Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been brough
Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:53 am
Warnock has turned around the Bluebirds' fortunes
The right noises are all there to avoid another Toshack. The noise of 15,000 at Cardiff City Stadium on Saturday reminded why you hope that the Cardiff City board back Neil Warnock.
By Chris Wathan
Monday 19th February 2017
There's been plenty of times down the years that Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been brought up, almost akin to a footballing parable.
The 1970 move of the local-lad-turned-great-striker to Liverpool, just when the side were threatening promotion to the top-flight, has repeatedly been a way of describing how the club's ambitions may not be in tune with the dreams of the supporters.
Back then — and more often than not in the five decades since — it has referred to the sale of the Bluebirds better players. It's a struggle to think of when it could be used to sum up a situation with a manager.
And yet this is where it all seems to be heading with Cardiff City and Neil Warnock at present, with the potential modern-day Toshack tale mentioned on a radio phone-in following this latest win — the 11th from 22 Championship games under the manager in question.
Because Cardiff fans have had a taste of the Warnock effect and, certainly not after this biggest win in seven years, cannot fathom a scenario where it shouldn't carry onto into the new campaign. The hope is that there is no Toshack crossroads to come.
All the noises are the right ones at present. Warnock has quietly, respectfully, set out his agenda for some time now, about how he wants to know he will get enough money to have a go at that eighth promotion he has mentioned enough times even players can cite it.
That said, he stressed in the build up to this game that he felt refreshed and he could see himself staying in situ for a few seasons so much is he enjoying life as a Bluebird.
Chairman Mehmet Dalman, before Saturday's game, said he expects the 68-year-old to be in South Wales next season, although his confidence came with the caveat of the work that must be done to provide the financial platform at a time where the last of the Premier League parachute money is dwindling, forcing the club to come up with other avenues of revenue to support spending.
But just as the win offered another hopeful glimpse of an united future with Warnock at the helm, so too did the beaten opponents remind that Warnock would not be afraid to walk away if he does not feel it's right.
Warnock also loved being at Rotherham as he led them away from relegation last year despite being six points from safety when he started with 16 games to go. Yet talks over a new deal broke down.
It was all cordial — hence why Warnock showed plenty of sympathy as his side dished out this beating that hammered another nail in Yorkshire side's Championship coffin — but, with a new contract on the table, he said he “did not have the time” to wait for the Millers to put some of their investment into a new training ground at the expense of first-team funding.
He said back then that watching the play-offs at the end of last season reminded him “that's what I want” and yet – though his Cardiff are closer to the top-six than the bottom three – he still insisted this weekend that “not in a million years” were the Bluebirds going to trouble those promotion places in the final standings.
Which all points towards next season. On the face of it Warnock is not holding the club to ransom, though what his private demands may be, only he and the club's decision-makers can say for sure.
Yet he has talked about around a kitty of £6m, around three or four players, things the fans currently blown away by this Bluebirds revival see as straight forward.
On stepping down from Rotherham, he talked of not needing big bucks to achieve promotion, but key elements of team spirit, camaraderie, getting in characters, getting fans behind you home and away, all of which is fast becoming evident in this current team. A team, it should be pointed out, currently has a better win percentage of any the sides Warnock has managed at 50 per cent.
He admitted you need ability, but he is bringing that out of players he has inherited. Kadeem Harris and Craig Noone are two examples of resurgent players as they got themselves on the scoresheet here with superb finishes.
Another goalscorer, Junior Hoilett, has underlined his eye for a bargain, as has Sol Bamba who contributed to a third clean sheet in five games.
There is Kenneth Zohore, a striker Warnock was ready to show the door before giving into instinct and giving a chance.
“When he listens to what I say, he’s a threat. I think he’s getting better and I think he can get better with a pre-season because with me, he doesn’t get away with anything,” Warnock said of the two goal striker who made it four in five games with his Rotherham brace. “He’s got to do it and he knows that. He’s responded well and he’s working really hard.”
