I still dont understand ?

Gwyn in all fairness has an almost irefutable point here Annis. You can't rob a man with nothing, and if Tan is bankrolling the club he can do what he wants,.

Well VT is doing what he wants, but that does not mean I have to agree and roll over, true or not ?

True Annis, very true. All I'm saying is in the great scheme of things we are in a terrible position as a club, and have no real choices.

So long term we all have to go with it, otherwise what's the other option? Do a TLG and walk away? No, we have to see what pans out from this, because we have no other way out.

Gwyn in all fairness has an almost irefutable point here Annis. You can't rob a man with nothing, and if Tan is bankrolling the club he can do what he wants,.

Well VT is doing what he wants, but that does not mean I have to agree and roll over, true or not ?

But surely for everyone who has the best interests of the club at heart (which I know you do), its surely a fair point to say that you then have an obligation to come up with a viable plan B, as otherwise, none of us will have a club left to support.

Gwyn in all fairness has an almost irefutable point here Annis. You can't rob a man with nothing, and if Tan is bankrolling the club he can do what he wants,.

Which is my point from my earlier post. he must have reasons for any investment and I for one don't think its from the goodness of his heart. If he wanted to donate to charity, there are plenty of worthy causes.

What is Tan's objective? what is his payback?

Possibly he's shrewd enough to see the potential in us, that with a good level of financial backing could return a profit, but to get that return, he's going to have to spend a fair bit first.

Of course he's shrewd enough it's though how is more important that matters to existing fans.

annis,the red lovers have their heads in the sand all because of there pathetic premier league dream and their belief that vt is gonna spend big on players ...no chance cant see it ,hes hoping we go up ,the guy doesnt realise how hard it is to get out of this league.....hate all this red shit ,even my 6 year old asked "why are the shirts red we play in blue "....on top of that my 2 year old will never see the bluebirds,other than some team in red....still fuming !!

Im having difficulty explaining to my kid why the bluebirds now play in red.

A 65 year old lady said to me today, Ive been going since I was 10 years old, why are they doing this to the club I love, I only go to home games, so I want to see my team play in blue as I have always done, they are my Bluebirds, if I wanted to see the Red and the Dragon I would go to the Rugby or to St Davids day. We have never had real money but always survived with pride, money has ruined us, she went on but with tears in her eyes, I put her on the phone to Carl who is suddenly a Red fan and even he could not convince her to ever accept Red. These Malaysians are dividing and killing the heart in our club.

Feel so sorry for the lady. Anyone who dares to question her love for the club is just a cruel, despicable person. This is one of the true victims, and there are plenty more like her whose stories will go untold

The matter is not one current fan is the concern of the Malaysian Vision. All average 20,000 can and probably will in the main be replaced.

The matter is not one current fan is the concern of the Malaysian Vision. All average 20,000 can and probably will in the main be replaced.

Dream the f**k on.

South Wales is a poor area.

annis,the red lovers have their heads in the sand all because of there pathetic premier league dream and their belief that vt is gonna spend big on players ...no chance cant see it ,hes hoping we go up ,the guy doesnt realise how hard it is to get out of this league.....hate all this red shit ,even my 6 year old asked "why are the shirts red we play in blue "....on top of that my 2 year old will never see the bluebirds,other than some team in red....still fuming !!

Im having difficulty explaining to my kid why the bluebirds now play in red.

A 65 year old lady said to me today, Ive been going since I was 10 years old, why are they doing this to the club I love, I only go to home games, so I want to see my team play in blue as I have always done, they are my Bluebirds, if I wanted to see the Red and the Dragon I would go to the Rugby or to St Davids day. We have never had real money but always survived with pride, money has ruined us, she went on but with tears in her eyes, I put her on the phone to Carl who is suddenly a Red fan and even he could not convince her to ever accept Red. These Malaysians are dividing and killing the heart in our club.

Imagine the state she would be in if we went out of existence

Annis don't have a pop at Gwyn, i remember you encouraging everyone to do some flag waving when they came and if you revisit your posts as recent as last week you were very pro them.

So if you want them out whats your alternative? Cos lets face it you bricked it when you thought they were going.

Annis don't have a pop at Gwyn, i remember you encouraging everyone to do some flag waving when they came and if you revisit your posts as recent as last week you were very pro them.

So if you want them out whats your alternative? Cos lets face it you bricked it when you thought they were going.

Exactly my thoughts also. Annis i read your views and could see your change in attitude when you thought they might walk so what has changed now ? seems to be getting pretty suspicious .

Annis don't have a pop at Gwyn, i remember you encouraging everyone to do some flag waving when they came and if you revisit your posts as recent as last week you were very pro them.

So if you want them out whats your alternative? Cos lets face it you bricked it when you thought they were going.

Perhaps because its come to light that they were never pulling out just propoganda used by the Gwyn snd the reds to scaremonger people into u turning.

Up to last week we had been told by TG that we would be playing in BLUE.

Annis don't have a pop at Gwyn, i remember you encouraging everyone to do some flag waving when they came and if you revisit your posts as recent as last week you were very pro them.

So if you want them out whats your alternative? Cos lets face it you bricked it when you thought they were going.

Perhaps because its come to light that they were never pulling out just propoganda used by the Gwyn snd the reds to scaremonger people into u turning.

Up to last week we had been told by TG that we would be playing in BLUE.

Did you honestly expect them to say "I'm glad we are going ahead with the investment and rebranding as otherwise we were off"? If this was the case they would always say otherwise as up its good PR and would have raised even more concerns amongst us fans. They had to come out and say what they said - good business sense.

Even if they would have stayed, the hints were there that the future would have been very different. Blue yes, but no doubt the cash tap would have been turned off slowly and they would have balanced the books, hence cutting costs accordingly. Reduced squad, less quality maybe MM walks and the decline starts. Who knows what division we end up in but I think we would be looking down from here and not up with the investment. And yeah they referred to new investment or selling us, but who would look at us with our debt levels and zero chance of a return for years if ever? At least the malaysians have already accepted that risk.

Some would be happy to play at a lower level but in blue - its opinion and nothing wrong with that. But it's naive to think that we could have stayed as we are in terms of the financial backing of the club whilst remaining in blue. I believe it would have been a harsh reality and a tough period lasting many many years.

For me that's the key difference between red and blue. Now the decision had been made we will never know what would have happened, but the two scenarios would most likely have been worlds apart IMO.

Answering football questions are simple Annis. That is why guys like you and I love the game.

Can some one please explain to me ?

some decent answers please and honest debate.

First how come we are £82 mill in debt ?

Mainly becuase we don't have football men at the helm.

How will we get out of this debt ?

Premiership

By changing our badge, what have we achieved ?

Divided the fans

By changing our colour what have we achieved ?

Divided the fans

Who is paying the 7% interest ?

No one at the moment

So are the Red lovers now saying we are debt free and no more debt ?

Will be soon but I feel they dont realise it will not last for long espeically if we don't go up.