OT: BREXIT (POLL)

Seems the EU itself is doing the job our own UK Government is failing to deliver...a full Brexit

Seems the EU itself is doing the job our own UK Government is failing to deliver...a full Brexit

Reading various papers EU could force UK to say fck u we are leaving you sort out your economic mess which will ensue with a no deal? After all it's not only uk that will suffer that's for sure

Never trust the French !!!

They are trying to push us into a second referendum. They need our money. I think a lot of what is being done by the UK government and the EU is all designed to end in a mess, ensuring that there will be no option for anything other than another vote. How hard is it to put so called secret documents full of scare tactics in an envelope before walking along a street in front of the press, rather than just carry it in full view of every camera around. May is a remainer, the people she is negotiating with want us to remain so that they can continue to dominate us. Watch what happens next - referendum no.2.

Never trust the French !!!

Or the Krauts

They've told us clearly many times what the options are, why doesn't she listen? If she doesn't like it then let's see if she's got the guts to crash out. Yesterday's theatrics was playing to the Tory gallery.

They've told us clearly many times what the options are, why doesn't she listen? If she doesn't like it then let's see if she's got the guts to crash out. Yesterday's theatrics was playing to the Tory gallery.

They’ve told us nothing, they simply rejected Mays pitch. I said right at the start we should simply walk away because they want to frustrate, delay and divide, not deal.

Never trust em indeed.. save them from the krauts, and all you get is 50yrs of grief.

They are trying to push us into a second referendum.

Source: The Independent 27 July 2018

Should a second referendum get called, the odds of the UK voting to remain are also at record low of 1/8, with 4/1 offered on another Leave vote. That compares to 1/3 remain 2/1 leave at the start of the year, and 1/5 remain 3/1 leave before Chequers.

Paddy Power makes Remain the overwhelming favourite to succeed (1/7) with Leave the rank outsider (4/1) although the bookie opined that “we’ve heard that before”.

They are trying to push us into a second referendum.

Source: The Evening Standard 5 September 2018

Brexit news latest: Brits would vote 59-41 to remain in EU if second referendum was held, new poll shows

They are trying to push us into a second referendum.

Source: The Evening Standard 5 September 2018

Brexit news latest: Brits would vote 59-41 to remain in EU if second referendum was held, new poll shows

If polls were accurate, we would not be negotiating an exit right now, the remainers were supposed to win the last referendum quite comfortably. If these polls are like the last ones, the leave vote will be bigger than last time.

Never mind Fekin Brexit, roll on Wexit. Wales part of a strong European Union and Fek the English once and for all

If polls were accurate, we would not be negotiating an exit right now, the remainers were supposed to win the last referendum quite comfortably. If these polls are like the last ones, the leave vote will be bigger than last time.

If, as you say, the leave vote will be bigger this time then you would not be afraid of giving the people the chance to make a final decision on BREXIT?

If polls were accurate, we would not be negotiating an exit right now, the remainers were supposed to win the last referendum quite comfortably. If these polls are like the last ones, the leave vote will be bigger than last time.

If, as you say, the leave vote will be bigger this time then you would not be afraid of giving the people the chance to make a final decision on BREXIT?

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

I have no problem with another vote. I am an ordinary person who is not loaded with money, and I don't have investments dotted all over Europe. It will make little difference to me if we leave or stay, just as it made no difference to me when we joined.

We will all be fed another load of bull and as I did last time, have to pick the bones out of it. I did'nt believe half of what Boris and his cronies had to say, and I'm still waiting for that emergency budget old George said would be needed within days of a leave vote to stop our economy falling off the edge of a cliff. I also remember him saying unemployment would soar, not only the economy but the pound would also collapse, and interest rates would be sky high causing hardship to nearly every family in the country. Did'nt get that quite right did he?

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

I have no problem with another vote. I am an ordinary person who is not loaded with money, and I don't have investments dotted all over Europe. It will make little difference to me if we leave or stay, just as it made no difference to me when we joined.