They all are, perhaps none more so than Aron Gunnarsson who is the beating heart of the born-again Bluebirds that gave a poor Millers midfield no respite.
There is an element of momentum, there will be defeats to come and there are limitations to this side – and there will certainly be tougher tests than a selection hit but a seemingly doomed Rotherham as weak as any side to come to Cardiff City Stadium.
“We could keep on winning – or we could lose the next seven and be in relegation trouble,” insisted Warnock on those play-off chances, still adamant he wants 50 points on board before any pats on his back.
But the way the team have found belief, purpose and connected with a supporter base has got people excited. Specifically, it has got them excited about the future.
It is not that he is reinventing the wheel. It is not football from the gods at times – Zohore's first was route one carried out well – but there is organisation, it is understanding, it is tactics that have broken down both teams above them in the table and below. It is certainly man-management and motivation, Warnock having that innate ability to criticise players but still feed them confidence as if he has added it to the drinks bottles.
Take Noone as a case in point: informed he was poor three weeks ago, challenged to do more, told 'Welcome back' when he responded in training, three impressive performances and two goals following.
With only three of the 14 players involved in the win that took Cardiff to 45 points, no wonder fans cannot fathom a situation where Warnock will not be retained.
They see the statistics – like the one that showed Rotherham two points below Cardiff when he arrived and now the Bluebirds 28 above them – and can't help but wonder 'what if' he had arrived earlier. Warnock's response, for the record, is Cardiff would have only wanted him when they were struggling.
But now Cardiff are not struggling, they are reborn as a team and feeling close to doing so as a club.
The need to be financially careful is something Cardiff as a club shouldn't be criticised for.
But it does feel as though that the fans sense something is really happening under Warnock and that all that can be done should be done to ensure it continues.
The right noises are all there to avoid another Toshack. The noise of 15,000 at Cardiff City Stadium on Saturday reminded why you hope that is the case.
The right noises are all there to avoid another Toshack. The noise of 15,000 at Cardiff City Stadium on Saturday reminded why you hope that the Cardiff City board back Neil Warnock.
By Chris Wathan
Monday 19th February 2017
There's been plenty of times down the years that Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been brought up, almost akin to a footballing parable.
The 1970 move of the local-lad-turned-great-striker to Liverpool, just when the side were threatening promotion to the top-flight, has repeatedly been a way of describing how the club's ambitions may not be in tune with the dreams of the supporters.
Back then — and more often than not in the five decades since — it has referred to the sale of the Bluebirds better players. It's a struggle to think of when it could be used to sum up a situation with a manager.
And yet this is where it all seems to be heading with Cardiff City and Neil Warnock at present, with the potential modern-day Toshack tale mentioned on a radio phone-in following this latest win — the 11th from 22 Championship games under the manager in question.
Because Cardiff fans have had a taste of the Warnock effect and, certainly not after this biggest win in seven years, cannot fathom a scenario where it shouldn't carry onto into the new campaign. The hope is that there is no Toshack crossroads to come.
All the noises are the right ones at present. Warnock has quietly, respectfully, set out his agenda for some time now, about how he wants to know he will get enough money to have a go at that eighth promotion he has mentioned enough times even players can cite it.
That said, he stressed in the build up to this game that he felt refreshed and he could see himself staying in situ for a few seasons so much is he enjoying life as a Bluebird.
Chairman Mehmet Dalman, before Saturday's game, said he expects the 68-year-old to be in South Wales next season, although his confidence came with the caveat of the work that must be done to provide the financial platform at a time where the last of the Premier League parachute money is dwindling, forcing the club to come up with other avenues of revenue to support spending.
But just as the win offered another hopeful glimpse of an united future with Warnock at the helm, so too did the beaten opponents remind that Warnock would not be afraid to walk away if he does not feel it's right.
Warnock also loved being at Rotherham as he led them away from relegation last year despite being six points from safety when he started with 16 games to go. Yet talks over a new deal broke down.
