PROTEST PLANNED IN TREHARRIS TOMORROW

I like it Gwyn
However for me and many others we can't really see how by changing the colour will prevent the club leaking a million a month...Are they saying by changing to red and increasing the capacity that folk will flood to the stadium ?
Its difficult to believe that these guys made their money on these type of notions but then again I'm not in marketing.

He got so much money mate I don't think it matters, its a bit like that film BUILD IT AND THEY WILL COME the Kevin Cosner baseball film.
The only way they will come is if we are successful, you can't just but success, but having some serious financial backing does help.

And you have a go at us for being childish Chief.

When did I do that?

You got your way Gwyn is there really the need to wipe people's nose in it.

that,s the way it looks from here chief.bit of humility from gywn wouldn,t go amiss here

Real Bites

I am afraid that it is you that is a million miles away. The analogy is there for everyone to see. Both were failing businesses that needed to make drastic changes to succeed. People told me it would never work and I was wasting my money but I knew if certain changes were made we could make it work.

Did a minority hate the changes....yes, did we lose some customers......yes, these were customers who as Gwyn said don't like to que at the bar, they don't like the sound of a jukebox, they hate the fact that the place is packed out on weekends and they can't watch x factor in peace and quiet. Will I lose sleep over these customers certainly not because I can't please everyone and these are the same time of people that make ridiculous comments like I would rather see us face administration and play in League 2 but at least we will have our pride and heritage in tact.

Some people hate change and the fact that I changed a dirty, musty old bar into a nice sports bar annoyed people but that's business, I even had one old guy complain because I changed to new glasses that gave his pint more life!! What I will say though is this, I took more money over the bar in the opening night than the pub had taken in it's last 2 months of trading and that is a genuine fact, trust me change isn't always bad!!

It's ok though, your 20 stone and 6 foot 6.[/quote]

Real Bites

I am afraid that it is you that is a million miles away. The analogy is there for everyone to see. Both were failing businesses that needed to make drastic changes to succeed. People told me it would never work and I was wasting my money but I knew if certain changes were made we could make it work.

Did a minority hate the changes....yes, did we lose some customers......yes, these were customers who as Gwyn said don't like to que at the bar, they don't like the sound of a jukebox, they hate the fact that the place is packed out on weekends and they can't watch x factor in peace and quiet. Will I lose sleep over these customers certainly not because I can't please everyone and these are the same time of people that make ridiculous comments like I would rather see us face administration and play in League 2 but at least we will have our pride and heritage in tact.

Some people hate change and the fact that I changed a dirty, musty old bar into a nice sports bar annoyed people but that's business, I even had one old guy complain because I changed to new glasses that gave his pint more life!! What I will say though is this, I took more money over the bar in the opening night than the pub had taken in it's last 2 months of trading and that is a genuine fact, trust me change isn't always bad!!

It's ok though, your 20 stone and 6 foot 6.

The navi is bumping with fanny also these days and its busy which is more than i can say for past owners for the last few years, change was good but not to are badge/colour

oh dear comparing a pub makeover to the changing the one thing that is most symbolic to a football club.

Unless you are like Adam Brown and support multiple football clubs comparing pubs to football clubs just isnt going to cut it.

Why cant everybody just wait 11 months to see how much VT has delivered on the rebrand.
In that time we should at least have achieved
1. Debt Free( All money invested turned into equity)
2. Training ground under construction
3. Stadium expansion due to start.(this will increase revenue/attendances by offering more family stand ticketing if not in premier league)

Increased playing budget doesn't guarantee promotion so it would be unfair to expect the board to deliver this in one season.

If VT has not delivered points 1-3 let the protest begin RED & Blue factions as one

Why cant everybody just wait 11 months to see how much VT has delivered on the rebrand.
In that time we should at least have achieved
1. Debt Free( All money invested turned into equity)
2. Training ground under construction
3. Stadium expansion due to start.(this will increase revenue/attendances by offering more family stand ticketing if not in premier league)

Increased playing budget doesn't guarantee promotion so it would be unfair to expect the board to deliver this in one season.

If VT has not delivered points 1-3 let the protest begin RED & Blue factions as one

I dont care if he delivers all 3 unless some plausible reason comes to light why it could only be acheived in red and not blue.

