Cardiff accounts show £130Mill is owed/Debt reaches £174 Mil

That figure does not account for the money we got back in fee's for players (must be around £30m recouped surely?)

So net debt (the bottom line) is £81 million.

i wouldnt say thats the bottom line at all. Thats how much debt we would still owe if we sold all our players and the stadium too! not exactly going to go that far

Yeah fair point

It is all creative accounting we have received lots of money from player sales, which will come into the next set of accounts plus we still have parachute payments to come, also we are not in debt, Vincent Tan owns Cardiff city and therefore he owes the money to himself

It is all creative accounting we have received lots of money from player sales, which will come into the next set of accounts plus we still have parachute payments to come, also we are not in debt, Vincent Tan owns Cardiff city and therefore he owes the money to himself

weve also spend a lot of money, and continue to have a massive wage bill without the additional income

It is all creative accounting we have received lots of money from player sales, which will come into the next set of accounts plus we still have parachute payments to come, also we are not in debt, Vincent Tan owns Cardiff city and therefore he owes the money to himself

and that's the key point, if he liquidated the club he would still have to wipe his chin to the tune of £81 million

Think next years accounts will see a big change, also the person who is taking the hit is Vincent Tan,

It is all creative accounting we have received lots of money from player sales, which will come into the next set of accounts plus we still have parachute payments to come, also we are not in debt, Vincent Tan owns Cardiff city and therefore he owes the money to himself

and that's the key point, if he liquidated the club he would still have to wipe his chin to the tune of £81 million

^^^^This is an important factor the whole saga, Gav ^^^^

Not defending Tan, but he would be the biggest 'loser' if he did 'pull the plug' and recent events appear to point towards a far more pragmatic approach from him and his entourage, so I am guessing that the club are (relatively speaking) in a good place so far as any real and present financial danger is concerned

The figures are pretty scary reading for us mere mortals, but Tan is on a different financial planet to all of us and Annis was pretty accurate with his (ridiculed by some) figures and I hope a few apologies are issued

Next year's accounts will be the most telling in the history of the club IMHO

£30 mill when tan started, well done mate fucked this right up!

Cardiff City accounts show £130m is owed in loans to overseas shareholders and other undertakings.

The Cardiff City accounts: Bluebirds lose nearly £12m in Premier League season as total debt pile reaches £174m


The net deficit of £81m has risen from £69.3m the year before.

Thurs 26 February 2015

By Chris Wathan

Cardiff accounts show £46m spent on wages during Premier League year and Vincent Tan loans incresed to £130m



The net deficit of £81m has risen from £69.3m the year before.



' The Cardiff City accounts '

The full picture of Cardiff City’s finances have been laid bare - with the club revealed to have lost almost £12m last year despite seeing their income rocket during their short-lived stay in the Premier League.

The club’s latest accounts have revealed the total amount it owes now adds up to a massive £174m, most of which is owed to majority shareholder Vincent Tan.

Cardiff’s City’s huge debts dwarf the value of its stadium, players and other assets - meaning that it owes £81m more than the value of all its assets.

The net deficit of £81m has risen from £69.3m the year before.


The accounts, which cover the year ending May 2014, show that the club lost money during its spell in the Premier League despite seeing revenue increase from £14.5m to £79.9m thanks mainly to £63.9m of broadcast payments for the year ending May 2014.

That loss was equivalent to nearly £1m a month after splashing out £45m on transfers and paying £46.7m on wages.

Losses were down thanks to the cash boost provided by Premier League television rights, falling from £30.9m in the 2012/2013 promotion season to £11.7m last term.

But the club was still dependent on Mr Tan.

The key Cardiff City figures
£174m
Total owed

£79.9m
Total revenue

£2m
The cost of replacing Mackay with Solskjaer

£46.7m
Wage costs

£5.1m
Disposal of player registrations

£45m
Amount spent on players

The Malaysian businessman doubling the amount of loans to the club during their season in the English top-flight with the accounts disclosing that ‘overseas shareholders and associated undertakings’ has now loaned a total of £130m to the club.

With money still owed elsewhere – including a new 8% interest-bearing loan of £7.5m to a non-UK registered company Torman Finance Inc – it means the club technically owes £174m as part of its current liabilities with £129.7m technically due within one year.

In the accounts the club state their net debt stands at £81m – up from £69.3m - with the value of Cardiff City Stadium and the playing squad offsetting some of the monies owed. The club themselves are owed £15.7m.


In the accounts, chairman Mehment Dalman reveals in his statement – signed July 2014 – the club had hopes for automatic promotion back to the Premier League, the accounts reiterating promotion to the Premier League in May 2015 as part of its its outlook summary.

The accounts suggest it cost around £2m to replace Malky Mackay with Ole Gunnar Solskjaer in January 2014.