It was all cordial — hence why Warnock showed plenty of sympathy as his side dished out this beating that hammered another nail in Yorkshire side's Championship coffin — but, with a new contract on the table, he said he “did not have the time” to wait for the Millers to put some of their investment into a new training ground at the expense of first-team funding.
He said back then that watching the play-offs at the end of last season reminded him “that's what I want” and yet – though his Cardiff are closer to the top-six than the bottom three – he still insisted this weekend that “not in a million years” were the Bluebirds going to trouble those promotion places in the final standings.
Which all points towards next season. On the face of it Warnock is not holding the club to ransom, though what his private demands may be, only he and the club's decision-makers can say for sure.
Yet he has talked about around a kitty of £6m, around three or four players, things the fans currently blown away by this Bluebirds revival see as straight forward.
On stepping down from Rotherham, he talked of not needing big bucks to achieve promotion, but key elements of team spirit, camaraderie, getting in characters, getting fans behind you home and away, all of which is fast becoming evident in this current team. A team, it should be pointed out, currently has a better win percentage of any the sides Warnock has managed at 50 per cent.
He admitted you need ability, but he is bringing that out of players he has inherited. Kadeem Harris and Craig Noone are two examples of resurgent players as they got themselves on the scoresheet here with superb finishes.
Another goalscorer, Junior Hoilett, has underlined his eye for a bargain, as has Sol Bamba who contributed to a third clean sheet in five games.
There is Kenneth Zohore, a striker Warnock was ready to show the door before giving into instinct and giving a chance.
“When he listens to what I say, he’s a threat. I think he’s getting better and I think he can get better with a pre-season because with me, he doesn’t get away with anything,” Warnock said of the two goal striker who made it four in five games with his Rotherham brace. “He’s got to do it and he knows that. He’s responded well and he’s working really hard.”
They all are, perhaps none more so than Aron Gunnarsson who is the beating heart of the born-again Bluebirds that gave a poor Millers midfield no respite.
There is an element of momentum, there will be defeats to come and there are limitations to this side – and there will certainly be tougher tests than a selection hit but a seemingly doomed Rotherham as weak as any side to come to Cardiff City Stadium.
“We could keep on winning – or we could lose the next seven and be in relegation trouble,” insisted Warnock on those play-off chances, still adamant he wants 50 points on board before any pats on his back.
But the way the team have found belief, purpose and connected with a supporter base has got people excited. Specifically, it has got them excited about the future.
It is not that he is reinventing the wheel. It is not football from the gods at times – Zohore's first was route one carried out well – but there is organisation, it is understanding, it is tactics that have broken down both teams above them in the table and below. It is certainly man-management and motivation, Warnock having that innate ability to criticise players but still feed them confidence as if he has added it to the drinks bottles.
Take Noone as a case in point: informed he was poor three weeks ago, challenged to do more, told 'Welcome back' when he responded in training, three impressive performances and two goals following.
With only three of the 14 players involved in the win that took Cardiff to 45 points, no wonder fans cannot fathom a situation where Warnock will not be retained.
They see the statistics – like the one that showed Rotherham two points below Cardiff when he arrived and now the Bluebirds 28 above them – and can't help but wonder 'what if' he had arrived earlier. Warnock's response, for the record, is Cardiff would have only wanted him when they were struggling.
But now Cardiff are not struggling, they are reborn as a team and feeling close to doing so as a club.
The need to be financially careful is something Cardiff as a club shouldn't be criticised for.
But it does feel as though that the fans sense something is really happening under Warnock and that all that can be done should be done to ensure it continues.
The right noises are all there to avoid another Toshack. The noise of 15,000 at Cardiff City Stadium on Saturday reminded why you hope that is the case.
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Re: Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been br
Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:13 am
morning Annis, any reason why this story is posted twice by you ?
Got a feeling of POSITIVE meeting today.