And you have a go at us for being childish Chief.

When did I do that?

You got your way Gwyn is there really the need to wipe people's nose in it.

that,s the way it looks from here chief.bit of humility from gywn wouldn,t go amiss here

Humility for what, we still got people planning protests, doing all they can to scupper things and possibly harm the club I love, and you expect me to let them just go about it without fighting back.

Why cant everybody just wait 11 months to see how much VT has delivered on the rebrand.
In that time we should at least have achieved
1. Debt Free( All money invested turned into equity)
2. Training ground under construction
3. Stadium expansion due to start.(this will increase revenue/attendances by offering more family stand ticketing if not in premier league)

Increased playing budget doesn't guarantee promotion so it would be unfair to expect the board to deliver this in one season.

If VT has not delivered points 1-3 let the protest begin RED & Blue factions as one

Spot on, let's see, let's give him the chance to deliver, let us show some trust and if he shafts us, then go for the jugular.

Nobody wants to be red, but you would rather the club stayed mired in debt and struggling with out investment.

oh dear comparing a pub makeover to the changing the one thing that is most symbolic to a football club.

Unless you are like Adam Brown and support multiple football clubs comparing pubs to football clubs just isnt going to cut it.

You're missing the whole point and failing miserably to be smart. The badge is important to you the same as the old bar was important to these customers, believe when I say they spent more time there than you ever could at Cardiff City, the comparison is in the fact of the change to take a business forward no matter what business and what change.

oh dear comparing a pub makeover to the changing the one thing that is most symbolic to a football club.

Unless you are like Adam Brown and support multiple football clubs comparing pubs to football clubs just isnt going to cut it.

You're missing the whole point and failing miserably to be smart. The badge is important to you the same as the old bar was important to these customers, believe when I say they spent more time there than you ever could at Cardiff City, the comparison is in the fact of the change to take a business forward no matter what business and what change.

You are missing the point.

People drink in multiple pubs, there is no unwritten rule if I drink in your pub I dont drink anywherelse.

If I stopped liking your pub and its changes I can go and get the exact same beer in another pub.

Thats not quite the same with football clubs.

And you have a go at us for being childish Chief.

When did I do that?

You got your way Gwyn is there really the need to wipe people's nose in it.

that,s the way it looks from here chief.bit of humility from gywn wouldn,t go amiss here

Humility for what, we still got people planning protests, doing all they can to scupper things and possibly harm the club I love, and you expect me to let them just go about it without fighting back.

they have their views gywn like you have yours.you should be able to see their views.you once shared them.you have the right to change your mind i know that.you,re not fighting back.you have the slight majority who through fear of losing c.c.fc are with you.you have the club on your side so fighing back you ain,t .this is about humiliating a few people.let the protests happen.as long as they are peaceful it don,t matter.

Me beginning a loyalist will never stand by and leave the Navi fail, I'll do my bit and 'hold up' that yellow bar every Saturday as well as the occasional mid weeker!

And you have a go at us for being childish Chief.

When did I do that?

You got your way Gwyn is there really the need to wipe people's nose in it.

that,s the way it looks from here chief.bit of humility from gywn wouldn,t go amiss here

Humility for what, we still got people planning protests, doing all they can to scupper things and possibly harm the club I love, and you expect me to let them just go about it without fighting back.

The best thing is that when you try to impinge on their democratic right to protest by issuing 'warnings' thinly disguised as threats, no one will listen to you due to the disgusting way you have conducted yourself throughout.

Why cant everybody just wait 11 months to see how much VT has delivered on the rebrand.
In that time we should at least have achieved
1. Debt Free( All money invested turned into equity)
2. Training ground under construction
3. Stadium expansion due to start.(this will increase revenue/attendances by offering more family stand ticketing if not in premier league)

Increased playing budget doesn't guarantee promotion so it would be unfair to expect the board to deliver this in one season.

If VT has not delivered points 1-3 let the protest begin RED & Blue factions as one

I dont care if he delivers all 3 unless some plausible reason comes to light why it could only be acheived in red and not blue.

