' independence Scotland Yes or No? '

Any thoughts on UKIP with our borders being challenged daily and a bursting nhs ?

From me.

Piss off you sweaty jocks. You have it easy. Free education, free prescriptions. 2% of the UK holding the rest to ransom? f**k off please.

It's a yes for me. Things will never improve as they are, and I can't see them being any worse in an Independant Scotland but Inbelieve we should at least have the opportunity to try and improve them.

The UK is only the UK when it suits London. The wars were won in a different era. It's not the same place anymore. History can't be changed but futures can be made.

I appreciate what you say about it not being the same anymore, but in all honesty how do you genuinely think (a) Scotland can survive fiscally for any reasonable length of time, and (b) how the lives of working class Scots will be improved in the longer term?

I don't live in Scotland (I absolutely love the place and its people) yet all I can see is a longer-term future where the country cannot support itself

I am intrigued by the closeness of a vote I originally thought was simply to pamper Alex Salmond, "The man who would be King" (someone who comes across as being as "in it for my own ends" as any of the Westminster politicians) and I am genuinely interested in the views of a Scottish resident

Sven, I've cut & paste these answers below from a similar set of questions put to me. It took a long time for me to be convinced, I've read alot of material & had debates(sometimes heated!) with people supporting both sides. I now truly believe that this is our chance as a nation to prosper and create a better Scotland for our children & grandchildren.

Every week we hear how Scotland(as well as Wales & NI) costs them more to fund than it's worth yet they are desperate to keep us. They're even trying to bribe people with the promise of extra powers, a poor tactic given that postal voting has already begun. Anyway.......


Scotland has been a net contributor to the union for as long as records have been kept. Only twice in the last 32 years has it run at a deficit. The UK is far too centralized and the north/south divide has been growing year on year. Employers in London will pay anything up to 25% more for the same job elsewhere in the country. If you factor in inflation over the next 10/20/30/50/100 years, how can you counter that? The UK needs to deflate London, and under the current system that won't happen. Independence and eventually our own currency will allow us to no longer worry about the life and soul, and finances of the country being sucked south east.

Thanks, Paul. I appreciate you responding

It all fascinates me and I honestly believe there are unseen issues ahead when/if the "Yes" vote is successful, although I will concede that Scotland has a far far better chance of 'making it work' than Wales will ever have

Too close to call at the moment, but I think the UK Government have grossly under-estimated their own figures regarding 'how' the Scottish people will vote and that just might come back to haunt them!

I don't know Alex Salmond other than what I see/read in the media, but he does come across as an old-style union leader and I'm not so sure he would want to move away from the limelight so easily

Anyway, good luck with it all and may the Scottish people be listened to!

Always like a good debate mate!

I'm certain Salmond has said he will stand down once it's all done & dusted - I think that's only if the country votes Yes though.

I think the UK Government have made an arse of it and now the "three leaders" have rolled up it smacks of desperation. I can't see how David Cameron will convince anybody of anything at any time never mind at this stage of proceedings.

I suppose we'll live or fall by it but I don't want to be thinking "what if" in 25 years time & I don't want my son asking "why didn't you" either!

Can't fault your logic regarding your son, mate

Good luck!

This is all labours fault.....

There was a time when labour MP's were hard working trade unionists who had some character and made it through the ranks. Or a bright lad that made it through his mother and fathers hard graft, in the steel mills,factories or mines. Now they are middle class nobodies who have never worked in thier life drafted into a safe seat.

I live in Miskin, so somehow I am in Pontypridd. I liked kim Howells, too left wing in his younger days, but understood the hardships of life. Now look at the clown we have or the one representing the Rhondda- Do they represent the people of the area, do you feel they understand our life........ Do they Fcuk

The liberal middle class "I know best" have ethnically cleansed the working class out of the labour party. In Scotland with the SNP not messing things up excelerated the decline of labour, regionallly and nationally.

Good post.
People also have a go at the Senedd for being inefficient, well it's not the institution's fault it's the Labour clowns running it.

I quite agree with you there are far to many 'career politicians' out there. Some even decide which party to join depending on the seat they can win not on political principle! For me there is only one party where the members join because of their beliefs and their wish to serve Wales and that's Plaid. Like it or not they are the only party that put the interest of Wales first just like the SNP in Scotland.

Rubbish! Plaid are either career politicians or hypocrites as they are pro - Europe, which gives us 4 layers of government and more and more power to Europe. Therefore Plaid are either after more jobs or would rather that Wales be governed by Brussels than Westminster. If they were anti - Europe and wanted independence then they would have my vote, but they want to be out of the UK and remain in Europe, which is why I stopped voting for Plaid. It is because of the EU why my generation can't speak Welsh as it was compulsory to take French or German, but Welsh was placed with all the important Science subject choices so that I had to drop Welsh and take a language I didn't want.

This is all labours fault.....

