Culture change at our club is needed among fans

I'm not gonna get into the Sam Hamman debate so please don't turn this into that, but one of the things i think we all agree on is that Sam Hamman aligned himself with fans and gave the fans a voice.
Some fans got closer to Sam than others and therefore gained more headlines (or whatever). This is not a dig in any way shape or form.

Since Sam has gone this culture at our club has continued and if i dare say, even gone on to the next level.

Some things have worked out for the good of the club, e.g the march against ridsdale, but i think whatever side we are on the last few days have been a massive own goal at our club.

I know this is far more complex than i can explain and certain brain dead clowns burning malaysian flags like we're campaigning for the liberation of south wales shows just how deep the problems go, problems that none of us on here can ever sort out.

But i think a new maturity is required from those who are often projected as fans representatives.
People from the trust, people from this board and others need to meet in an amicable meeting so that the fans can be represented with one voice.

All to often, one side is trying to show that they are doing more than the other side etc. These things are for the school playground and a fundamental change in the way us fans tackle these issues needs to begin.

The problem is that whether they like it or not, Annis, Gwyn, Carl, TLG, Vince and a few others carry a lot of influence on these message boards and need to work together and choose their words very wisely before they use them on here or ccmb.

I hope some good can come out of this and fans can learn to pull together to become a constructive ratger than a destructive force.

We had the right to object but some should have done so in a far better way. This Facebook nonsense and twitter rubbish has spooked the malaysians and who can blame them with threats against their family and their well being.

We have to keep our passion for our club, i will never let that go......how does the poem go:

If you can keep your head while all about you people are losing theirs.

Craig of course we do, but if there were proper channels for this to be done it would be far more healthy and far more constructive.

You must see that annis and carl command a lot of influence on here as does TLG over on ccmb (again not a dig) but sometimes it would be better if their opinions weren't always in the public domain especially after such shoxk news about kit rebranding etc.

Public arguments over message boards are often seen between TLG and Annis, i also publicly argye with people on here (but no-one gives a toss about what i think)

I'm not gonna get into the Sam Hamman debate so please don't turn this into that, but one of the things i think we all agree on is that Sam Hamman aligned himself with fans and gave the fans a voice.
Some fans got closer to Sam than others and therefore gained more headlines (or whatever). This is not a dig in any way shape or form.

Since Sam has gone this culture at our club has continued and if i dare say, even gone on to the next level.

Some things have worked out for the good of the club, e.g the march against ridsdale, but i think whatever side we are on the last few days have been a massive own goal at our club.

I know this is far more complex than i can explain and certain brain dead clowns burning malaysian flags like we're campaigning for the liberation of south wales shows just how deep the problems go, problems that none of us on here can ever sort out.

But i think a new maturity is required from those who are often projected as fans representatives.
People from the trust, people from this board and others need to meet in an amicable meeting so that the fans can be represented with one voice.

All to often, one side is trying to show that they are doing more than the other side etc. These things are for the school playground and a fundamental change in the way us fans tackle these issues needs to begin.

The problem is that whether they like it or not, Annis, Gwyn, Carl, TLG, Vince and a few others carry a lot of influence on these message boards and need to work together and choose their words very wisely before they use them on here or ccmb.

I hope some good can come out of this and fans can learn to pull together to become a constructive ratger than a destructive force.

TBH buddy I think you will find that Annis, Gwyn, Carl, TLG & Vince already work quite closely and were not the ones who hounded TG & VT on Facebook/Twitter or wherever.

I honestly believe that we will look back on the last 48hrs as a turning point in fan involvement not because of the words of the above mentioned but because of the words of the silent majority who have finally woken up.

Which ever side you are on, for me the amazing thing has been the numbers posting their views. Last night I mavelled at usernames I hadn't seen before or didn't recongnise who all had low post counts who broke cover and made their voices heard.

That is very healthy and can only help in bringing a resolution to our problem.

I'm not gonna get into the Sam Hamman debate so please don't turn this into that, but one of the things i think we all agree on is that Sam Hamman aligned himself with fans and gave the fans a voice.

Haha, contradictory there mate saying you won't get into the Hammam debate and then sparking a catalyst for a Hammam debate!

Anyway, onto the rest of your post. I disagreed with both of you about the whole kit thing but it was nice that even though we disagreed there was no personal slagging or abuse. I'm ok with passionate disagreement but as you say, some of it went way too far.