We will all be fed another load of bull and as I did last time, have to pick the bones out of it. I did'nt believe half of what Boris and his cronies had to say, and I'm still waiting for that emergency budget old George said would be needed within days of a leave vote to stop our economy falling off the edge of a cliff. I also remember him saying unemployment would soar, not only the economy but the pound would also collapse, and interest rates would be sky high causing hardship to nearly every family in the country. Did'nt get that quite right did he?

Don't hold your breath Steve, the night is young so to speak.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

I'm convinced our government and the EU want another one, I just wish they would come out with it rather than manufacture a position where there is no option other than to go back to the country. Going back to polls, the very last poll taken just before the last vote gave remain a 10 point lead. There was huge discrepancy with that one, just as with the last election. I think these polls have now become completely irrelevant. I wonder how many on this forum have been contacted to ask for their views.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

I'm convinced our government and the EU want another one, I just wish they would come out with it rather than manufacture a position where there is no option other than to go back to the country. Going back to polls, the very last poll taken just before the last vote gave remain a 10 point lead. There was huge discrepancy with that one, just as with the last election. I think these polls have now become completely irrelevant. I wonder how many on this forum have been contacted to ask for their views.

I think there's many who want another referendum Steve and from both sides of the argument. The problem is its, as ever, highly political. The Labour hierarchy would prefer a General Election and for good reason. I expect all options to be on the table shortly in the event we do not reach a deal by mid October. For us politicos this is proving to be excellent theatre at the very least

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

Second one for what leave the EU?
Remember referendum to join but must have memory loss as don't remember one for to leave before? As for better informed on what? As far as aware most scare mungering predictions of what will happen with brexit did not materialise and tbh does the average public actually know what will happen because politicians and the like certainly do not know.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

Second one for what leave the EU?
Remember referendum to join but must have memory loss as don't remember one for to leave before? As for better informed on what? As far as aware most scare mungering predictions of what will happen with brexit did not materialise and tbh does the average public actually know what will happen because politicians and the like certainly do not know.

Join or Leave Allan, two sides of the same coin.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

I'm convinced our government and the EU want another one, I just wish they would come out with it rather than manufacture a position where there is no option other than to go back to the country. Going back to polls, the very last poll taken just before the last vote gave remain a 10 point lead. There was huge discrepancy with that one, just as with the last election. I think these polls have now become completely irrelevant. I wonder how many on this forum have been contacted to ask for their views.

I think there's many who want another referendum Steve and from both sides of the argument. The problem is its, as ever, highly political. The Labour hierarchy would prefer a General Election and for good reason. I expect all options to be on the table shortly in the event we do not reach a deal by mid October. For us politicos this is proving to be excellent theatre at the very least

Yes, gives us something to argue over once we have finished discussing the latest game. Like I said, I am not one of the landed gentry and I expect any difference to me whatever the outcome will amount to little more than a couple of pints a week. I have to say had remain won the last time, I would have accepted the voice of the majority and got on with things. Not sure where it will all end. What if remain were to win by one or two points next time? Maybe have to go with the toss of a coin or settle it with a darts match.

As i said above, we will have another vote. The last one was said to be a once in a lifetime vote according to all involved, and the people had their say. If "leave" win the next one, I am sure the remainers will want a best of five once in a lifetime vote.

If you know the result won't change then surely it is not a problem for you.

The result of the first referendum was 51.9% to 48.1% hardly overwhelming.

People are far better informed now of the consequences of BREXIT than they were last time.

and you can put your mortgage on a Leave win and clean up with the bookies. Unless of course you think a better informed public would vote differently?

And the vote in 2016 was a second vote anyway so it set a precedent for multiple referendums.

I'm convinced our government and the EU want another one, I just wish they would come out with it rather than manufacture a position where there is no option other than to go back to the country. Going back to polls, the very last poll taken just before the last vote gave remain a 10 point lead. There was huge discrepancy with that one, just as with the last election. I think these polls have now become completely irrelevant. I wonder how many on this forum have been contacted to ask for their views.