There was a time when labour MP's were hard working trade unionists who had some character and made it through the ranks. Or a bright lad that made it through his mother and fathers hard graft, in the steel mills,factories or mines. Now they are middle class nobodies who have never worked in thier life drafted into a safe seat.

I live in Miskin, so somehow I am in Pontypridd. I liked kim Howells, too left wing in his younger days, but understood the hardships of life. Now look at the clown we have or the one representing the Rhondda- Do they represent the people of the area, do you feel they understand our life........ Do they Fcuk

The liberal middle class "I know best" have ethnically cleansed the working class out of the labour party. In Scotland with the SNP not messing things up excelerated the decline of labour, regionallly and nationally.

Good post.
People also have a go at the Senedd for being inefficient, well it's not the institution's fault it's the Labour clowns running it.

I quite agree with you there are far to many 'career politicians' out there. Some even decide which party to join depending on the seat they can win not on political principle! For me there is only one party where the members join because of their beliefs and their wish to serve Wales and that's Plaid. Like it or not they are the only party that put the interest of Wales first just like the SNP in Scotland.

Rubbish! Plaid are either career politicians or hypocrites as they are pro - Europe, which gives us 4 layers of government and more and more power to Europe. Therefore Plaid are either after more jobs or would rather that Wales be governed by Brussels than Westminster. If they were anti - Europe and wanted independence then they would have my vote, but they want to be out of the UK and remain in Europe, which is why I stopped voting for Plaid. It is because of the EU why my generation can't speak Welsh as it was compulsory to take French or German, but Welsh was placed with all the important Science subject choices so that I had to drop Welsh and take a language I didn't want.

I had no idea about that Thanks for the info!

This is all labours fault.....

There was a time when labour MP's were hard working trade unionists who had some character and made it through the ranks. Or a bright lad that made it through his mother and fathers hard graft, in the steel mills,factories or mines. Now they are middle class nobodies who have never worked in thier life drafted into a safe seat.

I live in Miskin, so somehow I am in Pontypridd. I liked kim Howells, too left wing in his younger days, but understood the hardships of life. Now look at the clown we have or the one representing the Rhondda- Do they represent the people of the area, do you feel they understand our life........ Do they Fcuk

The liberal middle class "I know best" have ethnically cleansed the working class out of the labour party. In Scotland with the SNP not messing things up excelerated the decline of labour, regionallly and nationally.

Good post.
People also have a go at the Senedd for being inefficient, well it's not the institution's fault it's the Labour clowns running it.

I quite agree with you there are far to many 'career politicians' out there. Some even decide which party to join depending on the seat they can win not on political principle! For me there is only one party where the members join because of their beliefs and their wish to serve Wales and that's Plaid. Like it or not they are the only party that put the interest of Wales first just like the SNP in Scotland.

Rubbish! Plaid are either career politicians or hypocrites as they are pro - Europe, which gives us 4 layers of government and more and more power to Europe. Therefore Plaid are either after more jobs or would rather that Wales be governed by Brussels than Westminster. If they were anti - Europe and wanted independence then they would have my vote, but they want to be out of the UK and remain in Europe, which is why I stopped voting for Plaid. It is because of the EU why my generation can't speak Welsh as it was compulsory to take French or German, but Welsh was placed with all the important Science subject choices so that I had to drop Welsh and take a language I didn't want.

I had no idea about that Thanks for the info!

The EU has some history where appeasing the French is concerned, which is why the headquarters moves from Brussels to Strasbourg for four days every month at a cost of £130m per annum.

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Scotland are already members

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Don't believe what you read in the English Press and certainly what you hear on the BBC. They tell us what we're supposed to hear.

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Scotland are already members

No they aren't FFS

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Don't believe what you read in the English Press and certainly what you hear on the BBC. They tell us what we're supposed to hear.

I don't need to you just need to read what the EU have already stated and look at how long it has taken the Eastern European Countries to become full members of the EU. But the application needs to be approved with all its members states which the UK and Spain have already stated that they wouldn't so it couldn't even get past the first stage of their application

Barroso even said it himself !!!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

From me.

Piss off you sweaty jocks. You have it easy. Free education, free prescriptions. 2% of the UK holding the rest to ransom? f**k off please.

You f**k off you c**t

From me.

Piss off you sweaty jocks. You have it easy. Free education, free prescriptions. 2% of the UK holding the rest to ransom? f**k off please.

You f**k off you c**t

well said!

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Scotland are already members

No they aren't FFS

Yes they are as part of the uk and nobody's going to change that!

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Scotland are already members

No they aren't FFS

Yes they are as part of the uk and nobody's going to change that!

Absolute nonsense and Barroso has even stated that FACT: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Today in Barcelona another country wants independence and EU fair representation.

Today in Barcelona another country wants independence and EU fair representation.

And that's why Spain are watching closely and have also stated that they would refuse Scotland their application to join the EU (please note that joining the EU requires an agreement with all member states). Spain knows that if it works for Scotland then they will have problems so going back to your original point the thought that Scotland are already EU members is absolutely not correct.