I don't necessarily think the culture of the club needs to change. In fact, I think the fans having a stronger voice has been more beneficial. Yes, there are pros and cons but the pros outweigh the cons in my opinion.

I am not a Hammam fan, I never was. I wasn't a Ridsdale fan either. In fact, the only two people I have time for at the club right now are Steve Borley because of all the hard work he's put into the club and Michael Isaac because I had a good working relationship with him.

I think the Malaysians are just like any other foreign owners and they are in this for the financial gain, not the love of the club. However, that means we share a common interest with them... the desire for success. I think the fans can help the Malaysians just as much as the Malaysians can help the fans.

The past few days have seen the worst of our fans but there have also been the sparks of some of the best. The fans showing their true passion and standing up for what they believe in on both sides of the argument. If I was VT and TG I would be ignoring the pathetic minority that resorted to personal abuse and looking at the majority that showed so much passion over the club in the past few days. That is passion that 99% of clubs in the world couldn't generate and surely that alone shows the Malaysians that they have a sound investment here.

You will get idiots wherever you go. It isn't everywhere that you find a set of fans that are as proud and passionate as us lot.

Thanks for your responses lads, and like i said the above posts were not a dig. I have lost it with one or two people on here, but where people remained civil with me i remained civil with them (apart from canton magic who was obviously a jack trying to be clever).

We are a passionate set of fans, which can be good but the last few day it hasnt been good. The three of you who have replied to this thread are good posters who i know have the good of cardiff city at heart and whether you disagree with me i know it's because you truly believe i am wrong. Others on here are often just on a wind up and jist say things to be controversial and i find it impossible to debate with them

your right there has to be a culture change in the club with the fans, theres still posts being made that its the new,younger fans who are the only ones who want the change they just dont want to aknowledge the older fans want change as well

Thanks for your responses lads, and like i said the above posts were not a dig. I have lost it with one or two people on here, but where people remained civil with me i remained civil with them (apart from canton magic who was obviously a jack trying to be clever).

We are a passionate set of fans, which can be good but the last few day it hasnt been good. The three of you who have replied to this thread are good posters who i know have the good of cardiff city at heart and whether you disagree with me i know it's because you truly believe i am wrong. Others on here are often just on a wind up and jist say things to be controversial and i find it impossible to debate with them

Soppy c**t.

Nah, in all seriousness, the thing that makes this club and board so good is the group of lads that don't resort to cheap shots and personal abuse when debating and arguing stuff. My introduction to this board was based on me disagreeing about Hammam's legacy with others but debating it in a composed manner. We have since found we tend to agree on more stuff than we disagree. The same goes for others here. I've had some quality debates with the likes of Tony Blue Williams, nerd and many others.

The cream will always rise to the top and the dregs will always fall to the bottom. Nobody is perfect and nobody is always right. It will be interesting to see what results of this event. I am positive that a resolution will be found and in the last 48 hours we have shown the Malaysians more of our passion than our shame.

Great to read a decent debate about the issue, which is entirely right and proper.

I was firmly against the colour change and remain so - I'm pleased VT and TG changed their minds and fans stood up for what they believed in.

I'm also glad we stood up against goal music too last season.

I also despise the swivel eyed, pea brained racists who used the row for their own ends.

People need to remember VT and TG are hard-nosed businessmen who are in this to make money either through the club or by using the club to further their interests in Malaysia. Nothing wrong with that as that's how British club ownership works, rightly or wrongly.

If anyone thinks they are going to walk away from their £40m investment so far, I believe they're wrong.

They have four choices - 1- invest heavily and try to reach the Premier; 2 - make cutbacks and get the club to break even and try to sneak into the Prem on the cheap. 3- continue on current course losing £1m a month 4- walk away, club goes into administration and they lose £40m.

It aint going to be 3 or 4 - it's just as likely to be option 1 now as it was before the red revolution.

I also think they'll respect that a large proportion of the fans stood up for what they believed in and made their point constructively.

After all, they tried to change the culture of the club without consulting anyone let's remember. Too many people were spineless and willing to go along with whatever was suggested in my opinion.

They have saved this club from going into administration and I'm hugely grateful for that. They seem decent people and I hope they talk to people at the club, reach a decent compromise and move forward. There's a lot of potential at this club if handled correctly.