I think there's many who want another referendum Steve and from both sides of the argument. The problem is its, as ever, highly political. The Labour hierarchy would prefer a General Election and for good reason. I expect all options to be on the table shortly in the event we do not reach a deal by mid October. For us politicos this is proving to be excellent theatre at the very least

Yes, gives us something to argue over once we have finished discussing the latest game. Like I said, I am not one of the landed gentry and I expect any difference to me whatever the outcome will amount to little more than a couple of pints a week. I have to say had remain won the last time, I would have accepted the voice of the majority and got on with things. Not sure where it will all end. What if remain were to win by one or two points next time? Maybe have to go with the toss of a coin or settle it with a darts match.

Oh I'd never call it arguing Steve, more debating. We might have different views but it's always a pleasure to hear yours.

And the precedent set after the 1975 vote, was that there was no second vote.

I don't usually bother to address remoaners on the subject because it only encourages them to deny democratic outcomes they don't like , and holds out hope that they can change reality, which is cruel.
However , on this occasion can I suggest that they get together with Gary Lineker and see if they can either get the result against Manchester City reversed or at least force a replay ?

The referendum was David Cameron's way of silencing the Euro-Sceptics wing that had split the Tory part since the late 80s.

He was sure he would win and would rid the Tories of internal divisions.

Capital Punishment was abolished in 1965. A referendum on Capital punishment in the subsequent 50 years would have seen the return of the death penalty (source).

This is undemocratic.

Do we elect governments to lead or to follow?

The referendum was David Cameron's way of silencing the Euro-Sceptics wing that had split the Tory part since the late 80s.

He was sure he would win and would rid the Tories of internal divisions.

Capital Punishment was abolished in 1965. A referendum on Capital punishment in the subsequent 50 years would have seen the return of the death penalty (source).

This is undemocratic.

Do we elect governments to lead or to follow?

Of course Cameroon will be recorded in history as the Prime Minister who called a referendum intending to call it off but painted himself into such a corner that he had no alternative but to actually hold it in the end. Most remarkable was that it apparently never occurred to him that he might lose it.

Couple of things, capital punishment wasn't abolished in 1965 , just capital punishment for murder. We kept it for years after that for treason and another offence till it was eventually binned as an option by a Jack Straw agreement with the EU. Interestingly, we could bring it back once we leave if we want to, but that's by the way .
More importantly , democracy isn't defined simply by a majority opinion and there's not a referendum on every single issue either. I think it was George Washington who said that democracy was more complicated that three wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner - we can see how that one would end.
It certainly is undemocratic to hold a vote as we did on leaving the EU then try to ignore the outcome, but it's not undemocratic to ignore popular opinions which have not been put to a vote though - in fact if we attempted to act upon every change in public opinion the result would be total chaos .

We kept it for years after that for treason and another offence till it was eventually binned as an option by a Jack Straw agreement with the EU. Interestingly, we could bring it back once we leave if we want to, but that's by the way .

Treason was not punishable by the death penalty, High Treason was the crime you are referring to. Not sure what it adds to the greater point but you seemed to want to get the facts straight.

It certainly is undemocratic to hold a vote as we did on leaving the EU then try to ignore the outcome, but it's not undemocratic to ignore popular opinions which have not been put to a vote though

A second referendum is not ignoring the first, quite the contrary. It would be the only legitimate way of addressing a change in public opinion in light of the events that followed first referendum.

If you accept that a referendum was an appropriate method for making the decision then I fail to see how it is not an appropriate method for reviewing the decision.

This leaves the point that it is undemocratic to review the decision. I fail to see how asking the public what they think undemocratic. In 1973 67% voted to join the Common Market was is undemocratic to hold a referendum to leave?

Any democracy reserves the rights to change their minds.

With that in mind if we have a 3rd referendum on membership of the EU and we vote to remain, how often should the population be polled to ensure they haven't further changed their minds ?

Should there be a fixed term for instance every 5 years ?