Sven wrote:AYES 202
NOES 432
A defeat by 230 votes
The Government's Brexit Bill is defeated and Jeremy Corbyn has tabled a 'Vote of No Confidence' in the Government
If the vote goes against the Government, Theresa May HAS to resign
A historic (if not surprising) and decisive night in British politics!
thomasblue wrote:dogfound wrote:thomasblue wrote:The 202 MPs should be sacked, they have a duty to deliver the will of the people
The country voted to leave. The deal did not allow that so this was the best outcome for the Leave camp
Backing that deal was keeping us in the EU through the back door
No deal is the only way now
not as simple as that, many of the 432 are remainers who do not want us to leave and many of the 202 voted for the deal because in their opinions it was the only way to get any sort of Brexit..
The only deal is no deal. The EU has made it that way by trying bullying tactics. We now need to call there bluff.
The only thing the MPs need to do is allow us to leave the EU with all our law making, Finances and border controls under our own control.
If the EU will not allow it we leave and go our seperate ways.
People underestimate how strong this country is
worcester_ccfc wrote:Not a shock. But definitely worse than she thought it would be.
Can’t see the No Confidence Motion getting through parliament tomorrow. She’ll have enough of her own MPs and the DUP to survive that.
Back at square one - but no deal has to be avoided.
I voted remain but I believe in democracy. Unfortunately, another referendum seems the most likely outcome now. If she goes to renegotiate her deal, the EU will offer her nothing more so it would be a pointless exercise.
SirJimmySchoular wrote:Sven wrote:AYES 202
NOES 432
A defeat by 230 votes
The Government's Brexit Bill is defeated and Jeremy Corbyn has tabled a 'Vote of No Confidence' in the Government
If the vote goes against the Government, Theresa May HAS to resign
A historic (if not surprising) and decisive night in British politics!
No, she doesn't have to resign, but she does have to call a General Election.
Doesn't matter though, because she's not going to lose a Confidence Vote in the Government in order for which to happen the government would have to vote against themselves.
It's historic alright, but only in terms of theatre rather than outcome, and it's certainly not decisive - just the latest little drama to create the illusion of accountability. In the end they'll do what they want to do and,since that's inconsistent with the vote, they will first appear to have no alternative except what they always intended to do.
thomasblue wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:Not a shock. But definitely worse than she thought it would be.
Can’t see the No Confidence Motion getting through parliament tomorrow. She’ll have enough of her own MPs and the DUP to survive that.
Back at square one - but no deal has to be avoided.
I voted remain but I believe in democracy. Unfortunately, another referendum seems the most likely outcome now. If she goes to renegotiate her deal, the EU will offer her nothing more so it would be a pointless exercise.
Why does no deal have to be avoided?
There is as good a chance that No deal is as good as a deal. Nobody knows what the right way to go is we just need to choose a path and take it.
The EU will soon come running after we leave with a decent trade deal and solution to Ireland. They need a deal as much as we do.
They are just playing there cards and unfortunatly they are better players than our lot
worcester_ccfc wrote:thomasblue wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:Not a shock. But definitely worse than she thought it would be.
Can’t see the No Confidence Motion getting through parliament tomorrow. She’ll have enough of her own MPs and the DUP to survive that.
Back at square one - but no deal has to be avoided.
I voted remain but I believe in democracy. Unfortunately, another referendum seems the most likely outcome now. If she goes to renegotiate her deal, the EU will offer her nothing more so it would be a pointless exercise.
Why does no deal have to be avoided?
There is as good a chance that No deal is as good as a deal. Nobody knows what the right way to go is we just need to choose a path and take it.
The EU will soon come running after we leave with a decent trade deal and solution to Ireland. They need a deal as much as we do.
They are just playing there cards and unfortunatly they are better players than our lot
That’s just my opinion. Should have made that clear.
I just think that no deal would be catastrophic.
thomasblue wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:thomasblue wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:Not a shock. But definitely worse than she thought it would be.
Can’t see the No Confidence Motion getting through parliament tomorrow. She’ll have enough of her own MPs and the DUP to survive that.
Back at square one - but no deal has to be avoided.
I voted remain but I believe in democracy. Unfortunately, another referendum seems the most likely outcome now. If she goes to renegotiate her deal, the EU will offer her nothing more so it would be a pointless exercise.
Why does no deal have to be avoided?
There is as good a chance that No deal is as good as a deal. Nobody knows what the right way to go is we just need to choose a path and take it.
The EU will soon come running after we leave with a decent trade deal and solution to Ireland. They need a deal as much as we do.
They are just playing there cards and unfortunatly they are better players than our lot
That’s just my opinion. Should have made that clear.
I just think that no deal would be catastrophic.
I wouldnt say catastrophic but i agree it could be bad.
The problem is nobody knows, it could end up being great for this country.
I was undecided at first but the longer this has gone on the more i lean towards leave. The conduct of the EU officials has been disgusting at times.
