust the Malaysians. And the more i hear as time goes on, and what i witness neither do i. I ain't a lawyer or claim to know jot on big business so who is right ? Only those in the negotiations know that answer.

When it all comes to backfire on the malaysians after geting to the prem then thinking they can turn around and settle it i hope it bites them on the arse and sam turns around and says "I WILL TAKE IT ALL NOW" to teach them a lesson. Im amazed why there still trying to drip feed him and them thinking he is going to buy it which hes not. If i done a job for somebody agreed a fee when the jobs done i go for the agreed amount and they say oh sorry but its this much now and you will have it in four payments i would be pissed so would anybody which is what the malaysians have done here. It makes no sence at all we got this still lingering over our club yet we are told one week in the media from the club "we want 100% of the club and will turn in it to equity" and the next "biggest transfer budget ever" yet we can not pay ten million to langston but fans really believe we got 100million how can there be if there not willing to pay ten million to move on with the the investment. They will continue to roll the club with 7% intrest thats all i can see them doing it for so this time next year on the accounts we will be near 100million in the red So much for this promise of is debt to equity.

I'm saying nothing or I'll be accused of only saying it for more brown envelopes off either side, Castle Blue has hit the nail on the head, it should be done behind closed doors and treated as a confidential business matter.
I don't want to get involved in Sam Hammam arguments now, got more than enough going on With Red and now the banning orders..


But in all seriousness, as a fan and fair minded in my opinion (obviously) I would like to see Sam?Langston get a fair deal out of this and the sooner the better, I want to see the Malaysians invest and in equity and I want the club to have a settled successful period on and off the pitch

If people think those views are down to me receiving bribes/backhanders then you must believe I am far more important than I actually feel myself, I'm just a fan, a chopsy, opinionated out spoken fan, but just a fan, not a fans leader and not on any side other than what's best for the club I have supported and loved for forty six years.

Why some people think that my views or support is worth paying for in the form of a bribe, is beyond me, but make your own minds up.

Teaching Sam a lesson in business! They seem very tuff business men, and know what works and I think Sam I caught up in something he could never come out on top. He should accept the deal and move on or he could en up with nothing and so could we!

Teaching Sam a lesson in business! They seem very tuff business men, and know what works and I think Sam I caught up in something he could never come out on top. He should accept the deal and move on or he could en up with nothing and so could we!

Not much of a lesson then because if there was something wrong with the way hes owed the 24million then they would not be offering him ANYTHING would they.

Teaching Sam a lesson in business! They seem very tuff business men, and know what works and I think Sam I caught up in something he could never come out on top. He should accept the deal and move on or he could en up with nothing and so could we!

Not much of a lesson then because if there was something wrong with the way hes owed the 24million then they would not be offering him ANYTHING would they.

But I think it's quite obvious that he is only owed 10 mill officially or they would have to offer him MORE wouldn't they?

Teaching Sam a lesson in business! They seem very tuff business men, and know what works and I think Sam I caught up in something he could never come out on top. He should accept the deal and move on or he could en up with nothing and so could we!

Not much of a lesson then because if there was something wrong with the way hes owed the 24million then they would not be offering him ANYTHING would they.

But I think it's quite obvious that he is only owed 10 mill officially or they would have to offer him MORE wouldn't they?

Why not pay him then ? if hes owed it so we can all move forward and the malaysians turn there debt in to equity ? Because as we stand there bumping up 7% intrest loans and doing whatever they want at the club and there not even are sole OWNERS 100% and we have had nothing for it as of yet bar rebrand &loans owed

Dodgy

The way the alleged 24m 'debt' materialised in the first place

Dodgy

How Sam said Langstone was nothing to do with him

Dodgy

How Cardiff City ended up in the High Court with him still denying
any involvement ( we could have gone to the wall had the Judge found for Langstone)

Dodgy

How the Malaysians are dealing with the whole affair.

Sorry Monsieur Hammam, what goes around comes around

^^^^^^^^^^ exactly!