Pro Change people - Give us some proof

I would love to see some proof that changing our badge and kit colour will bring us more money.

I would love to see some proof that there is substantial revenue to be made in Malaysia from the Cardiff City brand.

I would love to see some proof that we could compete with United, Liverpool and Barcelona in Japan and china.

I would love to see some proof that we can compete for trophies BECAUSE not many Asians will drop Man United for us if we don't win premierhips and cups.

I would love to see some proof that he is going to pay us 100 million.

I would love to see some proof that they really give a shit about my club.

I would love to see some figures on how much money Man United make in Malaysia. I'd say not more than a few million a year.

I think you are f*cking dreaming if you think we can compete in Asia. Maybe we can get a small piece of the Malaysian market (which is financially small) but we will never be able to compete with Barcelona and Man United.

I'd like to see the proof that if we don't except so me change we'll still have a club.

I'd like to see the proof that if we don't except so me change we'll still have a club.

Fully agree. Tan knew we played in blue before he brought into the club and whilst there are plenty of teams who wear red!!! Patheitc in my opinion!!!

I'd like to see the proof that if we don't except so me change we'll still have a club.

looks like we are doomed then Mr Mainwaring ...... doomed

It's so funny to see the pro-red people calling the initial reaction's 'emotional' and 'factless', when their flag-waving, arse-licking, songsinging reactions were even more based on emotions and less on rational arguments.

There is no proof.

There will be in 5 years time - proof that the idea failed, that we'll have 15000 empty seats, that we'll have more debt, no promising youngsters....

Fergy it's impossible to answer some of those questions with hard facts but what i will say to you (having spent some time in that part of the world) is that it's impossible to interpret asians mindset using western logic.

I, for one don't expect them to drop man united. On the contrary i was amazed when i asked what team they supported i'd get responses like "man utd, liverpool and chelsea!"

Secondly i'm reading a boik called asian godfathers (VT is in the book) and the author says the godfathers biggest gift is being able to capitalise on their own markets.
If VT thinks he can make money off the asian market with the cardiff city brand then thats good enough for me.

Thirdly you can only negotiate from a position of power. I don't believe £72 million debt is a position of power so i'm afraid, for the future of cardiff city i'm willing to see VT implement these changes.

Nice to see the supporters sticking together for the benefit of our beloved club.

Because there is no PROOF of that behaviour in this thread.

I understand the sceptism amongst some supporters however the neglegance some show when they feel almost invincible in regards to what will happen if VT walked away as our Main Financial Backer is quite laughable.

You want the proof of that then here it is

We are around £70m in the Red singing to the tune of £1m going out of the club per month.
We cannot continue in that form and VT has organised a plan to counter that.
Only time will tell whether it will or won't, but one thing is for sure, if we don't do something our future won't be Blue or Red,
It will only be BLEAK!!!!!!

There is no proof but a businessman has suggested he was willing to bet £100million on it.

Only time would tell. if the money did not come, we would have a massive uprising, but if the money was forthcoming and the bet failed, we would still have written off our debts.

We have to be happy with our choices. I still say no changes whatsoever, but I am willing to stand up and accept the consequences, are others?

I'd like to see the proof that if we don't except so me change we'll still have a club.

Great answer

I'd like to see the proof that if we don't except so me change we'll still have a club.

Not an expert on football finances but see if anyone can work this out as I have been trying without luck.

If the club owe £70 mil of which £40 mil of it is to VT what sense is there in pulling out?

If they liquidate the club I doubt there are anywhere near £70 mil of assets so what they actually get would be split between all the creditors.

I don't agree with what the Malaysians initially proposed but neither do I think they are stupid. If they want to see any return from the club liquidation is the last thing they will do.

Would any of the scaremongers on here walk away from £40 mil even if they had VT's money?

No point trying to second guess what is gonna happen today just wait and see but the responses from some city fans on BOTH sides of the argument have left us with a very weak bargaining position.

So loads of people are telling me to agree with a red strip and a new badge yet there is no proof that such changes will bring success. I can obviously see $100m will help us but I can't see any proof or any answers to my original post.

I take it that the pro red people are taking a big gamble.

I hope the pro reds are right or they will all look really stupid.