I believe this country has everything it needs to be succesful in the world without being tied to anybody else.
worcester_ccfc wrote:thomasblue wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:Not a shock. But definitely worse than she thought it would be.
Can’t see the No Confidence Motion getting through parliament tomorrow. She’ll have enough of her own MPs and the DUP to survive that.
Back at square one - but no deal has to be avoided.
I voted remain but I believe in democracy. Unfortunately, another referendum seems the most likely outcome now. If she goes to renegotiate her deal, the EU will offer her nothing more so it would be a pointless exercise.
Why does no deal have to be avoided?
There is as good a chance that No deal is as good as a deal. Nobody knows what the right way to go is we just need to choose a path and take it.
The EU will soon come running after we leave with a decent trade deal and solution to Ireland. They need a deal as much as we do.
They are just playing there cards and unfortunatly they are better players than our lot
That’s just my opinion. Should have made that clear.
I just think that no deal would be catastrophic.
TopCat CCFC wrote:dogfound wrote:Sven wrote:TopCat CCFC wrote:Sven wrote:TopCat CCFC wrote:Worse than what they thought .
Tony, indeed it is and I think it will surprise many insiders, too (MP's, Press, etc.)
I'm surprised she hasn't gone already but I guess the night is young
The night is still young Chris - But i think she will stay. The lady just won't give in .
Tony, a good friend of mine is with the Chaplaincy and one of his own friends/colleagues is Theresa May's vicar and close friend. When I suggested she should go with a heavy defeat, he said they'd had that conversation and her priest called her "an incredibly honourable lady, whose sense of duty would make her want to see it through" and he believed she would fight all the way
I do actually have some sympathy for her. Cameron dropped her in it, Boris and the sychophantic Gove plus her own stubbornness perpetuated the situation. But a loss in the 'no confidence' vote tomorrow would mean she has to go under the format/rules of that vote
Early suggestions are that the DUP will NOT vote against the Government, so the possibility of her winning that and remaining (excuse the pun) will be higher. Like you, I don't think she will take the decision herself, having stated previously she wants to "see it through before standing down at the next election"
the problem is though what she sees as being honourable and her duty are based on not wanting to leave the EU to start with.
and there lies the problem. the day after the vote people who had fought for the leave campaign should have been the ones following it through.
Agree with that .
Lengee wrote:The Vote of No confidence will fail. The conservative party will not do anything that is not in the parties interests. Sadly the whole referendum debacle was caused by divisions in their party. It was not due to some huge demand within the electorate of the UK.
Hence the shambolic government will limp on. The only alternative would be a party led by Corbyn which is not palatable to the majority in Britain.
May now offers to speak to other parties a mere 2 years too late. She had no plan B. Only the foolhardy would want a no deal that jeopardizes people's jobs and future.
Nothing further to say...that's my view. Goodnight
2blue2handle wrote:I do feel a tad sorry for Teresa, doing something she didn't vote for but stuck to it. Always voted Labour before last election but imagion voting for Corbyn with Abbot beside him. He couldn't even get proper coat for rememberence sunday.
SirJimmySchoular wrote:Sven wrote:AYES 202
NOES 432
A defeat by 230 votes
The Government's Brexit Bill is defeated and Jeremy Corbyn has tabled a 'Vote of No Confidence' in the Government
If the vote goes against the Government, Theresa May HAS to resign
A historic (if not surprising) and decisive night in British politics!
No, she doesn't have to resign, but she does have to call a General Election.
Doesn't matter though, because she's not going to lose a Confidence Vote in the Government in order for which to happen the government would have to vote against themselves.
It's historic alright, but only in terms of theatre rather than outcome, and it's certainly not decisive - just the latest little drama to create the illusion of accountability. In the end they'll do what they want to do and,since that's inconsistent with the vote, they will first appear to have no alternative except what they always intended to do.
ReesWestonSuperMare wrote:A couple of things -
The pound has risen after this result
Even if there is a general election Corbyn will lose it. Labour and he are 6 points behind in the polls - even after all this !!
He will lose his vote of no confidence in the Govt
There is a fixed term parliament act - and can only be over ruled by a two thirds majority vote in the commons - that will never happen.
The upshot of this - there wont be a general election, May will remain PM. The EU may or may not agree on a change in the agreement - otherwise either Article 50 will be extended or it's a no deal brexit.
The EU in no way shape or form want that - they need 39 billion from us, they have a trade surplus with us, the Irish are well and truely fecked if we reciprocate with trade tarifs and put barriers up to delay their exports to the rest of the EU
Sven wrote:SirJimmySchoular wrote:Sven wrote:AYES 202
NOES 432
A defeat by 230 votes
The Government's Brexit Bill is defeated and Jeremy Corbyn has tabled a 'Vote of No Confidence' in the Government
If the vote goes against the Government, Theresa May HAS to resign
A historic (if not surprising) and decisive night in British politics!