Today in Barcelona another country wants independence and EU fair representation.

And that's why Spain are watching closely and have also stated that they would refuse Scotland their application to join the EU (please note that joining the EU requires an agreement with all member states). Spain knows that if it works for Scotland then they will have problems so going back to your original point the thought that Scotland are already EU members is absolutely not correct.

http://www.dw.de/independent-scotland-f ... a-17912094

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Scotland are already members

No they aren't FFS

Yes they are as part of the uk and nobody's going to change that!

You're wrong. They may be part of the EU now as part of the UK, but it's been stated many many times that they'd have to apply to be part of the EU if they get independence.

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Today in Barcelona another country wants independence and EU fair representation.

And that's why Spain are watching closely and have also stated that they would refuse Scotland their application to join the EU (please note that joining the EU requires an agreement with all member states). Spain knows that if it works for Scotland then they will have problems so going back to your original point the thought that Scotland are already EU members is absolutely not correct.

http://www.dw.de/independent-scotland-f ... a-17912094

Barroso has said it himself so that link is bollocks: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Don't people realise that an application to join the EU would take 5 years minimum

Scotland are already members

No they aren't FFS

Yes they are as part of the uk and nobody's going to change that!

You're wrong. They may be part of the EU now as part of the UK, but it's been stated many many times that they'd have to apply to be part of the EU if they get independence.

If Scotland says yes and changes it's status so does the uk.. It is a different entity.

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Is this coming from the same side who are simply dodging every question about the finances of a yes vote FFS!!! The only wallys are the ones believing this shit!!! Baroso has said it himself http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

I suppose we could call it "FUK" former United Kingdom

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Is this coming from the same side who are simply dodging every question about the finances of a yes vote FFS!!! The only wallys are the ones believing this shit!!! Baroso has said it himself http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Who is Barroso ? Isn't this the guy who never mentions jersey or Guernsey who are "NOT" members of the EU, have different social and financial policies and yet retain the Bank of England and the pound sterling. He is just an overpaid un elected official.

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Is this coming from the same side who are simply dodging every question about the finances of a yes vote FFS!!! The only wallys are the ones believing this shit!!! Baroso has said it himself http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Who is Barroso ? Isn't this the guy who never mentions jersey or Guernsey who are "NOT" members of the EU, have different social and financial policies and yet retain the Bank of England and the pound sterling. He is just an overpaid un elected official.

I don't like the way the EU operates as much as anyone but you know exactly who Barroso is and you know that his comments are more creditable than anything the yes campaign can throw in the public arena

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Is this coming from the same side who are simply dodging every question about the finances of a yes vote FFS!!! The only wallys are the ones believing this shit!!! Baroso has said it himself http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Who is Barroso ? Isn't this the guy who never mentions jersey or Guernsey who are "NOT" members of the EU, have different social and financial policies and yet retain the Bank of England and the pound sterling. He is just an overpaid un elected official.

I don't like the way the EU operates as much as anyone but you know exactly who Barroso is and you know that his comments are more creditable than anything the yes campaign can throw in the public arena

That is crap as you know he wasn't elected by the people, over 80% of the voting population are going to vote, it's called a democratic mandate.

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Is this coming from the same side who are simply dodging every question about the finances of a yes vote FFS!!! The only wallys are the ones believing this shit!!! Baroso has said it himself http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Who is Barroso ? Isn't this the guy who never mentions jersey or Guernsey who are "NOT" members of the EU, have different social and financial policies and yet retain the Bank of England and the pound sterling. He is just an overpaid un elected official.

I don't like the way the EU operates as much as anyone but you know exactly who Barroso is and you know that his comments are more creditable than anything the yes campaign can throw in the public arena

That is crap as you know he wasn't elected by the people, over 80% of the voting population are going to vote, it's called a democratic mandate.

he was elected by the politicians from within the EU and the same politicians who were voted in by the people. As I say I don't like the why the EU works but his comments are far more creditable than what the yes campaign has stated.

Adam you wally..

http://www.yesscotland.net/answers/will ... pean-union

Is this coming from the same side who are simply dodging every question about the finances of a yes vote FFS!!! The only wallys are the ones believing this shit!!! Baroso has said it himself http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ember.html

Who is Barroso ? Isn't this the guy who never mentions jersey or Guernsey who are "NOT" members of the EU, have different social and financial policies and yet retain the Bank of England and the pound sterling. He is just an overpaid un elected official.

I don't like the way the EU operates as much as anyone but you know exactly who Barroso is and you know that his comments are more creditable than anything the yes campaign can throw in the public arena

That is crap as you know he wasn't elected by the people, over 80% of the voting population are going to vote, it's called a democratic mandate.

he was elected by the politicians from within the EU and the same politicians who were voted in by the people. As I say I don't like the why the EU works but his comments are far more creditable than what the yes campaign has stated.

He was not elected by the people full stop! It's called a democratic deficit, no orbital right view is going to change that! Anyway off out now to join the march with about a million others.. Big brother is dead