Ffs you've read the statements about why they want red. You may not like it but it's what VT wants. It may well be that it's just a personal preference but when your prepared to put 100m in then you get to make choices like that. Face up to it. The only difference between the so called pro reds and those against is they can see the bigger picture from a business perspective. Everybody would prefer to stay in blue but it's not going to happen for now. If youre waiting for some report to be issued that proves 100% that red is better than blue then accept that its not going to come. Move with it and one day it may well change back but at least we will be on a much stronger financial position

Who are the hell are you to tell others what to do you condesending little man?

Gwyn is'nt it about time you started growing up, forget the witty reposte, you got what you wanted, now get on with it.

Sel

oh dear comparing a pub makeover to the changing the one thing that is most symbolic to a football club.

Unless you are like Adam Brown and support multiple football clubs comparing pubs to football clubs just isnt going to cut it.

You're missing the whole point and failing miserably to be smart. The badge is important to you the same as the old bar was important to these customers, believe when I say they spent more time there than you ever could at Cardiff City, the comparison is in the fact of the change to take a business forward no matter what business and what change.

You are missing the point.

People drink in multiple pubs, there is no unwritten rule if I drink in your pub I dont drink anywherelse.

If I stopped liking your pub and its changes I can go and get the exact same beer in another pub.

You are looking at this very blinkered. You're only seeing this through your eyes. I agree with you because football is more important to me than which pub I drink in, however, I will pay for your beer all day if you can win arguement with these old blokes that they can just go and drink in another pub because it's the same. Their argument to you will be to support another club, football is football to them, it's all down to how you look at it but the point behind it all is exactly the same.



Thats not quite the same with football clubs.

Corkery its not blinkered the nearest analogy to your pub being brought up to date is moving from NP to the CCS.

Some didnt want it and still refuse to accept it but it was essential.

Changing your club colours and identity is not essential to move forward.

Corkery its not blinkered the nearest analogy to your pub being brought up to date is moving from NP to the CCS.

Some didnt want it and still refuse to accept it but it was essential.

Changing your club colours and identity is not essential to move forward.

If there was a que of people looking to invest in our club you would be spot on, however there isn't and the only people willing to keep us afloat happen to want to change our colours. Now unless there is someone out there willing to take us forward and stay blue I don't see what option we have so as I see it it is essential to change to move forward.

Gwyn is'nt it about time you started growing up, forget the witty reposte, you got what you wanted, now get on with it.

Sel

Agreed!

Who are the hell are you to tell others what to do you condesending little man?

Someone who is grown up enough to post without insults and to not keep on whining about the same thing day in day out. You know the reasons why the change is taking place as it comes down to what VT wants and thinks is best for the finances of the club. He may be wrong but history will be the judge.

Corkery its not blinkered the nearest analogy to your pub being brought up to date is moving from NP to the CCS.

Some didnt want it and still refuse to accept it but it was essential.

Changing your club colours and identity is not essential to move forward.

If there was a que of people looking to invest in our club you would be spot on, however there isn't and the only people willing to keep us afloat happen to want to change our colours. Now unless there is someone out there willing to take us forward and stay blue I don't see what option we have so as I see it it is essential to change to move forward.

Spot on.

As for change when is the outside of the navi going to change colour,just past it and its still blue,mabee gwyn and the boys r waiting for refurb on the stadium to get a few tins of red of the Malaysian owners ,mabee they will get a dragon on the sign outside ,I'm sure they they will chuck an extra few quid gwynns way to get rid of that horrible blue colour

Real Bites

I am afraid that it is you that is a million miles away. The analogy is there for everyone to see. Both were failing businesses that needed to make drastic changes to succeed. People told me it would never work and I was wasting my money but I knew if certain changes were made we could make it work.

Did a minority hate the changes....yes, did we lose some customers......yes, these were customers who as Gwyn said don't like to que at the bar, they don't like the sound of a jukebox, they hate the fact that the place is packed out on weekends and they can't watch x factor in peace and quiet. Will I lose sleep over these customers certainly not because I can't please everyone and these are the same time of people that make ridiculous comments like I would rather see us face administration and play in League 2 but at least we will have our pride and heritage in tact.