I still don't get why asians will support us when we will never win the premiership even with 100m. Asians Premiership supporters are the biggest glory hunters in the world. They won't be suduced by mid table mediocracy.

Of course, because I don't believe in this guys arguments I must be a risk to this potentially new football franchise.

So loads of people are telling me to agree with a red strip and a new badge yet there is no proof that such changes will bring success. I can obviously see $100m will help us but I can't see any proof or any answers to my original post.

I take it that the pro red people are taking a big gamble.

I hope the pro reds are right or they will all look really stupid.

I still don't get why asians will support us when we will never win the premiership even with 100m. Asians Premiership supporters are the biggest glory hunters in the world. They won't be suduced by mid table mediocracy.

Of course, because I don't believe in this guys arguments I must be a risk to this potentially new football franchise.

c'mon mate thats a silly reply. people have tried to answer ur question as best they can but how are they supposed to give you evidence to the question, "give me evidence that cardiff city will make more money in asia playing in red!"

That's ridiculous and you know it is

It's an OPPORTUNITY. Doesn't mean it will 100% work but theres a good chance we can pull it off.

Don't you lot understand? £100mil of investment would be fantastic for this club.

Not to mention the emerging markets in the world are actually Asian, who love watching PREM teams and see red as THEIR (not ours) lucky colour and its part of their culture. It's not about shirt sales ffs. Its about appealing to Asian investors, Asian TV rights and more of an awareness.

It CAN work, VT & TG know the Asian market more than any of us.

It is not silly. I am being serious. If I am being called names and being labelled a threat to the future of my club, I would like my questions answered. I have been to Malaysia, spoken to many people there. I don't see how we can make any money at all over there. I would like some proof. That's all. If you haven't got any then don't reply to this thread. I am being genuine and I respect the views of other board members who care less about the colours and badge of my club than me. That doesn't bean they are lesser supporters or that they are knobheads. They are just different to me. I would like to know why people are blindly following these demands. Are they not listening to supporters of other clubs too? We are seriously damaging our reputation. This bloke from Malaysia has now (via the leak) driven a wedge between our fans. That in itself is well out of order.

Before this shit happened I defended the Malaysans. I supported them. They went too far. I now couldn't care if they left and I certainly don't care for Malaysia or any relationship with that country. I'm not racist. I don't like non democratic countries generally especially when the poor are terribly poor and the right are a tiny minority with most of the country's wealth but that's going off topic a bit.

That fact is mate ir's impossible to answer you question with evidence because it's an unprecidented move. I dont know a great dwal about what drives the malaysian economy or the malaysian people themselves but one thing i'm willing bet on is that vincent tan does. I'm also willing to bet that he wouldnt bother wasting his time in this venture if there wasnt money to be made.

As for the views of other fans, most of them i have read are jacks and i couldnt give 2 fucks what they think!

What does it matter either way?

Have you got £40mil to keep the club going for two years? If not

I would not throw good money after bad. I am not stupid. If I invested my fortune in a football club I would follow Arsenal's model. They do alright.

Spending beyond our means is stupid. Me and the other lads who are against sucking up to the Malaysians due to their unecessary demands to change the colours and the badge are NOT to blame. We didn't blow all this mney and take our debts from 1m to 70mill in the space of a few years.

We will never be big in Asia - Simply because we will not win the Premier League or play in the Champions League every year. We are not a huge club.

Liverpool have spent millions and got nowhere. We would not compete. I obviously could be wrong but I doubt Tan will give us enough cash to do a Man city. He isn't rich enough. If he was then why would he be looking for investors.

I would love to see some proof that changing our badge and kit colour will bring us more money.

I would love to see some proof that there is substantial revenue to be made in Malaysia from the Cardiff City brand.

I would love to see some proof that we could compete with United, Liverpool and Barcelona in Japan and china.

I would love to see some proof that we can compete for trophies BECAUSE not many Asians will drop Man United for us if we don't win premierhips and cups.

I would love to see some proof that he is going to pay us 100 million.

I would love to see some proof that they really give a shit about my club.

I would love to see some figures on how much money Man United make in Malaysia. I'd say not more than a few million a year.

I think you are f*cking dreaming if you think we can compete in Asia. Maybe we can get a small piece of the Malaysian market (which is financially small) but we will never be able to compete with Barcelona and Man United.