No, she doesn't have to resign, but she does have to call a General Election.
Doesn't matter though, because she's not going to lose a Confidence Vote in the Government in order for which to happen the government would have to vote against themselves.
It's historic alright, but only in terms of theatre rather than outcome, and it's certainly not decisive - just the latest little drama to create the illusion of accountability. In the end they'll do what they want to do and,since that's inconsistent with the vote, they will first appear to have no alternative except what they always intended to do.
ReesWestonSuperMare wrote:A couple of things -
The pound has risen after this result
Even if there is a general election Corbyn will lose it. Labour and he are 6 points behind in the polls - even after all this !!
He will lose his vote of no confidence in the Govt
There is a fixed term parliament act - and can only be over ruled by a two thirds majority vote in the commons - that will never happen.
The upshot of this - there wont be a general election, May will remain PM. The EU may or may not agree on a change in the agreement - otherwise either Article 50 will be extended or it's a no deal brexit.
The EU in no way shape or form want that - they need 39 billion from us, they have a trade surplus with us, the Irish are well and truely fecked if we reciprocate with trade tarifs and put barriers up to delay their exports to the rest of the EU
Sven wrote:SirJimmySchoular wrote:Sven wrote:AYES 202
NOES 432
A defeat by 230 votes
The Government's Brexit Bill is defeated and Jeremy Corbyn has tabled a 'Vote of No Confidence' in the Government
If the vote goes against the Government, Theresa May HAS to resign
A historic (if not surprising) and decisive night in British politics!
No, she doesn't have to resign, but she does have to call a General Election.
Doesn't matter though, because she's not going to lose a Confidence Vote in the Government in order for which to happen the government would have to vote against themselves.
It's historic alright, but only in terms of theatre rather than outcome, and it's certainly not decisive - just the latest little drama to create the illusion of accountability. In the end they'll do what they want to do and,since that's inconsistent with the vote, they will first appear to have no alternative except what they always intended to do.
Yes, apologies but that is what I meant .
She has to resign her Government at the behest of the Queen and another election be called (with her very likely to be Party leader
Don't think it will happen though and feel she will fight on until the business of Brexit (or not) is sorted
captbirdseye wrote:I sometimes wonder whether people take the time to actually read the implications of a 'No Deal' or just rely on funny Facebook memes for their information.
But hey, it's always the evil EU and their dirty tactics instead of our own political elite making billions of hedge funds and forex ie Farage and Odey.
dogfound wrote:SirJimmySchoular wrote:Sven wrote:AYES 202
NOES 432
A defeat by 230 votes
The Government's Brexit Bill is defeated and Jeremy Corbyn has tabled a 'Vote of No Confidence' in the Government
If the vote goes against the Government, Theresa May HAS to resign
A historic (if not surprising) and decisive night in British politics!
No, she doesn't have to resign, but she does have to call a General Election.
Doesn't matter though, because she's not going to lose a Confidence Vote in the Government in order for which to happen the government would have to vote against themselves.
It's historic alright, but only in terms of theatre rather than outcome, and it's certainly not decisive - just the latest little drama to create the illusion of accountability. In the end they'll do what they want to do and,since that's inconsistent with the vote, they will first appear to have no alternative except what they always intended to do.
well that's the cynical take on it..
but as time goes on it does look more and more likely that its exactly what some MPs are doing.
I think they are playing with fire and really do not get it.
bluebird7291 wrote:pembroke allan wrote:bluebird7291 wrote:Fantastic news
Who for? The mps who want to destroy the democratic will of the people?
We vote a government in to do the best for the country. And the biggest impact on our country for decades have been put in the hands of plumbers, postmen etc.
When the average Joe doesn't really have any idea of the potential impact on their lives.
If you was a plumber you wouldn't ask the house holder what tool to use on a job just to see if they can guess right.
castleblue wrote:I can only see one way out of this crisis, and that's exactly what this is, and that's to take this decision away from Westminster and move immediately to a 2nd referendum and that referendum have just two options, Remain on our current terms or Leave on the terms negotiated.
I voted leave in the referendum and despite there being an overwhelming majority in favour of leave in my constituency last night our MP, Wayne David, voted against the deal negotiated by Theresa May, Why? I feel totally let down by my MP and I will be sending him an email today telling him just that and making him one promise, he will never get my vote again.
I actually feel a little sympathy for Theresa May as just over a month ago 117 of her own MP's voted against her in the Tory party confidence vote in her leadership, last night 116 of her MP's voted against her agreement which has turned a drama into a full blown crisis. However this morning the posh boy Rees-Mogg is on Sky saying HIS group will support TM in the confidence vote this evening. These are the type of games being played by the very people we elect to run our country on our behalf.
I believe it's time for the ordinary people of this country to settle this issue once and for all and that's through a 2nd referendum, last time I voted leave and will do so again but whatever the outcome the result MUST be respected by all sides.
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