Some people hate change and the fact that I changed a dirty, musty old bar into a nice sports bar annoyed people but that's business, I even had one old guy complain because I changed to new glasses that gave his pint more life!! What I will say though is this, I took more money over the bar in the opening night than the pub had taken in it's last 2 months of trading and that is a genuine fact, trust me change isn't always bad!!

It's ok though, your 20 stone and 6 foot 6.

[/quote]

You are right about change not being bad.The pub analogy is simply showing how changes can make a business work when it was failing previously.I can give you examples where changes were made to pubs with hundreds of thousands spent and they still shut down so the analogy can work both ways.
Lets get back to comparing apples with apples shall we. You may see some similarity to us in the next example.
Roman Abramovich in 2003 took over Chelsea from Ken Bates and immeadiately embarked on an ambitious programme of commercial development, with the aim of making it a worldwide brand. Plans were announced to build a state-of-the-art training complex in Cobham, Surrey and money was made available to strengthen the squad and management.
In the year ending June 2005, Chelsea posted record losses of £140 million which is considerably more debt than Cardiff City.
Although Abramovich wanted to turn Chelsea into a world brand especially in eastern europe he did it through investing money in quality players and good high profile managers. As part of his marketing strategy and to align the club to the eastern european market he could have easily replaced the Chelsea lion with a bear or changed the traditional blue colour to a more communist friendly red or even replaced the blue seats or colour of the Chelsea stadium. Abramovich did none of these things yet he has one of the most successful and high profile clubs on the planet.
Abramovich has created this brand not by changing the clubs identity and trying to turn it into something else but instead has learnt that the clubs tradition and heritage was part of its branding strength.

Real Bites

I am afraid that it is you that is a million miles away. The analogy is there for everyone to see. Both were failing businesses that needed to make drastic changes to succeed. People told me it would never work and I was wasting my money but I knew if certain changes were made we could make it work.

Did a minority hate the changes....yes, did we lose some customers......yes, these were customers who as Gwyn said don't like to que at the bar, they don't like the sound of a jukebox, they hate the fact that the place is packed out on weekends and they can't watch x factor in peace and quiet. Will I lose sleep over these customers certainly not because I can't please everyone and these are the same time of people that make ridiculous comments like I would rather see us face administration and play in League 2 but at least we will have our pride and heritage in tact.

Some people hate change and the fact that I changed a dirty, musty old bar into a nice sports bar annoyed people but that's business, I even had one old guy complain because I changed to new glasses that gave his pint more life!! What I will say though is this, I took more money over the bar in the opening night than the pub had taken in it's last 2 months of trading and that is a genuine fact, trust me change isn't always bad!!

It's ok though, your 20 stone and 6 foot 6.

You are right about change not being bad.The pub analogy is simply showing how changes can make a business work when it was failing previously.I can give you examples where changes were made to pubs with hundreds of thousands spent and they still shut down so the analogy can work both ways.
Lets get back to comparing apples with apples shall we. You may see some similarity to us in the next example.
Roman Abramovich in 2003 took over Chelsea from Ken Bates and immeadiately embarked on an ambitious programme of commercial development, with the aim of making it a worldwide brand. Plans were announced to build a state-of-the-art training complex in Cobham, Surrey and money was made available to strengthen the squad and management.
In the year ending June 2005, Chelsea posted record losses of £140 million which is considerably more debt than Cardiff City.
Although Abramovich wanted to turn Chelsea into a world brand especially in eastern europe he did it through investing money in quality players and good high profile managers. As part of his marketing strategy and to align the club to the eastern european market he could have easily replaced the Chelsea lion with a bear or changed the traditional blue colour to a more communist friendly red or even replaced the blue seats or colour of the Chelsea stadium. Abramovich did none of these things yet he has one of the most successful and high profile clubs on the planet.
Abramovich has created this brand not by changing the clubs identity and trying to turn it into something else but instead has learnt that the clubs tradition and heritage was part of its branding strength. [/quote]

Agreed. But VT is not Abramovich and wants to do things his way. It's as simple as that. You won't get any proof that it's going to fail or be a great success until it has happened. We can talk around in circles into oblivion about the rights and wrongs and like now every day can be groundhog day but ultimately the results will speak for themselves

And you have a go at us for being childish Chief.