It states gate receipts increased from £6.2m to £8.2m while “centralised broadcasting and commercial distributions” rose from £4.8m in the Championship to £63.9m.

Wages and salaries across the club rose from £27m to £46.7m while “disposal of players’ registrations” during that period is quoted at £5.1m.

Cost of player registrations is stated at £45.7m, up from £16.5m the previous season, while £11.6m came from sales

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith


Can u put a link on here once updated Please Keith

I'm shocked at this. I never thought it was that much

I kept saying it was this bad,but the Tan lovers kept saying I was lying because of my dislike to Tan.
They still defend him

Our Club has been run shockingly for 4 years.

why just 4yrs annis? What happened to the 3yrs before tan or doesnt that count as truefully thats whats started this dabarcle! Yes debt staggering but hey oh thats football!

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

I'm shocked at this. I never thought it was that much

I kept saying it was this bad,but the Tan lovers kept saying I was lying because of my dislike to Tan.
They still defend him

Our Club has been run shockingly for 4 years.

why just 4yrs annis? What happened to the 3yrs before tan or doesnt that count as truefully thats whats started this dabarcle! Yes debt staggering but hey oh thats football!

Allan,Because when certain posters started to say our club is now being run professionally and the bad days are over, I could see the debt was rising faster than ever and I also could see the club was being run worse than a circus.
So we were going from bad to worse over the last 4 years.

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked at this. I never thought it was that much

I kept saying it was this bad,but the Tan lovers kept saying I was lying because of my dislike to Tan.
They still defend him

Our Club has been run shockingly for 4 years.

why just 4yrs annis? What happened to the 3yrs before tan or doesnt that count as truefully thats whats started this dabarcle! Yes debt staggering but hey oh thats football!

Allan,Because when certain posters started to say our club is now being run professionally and the bad days are over, I could see the debt was rising faster than ever and I also could see the club was being run worse than a circus.
So we were going from bad to worse over the last 4 years.

wouldn't no about professionally as not access to inner workings of club annis! Seems to me that getting to premier is a poison chalice for clubs take a look around league full off clubs massively in debt and finding it hard to recover at least got safety net for And until that changes life goes on unchanged.

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked that we didn't make the most of revenue streams last season to only turn over 80 million seems shocking unless that was a wrong figure in the article ,12 million loss is shocking too ,I hope Keith can pick the bones out of it better than the echo

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked that we didn't make the most of revenue streams last season to only turn over 80 million seems shocking unless that was a wrong figure in the article ,12 million loss is shocking too ,I hope Keith can pick the bones out of it better than the echo

Wez, Keith, Will give us an honest/professional reading

Cardiff accounts show £130Mill is owed/Debt reaches £174

Mental stuff

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked that we didn't make the most of revenue streams last season to only turn over 80 million seems shocking unless that was a wrong figure in the article ,12 million loss is shocking too ,I hope Keith can pick the bones out of it better than the echo

Wez, Keith, Will give us an honest/professional reading

annis it would be nice if someone can say this is our actual debt not its xyz i think?

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked that we didn't make the most of revenue streams last season to only turn over 80 million seems shocking unless that was a wrong figure in the article ,12 million loss is shocking too ,I hope Keith can pick the bones out of it better than the echo

Wez, Keith, Will give us an honest/professional reading

annis it would be nice if someone can say this is our actual debt not its xyz i think?

I agree Allan, I will ask Keith,to put it out in layman's terms

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked that we didn't make the most of revenue streams last season to only turn over 80 million seems shocking unless that was a wrong figure in the article ,12 million loss is shocking too ,I hope Keith can pick the bones out of it better than the echo

Wez, Keith, Will give us an honest/professional reading

annis it would be nice if someone can say this is our actual debt not its xyz i think?

I agree Allan, I will ask Keith,to put it out in layman's terms

Just puzzled one minute 130m in debt next line its 174m ? And wrong accounts ccfc holdings not club?? Confuscious making comeback!

Annis

Chris has got a number of these figures wrong , because he has looked only at the football club company. The correct company to look at is Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited so that figures for the stadium company etc are also included.The fact is though that the overall figures do not make happy reading.

I will be speaking to Chris by telephone shortly , but will be posting a more detailed commentary on the Trust website when I get a chance this evening. Feel free to refer to it here on your board when it appears.

Keith

Cheers Keith

a few things don't add up for me ,annis especially we were 119 m in debt last account s , lost 12 m and the Wales on line say we are now 172m. seems odd that unless Like Keith said they got it wrong ,still shockin. We lost 12 million last season

Your right Wez, some there figures dont add up, incl the ones your saying,but over all its still shocking.

I'm shocked that we didn't make the most of revenue streams last season to only turn over 80 million seems shocking unless that was a wrong figure in the article ,12 million loss is shocking too ,I hope Keith can pick the bones out of it better than the echo

Wez, Keith, Will give us an honest/professional reading

annis it would be nice if someone can say this is our actual debt not its xyz i think?