Got a feeling of POSITIVE meeting today.
Re: Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been br
Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:37 am
I remember the Toshack sale - I was 9 and really getting into the City, it was a terrible decision.
Different times now but selling Kav was worse - at least we weren't going bust all the time in 1970.
Different times now but selling Kav was worse - at least we weren't going bust all the time in 1970.
Re: Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been br
Mon Feb 20, 2017 8:09 am
I don't think selling Toshack was the mistake although he had a great partnership with Brian Clark. That season JT had scored 8 goals in 16 matches prior to his transfer to Liverpool.
At the time of his transfer the club were 3rd in the division and by the time the club signed his replacement, Alan Warboys, 7 games later we had dropped to 5th after only 2 wins in those 7 games. Warboys scored 13 goals in the 17 games he played in that season and after a good run of results we were back in 2nd place with 5 games to go but a 1-0 defeat to relegation threatened Watford followed by heavy away defeats at Sheffield Utd and Luton did for us.
As much as the delay in signing the replacement for JT back in 1970 the club MUST NOT let this opportunity with NW pass them by now.
Get it sorted NOW without delay.
At the time of his transfer the club were 3rd in the division and by the time the club signed his replacement, Alan Warboys, 7 games later we had dropped to 5th after only 2 wins in those 7 games. Warboys scored 13 goals in the 17 games he played in that season and after a good run of results we were back in 2nd place with 5 games to go but a 1-0 defeat to relegation threatened Watford followed by heavy away defeats at Sheffield Utd and Luton did for us.
As much as the delay in signing the replacement for JT back in 1970 the club MUST NOT let this opportunity with NW pass them by now.
Get it sorted NOW without delay.
Re: Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been br
Mon Feb 20, 2017 8:43 am
castleblue wrote:I don't think selling Toshack was the mistake although he had a great partnership with Brian Clark. That season JT had scored 8 goals in 16 matches prior to his transfer to Liverpool.
At the time of his transfer the club were 3rd in the division and by the time the club signed his replacement, Alan Warboys, 7 games later we had dropped to 5th after only 2 wins in those 7 games. Warboys scored 13 goals in the 17 games he played in that season and after a good run of results we were back in 2nd place with 5 games to go but a 1-0 defeat to relegation threatened Watford followed by heavy away defeats at Sheffield Utd and Luton did for us.
As much as the delay in signing the replacement for JT back in 1970 the club MUST NOT let this opportunity with NW pass them by now.
Get it sorted NOW without delay.
I understand the stats and Warbs was fab, but as you mention it was the delay in getting him in that hurt us.
But biggger than that was the emotional message selling Tosh did to us - the perception it gave was we were second rate.
CTID
Re: Cardiff City's decision to sell John Toshack has been br
Mon Feb 20, 2017 8:14 pm
JimmyJazz wrote:castleblue wrote:I don't think selling Toshack was the mistake although he had a great partnership with Brian Clark. That season JT had scored 8 goals in 16 matches prior to his transfer to Liverpool.
At the time of his transfer the club were 3rd in the division and by the time the club signed his replacement, Alan Warboys, 7 games later we had dropped to 5th after only 2 wins in those 7 games. Warboys scored 13 goals in the 17 games he played in that season and after a good run of results we were back in 2nd place with 5 games to go but a 1-0 defeat to relegation threatened Watford followed by heavy away defeats at Sheffield Utd and Luton did for us.
As much as the delay in signing the replacement for JT back in 1970 the club MUST NOT let this opportunity with NW pass them by now.
Get it sorted NOW without delay.
I understand the stats and Warbs was fab, but as you mention it was the delay in getting him in that hurt us.
But biggger than that was the emotional message selling Tosh did to us - the perception it gave was we were second rate.
CTID
tend to agree.. yes signing Warboys earlier MIGHT have got us up, but the fact that selling Tosh is more often than not accompanied by thoughts of lack of ambition almost 50 years on speaks volumes.