When did I do that?

You got your way Gwyn is there really the need to wipe people's nose in it.

that,s the way it looks from here chief.bit of humility from gywn wouldn,t go amiss here

Humility for what, we still got people planning protests, doing all they can to scupper things and possibly harm the club I love, and you expect me to let them just go about it without fighting back.

they have their views gywn like you have yours.you should be able to see their views.you once shared them.you have the right to change your mind i know that.you,re not fighting back.you have the slight majority who through fear of losing c.c.fc are with you.you have the club on your side so fighing back you ain,t .this is about humiliating a few people.let the protests happen.as long as they are peaceful it don,t matter.

Totally agree with you, respect other people's opinions, understand they are hurting, but the only people that I humiliate are those that can't debate or put their points over without dishing out their own abuse or attempts at humiliation.
If they debate properly, I'll debate and discuss things properly with them all day.
If they try dishing it out, i'll give it back to them with bows on it.

As for humiliation, it works both ways, have you seen some of the stick that as come my way this week, difference is to me it's like water off a ducks back, I love the club, i am doing what i do for my love of the club, not for back handers or pats on the back, not for five minutes on the telly, not for Sam Hammam,I'm doing it for the club I love and have loved for 46 years.

Great post Gwyn

Real Bites

I am afraid that it is you that is a million miles away. The analogy is there for everyone to see. Both were failing businesses that needed to make drastic changes to succeed. People told me it would never work and I was wasting my money but I knew if certain changes were made we could make it work.

Did a minority hate the changes....yes, did we lose some customers......yes, these were customers who as Gwyn said don't like to que at the bar, they don't like the sound of a jukebox, they hate the fact that the place is packed out on weekends and they can't watch x factor in peace and quiet. Will I lose sleep over these customers certainly not because I can't please everyone and these are the same time of people that make ridiculous comments like I would rather see us face administration and play in League 2 but at least we will have our pride and heritage in tact.

Some people hate change and the fact that I changed a dirty, musty old bar into a nice sports bar annoyed people but that's business, I even had one old guy complain because I changed to new glasses that gave his pint more life!! What I will say though is this, I took more money over the bar in the opening night than the pub had taken in it's last 2 months of trading and that is a genuine fact, trust me change isn't always bad!!

It's ok though, your 20 stone and 6 foot 6.

You are right about change not being bad.The pub analogy is simply showing how changes can make a business work when it was failing previously.I can give you examples where changes were made to pubs with hundreds of thousands spent and they still shut down so the analogy can work both ways.
Lets get back to comparing apples with apples shall we. You may see some similarity to us in the next example.
Roman Abramovich in 2003 took over Chelsea from Ken Bates and immeadiately embarked on an ambitious programme of commercial development, with the aim of making it a worldwide brand. Plans were announced to build a state-of-the-art training complex in Cobham, Surrey and money was made available to strengthen the squad and management.
In the year ending June 2005, Chelsea posted record losses of £140 million which is considerably more debt than Cardiff City.
Although Abramovich wanted to turn Chelsea into a world brand especially in eastern europe he did it through investing money in quality players and good high profile managers. As part of his marketing strategy and to align the club to the eastern european market he could have easily replaced the Chelsea lion with a bear or changed the traditional blue colour to a more communist friendly red or even replaced the blue seats or colour of the Chelsea stadium. Abramovich did none of these things yet he has one of the most successful and high profile clubs on the planet.
Abramovich has created this brand not by changing the clubs identity and trying to turn it into something else but instead has learnt that the clubs tradition and heritage was part of its branding strength.

Agreed. But VT is not Abramovich and wants to do things his way. It's as simple as that. You won't get any proof that it's going to fail or be a great success until it has happened. We can talk around in circles into oblivion about the rights and wrongs and like now every day can be groundhog day but ultimately the results will speak for themselves[/quote]

The above analogy is certainly a better example compared to one that uses a pub. Even though Abramovich had been there for 2 years and was still looking at a 140 million pound loss, he still resisted the need to turn the club into something else in ordrer to exploit more revenue.He stuck to the clubs traditions and poured more money in.