I agree Allan, I will ask Keith,to put it out in layman's terms

Agree with this

Cardiff City
Cardiff announce annual losses of £12m to increase overall debt to £174m
• Majority of debt is owed to chairman Vincent Tan
• Club lost £1m a month during seaoson in the Premier League

Vincent Tan is now owed £174m by Cardiff after the club released its latest financial accounts.
Guardian sport
Thursday 26 February 2015 The Guardian

Cardiff City have announced annual losses of £12m despite spending last season in the Premier League, with the club’s total debt now standing at a staggering £174m.

The Welsh side were relegated in their first top-flight season since 1961/2 after finishing bottom of the table but still received £62m in prize money from the Premier League. However, the club’s latest accounts covering the year ending May 2014 were released on Thursday and show that they still lost a significant amount of money despite increasing revenue to £79.9m.

That works out as almost £1m a month in losses while they were in the Premier League, taking the club’s total deficit when the value its stadium, players and other assets are subtracted to £81m. Most of the money is owed to chairman Vincent Tan, the Malysian businessman who purchased 30% of shares in May 2010 before increasing that to beyond 90% last year. In total, the accounts state that Cardiff spent £45m on transfers and £46.7m on wages. That included the purchase of Danish striker Andreas Cornelius for £7.5m, who was sold back to FC Copenhagen for a fraction of the cost.

I am pleasantly surprised that the wage bill was so reasonable, I thought it might be a lot bigger. The problem is that unless players like Kenwyne Jones had relegation clauses they are still going to be on premiership wages. With all the paying off of contracts that has been going on I'd be surprised if we got our wage bill under £37m for the 14/15 accounts.

According to transfermarkt which I know is not always very accurate, since these accounts we have made a profit of £12m on transfer sales minus transfer purchases.

So if in our promotion season we made a loss of £30m with a wage bill of £27m and a loss of £12 on transfers then this season with a wage bill of hopefully less than £37m, a profit of £12m from transfers and £20m of parachute money we should make a profit of about £4m. Every little helps.

I would like to know how much the stadium expansion cost.

Overall the accounts are pretty much as I expected, just off to check down the back of the sofa to see if my loose change is enough to pay up to Tan's £130m.

No matter how you dress it up we are more knackered without Tan than with !!

This is not Administration territory it's straight to winding up and no more Cardiff City of Tan simply takes the hit.

That said, it's highly unlikely that he would do that and, arguably, we're in a safer place now than for the 10 years prior to his arrival because, unlike before, we have an owner able to cover that debt.

Whichever figure is correct, it does not make pleasant reading for a mid table Championship side. We all know that this team are not going to be promoted any time soon, and the big money available in the PL won't be coming our way for quite a while, if at all. No point taking our so called assets from the total figure owed, if we could sell the ground and all our players we haven't got a football club. Whichever way you dress this up, Annis was a lot more accurate with his forecast than many other posters on here.

Whichever figure is correct, it does not make pleasant reading for a mid table Championship side. We all know that this team are not going to be promoted any time soon, and the big money available in the PL won't be coming our way for quite a while, if at all. No point taking our so called assets from the total figure owed, if we could sell the ground and all our players we haven't got a football club. Whichever way you dress this up, Annis was a lot more accurate with his forecast than many other posters on here.

could be worse like bolton (as much debt) but they dont have anyone backing them up!
at present no one knows figures so think will wait until someone actually says we are x amount in debt not xyz amounts!

There are two area's that need further explanation, why do we have a debt of £7.4 million to Torman Financial Inc at a rate of 8%?? I thought that all historical debts had been settled or if it's a new one, as I have not heard of this debt before, then why on earth if we have a Billionaire owner are we borrowing any money at 8%??

Also our administrative costs have rose from £7.4 million to £15.8 million in 2012-2013, which at the time was unacceptable seeing as there were no extra staff etc, now they have now increased to £39.7 million
What the hell do these administrative costs cover? and why do they keep doubling

There are two area's that need further explanation, why do we have a debt of £7.4 million to Torman Financial Inc at a rate of 8%?? I thought that all historical debts had been settled or if it's a new one, as I have not heard of this debt before, then why on earth if we have a Billionaire owner are we borrowing any money at 8%??

Also our administrative costs have rose from £7.4 million to £15.8 million in 2012-2013, which at the time was unacceptable seeing as there were no extra staff etc, now they have now increased to £39.7 million
What the hell do these administrative costs cover? and why do they keep doubling

The article isn't the football club accounts ,Keith said he was going to explain later today some time

The Guardian also ran this story with £12m loss and £174m debt headline figures.

I can't believe that one of the big nationals could get it totally wrong.

Annis, looks like you were right all along.